Identifying a gun

BigDuffman

Hi all,

Looking for a bit of advice regarding a piece that I recently inherited from my grandmothers attic. Nothing known about piece bar what I can casually observe. Anyone have any ideas on what it might be?

Gun Maker: Joseph Egg London (circa 1800-1840)
Type: Percussion cap, appears to be smooth bore (but hard to tell from barrel)
Condition: Original finish on woodwork appears to be 95% the metal engraving is undamaged but appears to have some cosmetic blotching and fouling from age, with some grime built up around the striker (from where some pesky kids put paper caps on the nipple and simulated caps aka me as a child) should clean up nicely. Mechanism appears fully functional. No evident cracks, dents or pitting.

Anyone shed any light? I wouldn't mind cleaning it up a bit but have no experience with firearms of this vintage so don't want to damage it.

cookimonster

Have a look here for a start.

http://collections.museumvictoria.com.au/items/373579

Rosahane

Given the rear sight I'd say it is a rifle but the foresight appears to be missing.

Be very careful cleaning it as you don't want to remove any case hardening on the metal. If you haven't any specific gun cleaner try a bit of WD40 On a cotton rag on the metal parts. Wipe off any excess especially on the wood and finish with a wipe with a rag and a little 3 in one oil or similar.

Don't use any steel wool or anything abrasive at this stage.

To clean it properly you probably need to remove the lock but this needs a bit of skill and knowledge.

BigDuffman

cookimonster wrote: »

Have a look here for a start.

http://collections.museumvictoria.com.au/items/373579

Thanks for that. Looks very similar bar the metal work and the Square piece behind the hammer? I thought this may have been for putting powder / spare caps in but unsure now.

Rosahane wrote: »

Given the rear sight I'd say it is a rifle but the foresight appears to be missing.

Be very careful cleaning it as you don't want to remove any case hardening on the metal. If you haven't any specific gun cleaner try a bit of WD40 On a cotton rag on the metal parts. Wipe off any excess especially on the wood and finish with a wipe with a rag and a little 3 in one oil or similar.

Don't use any steel wool or anything abrasive at this stage.

To clean it properly you probably need to remove the lock but this needs a bit of skill and knowledge.

There's a recess at the front of the barrel that looks like it could have had a fore sight at some stage.

I might give it a lick with some cloth and WD40 and 3 in 1 or CLP. I won't be opening her up as I'd be uncomfortable with a piece of this age.

From what I can see its smooth bore. But its difficult to tell just by looking down the barrel. From Cookimonsters link it looks similar to the single barrel shot gun.

Any ideas on valuation etc?

Grizzly 45

DO NOT USE WD40 ANYWHERE near a firearm!!
Its a water dispersent and not an oil and can be death to firearms metal and finishes.Especiall old finishes. Use 3in 1 if you must and nothing more abrasive than a nylon gun toothbrush or a hard new toothbrush.
Next thing for safteys sake you need to do is see if it is still loaded!! Be surprised how many of these old guns can still have a charge in them.Simple enough,get a dowel rod that fits into the bore.Drop it down the barrel and mark it where it stops at the muzzle. Remove the dowel and put it up alongside the muzzle on the barrel .If the mark is flush with the muzzle ,it's safe and unloaded,if there is any discrepency of over an inch.There is somthing in there!! Could be a load of muck or it could be a powder charge.This is where WD40 comes into play.If possible remove the nipple and spray with the can hose a load into the hole.WD will kill any pwder stone dead within seconds.
Going by the graudated sites,it most certainly is a hunting rifle so its rifled and is in very good condition for its age ,in the fact the lettering and details is still visible. So it hasnt been that badly bollocked about in its life..They arent very hard to strip.BUT you do need the right tools and proper screwdrives to do so,not to mind alot of patience woth balky screws without gouging them to bits.

BigDuffman

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

DO NOT USE WD40 ANYWHERE near a firearm!!

I've always been under the impression that you can use WD40 on external metal parts as its a penetrant and will loosen rust and deep grime. But you clean off and oil up afterwards? I've never seen any issues in the metal before on other weapons? Although I've never used WD40 on gas effected or working parts as it is supposed to Gum up etc.

But I'll err on the side of caution and stick to CLP for this so. Thanks for the heads up.

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Going by the graudated sites,it most certainly is a hunting rifle so its rifled and is in very good condition for its age ,in the fact the lettering and details is still visible. So it hasnt been that badly bollocked about in its life..

I haven't been able to identify any rifling in the barrel but it could just be obscured with dust and age. I must try take a closer look after a clean. Yeah I checked the barrel for a charge, nothing there thankfully.

Anyone know where you'd get something like this valued?

barnaman

Looks like could be worth around 800 to 1000 euros. This one is your rifle

http://auctions.holtsauctioneers.com/asp/fullCatalogue.asp?salelot=A1072++++508+&refno=+++66636&saletype=

sold for 960 pounds but it had a casem the ram rod and accesseories. 20% commission to pay on that too if you sell it.
Careful cleaning it and nice rifle

Victor

Have you added it to your licence?

Is it worthwhile checking the rest of the property for other guns or ammunition?

Or large wads of used twenty pound notes.

BigDuffman

barnaman wrote: »

Looks like could be worth around 800 to 1000 euros. This one is your rifle

http://auctions.holtsauctioneers.com/asp/fullCatalogue.asp?salelot=A1072++++508+&refno=+++66636&saletype=

sold for 960 pounds but it had a casem the ram rod and accesseories. 20% commission to pay on that too if you sell it.
Careful cleaning it and nice rifle

Great find Barnaman thanks for that. Looks very similar alright. A small difference I've noticed to the rear of the hammer. Unsure as to what to call it!

Kepler 186f

Victor wrote: »

Have you added it to your licence?

Is it worthwhile checking the rest of the property for other guns or ammunition?

Or large wads of used twenty pound notes.

Agreed on all counts!

Grizzly 45

Made around 1835.
ASFIR that makes it exempt from liscensing in Ireland??
Weirdest penetrating oil I've used and been very effective has been a 50/50 mix of Acetone and brake fluid. Acetone is what the missus uses for the nail polish removing and brake fluid you know what does. You have to shake well before use until you get a Mc Donalds strawberry milkshake colour.[Washed out pink]. Use a eye dropper or syringe to put a few drops on threads or bolts and let it sit for a few hours. This eats into crud almost like a magnet,but it neeeds usuall y a few doses to get right into the threads,especially with flush precision stuff. Other trick is to heat an old screwdriver to red hot and put it into the slot of the stubborn screw.Apply light oil to th screw head immediately after.Repeat as often as necessary,the oil will bubble and penetrate into the threads pretty quicky as the metal has been heated and expanded by microns.It is enough to break the crud hold.

barnaman

Yeah but its another grey area its so long as its antique and not intend to use it then not need to license it. If OP intended to use it and I guess he could in then it needs a licence; anyone shoot black powder in Ireland? Have friends guards and the rule for antique is it means black powder if it can take a bullet/cartridge its not antique. Had a pub chat about WW1 guns!

Grizzly 45

Good luck getting BP down here.:)As its an explosive and not a propellant its about as easy to get as getting 6 numbers in the lottery ,or the percussion caps too.Yes,if it is a BP cartridge,its a firearm alright and needs a liscense.This isnt,its a stuff from the front smoke pole.Until there is a cop on about the difference between modern day propellants and BP expolsives,I cant see antique or vintage guns being shot much down in the South.Would fancy a nice Sharps rifle myself in a BP cartridge 45/70.

barnaman

They are pretty cool saw them (Replicas) used by Waterloo period reanactors twice in England; they use blackpowder/gun powder. Recommend seeing them if ever get a chance. Yeah doubt it might get further though then my pub argument that a Vickers machine gun is an antique and not need a licence.

Grizzly 45

Suppose we could do the old East German re enactors trick as well.They were banned from owning any type of firing firearms under the communist state.
So all they had were utter mock ups of muskets.Used to light a banger and chuck it down the muzzle....Oh wait....Bangers are illegal here as well.:rolleyes:
So a communist state was more liberal than democratic ireland on some things like fireworks.:rolleyes: