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Estate Agent Obligations

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  • 01-03-2016 2:13pm
    #1
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭


    Quick question about Estate Agent obligations to bidders.

    Long story short we saw a house we liked and informed the EA that we'd like to make a 'one time offer' to the vendor. Our offer made us the highest bigger.

    The EA was making all the right noises in terms of what the vendor was looking for and just quizzed us about our financial situation etc etc. All grand.

    Then I hear nothing from the EA for a while and then on passing the house I see 'Sale Agreed' on the sign outside. Rang the EA and it was then she told me that a higher offer was made and the vendor accepted.

    This happened 2 months ago, the advert is still online. But I got thinking - even though we said that our offer was 'one time' surely the EA should have kept us better informed? There was never a time where the EA said, you've been outbid - are you sure that was your final offer etc.

    Just wondering what people think.

    Thanks


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    #2
    Valetta
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,611 ✭✭✭Valetta


    bemak wrote: »
    Quick question about Estate Agent obligations to bidders.

    Long story short we saw a house we liked and informed the EA that we'd like to make a 'one time offer' to the vendor. Our offer made us the highest bigger.

    The EA was making all the right noises in terms of what the vendor was looking for and just quizzed us about our financial situation etc etc. All grand.

    Then I hear nothing from the EA for a while and then on passing the house I see 'Sale Agreed' on the sign outside. Rang the EA and it was then she told me that a higher offer was made and the vendor accepted.

    This happened 2 months ago, the advert is still online. But I got thinking - even though we said that our offer was 'one time' surely the EA should have kept us better informed? There was never a time where the EA said, you've been outbid - are you sure that was your final offer etc.

    Just wondering what people think.

    Thanks

    Seems to me you want to have it both ways.

    Your "one time only" offer was obviously designed to put pressure on the vendor.

    The estate agent took you at your word and moved on when a higher offer came in.

    Your strategy came back and bit you.


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    #3
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    ya i'm sure that's what it was. i've done that before with other offers previously and we always heard back regardless. probably says more about the EA and not doing more for the vendor (i.e. coaxing a bidding war)


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    #4
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    oh and we were never told we were outbid..... surely - one time offer or not, you should be informed when you're no longer the highest bidder.


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    #5
    SteM
    Registered Users Posts: 6,726 ✭✭✭SteM


    Depends on how you approached the EA in the first place. If you were very firm in your 'one time only offer' stipulation then they would have no reason to go back to you. Maybe they should have informed you that you outbid as a courtesy but they're working for the seller not the buyer, so I can see why they didn't bother.

    EAs get a lot of stick on this country, rightly so, but they do meet a lot of people that are difficult to deal with - they generally steer clear of them as sometimes it's just not worth the hassle.


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    #6
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    wouldn't have been that firm with them - but it's open to interpretation. think next time we'll just add that we'd like to be kept informed of developments


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    #7
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    bemak wrote: »
    oh and we were never told we were outbid..... surely - one time offer or not, you should be informed when you're no longer the highest bidder.

    You made a "one time offer" and it wasn't accepted. What's the point of saying its a one time offer if you don't mean it? The EA took you at your word, the vendo didn't accept it and a higher offer was received, what is your issue? Do you think the EA shouldn't have believed you?


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    #8
    Speedwell
    Registered Users Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭Speedwell


    "This is our one and only offer. But let us know how things go in case we lied."


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    #9
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    davo10 wrote: »
    You made a "one time offer" and it wasn't accepted. What's the point of saying its a one time offer if you don't mean it? The EA took you at your word, the vendo didn't accept it and a higher offer was received, what is your issue? Do you think the EA shouldn't have believed you?

    actually all that was necessary was a "sorry to inform you but you've been outbid on the house. keep an eye out in our office, we often come across properties in your price range. Regards. EA."

    Maybe I just expect a higher level of professionalism because that's what I expect from myself. A quick rapid fire email like that keeps future business in mind.


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    #10
    SteM
    Registered Users Posts: 6,726 ✭✭✭SteM


    bemak wrote: »
    actually all that was necessary was a "sorry to inform you but you've been outbid on the house. keep an eye out in our office, we often come across properties in your price range. Regards. EA."

    Maybe I just expect a higher level of professionalism because that's what I expect from myself. A quick rapid fire email like that keeps future business in mind.

    Yeah, or they think that if they shoot you an email like that you will come back for other viewings with more 'one time only' offers. Like I say, sometimes it's not worth the hassle dealing with certain people. They do want to deal with people that show some flexibility.


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    #11
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    SteM wrote: »
    Yeah, or they think that if they shoot you an email like that you will come back for other viewings with more 'one time only' offers. Like I say, sometimes it's not worth the hassle dealing with certain people. They do want to deal with people that show some flexibility.

    i suppose in the brief description i've given I can see how you might think that. thanks for getting back to me.


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    #12
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    bemak wrote: »
    actually all that was necessary was a "sorry to inform you but you've been outbid on the house. keep an eye out in our office, we often come across properties in your price range. Regards. EA."

    Maybe I just expect a higher level of professionalism because that's what I expect from myself. A quick rapid fire email like that keeps future business in mind.

    "One time offer", those three words are the reason why you didn't get the property and why the EA didn't keep you informed.

    The EA showed exemplary professionalism to both you and the vendor, s(he) didn't bother you again when a higher bid was received, you made it clear that was your only bid, and the vendor was probably informed that you would not be making a higher bid.


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    #13
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    davo10 wrote:
    The EA showed exemplary professionalism to both you and the vendor, s(he) didn't bother you again when a higher bid was received, you made it clear that was your only bid, and the vendor was probably informed that you would not be making a higher bid.

    davo10 wrote:
    "One time offer", those three words are the reason why you didn't get the property and why the EA didn't keep you informed.


    I still think there was a lack of common courtesy of informing us we were no longer the highest bidder. We were lining up engineers and solicitors because we had been given the impression that were we on the money. So no it wasn't "exemplary professionalism".


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    #14
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,407 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    bemak wrote: »
    I still think there was a lack of common courtesy of informing us we were no longer the highest bidder. We were lining up engineers and solicitors because we had been given the impression that were we on the money. So no it wasn't "exemplary professionalism".

    Never line up a survey unless you go sale agreed.
    The EA could have prompted a bidding war here, but as you said it was your final offer, he didn't, I think that's professional.

    EA's come in for some stick over the years and yet when they do something by the book, they still get the stick thrown at them.

    Lesson learned OP, you now know in future that hard ball plays don't always win, sometimes they do though.

    In all honesty, would you have increased your offer?


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    #15
    Butters1979
    Registered Users Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭Butters1979


    Is it because you would have bid higher or is it because you just wanted to know you didn't get it?


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    #16
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,218 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    bemak wrote: »
    ya i'm sure that's what it was. i've done that before with other offers previously and we always heard back regardless. probably says more about the EA and not doing more for the vendor (i.e. coaxing a bidding war)

    How do you start a bidding war with one person only making a one time offer?


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    #17
    PhoenixParker
    Registered Users Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭PhoenixParker


    godtabh wrote: »
    How do you start a bidding war with one person only making a one time offer?

    Or with a guy who stated that he opened with his highest bid?


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    #18
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    <SNIP> just wanted to know if there was an obligation on the EA to tell me that I was outbid. it's not actually about losing the house - we put in a one time offer cos that was our max and 25k above the previous offer. on speaking with the EA two other bidders came in 2 weeks after our offer and drove it up another 25k.

    thanks for yer comments though. appreciate it.


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    #19
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    Butters1979 wrote: »
    Is it because you would have bid higher or is it because you just wanted to know you didn't get it?

    ya just to know that we were outbid. my question is about the process - not my personal bidding tactic.


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    #20
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    godtabh wrote: »
    How do you start a bidding war with one person only making a one time offer?

    missed the point


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    #21
    Butters1979
    Registered Users Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭Butters1979


    Even if you told the EA it was your final bid, I would still expect them to let you know your were outbid. As a matter of courtesy in business this is a fair expectations. Why wouldn't he? Save a phone call?

    A lot of people seem to be picking up on your "bidding tactic'" and don't like it without actually thinking about it.

    If it was the OP's max limit then surely he was right to say it was a one off offer. Telling the truth isn't a "tactic".


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    #22
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    Butters1979 wrote: »
    Even if you told the EA it was your final bid, I would still expect them to let you know your were outbid. As a matter of courtesy in business this is a fair expectations. Why wouldn't he? Save a phone call?

    A lot of people seem to be picking up on your "bidding tactic'" and don't like it without actually thinking about it.

    If it was the OP's max limit then surely he was right to say it was a one off offer. Telling the truth isn't a "tactic".


    i've no problem with our approach not working but it's as you say - just let us know that we were no longer the highest bidder. it's not a big ask.


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    #23
    ChickCave
    Registered Users Posts: 31 ✭ChickCave


    You never know what's happening in the background. I was bidding on a house a few years back. There were 2 of us bidding then outbidding each other etc.. When it got to the end of the process and the other bidder bowed out the EA told us that the seller had already committed to selling to a family member and had only put the house on the market to see how much they could get for it and decide what to charge said family member for the house. Bad form in my opinion.


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    #24
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    ChickCave wrote: »
    You never know what's happening in the background. I was bidding on a house a few years back. There were 2 of us bidding then outbidding each other etc.. When it got to the end of the process and the other bidder bowed out the EA told us that the seller had already committed to selling to a family member and had only put the house on the market to see how much they could get for it and decide what to charge said family member for the house. Bad form in my opinion.

    that is unreal!


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    #25
    sapper
    Registered Users Posts: 423 ✭✭sapper


    I've had that happen to me too.

    Also just to point out that chances are its not the EA messing you around, its the vendor. A good agent acts on instruction from his client only. Maybe the people selling the house told the EA not to bother with you and crack on and sell the house. There are plenty of people out there selling who dont want to bother with more negotiations, viewings etc for the sake of a few grand.

    And another thought - maybe the other bidder beat you at your own game and made an offer on condition the house was taken off the market immediately.

    You dont know whats happening and you cant assume that someone is being malicious - its just a transaction


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    #26
    seamie78
    Registered Users Posts: 900 ✭✭✭seamie78


    something similar happened to me a few months back, looking at a house was in the process of arranging full mortgage approval, spoke to the estate agent saying I was doing the same prior to making an offer and asked to be informed of any offers, it went sale agreed within a day or two, it was two days later that I spotted the sign. I assumed at the time the buyer must have come in with the full asking price. It turned out as per the PPR it was sold for 20% less than asking. surely the Ea has an obligation to the vendor to maximise the price, and that would surely involve letting all genuine interested parties know if a bid has been made.


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    #27
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    bemak wrote: »
    i've no problem with our approach not working but it's as you say - just let us know that we were no longer the highest bidder. it's not a big ask.

    There's a lot of messing/naivety/gombeenery on both sides of property transactions. It's very often it's nothing to do with the estate agents

    In this case it looks as if there was a lot of interest in this property or a very interested and perhaps more financially sound option for the estate agent. You could have made yourself aware of this before giving your "one time offer" by enquiring about the bidding process to date, the financial standing of the other bidders, the position of the seller and the asking price relative to sold prices in the area.

    From the description you've given so far and your response to advice offered, I'm afraid you come across as a very naieve to the process and I can see why the estate agent didn't bother contacting you again. I suggest you digest what's been advised here, take a step back and think hard about a one time offer again unless the conditions suit this very rarely to be used tactic with the property market as it is now


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    #28
    bemak
    Registered Users Posts: 890 ✭✭✭bemak


    Barely Hedged wrote: »
    There's a lot of messing/naivety/gombeenery on both sides of property transactions. It's very often it's nothing to do with the estate agents

    In this case it looks as if there was a lot of interest in this property or a very interested and perhaps more financially sound option for the estate agent. You could have made yourself aware of this before giving your "one time offer" by enquiring about the bidding process to date, the financial standing of the other bidders, the position of the seller and the asking price relative to sold prices in the area.

    From the description you've given so far and your response to advice offered, I'm afraid you come across as a very naieve to the process and I can see why the estate agent didn't bother contacting you again. I suggest you digest what's been advised here, take a step back and think hard about a one time offer again unless the conditions suit this very rarely to be used tactic with the property market as it is now

    well see I was being honest when I said 'one time offer'. It was our max and it made us the highest bidder. How is that being naive?

    I'm not annoyed at losing out - we clearly came up against a stronger bidder. Fair enough. What annoyed me was that we were never informed that we had been outbid. We wouldn't have gone any further with it because we had been maxed out but surely as a bidder the very least we were entitled to was to know that our bid was no longer the highest!


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    #29
    ChickCave
    Registered Users Posts: 31 ✭ChickCave


    All of the above being said there should be no reason why the EA, out of professional courtesy, can't make a simple phone call to let you know what's happening with the house your interested in. And from the EAs point of view, your looking to buy a house and he's in the business of selling houses so it would make sense for him to have a good relationship with you with the hopes of helping you to find another house in the future.

    I don't think this is naïve at all.


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    #30
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    bemak wrote: »
    well see I was being honest when I said 'one time offer'. It was our max and it made us the highest bidder. How is that being naive?

    I'm not annoyed at losing out - we clearly came up against a stronger bidder. Fair enough. What annoyed me was that we were never informed that we had been outbid. We wouldn't have gone any further with it because we had been maxed out but surely as a bidder the very least we were entitled to was to know that our bid was no longer the highest!

    I suggest you talk to somebody who has sold a house before to gain some perspective. The house you were bidding on obviously attracted a lot of interest, from what has been described in the previous posts. In this context, you're offer was not taken seriously. Why would an estate agent respond to non serious bidders, particularly one that was capped and significantly below the final best offer. The estate agent did nothing wrong and you need to stop directing your frustration at them and move on.

    As has been pointed out several times now, your bidding strategy failed and you're looking to blame somebody. You're blame is directed at their supposed uprofessionalism but unfortunately you have nobody to blame but yourself. There has been a lot of good, simple advice offered in this thread


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    #31
    saabsaab
    Registered Users Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Hard to know what is going on with some auctioneers/sellers. Yep he should have e-mailed that you were no longer the high bidder and thank you for your interest even taking your offer as final.

    I had a bid on a place that was higher that the last bid but the EA said that they would go with the prior offer, for some reason I said to contact me if they pulled out as I was still interested, It turns out that this other bid pulled out but the EA never came back to me, I found this out by accident from a neighbour some time later - the place never sold in the end.


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