GRPAI

gunny123

jb88 wrote: »

NASRPC refusing to discuss the GRPAI at its meeting, a big mistake.
Any rational individual would openly embrace a group trying to improve Gallery shooting in Ireland, but not this current committee.

It will lead to its downfall and possibly even the demise of the NASRPC in terms of Gallery shooting in Ireland if they keep this up.

The GRPAI are not the competition but the NASRPC is allowing this to happen.

NASRPC - Time to wake up here please. But I guess the good people on the committee are controlled by the few.

There will be an association for every shooter in Ireland soon if all this nonsense doesn't stop soon. Talk about alphabet soup.

hexosan

New group the GGWLTSTATASS (Guys & Girls who like to shoot on Tuesdays and Thursday's and sometimes Saturday) .

BattleCorp

Tinybelle wrote: »

I see we have to register for the NASRPC shoot in Harbour House this weekend. I tried to register, but the site was very difficult to follow. Finally I get to my disciplines only to find the times allocated don't suit me at all.

I hate that my hobby has become a hassle. I hate that I must register prior to each competition. I hate that I must keep an eagle eye out for notice of registration and register immediately to ensure a place. I understand that small host clubs may need registration but Harbour House is large enough to accommodate any and all that arrive to participate, and have done so successfully in the past.

This registration business and the fiasco of the Nationals ( first I was in the top ten, then I wasn't, then I was again - I mean how hard is it to add up 3 numbers) had left me totally disillusioned with the new NASRPC. I wish competitions would return to the old way, hassle free and enjoyable. I am seriously considering halting participation in future NASRPC competitions, it's just not worth it.

25% of each line approx. will be kept free for walk-ons (people who haven't registered). That's what I've been told anyway.

I found the registration page straightforward enough to navigate. I'll give it a chance and see how things work out. You are right though, you have to be quick off the mark if you want to get times that suit you.

Tinybelle

I am delighted to hear that 25% of all lines are being kept for non registered competitors. I believed from the NASRPC web site that it was mandatory. I continue to believe that pre registration goes against the core ethos of inclusion as stated by the NASRPC (past and present). Many members of clubs are of the older generation who may not have competence or access to computers. This pre registration issue will discourage many usual competitors from attending NASRPC events.
I envisage in the not too distant future, when registered people don't show up for a competition (for whatever reason) that they will require us to pay upfront.
This, to my mind is akin to the Water issue. The NASRPC need to listen to its membership before it drives it's members to other associations.

Valhalla18

The spare slots on the line are supposed to be for the ro's first so as they can get some shooting done aswel.( After that any space left is up for grabs.) Thats according to previous emails from D Keogh. As far as i am aware this was done because of complaints by various ro's who kept turning up but got very little chance to shoot. Correct me if im wrong.

clivej

Tinybelle wrote: »

I see we have to register for the NASRPC shoot in Harbour House this weekend. I tried to register, but the site was very difficult to follow. Finally I get to my disciplines only to find the times allocated don't suit me at all.

I hate that my hobby has become a hassle. I hate that I must register prior to each competition. I hate that I must keep an eagle eye out for notice of registration and register immediately to ensure a place. I understand that small host clubs may need registration but Harbour House is large enough to accommodate any and all that arrive to participate, and have done so successfully in the past.

This registration business and the fiasco of the Nationals ( first I was in the top ten, then I wasn't, then I was again - I mean how hard is it to add up 3 numbers) had left me totally disillusioned with the new NASRPC. I wish competitions would return to the old way, hassle free and enjoyable. I am seriously considering halting participation in future NASRPC competitions, it's just not worth it.

Tinybelle wrote: »

I am delighted to hear that 25% of all lines are being kept for non registered competitors. I believed from the NASRPC web site that it was mandatory. I continue to believe that pre registration goes against the core ethos of inclusion as stated by the NASRPC (past and present). Many members of clubs are of the older generation who may not have competence or access to computers. This pre registration issue will discourage many usual competitors from attending NASRPC events.
I envisage in the not too distant future, when registered people don't show up for a competition (for whatever reason) that they will require us to pay upfront.
This, to my mind is akin to the Water issue. The NASRPC need to listen to its membership before it drives it's members to other associations.

The next part is you WILL have to pay upfront with PayPal. It's the next step to prevent people pre-reg'ing and not turning up to shoot.

I don't agree with the pre-reg at all.

clivej

The pre-reg goes against the ethos of "Open to all shooters" at the NASRPC national events.

How can people that are not on.....
The NASRPC mailing list
Don't do Face Book
Don't do social media
Not good with the comptuer
..... know when the pre-reg is up on-line to complete????

It's all a load of sh!te and in my opinion it will reduce the people attending the national comps. In one swoop the NASRPC have managed to alienate themselves from it's members AGAIN.

It's looking more and more like the GRPAI have the correct idea of separating Gallery shooting from the NASRPC.
Such a pity that our national committee have managed to fcuk up a well oiled organisation in such a short time

Tinybelle

I wholeheartedly agree with everything you said clivej. Bravo... you said what I and many others are thinking.

Boxer1

clivej wrote:

It's all a load of sh!te and in my opinion it will reduce the people attending the national comps. In one swoop the NASRPC have managed to alienate themselves from it's members AGAIN.

clivej wrote:

How can people that are not on..... The NASRPC mailing list Don't do Face Book Don't do social media Not good with the comptuer ..... know when the pre-reg is up on-line to complete????

clivej wrote:

The pre-reg goes against the ethos of "Open to all shooters" at the NASRPC national events.

clivej wrote:

It's looking more and more like the GRPAI have the correct idea of separating Gallery shooting from the NASRPC. Such a pity that our national committee have managed to fcuk up a well oiled organisation in such a short time

Tinybelle wrote:

I wholeheartedly agree with everything you said clivej. Bravo... you said what I and many others are thinking.

OK lads it looks like you are not up for any change no progress, or are you just as a point against any change. I rekon the two of you meet every week to organise and have a bitch fest. Tut tut tut, Ah well, in my humble opinion the only way forward is with change and the benefits are there to be seen. Ease of entry to any competition ease of payment is hopefully next. One major good point about these two changes it cuts out the time wasters and the genuine competition shooter prevails.

jb88

Boxer1 wrote: »

OK lads it looks like you are not up for any change no progress, or are you just as a point against any change. I rekon the two of you meet every week to organise and have a bitch fest. Tut tut tut, Ah well, in my humble opinion the only way forward is with change and the benefits are there to be seen. Ease of entry to any competition ease of payment is hopefully next. One major good point about these two changes it cuts out the time wasters and the genuine competition shooter prevails.

Genuine shooters don't prevail in relation to this, it makes it less accessible to new entrants and makes it elitist. I have explained these concerns to the VP already. Yes to people familiar with technology who don't have diverted and blocked emails cleared into a junk folder its great.

Don't get me wrong I like technology and its a good system, just not suitable for all competitors. For some clubs due to the growth in Gallery shooting if the club doesn't have the bays and facilities, and you haven't registered you may not get to compete.

Nearly happened to me last time out and only for cancellations on the day, I was lucky it would have been a wasted trip.

So clubs expand your facilities and have your members take a more active interest in Gallery and promote it locally. The way its going now, a lot of the clubs will just get left behind, members of the NASRPC or not.

If you cant provide the facilities whats the point in hosting a competition for 150 people who all want to do 8 or 10 comps in one day? With 12 bays available and the average comp time is a min 20 minutes. Do the math, it just wont work. Just shy of 100 turned up for our club competition a couple of weeks back, that's a local club league.

The risk of not having enough comps to qualify for certain events, its things competitive shooters don't need with the rest of the problems going on at the moment

Also Boxer 1 don't follow your issue on genuine time waster, sure if you turn up at an event registered or not your not a time waster, but if you REGISTER and don't turn up what does that make you?????

Oh and the bitching session is around 11.30am on most Saturdays, you are more than welcome to join. Might give you a practical insight into all the sh1t people have to deal with, and our members position on lots of things.

Like the technology and detail and all the hard work gone into the registration process, its excellent, but always ask is it necessary. Its never been up until now.

clivej

Boxer1 wrote: »

OK lads it looks like you are not up for any change no progress, or are you just as a point against any change. I rekon the two of you meet every week to organise and have a bitch fest. Tut tut tut, Ah well, in my humble opinion the only way forward is with change and the benefits are there to be seen. Ease of entry to any competition ease of payment is hopefully next. One major good point about these two changes it cuts out the time wasters and the genuine competition shooter prevails.

So why won't you meet with the GRPAI???
If your all for making changes for the better??????

Or keep writing cheques your arse can't cash???

Tackleberry.

Talked to a committee member today, about HH shoot this weekend, he knows that i dislike the pre reg for the shoots, but we discussed it some bit among other things shooting, and in fairness i can now see advantages to pre reg, I was able to plan my day really i now know that i dont need to be up early and on the road (which is just over an hour of a spin to HH) i know when im on the line and when i finished and can only guess when ill be home...hopefully after a great day..and apparently if all turn up that have pre reg for this shoot it will be some what of a record breaker... so really lots of people are pre registering ...

Tinybelle

Boxer1 wrote: »

OK lads it looks like you are not up for any change no progress, or are you just as a point against any change. I rekon the two of you meet every week to organise and have a bitch fest. Tut tut tut, Ah well, in my humble opinion the only way forward is with change and the benefits are there to be seen. Ease of entry to any competition ease of payment is hopefully next. One major good point about these two changes it cuts out the time wasters and the genuine competition shooter prevails.

Not all change is good. If change is for changes sake or for the convenience of the committee and not its members then change is not acceptable. This pre registration change is not convenient nor helpful to many competitors.

I have noticed that people who can not defend their actions resort to personal defamation on individuals, namely myself and clivej. For the avoidance of doubt, I have not had any contact, what so ever, with clivej since the Nationals. I have neither the time nor inclination to participate in a ' bitch fest'. To this end, Boxer1, I expect a public apology (not a PM). I am not a keyboard warrior, and I have no problem in saying what I think straight to anyone's face.

As regards to your humble opinion, which I find condescending and derogatory, you say the only way forward is through change. Why? If it ain't broke don't fix it. The 'old' way of turning up to shoot at times convenient for the competitors has worked perfectly up until now. No one ever complained about it, so what's there to change. It seems to me, that it will be more convenient for the committee and therefore they want to railroad the members into submission.

How dare you call paying members of the NASRPC, who turn up to competitions as 'time wasters'. No one who travels, waits in line, pays entry fees and participates in NASRPC organised competitions should ever be called time wasters. We are customers, without us, there is no NASRPC. Maybe it's time the customers moved to a more convenient organisation where we will be treated with dignity and respect.

Cass

To get back on topic:

From the NASRPC website.

So perhaps someone can clear something up for me. The NASRPC were always considered the NGB. This status was "muddied", if only for a moment, with the claim from the GRPAI. Then came the claim that the IGRF did not recognise the NASRPC. Then the above. Now claims can be made but are nothing more than wanting or hoping if its unsubstantiated. The NASRPC have re-enforced their claim as rightful NGB by saying they are the ones listed on the IGRF site along with being the representative for Gallery rifle and pistol on the SSAI/FISA and FCP over the years.

The GRPAI did not exist before February of this year (2016). The website was only set up on the 16th Feb (just type in GRPAI for results) exactly one month after the AGM. The site originally listed the committee members but quickly removed these for some reason. Why?

As soon as the site went live the GRPAI claimed to be the NGB. When did they gain this status? Did they get it from the international body? Is it recognised by the FISA/FCP/ISC? If so why does the international site not list them? So with all this of this why do the GRPAI still claim to be the NGB?

Also the GRPAI say that they are not an association of clubs nor do they represent clubs. How can they be an NGB if they don't do any of the things an NGB should be doing?


I just cannot get my head around this. It makes no sense. So please, someone, break it down for me. Not some "PR" reply, an answer to the questions above would be appreciated. As i've said already it seems backlash from the last AGM.

TheAppleMan

I am not expecting an answer here. I am saying that it is entirely odd that I cant get any info as to why the GRPAI committee members' names were removed form the website. It is odd that I am unable to see who these individuals are. They are referenced here, on the website and on Facebook but not named there. This is info that should be easily accessible where an entity is claiming to be an NGB!

There is no info as to how the GRPAI gained NGB status, who they got it from.

The whole thing looks very cloak and dagger which is silly.

For all I know this was started by an anti my sport lobbyist with a flair for sh1t stirring!

Tackleberry.

I just happened to copy this at the time...
3 March GRPAI Facebook page

We are pleased to announce the formation of the Gallery Rifle & Pistol Association of Ireland (GRPAI) which is the National Governing Body for Gallery Rifle and Pistol target shooting sports in Ireland.

The National Association of Sporting Rifle and Pistol Clubs have been caretakers for Gallery Rifle in Ireland for the past few years and we would like to thank them for what they have achieved to date and we wish them well with their objectives going forward.

As competitive Gallery Rifle & Pistol shooters we find the need to regularise the situation in Ireland to ensure the future and further development of Gallery Rifle & Pistol sports.  Therefore, in line with many other shooting disciplines in Ireland including the WA1500 Association of Ireland and the National Rimfire Benchrest Association of Ireland we have formed a dedicated discipline focused organisation tasked only with the objectives set out below.

Gallery Rifle in Ireland, while under the umbrella of the NASRPC, was always kept separate, had its own rules in relation to Squad selection, Team criteria, Captain selection and our plan is to grow and improve all of this though the Gallery Rifle & Pistol Association of Ireland.

Our association will not be competing with the NASRPC, we do not represent clubs and we are not an association of clubs.  The NASRPC have our full support and we look forward to working with them going forward.

Our committee includes the current Gallery Rifle Team captains, the current National Champions and the previous Gallery Rifle Co-ordinator.

We intend to develop and promote Gallery Rifle & Pistol Shooting sports in Ireland.

We look forward to working with Gallery Rifle & Pistol shooters in order to promote and develop our sports in a positive manner and we also look forward to working with clubs and other organisations as appropriate including the NASRPC.

Please do not hesitate to contact any of our committee below should you need to discuss any aspect of this further.  Email enquiries may be sent to info@grpai.ie

Mark Nolan
Chairman & PRO

Jimmy Byrne
Current Gallery Rifle Smallbore Team Captain

Ray Holohan
Treasurer & Training Officer

Martin Hayes
Secretary and Current Gallery Rifle Centrefire Team Captain

Glenn Forde
Gallery Rifle Squad Co-Ordinator

TheAppleMan

Thank you Tackleberry. A clear direction for further questions.

gunny123

If i set up a shooting organisation in my garden shed, can i claim that its the national governing body ?

Boxer1

jb88 wrote:

Nearly happened to me last time out and only for cancellations on the day, I was lucky it would have been a wasted trip.

You need to pay more attention to your chosen sport and stop bitching. I think all these changes are for the better. The new NDC as I know him will make sure all shooters get a fair crack Even though he can be a bit cranky he's OK really when you get to know him!! Any shooter willing to put the time in to improve their shooting will be rewarded, approached and encouraged to compete and helped with the new registration system if needs be!!! **** even help can be organised for you seasoned old farts

Boxer1

clivej wrote:

So why won't you meet with the GRPAI??? If your all for making changes for the better??????

clivej wrote:

Or keep writing cheques your arse can't cash???

Tinybelle wrote:

I have noticed that people who can not defend their actions resort to personal defamation on individuals, namely myself and clivej. For the avoidance of doubt, I have not had any contact, what so ever, with clivej since the Nationals. I have neither the time nor inclination to participate in a ' bitch fest'. To this end, Boxer1, I expect a public apology (not a PM). I am not a keyboard warrior, and I have no problem in saying what I think straight to anyone's face.

Tinybelle wrote:

How dare you call paying members of the NASRPC, who turn up to competitions as 'time wasters'. No one who travels, waits in line, pays entry fees and participates in NASRPC organised competitions should ever be called time wasters. We are customers, without us, there is no NASRPC. Maybe it's time the customers moved to a more convenient organisation where we will be treated with dignity and respect.

Tinybelle one thing I will never do is apologize for my opinion there mine and that's that. Also please don't try to twist my words, can you please point out in my post where I mention the NASRPC or any other organisation????? I have been involved in shooting for many years and other sports also In all walks of life or sports you have the time wasters they are a byproduct. I have said this already the genuine shooter will prevail over the time waster it's a fact not an opinion. Look at all the other sporting organisations in the world where would they be if the time wasters prevailed???. I will be expecting your apology soon

Sparks

gunny123 wrote: »

If i set up a shooting organisation in my garden shed, can i claim that its the national governing body ?

Yes, but the question of who recognises it as being the NGB does arise.
BTW, I'm not being a smartarse here, but don't slag off humble beginnings. Some of us remember the locations where some of these alphabettispaghetti bodies began and they didn't all sign their constitutions in Dublin Castle with the President of Ireland in attendance while a marching band played outside - and some bodies with reasonably well-announced beginnings fell flat completely. (Also, my home range is a converted hayshed so :P )
I go by how they're run. I've found it's a better indicator.

Tinybelle

Boxer1 wrote: »

Tinybelle one thing I will never do is apologize for my opinion there mine and that's that. Also please don't try to twist my words, can you please point out in my post where I mention the NASRPC or any other organisation????? I have been involved in shooting for many years and other sports also In all walks of life or sports you have the time wasters they are a byproduct. I have said this already the genuine shooter will prevail over the time waster it's a fact not an opinion. Look at all the other sporting organisations in the world where would they be if the time wasters prevailed???. I will be expecting your apology soon

Boxer1 in my original post I complained about the NASRPC 's new requirement namely preregistration. I specifically named the Harbour House shoot and I expressly named the NASRPC on several occasions in my post. I did not refer to any other organisation.
When you replied to my post defending these changes it is assumed you were also referring to the NASRPC. You did not name any other associations and their changes to preregistration.
Let me get this straight....You wish me to apologise to you for You for making a false accusation against me
- meeting clivej weekly to organise and have a bitch fest.....Tut tut tut.
Let me tell you, it will be a cold day in hell before I ever apologise to you for you insulting me.

jb88

On the issues of the NGB and a Representation of clubs being in charge of a national shooting association and not the participants it will all be decided on an international level soon enough. Im assured the GRPAI will triumph. (No matter really I think most of us have already decided where we stand on that)

As a shooter I thank everyone on the NASRPC committee's for all of their hard work and I will continue to support them in what capacity I can as a shooter.

GRPAI with the majority of Gallery Shooters for the Gallery Shooters run and governed by Gallery shooters will be in charge of their own affairs and representation. Being told what to do by the Clubs representative committee, NASRPC, that's over in that respect.

The NASRPC failed to even meet or discuss with the GRPAI. Point blank refused.


Not listening to Shooters is what has failed here, and I for one don't want someone who is not even a club member or even a shooter given a voting card at an AGM and being told to vote against something they don't even understand.

The new NASRPC committee have made some amends and a lot of hard work has gone into making some changes, maybe not the fake facebook page, which was removed, nor certain issues at a national event, not connected to online registration by the way ;-) which upon reflection is a positive change which needed to happen and a lot of hard work went into it. Thanks to those involved and look forward to even more improvements to come

But I don't think the NASRPC Committee who took office this year grasped the idea that its not the clubs but the members who are in charge and like it or not they have had no alternative but to empower themselves.

Shooters wont have to choose sides because there are none.
Some clubs who are members of the NASRPC don't have Gallery facilities, yet they decided mine and many other s fate. Not exactly fair would you think.

Clubs will be represented by the NASRPC and Gallery Shooters by the GRPAI.

So in most instances if not all, your a member of both if your a Gallery shooter. You can go directly to the GRPAI committee to get assistance and training and help promote your Gallery sport. There is training, in fact its been ongoing with practice most Saturdays in Harbour House since the new year and that I am told will continue every Saturday.

I hope it will expand to other clubs in fact I think its been in Hilltop for years.

If its a club issue you go to your NASRPC Club rep of which there are two in each club and they can assist.


For the record I am not a committee member in any respect just a club member who wants change and looks like that's going to happen

Cass

jb88 wrote: »

On the issues of the NGB and a Representation of clubs being in charge of a national shooting association and not the participants it will all be decided on an international level soon enough. Im assured the GRPAI will triumph. (No matter really I think most of us have already decided where we stand on that)

How so? Is there some meeting, vote, discussion?

Also, and someone correct me if my thinking is wrong, you say that the participants (IOW members of clubs) are not represented, but that the association is controlled by representatives of the various clubs that make up the NASRPC. Is this not representation? IOW do the participants not elect their club reps, and then the representatives represent their clubs concerns/needs at association meetings? How can the GRPAI be an NGB without club support/affiliation?

GRPAI with the majority of Gallery Shooters for the Gallery Shooters run and governed by Gallery shooters will be in charge of their own affairs and representation. Being told what to do by the Clubs representative committee, NASRPC, that's over in that respect.

Again, how so? You say it's over so has the above change already been implemented? I'd also repeat what question on clubs reps sitting on the association committee being representatives of the individual clubs concerns.

The NASRPC failed to even meet or discuss with the GRPAI. Point blank refused.

From my own opinion/point of view i think this is a mistake. I can understand their not wanting to meet given how the GRPAI have introduced themselves to the world, but i think a meeting would have been beneficial.

Not listening to Shooters is what has failed here, ...........

Is this recent? By that i mean all the complaints about how ineffective the NASRPC has been at representing the needs of "ordinary shooters" (hate that expression) seem to be happening since the recent AGM. Is it the new committee people have a problem with or do these issues stem from the old committee, in which case why was the GRPAI set up one month after the AGM, and why were these issues not brought up at the AGM?

But I don't think the NASRPC Committee who took office this year grasped the idea that its not the clubs but the members who are in charge and like it or not they have had no alternative but to empower themselves.

So it's the new committee that is the problem? Would an EGM solve this? Can an EGM be called?

Clubs will be represented by the NASRPC and Gallery Shooters by the GRPAI.

I still don't understand how this can work.

The GRPAI, by its very name, is not just Gallery rifle, but pistol shooting. By taking control of both of these disciplines they effectively make the NASRPC redundant if not obsolete. At the very least it resigns the NASRPC from NGB to association with no NGB status/recognition.

So in most instances if not all, your a member of both if your a Gallery shooter.

And pistol shooters?

If its a club issue you go to your NASRPC Club rep of which there are two in each club and they can assist.

Is this not how it already works in all clubs regardless of which association/NGB they are affiliated to?

I hate that i have to do this, but i need to once again clarify that i'm not taking sides. I'm asking out of curiosity and for the sake of transparency as to what is happening.

From my point of view it seems that the disciplines involved are being split unnecessarily into yet another group and that this split will in effect cause the demise of one or the other groups.

Tackleberry.

My 2 cents,
The NGB that is currently held by the NASRPC.
I believe that a former NASRPC/IGRF committee member taught he might just swing the NGB status the way of the GRPAI with the help of one of English IGRF committee members, this never happened and came as a surprise to the rest of the IGRF committee members, this issue is now closed, NASRPC have the NGB and this has been confirmed by the IGRF.

As for Gallery Rifle shooters there are plenty attending the NASRPC shoots, Harbour House only last weekend was up in the number of shooters attending and given the weather it says a lot that the NASRPC are doing something right.

NASRPC Failing to listen to shooters?? I don't agree, I got a timely response to a recent email answering my concerns, my concerns where Pre Reg didn't like it, but again the answer is also is seen in the attendance of the HH shoot last weekend, also did you read there recent newsletter
http://nasrpc.ie/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/NASRPC-Newsletter-March-2016.pdf

I won't be attending any GRPAI shoot, the hole thing stinks of an old committee (even if it's behind the scene) looking to hold on to some sort power/control which is nuts,no one wins.

Anybody know why the GRPAI failed to turn up to the recent meeting they where invited to by the NASRPC?

The GRPAI can't continue to play nice guy telling us they only intend on promoting shooting when they have not given any reason or example as to why the NASRPC can't continue as it has, the only thing the GRPAI are promoting is a split.

targetx

Tackleberry. wrote: »

Anybody know why the GRPAI failed to turn up to the recent meeting they where invited to by the NASRPC?

The NASRPC did not invite the GRPAI to any meeting. In fact the GRPAI have now made several requests to the NASRPC to arrange a meeting which the NASRPC have refused.

Tackleberry. wrote: »

The GRPAI can't continue to play nice guy telling us they only intend on promoting shooting when they have not given any reason or example as to why the NASRPC can't continue as it has, the only thing the GRPAI are promoting is a split.

I will now post a detailed letter which was sent to the NASRPC recently pointing out the advantages to them of the GRPAI becoming the NGB. The Committee of Harbour House Sports Club offered to deliver this to the NASRPC at a recent meeting with the NASRPC but they refused to accept it.

targetx

Email sent to NASRPC and others on 24th March 2016 following their refusal to accept our Statement at a meeting with Harbour House on 23rd March 2016:

Dear fellow shooters,

The Gallery Rifle & Pistol Association of Ireland (GRPAI) was recently established to promote and develop Gallery Rifle & Pistol sports in Ireland. To do this effectively, we have sought recognition from the IGRF as the National Governing Body for Gallery Rifle and Pistol target shooting sports in Ireland. Our committee includes the current International Team Captains in Smallbore and Centrefire Gallery Rifle, the previous Irish Gallery Rifle Co-ordinator and the current National Champions in Smallbore Gallery Rifle.

Our objectives are clear and focused, we will promote and develop Gallery Rifle & Pistol sports in Ireland, including the training and development of new competitors and the management of the International Teams.

We feel that the NASRPC who are primarily an association of Clubs and involved in the political representation of target shooting sports have not had the resources during the past few years to focus on Gallery Rifle & Pistol and the sports are therefore not experiencing the expected growth in new competitors.

We believe that the NASRPC have unwittingly brought the sports of Gallery Rifle & Pistol into disrepute in a number of ways recently and these issues have convinced us that a new and focused NGB is required to take responsibility for Gallery Rifle & Pistol in Ireland.

Furthermore, the NASRPC have indicated that individuals involved in the GRPAI Committee will be excluded from the National Teams if we do not abandon our proposal. This goes against all Gallery Rifle rules and regulations that exist in Ireland today. We feel that this negative action will cause untold damage to the National Teams and the international reputation of Irish Gallery Rifle shooting.

We have at all times acted responsibly and professionally and intend to work in a positive manner with the NASRPC and all other shooting bodies to develop Irish target shooting sports in a safe, sustainable and professional manner. We have also made it clear to the NASRPC that we recognise and respect their status as a representative body for Clubs.

We believe that our dedicated focus on Gallery Rifle and Pistol disciplines can grow the numbers of competitors and this will in turn benefit the NASRPC and their member clubs.

We are proud to have the support of Harbour House Sports Club and Hilltop Shooting Sports Club, who are the two largest Gallery Rifle & Pistol clubs in Ireland and who make up the majority of Irish competitive shooters nationally and Internationally. We also have significant support within the International Squads and we have sponsors on board who have offered to provide financial assistance towards our objectives, something that the NASRPC have never had available.

We appreciate that developments during the past few weeks may have come as a surprise to many interested parties but we wish to assure you that it is our intention to move forward in a fair and professional manner with the best interests of our shooting disciplines in mind and to ensure that the international reputation of Irish Gallery Rifle shooting is not only maintained but improved. We are greatly encouraged by the significant level of positive support and encouragement received over the past few weeks and are committed to working with all stakeholders to gain their trust and understanding.

The IGRF has requested that the two parties in Ireland discuss matters and come up with a solution internally. We have attempted to do this but unfortunately the NASRPC have refused to engage with us. The status of the Irish International event in July may now be at risk and we wish to resolve matters in order to protect that event and the status of the World Championships to be held in Ireland in 2017.

The committee of Harbour House Sports Club very kindly offered to host a meeting with the NASRPC committee last night in order to discuss the outstanding matters. We were unable to attend as the NASRPC have clearly stated that they will not engage with us. The committee of Harbour House Sports Club agreed to deliver a statement to the NASRPC on our behalf, outlining the advantages to all stakeholders of us becoming the NGB for Ireland. Unfortunately the NASRPC refused to accept the statement and refused to allow it to be read during the meeting.

Our statement is attached and we trust that it demonstrates our sincere intention to work with the NASRPC in their capacity as an association of clubs in order to advance our sporting disciplines.

We trust that this email will clarify the reasons behind our proposal and that you will consider what is in the best interests of our sports, our shooters and our relationship with our international friends and colleagues.


Yours in sport,

GRPAI

(Attachment to follow)

targetx

STATEMENT TO THE NASRPC 23rd MARCH 2016

The GRPAI would like the NASRPC to agree to our appointment as NGB for Gallery Rifle & Pistol in Ireland and for both organisations to work together in a positive manner going forward.
In seeking your agreement we would like to outline the following advantages to all stakeholders including the NASRPC. Please note that our commitment to some of the points that follow is subject to the NASRPC agreeing to our appointment as NGB and we would like to encourage this as soon as possible in order to resolve the uncertainty that surrounds the Irish International event in July and to repair the international reputation of Irish Gallery Rifle shooting which has suffered some recent damage.

- GRPAI will offer skills training in Gallery Rifle & Pistol disciplines and we believe that this can increase the number of competitors attending NASRPC competitions. There are Gallery Rifle shooters on the NASRPC committee that we would welcome the opportunity to work with on this.

- GRPAI will support the NASRPC competition calendar and National Championships and will encourage shooters to attend NASRPC competitions.

- GRPAI will agree not to hold competitions on the same weekend as any NASRPC competition event. We will run a competition calendar of our own, just like the NRBAI do. In fact, we have already discussed with the NRBAI regarding co-hosting some of their competition events.

- We understand the concerns that the NASRPC have in terms of loss of revenue and we trust that the above commitments will demonstrate that the NASRPC should not be at any risk of loss of revenue. We believe that a spirit of co-operation can benefit all parties including the NASRPC and its member clubs.

- GRPAI Committee members will play their part as Range Safety Officers at NASRPC events and will also encourage other RO’s to make this commitment. Many RO’s have already volunteered a commitment to the GRPAI. It is fair to say that the NASRPC no longer has the same pool of qualified RO’s available and we will encourage existing qualified RO’s to participate at NASRPC events.

- GRPAI will offer to co-operate with the NASRPC in the training of existing club RO’s to competition standard, this will benefit both organisations.

- Regarding the 2016 Irish International Open in July, with the best interests of the sport in mind we would like to see this event proceeding with all parties working together in order to demonstrate to the International community that we can work together in harmony and to protect the reputation of the event.

- GRPAI will review and manage the Gallery Rifle Squad & Team rules in a fair manner and will report directly to the IGRF on such matters.

- GRPAI will take responsibility for funding the International Teams.

- GRPAI will recognise results from all NASRPC competition events in terms of Gallery Rifle Squad and Team qualification, subject to those events being run to the correct standards.

- GRPAI committee will agree to a meeting with the NASRPC committee at regular intervals, for example twice each year, to discuss matters of common interest.

- We believe that NASRPC agreement to GRPAI as NGB will boost support for the NASRPC and will allow all parties to move forward in the best interests of our clubs and sports.

- We encourage the NASRPC and its member clubs to facilitate Target Shooting sports of all disciplines, not only Gallery Rifle & Pistol but Benchrest, WA1500, Sporting Rifle and Silhouettes. Some of those disciplines are in serious decline in Ireland and we feel that the NASRPC should work with each individual NGB to facilitate the promotion of all target shooting sports. We also encourage the NASRPC to facilitate the formation of a new independent NGB for Sporting Rifle.

- We believe that our proposal can allow the NASRPC to become a more focused association of Clubs and a body working in the interests of all target shooters in co-operation with relevant NGB’s. We also believe that this is in the best interests of all parties – shooters, clubs and both associations.

We welcome any feedback and opportunity for discussion. If the NASRPC can identify any disadvantages for any stakeholders then we welcome the opportunity to review same. We would like to stress the urgency of this matter so that the status of the Irish International in July and the opportunity for Ireland to host the Gallery Rifle World Championships in 2017 are not put into any further uncertainty.

GRPAI Committee

targetx

Email sent to NASRPC Friday 1st April 2016:

Dear Gerry,

In response to your statement on Facebook and on your website, we note your refusal to enter discussions with the GRPAI unless we renounce our desire to be an NGB.

As one of our key objectives is to be recognised as an NGB we cannot meet that condition, but we are willing to meet with representatives of the NASRPC with no pre-conditions on either side and with all relevant topics open for discussion. We have already made several requests to you in this regard.

We would like to remind you that the IGRF have issued a direction to both parties to have a meeting and to resolve the situation between ourselves. We are disappointed at your reluctance to follow this course of action. In addition to the IGRF, some of your affiliated clubs and the vast majority of shooters that we have spoken to would like both organisations to meet and discuss matters.

We note that you also refused to accept a document on our behalf from the committee of Harbour House last week. We subsequently provided that document to you by email and it describes clear advantages of our proposals to all stakeholders including the NASRPC. We would welcome the opportunity to discuss it with you and we are open to understanding the reasons why you might disagree with our proposals.

We hope that you might re-consider our offer to have discussions.


Yours in sport,

Cass

The GRPAI appeared on the scene just over a month ago claiming to be the NGB for gallery rifle and pistol shooting. I asked, as did others, numerous times since the start of this thread as to how they were the NGB when the NASRPC already were. I got no answers, nor did anyone else, and now this:

targetx wrote: »

To do this effectively, we have sought recognition from the IGRF as the National Governing Body for Gallery Rifle and Pistol target shooting sports in Ireland.

targetx wrote: »

The GRPAI would like the NASRPC to agree to our appointment as NGB for Gallery Rifle & Pistol in Ireland and for both organisations to work together in a positive manner going forward.

targetx wrote: »

In response to your statement on Facebook and on your website, we note your refusal to enter discussions with the GRPAI unless we renounce our desire to be an NGB.

As one of our key objectives is to be recognised as an NGB we cannot meet that condition, ,

So the short answer that i sought all this time was you're not. Not then, not now. Yet it still remains on the website that they are:

GRPAI Website wrote:

The Gallery Rifle & Pistol Association of Ireland is a new National Governing Body for Gallery Rifle & Pistol Target Shooting sports in Ireland

This does not exude professionalism and acting responsibly.

The claim the NASRPC does not want to talk seems less believable now but with that said put yourself in the shoes of the current NASRPC committee.

• You've just an AGM where the old committee resign/step down/get fired (however you want to word it) and a new committee is elected.
• Two weeks later the GRPAI website is registered unknown to you.
• You are facing a barrage of angry people that are split over the recent events of the AGM
• A couple of weeks later the GRPAI appear on the scene and make unbelievable and according to the above highlighted bits, false claims about being the NGB.
• Reasons for their appearance are cited as ineffective leadership via the committee however no distinction is made that most problems listed seem/were under the old committee.
• The appearance of the GRPAI has caused a massive rift in the NASRPC
• The goals, including the now admitted to one of becoming NGB, would effective remove the need for the NASRPC to exist and resign them to be in the position the GRPAI are now. A group of people, nothing more.

What way are people supposed to react to this? With open arms?

The timing of the website registration, the swiftness of the formation of the group, the support from ranges and RFD(s) are all too quick for something that was only brought into being in the last few weeks. IOW this had to be planned well in advance, probably when the old committee sat on the NASRPC.

The whole thing, to me, seems exactly like the problems with the so called "sports coalition". There was no worldly reason to form this "group". All it took was for the people that formed it and called for unity to simply return to recognised table and continue where things left off.

The NASRPC have the NGB, they run comps for both Gallery and pistol shooters, have recognition from the ISC and IGRF, not to mention sit on the FCP. So it begs the questions:

1. Why can the GRPAI not do what they want the NASRPC to do and be happy to promote the sport(s) and continue to follow and support the NASRPC?
2. Why the need to effectively reduce the NASRPC to what the GRPAI is now? (even less if their call for the sporting rifle section of the NASRPC to become yet ANOTHER independent NGB, are heeded)
3. Why not just support the NASRPC by joining with them to resolve these issues and remain united?
4. Most importantly why the need to be NGB at all?

Would this have anything to do with it?:

Tackleberry. wrote:

I believe that a former NASRPC/IGRF committee member taught he might just swing the NGB status the way of the GRPAI

If this is the case or has any substance to it, then it begs the question, has the GRPAI been in the works well before the AGM (or at least the notion of a GRPAI type alternative group). If so was it being kept in "reserve" should it be needed (such as after the events of the AGM when s/he or they no longer held a committee position). If so it would provide an alternative option for "them" to remain in control. If this is the case then what had this person that made them believe they had something that could guarantee this (at least in their mind).


I'm not a member and i think it has truck size holes in it, and this is only the NGB issue. There are other issues i'd take issue with if i were a member. The veil/subtle comments about not having enough ROs, but "they'll help", the issues about finances not being effected but they "will encourage shooters to continue to shoot at NASRPC events" to make sure this does not happen. They are already speaking from a position of authority, undermining the NASRPCs position while making themselves out to be the saving grace.