Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016

gosplan

Interesting point.

In Drogba's first 5 years at Chelsea, he scored 55 league goals (134 matches).

In Giroud's 4 years at Arsenal, he's scored 57 league goals (135 matches).

What's the difference?

Why did they absolutely love Drogba and so many Arsenal fans think Giroud is so beyond what we need?

I'm not saying he is or isn't either way. I just find it very interesting. They're so similar in terms of age, style of play, gpg.

Hyzepher

Maybe because he should be scoring more with the team we have behind him. Don't get me wrong. I think Giroud is great and with the right formation would excel in any team. At the moment we dont have the playing style to suit him. We could but AW is stuck witht he current formation for now.

Ol' Donie

gosplan wrote: »

Interesting point.

In Drogba's first 5 years at Chelsea, he scored 55 league goals (134 matches).

In Giroud's 4 years at Arsenal, he's scored 57 league goals (135 matches).

What's the difference?

Why did they absolutely love Drogba and so many Arsenal fans think Giroud is so beyond what we need?

I'm not saying he is or isn't either way. I just find it very interesting. They're so similar in terms of age, style of play, gpg.

Jesus really?

Wow!

I suspect if we had someone banging them in from midfield like Lampard last season to win us the league, Giroud would be viewed much more favourably.

brianregan09

Ya lampard regularly got them 20 a season aswell so they could afford that plus some seasons you had terry hitting double figures aswell from CB

Where'd we here Dick Law was in Germany ? Because it's got me thinking the rumours conflict with one another unless we're in for both some one from Germany and Mahrez which would be amazing altogether

gosplan

gosplan wrote: »

Interesting point.

In Drogba's first 5 years at Chelsea, he scored 55 league goals (134 matches).

In Giroud's 4 years at Arsenal, he's scored 57 league goals (135 matches).

What's the difference?

Why did they absolutely love Drogba and so many Arsenal fans think Giroud is so beyond what we need?

I'm not saying he is or isn't either way. I just find it very interesting. They're so similar in terms of age, style of play, gpg.

Chelsea won leagues and we didnt. The fans need a scapegoat and the English fans in particular wont look too close to some of their own local boys.

gosplan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Chelsea won leagues and we didnt. The fans need a scapegoat and the English fans in particular wont look too close to some of their own local boys.

Yeah, was looking through the scoring numbers for Chelsea in those seasons, particularly Drogba's first 3 where Chelsea finished 1st, 1st, and 2nd with 2 cups.

Every season Drogba had a backup striker scoring about 8-10 league goals, kalaou etc.

I thought Robben, Cole etc would have scored more but not really. Maybe 15 goals from the wings per season.

But they always had Lampard scoring about 15 and a defence that contribute about 10 goals a season.

All we have in recent years beyond Giroud is Sanchez.

speedboatchase

Gazzetta dello Sport saying that Napoli gonna go for Lacazette with their Higuain money.

I really hope there is something to these Mahrez rumours, as striking options are shrinking.

gosplan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Chelsea won leagues and we didnt. The fans need a scapegoat and the English fans in particular wont look too close to some of their own local boys.

Also you can't be relying on one player.

Like if Wenger is playing one striker then Ozil, Sanchez and RW need to contribute about 15 goals per season each.

I get that Ozil's game is assisting but it's probably not enough to be honest. If the CMF contributed with more goals, then maybe.

Alfred Borden

gosplan wrote: »

Interesting point.

In Drogba's first 5 years at Chelsea, he scored 55 league goals (134 matches).

In Giroud's 4 years at Arsenal, he's scored 57 league goals (135 matches).

What's the difference?

Why did they absolutely love Drogba and so many Arsenal fans think Giroud is so beyond what we need?

I'm not saying he is or isn't either way. I just find it very interesting. They're so similar in terms of age, style of play, gpg.

While I never thought Drogba was the big deal he was made out to be, to be fair to him he played in a defence first set up. Chelsea conceded a total of 37 goals in the 04/05 and 05/06 seasons compared to us shipping 36 last year. Giroud plays in a much more attack orientated team and so them stats are not too shocking.

..and of course Mahrez scores for Leicester

speedboatchase

Basil3 wrote: »

..and of course Mahrez scores for Leicester

Lovely goal too.

mansize

gosplan wrote: »

Also you can't be relying on one player.

Like if Wenger is playing one striker then Ozil, Sanchez and RW need to contribute about 15 goals per season each.

I get that Ozil's game is assisting but it's probably not enough to be honest. If the CMF contributed with more goals, then maybe.

Özil wasn't the problem last season, Sanchez's poor form and Giroud's drought was

emmetlego

I'd say (pure guess work here) if you looked at the chances per game, Drogba would have got his goals with a lot less chances. Giroud misses too many sitters for me, yes Drogba missed some, but no where near to the same extent as OG does, and certainly not as often! As has been said here, that Chelsea team were set up defensively, OG is in a much more attacking biases team.

Yet again, statistics shown they are not the be all and end all of football analysis.

gosplan

mansize wrote: »

Özil wasn't the problem last season, Sanchez's poor form and Giroud's drought was

Granted but my point is you can't just have 2 scoring players.

People have said we'd never win the league with Giroud. Maybe that's correct.

But with the returns from our RW and our 3 midfield players, is it possible anyway??

Edit: our RW, contributed 6 goals last season. Need another 10 there.

Also our midfield three only contributed 6 too. Also another 10 needed there.

brianregan09

Mahrez looked awesome easily the best player on the pitch

greendom

Alfred Borden wrote: »

While I never thought Drogba was the big deal he was made out to be, to be fair to him he played in a defence first set up. Chelsea conceded a total of 37 goals in the 04/05 and 05/06 seasons compared to us shipping 36 last year. Giroud plays in a much more attack orientated team and so them stats are not too shocking.

Don't buy that at all. If he really was playing in such an attack minded team, why are there so few players up there close to him in the goal scoring charts?

Our midfielders aren't scoring enough and that includes Ozil. Apart from Sanchez no one is scoring enough. Surely it can't all be Giroud's fault especially as his link up play is so good.

tayto lover

Doubt Marez would have played if we were genuinely in for him.

gosplan

greendom wrote: »

Don't buy that at all. If he really was playing in such an attack minded team, why are there so few players up there close to him in the goal scoring charts?

Our midfielders aren't scoring enough and that includes Ozil. Apart from Sanchez no one is scoring enough. Surely it can't all be Giroud's fault especially as his link up play is so good.

The invincibles kind of went that way. Like no-one scored much except for Pires and Henry. But Henry scored 30. Good luck finding that anywhere.

But the thing is we need another 15 goals or so. If you spend 80 million on Higuain, you get 10 at best say.

If you spend 50 million on Lacazette, you get maybe 5-10 at best.

I don't buy it as a story but if you spend 40 million on Mahrez you'll get 10.

And I think if Xhaka allows Ramsey to play a CMF role that he's suited to where he can make the final run to the box and finish, you might get quite a few that way.

But what I'm pretty sure of is that Caz at CMF, Ozil at AMF and Rambo on RW is not good enough in terms of goalscoring.

You'd need Henry.

greendom

gosplan wrote: »

Granted but my point is you can't just have 2 scoring players.

People have said we'd never win the league with Giroud. Maybe that's correct.

But with the returns from our RW and our 3 midfield players, is it possible anyway??

Edit: our RW, contributed 6 goals last season. Need another 10 there.

Also our midfield three only contributed 6 too. Also another 10 needed there.

Sorry Gos, didn't see this - 100% agree!

Ken Shamrock

Interesting point about the lack of goals coming from the wings and midfield, never thought about it too much. What do you do to fix that though?

Alfred Borden

greendom wrote: »

Don't buy that at all. If he really was playing in such an attack minded team, why are there so few players up there close to him in the goal scoring charts?

Our midfielders aren't scoring enough and that includes Ozil. Apart from Sanchez no one is scoring enough. Surely it can't all be Giroud's fault especially as his link up play is so good.

But see the thing is, our supporting cast arent scoring any less than our last title win in 2004. Although we always had lads chipping in, we always had a top striker scoring around 25 league goals. We scored 73 league goals that season shared out as follows:

Defence: 2 goals
Vieira, Gilberto, Edu & Parlour: 9 goals
Reyes, Pires, Ljungberg, Aliadiere and Wiltord: 23 goals
Bergkamp: 4 goals
Kanu: 1 goal
Henry: 30 goals
Own Goals: 4 goals

Now trying to make like for like comparisons to last seasons squad:

Defence : 7 goals - 5 more
Ramsey, Coquelin, Wilshere & Cazorla: 5 goals - 4 less
Sanchez, Walcott, Ox, Iwobi & Campbell: 24 goals - 1 more
Ozil: 6 goals - 2 more
Welbeck: 4 goals - 3 more
Giroud: 16 goals - 14 less
Own Goals: 3 goals - 1 less

Its not Girouds fault he is not at Henrys level, but we can and do deserve better as a starting striker with our playing style.

Ken Shamrock

Ken Shamrock wrote: »

Interesting point about the lack of goals coming from the wings and midfield, never thought about it too much. What do you do to fix that though?

Our problem last year was chance conversion. I think we only converted like 1 in 10 shots or something ridiculous like that. I'm pretty sure that's way worse than other years.

What can be done to fix it? I don't know, but confidence is a huge thing. Just having a world class player leading the line would surely raise the confidence of the entire team.

Pudders

Deleted User wrote: »

The fans need a scapegoat and the English fans in particular wont look too close to some of their own local boys.

Afraid this isn't true. The local boys get as hard a time as Giroud and some even worse. There is limited if any loyalty to nationality st the Emirates amongst the fan base.

beer enigma

Look reality is that despite our season tickets being the highest in Europe, the board & Kroenke are delighted with the return of runners up status. Gazidis statement as good as confirms that there will be no more big money signings and we should all be grateful for what we have. I'd be wary of the commitment of some players given the lack of signings.

How many players are injured for the Liverpool game ?

Andip

Andip wrote: »

Look reality is that despite our season tickets being the highest in Europe, the board & Kroenke are delighted with the return of runners up status. Gazidis statement as good as confirms that there will be no more big money signings and we should all be grateful for what we have. I'd be wary of the commitment of some players given the lack of signings.

How many players are injured for the Liverpool game ?

Sorry, I don't get the point of your first paragraph, nor do I agree with it.

Physioroom says Welbeck is our only real injury. Gabriel has tonsillitis, Jenko also back with the club recovering from injury.

gosplan

Alfred Borden wrote: »

But see the thing is, our supporting cast arent scoring any less than our last title win in 2004. Although we always had lads chipping in, we always had a top striker scoring around 25 league goals. We scored 73 league goals that season shared out as follows:

Defence: 2 goals
Vieira, Gilberto, Edu & Parlour: 9 goals
Reyes, Pires, Ljungberg, Aliadiere and Wiltord: 23 goals
Bergkamp: 4 goals
Kanu: 1 goal
Henry: 30 goals
Own Goals: 4 goals

Now trying to make like for like comparisons to last seasons squad:

Defence : 7 goals - 5 more
Ramsey, Coquelin, Wilshere & Cazorla: 5 goals - 4 less
Sanchez, Walcott, Ox, Iwobi & Campbell: 24 goals - 1 more
Ozil: 6 goals - 2 more
Welbeck: 4 goals - 3 more
Giroud: 16 goals - 14 less
Own Goals: 3 goals - 1 less

Its not Girouds fault he is not at Henrys level, but we can and do deserve better as a starting striker with our playing style.

I think we do deserve better. Or at least a bit more hope in the position. I want to be excited at the kid coming on when Giroud is substituted.

However, if we're trying to bridge the gap to the title it appears, admittedly from superficial enough stats, that we need someone to get 30 goals. That's basically Suarez for Liverpool or RVP in his last season for us. Kind of unachievable.

But there is a fair argument that we create so much that all strikers will get way more chances.

I'd say there's a lot of truth in that, but against the best defences you really need that bit extra. Going back to my post earlier, part of the special thing about Drogba was that he was a big game player. Henry and Suarez could take on the best defences and create and finish all by themselves.

I honestly think that this season, Higuain would probably be good enough to put up a title winning points total. I think the other players linked would probably do very well against lesser teams but not a whole lot when they're starved of chances against the better few defences and we'd come up short.

I think if we could find a 15/20 goal midfielder, it might do it too.

And the more I think of it, the more I'm dying to see how the Xhaka and Caz vrs Rambo thing works out.

wandatowell

I think that's us done in recruiting for the 1st team.

At home to Liverpool will be very telling.

The 'pool will definitely fancy their chances.

Bounty Hunter

wandatowell wrote: »

I think that's us done in recruiting for the 1st team.

I'm not suggesting your definitely signing Mahrez / Draxler etc but what makes you say this when Wenger is saying the following:

Speaking after Friday night's draw, Wenger told the club's official website: "I am sure that [Gazidis] didn t want to dampen the expectations on that front. We are very active."

Edit: reports suggest Ginter is the (Dortmund) German player Arsenal are after. He would be the long term partner for Kos and replacement for Mert.

Ginter did not travel with the rest of the Dortmund squad for their pre-season tour of China.

Giggsy11

gosplan wrote: »

Interesting point.

In Drogba's first 5 years at Chelsea, he scored 55 league goals (134 matches).

In Giroud's 4 years at Arsenal, he's scored 57 league goals (135 matches).

What's the difference?

Why did they absolutely love Drogba and so many Arsenal fans think Giroud is so beyond what we need?

I'm not saying he is or isn't either way. I just find it very interesting. They're so similar in terms of age, style of play, gpg.

Because Stats don't tell the full story. In the first 4 seasons Benteke scored 51 league goals in 118 league games and last season he barely played. Also Benteke was just 21 when he started playing in England.

greendom

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Because Stats don't tell the full story. In the first 4 seasons Benteke scored 51 league goals in 118 league games and last season he barely played. Also Benteke was just 21 when he started playing in England.

Villa played to Benteke's strengths, Arsenal not so much for Giroud

Giggsy11

greendom wrote: »

Villa played to Benteke's strengths, Arsenal not so much for Giroud

I think Arsenal play to Giroud strengths too. He is one of the best at flicks and lay offs which Arsenal play a lot. They don''t cross much but it doesn't make sense to just cross because you have Giroud when all your players are not so strong heading the ball.

Also Benteke played for piss poor Villa who were atrocious.

Giggsy11

Giggsy11 wrote: »

I think Arsenal play to Giroud strengths too. He is one of the best at flicks and lay offs which Arsenal play a lot. They don''t cross much but it doesn't make sense to just cross because you have Giroud when all your players are not so strong heading the ball.

Also Benteke played for piss poor Villa who were atrocious.

Giroud can't score when he's flicking and laying off, though.

We are rubbish at putting crosses in, too. Giroud and Alexis are both decent headers of the ball.

Giggsy11

Basil3 wrote: »

Giroud can't score when he's flicking and laying off, though.

We are rubbish at putting crosses in, too. Giroud and Alexis are both decent headers of the ball.

Yes but he can have impact on the game and be more involved. Arsenal create lot more clear cut chances than Villa. Btw, if Arsenal try to put more crosses they will be less effective IMO. They have team built for quick one twos and quick passing. Giroud is the only player in the front 6 who is very good header of the ball, so I don't think crossing the ball should be a much needed change for Arsenal.

Like I said, stats are very misleading as they don't tell how player like Drogba was so useful with his hold up play or drawing CBs with his presence.

Giggsy11

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Yes but he can have impact on the game and be more involved. Arsenal create lot more clear cut chances than Villa. Btw, if Arsenal try to put more crosses they will be less effective IMO. They have team built for quick one twos and quick passing. Giroud is the only player in the front 6 who is very good header of the ball, so I don't think crossing the ball should be a much needed change for Arsenal.

Like I said, stats are very misleading as they don't tell how player like Drogba was so useful with his hold up play or drawing CBs with his presence.

That's bollocks.
It's all about their mentality and willingness to get on the end of things.
Back when we had the likes of Chamakh, we hardly ever crossed it in.

Back when pires and freddy were on the wings we used to cross it a hell of a lot and we had no big CF and it worked well.

Giggsy11

Bam Bam Mickey wrote: »

That's bollocks.
It's all about their mentality and willingness to get on the end of things.
Back when we had the likes of Chamakh, we hardly ever crossed it in.

Back when pires and freddy were on the wings we used to cross it a hell of a lot and we had no big CF and it worked well.

When you play with lone striker and the trio behind the striker are Sanchez, Ozil and one of Walcott or Ramsey or anyother winger then it's useless to cross the ball. Most of the PL CBs are good headers of the ball, unless you put a pin point cross it's mostly useless activity.

Pires cross the ball more? All I remember was how he linked up with Henry and Bergkamp playing through balls more than any other team.

Giggsy11

Giggsy11 wrote: »

When you play with lone striker and the trio behind the striker are Sanchez, Ozil and one of Walcott or Ramsey or anyother winger then it's useless to cross the ball. Most of the PL CBs are good headers of the ball, unless you put a pin point cross it's mostly useless activity.

Pires cross the ball more? All I remember was how he linked up with Henry and Bergkamp playing through balls more than any other team.

Did you ever hear of crossing it low?
The problem with the current crop is the all want to walk it into the net down the middle of the park.

Giggsy11

Bam Bam Mickey wrote: »

Did you ever hear of crossing it low?
The problem with the current crop is the all want to walk it into the net down the middle of the park.

How exactly crossing low is playing to Giroud strengths? That's the point of conversation.

Giggsy11

Giggsy11 wrote: »

How exactly crossing low is playing to Giroud strengths? That's the point of conversation.

that's the problem with the squad, they don't know how to.
Tippy tappy is still quite evident, what's wrong is we cannot do anything other than tippy tappy walk it into the net

wandatowell

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

wandatowell wrote: »

I think that's us done in recruiting for the 1st team.

I'm not suggesting your definitely signing Mahrez / Draxler etc but what makes you say this when Wenger is saying the following:

Speaking after Friday night's draw, Wenger told the club's official website: "I am sure that [Gazidis] didn t want to dampen the expectations on that front. We are very active."

Edit: reports suggest Ginter is the (Dortmund) German player Arsenal are after. He would be the long term partner for Kos and replacement for Mert.

Ginter did not travel with the rest of the Dortmund squad for their pre-season tour of China.

I would think that 90% of what Arsene says is spin.

A few bad results in the league might push him to buy the not much else will.

wandatowell

wandatowell wrote: »

I would think that 90% of what Arsene says is spin.

A few bad results in the league might push him to buy the not much else will.

We can only hope.

Quazzie

wandatowell wrote: »

I would think that 90% of what Arsene says is spin.

A few bad results in the league might push him to buy the not much else will.

Why does it take a couple of bad results though. Surely he can see what everyone else sees that we need a better striker. To fail to act on that before the start of the season is incompetence and no one can argue that.

I'd love for Wenger to make another decent signing before the start of the season, if only to show that you bunch of pessimistic moany buggers are clueless :pac:

speedboatchase

Icardi's agent meeting with Napoli, according to Italian press.

Basil3

Basil3 wrote: »

I'd love for Wenger to make another decent signing before the start of the season, if only to show that you bunch of pessimistic moany buggers are clueless :pac:

If that's all you care about them no wonder Wenger has full control and the Emirates is full of mute sheep.

Bam Bam Mickey

Bam Bam Mickey wrote: »

If that's all you care about them no wonder Wenger has full control and the Emirates is full of mute sheep.

It's not ALL I care about, but it's high on the list

Still better than hoping for the team to lose so we'll sign someone

gosplan

Just to get you all worked up.

For some reason Mahrez left the Leicester training camp last night and went to London.

brianregan09

To get pissed i'd say

emmetlego

gosplan wrote: »

Just to get you all worked up.

For some reason Mahrez left the Leicester training camp last night and went to London.

Where did you hear that?

Basil3

Basil3 wrote: »

It's not ALL I care about, but it's high on the list

Still better than hoping for the team to lose so we'll sign someone

Ah no I agree I'd never hope they lose to bolster an argument.

Quazzie

gosplan wrote: »

Just to get you all worked up.

For some reason Mahrez left the Leicester training camp last night and went to London.

It wasn't just Mahrez. There were a few Leicester plays that went to London. Probably a media or sponsorship gig.