Avis Rental car with Triangle Tyres

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

coolbeans

Fred Swanson wrote: »

Now hang on a minute. If these tyres are so unsafe, why are they for sale? Surely the nanny state would step in?

Because it's not the nanny state you believe it to be man.

DakarVert

I love how people automatically form an opinion on tyres without actually trying them.

My last car came with new Landsails on the front and Hiflys on the back, Not once did they spin or lose grip... Tad loud but other than that were fine. That's mixed country roads, town and motorway use... Yes maybe a bit longer pulling up if braking hard but I didn't experience it so can't comment.


95% of renters couldn't give a feck.... It's a business, They'll cut costs where possible to make profit.

Mycroft H

Had Austones fitted when I bought the old xantia. They were noisy but they weren't dangerous. Replaced them with verdsteins and they weren't that much better that people would lead you to believe

R.O.R

DakarVert wrote: »

I love how people automatically form an opinion on tyres without actually trying them.

My last car came with new Landsails on the front and Hiflys on the back, Not once did they spin or lose grip... Tad loud but other than that were fine. That's mixed country roads, town and motorway use... Yes maybe a bit longer pulling up if braking hard but I didn't experience it so can't comment.


95% of renters couldn't give a feck.... It's a business, They'll cut costs where possible to make profit.

I drove for the first and last time on Landsails to our Christmas Party in 14. S-Max 115ps model with half the office in it, including the tyre expert.

Landsails are now on the do not fit list for our fleet as the wet grip was very poor in the wet, and as underpowered Ford was easily spinning tyres in 2nd gear, which tells us they are not good at all.

Better than Triangles though, which I've had the misfortune of using on more than one occasion. If you know just how bad they are, and are prepared to crawl around any bend more severe than 3 degrees, then you'll be grand. You don't want to find out the tyres you have on the car you are driving are utter sh1te the first time you try to go around a roundabout at a moderate speed, and almost end up in the barrier at the side of the roundabout.

Guy:Incognito

R.O.R wrote: »

I drove for the first and last time on Landsails to our Christmas Party in 14. S-Max 115ps model with half the office in it, including the tyre expert.

Landsails are now on the do not fit list for our fleet as the wet grip was very poor in the wet, and as underpowered Ford was easily spinning tyres in 2nd gear, which tells us they are not good at all.
.

Is it not possible that certain models of known brand name summer tyres could have done similar? I doubt it would lead to all Michelins being struck off the list.

colm_mcm

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Is it not possible that certain models of known brand name summer tyres could have done similar? I doubt it would lead to all Michelins being struck off the list.

Honestly you'd need to try these to believe how bad they are. Wheel spin in 2nd in a 1.4 Auris type bad.

gk5000

Obviously some people don't care the type of tyre and that is fine.
But I care, and I'm scared of driving round on these ones in the wet - and have experienced the bad effects of driving on these.

But my point is that Rental Cars should fit OEM spec tyres - something that Opel, Ford, Toyota etc would consider suitable for their cars.

ba_barabus

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

visual

Fred Swanson wrote: »

If they are so unsafe, why is it even possible to buy them?

Because testing standards are slack and there is a market for cheap round black things

pablo128

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Why was it possible to purchase horse meat labelled as beef? Because of a lack of check ups, just like the E marking on cheap tyres.

I had Accelera Alpha tyres on my diesel Avensis when I bought it. It was fine in the dry, but dangerous in the wet. I was losing the front and/or the rear driving in normal traffic in the wet. I put a set of Kumhos on, which are good but not a premium brand, and haven't had a single slide in well over a year since I put them on.

You definitely get what you pay for when it comes to tyres.

pa990

I wouldn't be happy with Chinese ditch finders on any car I'm driving, but as they are legal, I doubt the car rental company is doing anything wrong, and I would doubt that any renter would have any legitimate reason for a refund or replacement.

visual

pa990 wrote: »

I wouldn't be happy with Chinese ditch finders on any car I'm driving, but as they are legal, I doubt the car rental company is doing anything wrong, and I would doubt that any renter would have any legitimate reason for a refund or replacement.

When you rent a car it's often on your insurance policy. Rental company isn't at a loss if you run into back of someone but you will be. That's more than enough reason to reject the car.

pa990

visual wrote: »

When you rent a car it's often on your insurance policy. Rental company isn't at a loss if you run into back of someone but you will be. That's more than enough reason to reject the car.

How.....

If the car is road legal, and "technically" road worthy.

visual

pa990 wrote: »

How.....

If the car is road legal, and "technically" road worthy.

horse and cart with wooden spoke wheels is technical road legal too but that is not the point.

Rental company to maximise profit and cut costs fits car with budget tyres has traded cost for safety. Transferring risk to the renter who most likely will be unaware.

But if you spotted cheap budget tyres and know your wet stopping distance is 3 time longer than proper tyres and then you might not be happy accepting this additional risk and why should you it is considerable risk your placing on yourself, your family and your insurance.

Special Circumstances

Every week a whole load of people try to claim a dacia is the same as a rolls royce, pink slime frozen patties are the same as freshly prepared steak mince burgers, grants whiskey is the same as midleton.


And every week they're wrong.

pa990

But its road legal, and road worthy.

What are the grounds for rejecting it....

Other than a personal preference for a better grade of tyre... which still meets the basic legal requirements.

I don't think the op has a leg to stand on
(I personally wouldn't be happy with the tyre choice)

And a road legal/worthy rolls royce and a road legal/worthy duster, are still both legal/worthy.
And a pink slime patty is also legal.

pa990

I've a copper wire delivering my broadband... should I reject it because it's not fth !!!???... I'd like to, but it's still broadband.
Not great broadband.. but legally still classed as broadband.

pa990

Also...

I'd never ever buy ditch finders.

I know my cars and I know their limits, and ditch finders seriously reduce those limits to less than what I would expect from normal day to day driving.... But... ther are still still legal/worthy,

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

pa990

Fred Swanson wrote: »

No one has yet presented any real evidence that they are dangerous.

Personal experience is that they are less effective in damp or wet conditions, but are that still didn't dismiss the fact that they are today legal /roadworthy. .
I still wouldn't trust then

pablo128

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

It's a discussion forum. Posters, including me, have given personal experiences, mostly negative of the cheapest brands of tyre. I will admit I drive on a bit, but I have had zero drama with the mid range brand on my car currently. In saying that, I normally have a premium brand on my cars.

Special Circumstances

Legal doesn't have to mean good or acceptable. Shur bertie, redacted, lowry etc are all still walking around free aren't they?

If the customer pays for something, and is unhappy with what he got for his money, nobody can shoot him for complaining. They can try to address the issue, or tell him eff off if they think he is being unreasonable.

Personally I'd probably take the irish option. Grumble about how sh1t it was to anyone except the business and never use them again.

power pants

Just goes to prove how reliable triangle tyres actually are. If they were causing crashes as do many seem to believe in here ( with zero evidence) then I doubt a major fleet car company would use them.

Would be interested to know how many crashes that particular car has been involved in

I'm guessing none

More and more people are sounding like car geeks, snobs regarding this tyre debate. It's ridiculous, it's ok to be wrong sometimes and gullible to spend 3x the price of a tyre because good marketing has convinced you to.

MarkR

power pants wrote: »

Just goes to prove how reliable triangle tyres actually are. If they were causing crashes as do many seem to believe in here ( with zero evidence) then I doubt a major fleet car company would use them.

Would be interested to know how many crashes that particular car has been involved in

I'm guessing none

More and more people are sounding like car geeks, snobs regarding this tyre debate. It's ridiculous, it's ok to be wrong sometimes and gullible to spend 3x the price of a tyre because good marketing has convinced you to.

I've scrolled a fair bit, did someone from one of these companies say they use them? I saw one guy say they didn't. Was there a counter?

Alun

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I've got a pair of stained underpants from the time some almost brand new ironically named Triangle "Talons" tried to kill me in our MX-5 if you'd like to examine them?

Charles Babbage

gk5000 wrote: »

Obviously some people don't care the type of tyre and that is fine.
But I care, and I'm scared of driving round on these ones in the wet - and have experienced the bad effects of driving on these.

But my point is that Rental Cars should fit OEM spec tyres - something that Opel, Ford, Toyota etc would consider suitable for their cars.

This. If only for equity in the people who rent the cars who are charged the same. If your car is newish and has the original types you pay the same fee if it has a higher mileage, the increased mileage has some other disadvantages but that should not include replacement with a useless tyre.

There was a tyre test on a technical magazine I was reading. The best tire was:

Nokian Hakka Green 2:
Great in wet
Low rolling resistance

Nothing to complain.

---

Goodyear Efficient Grip:
Low rolling resistance
Good grip in wet

Bad: Nothing

---

Pirelli Cinturato P7 Blue:
Good grip in all the conditions
Handling

Bad: Average resistance to aquaplaning

----

Continental Conti PremiumContact 5

Good handing on all condition
Strong all-round performance without any significant drawbacks.

Bad: Nothing

----

The tyres above were rated 9 or over out of 10. Following group got between 8.8 - 7.5 in scale 10 best 4 worst. Surprised about Landsail (positively) and Kumho (negatively).
Apollo Alnac 4G
Dunlop Sport BluResponse
Michelin Primacy 3
Vredestein Sportrac 5
Landsail LS388 (Chinese brands can also be average)
Barum Bravuris 3 HM
Kumho Ecowing ES01

The two worst performers were:

---

Nankang Green/Sport
Good: nothing
Bad: Grip and handling, high rolling resistance

---

The worst tire was Wanli Harmonic H220:
Nothing good:

Bad points:
Bad grip both wet and dry
Unpredictable handling

visual

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I have stated earlier that they are dangerous but will repeat with more detail

Bough a BMW 525i with Triangle tyres fitted all round thread was very good
Drove the car in the dry it drove fine, grip seem good. Then it rained
Traction control light came on every time I went to take off. ABS light every time I braked in the wet. Turning sharply in the wet at a moderate speed while braking car just couldn't hold the road and I nearly hit a pole.

So I backed off my speed and left bigger gap. was driving back from the airport on M50 car in front was quite a bit away from me but for some reason the traffic up ahead had come to a brief halt. I applied the brakes and ABS came on but car wasn't slowing it was sliding up to the cars in front. Luckily the cars in front started to move forward a little and I came to a stop just in time but if the car hadn't move forward a couple of car lengths I would have rear ended one of them. That was enough to convince me either I stump up for new tyres or be dealing with expensive crash repair and lost of NCB

Next day I went out and replace all 4 tyres. Car in front stops I can stop if they emergency brake so can I without the fear of sliding into the back of them in the wet.

I didn't want the expense of replacing 4 tyres within a couple of weeks of buying the car especially as there was lots of thread on the tyres. But the difference is night and day. Traction light doesn't come on every time I take off and ABS doesn't come on every time I brake normally.

That was over a year ago on Saturday I was driving by a car waiting to pull out from a side road. At the last moment he pulled out and only spotted me after he had blocked the road. I emergency braked from 60KPH while turning the car to opposite side of the road in about 2 car lengths missing this guy by inches.
My passenger got such a fright and thought she pulled muscle in her back from the sudden stop. impressive braking even if I say so myself but there is one thing for sure there is no way the Triangle tyres could have stopped me as quickly and allowed me swerve to avoid the collision.

If my experience and others on here that have posted their experience of these tyres isn't good enough, then google search independent tyre tests

visual

power pants wrote: »

Just goes to prove how reliable triangle tyres actually are. If they were causing crashes as do many seem to believe in here ( with zero evidence) then I doubt a major fleet car company would use them.

Would be interested to know how many crashes that particular car has been involved in

I'm guessing none

More and more people are sounding like car geeks, snobs regarding this tyre debate. It's ridiculous, it's ok to be wrong sometimes and gullible to spend 3x the price of a tyre because good marketing has convinced you to.

you just can't help yourself its like a flame to a moth when rubbish tyres are mentioned.

Voodoomelon

This thread almost makes me want to fit a set of Triangles to see how bad they are.

Neilw

Unfortunately there are people out there who despite test results and personal experience won't accept facts.

Budget tyres are rubbish, but as I said some just can't be educated.

I've had cars with cheap tyres, nankangs, maragoni, stunner, all complete rubbish in wet or damp conditions.
Both my cars have good tyres, continental sport contact 5 on one car and michelin pilot sports on the other. I know if something happens where I need to take evasive action I can't blame the tyres if it all goes wrong.

power pants

Neilw wrote: »

Unfortunately there are people out there who despite test results and personal experience won't accept facts.

Budget tyres are rubbish, but as I said some just can't be educated.

I've had cars with cheap tyres, nankangs, maragoni, stunner, all complete rubbish in wet or damp conditions.
Both my cars have good tyres, continental sport contact 5 on one car and michelin pilot sports on the other. I know if something happens where I need to take evasive action I can't blame the tyres if it all goes wrong.

who's personal experience? why would I take yours over mine?

evasive action? :pac: some of you really think you are racing car drivers:pac:

Special Circumstances

power pants wrote: »

who's personal experience? why would I take yours over mine?

evasive action? :pac: some of you really think you are racing car drivers:pac:

I see you've moved away from claiming some massive conspiracy in all the independent tyre test results.

Why is that I wonder.

Neilw

power pants wrote: »

who's personal experience? why would I take yours over mine?

evasive action? :pac: some of you really think you are racing car drivers:pac:

Why, because I, along with others who have posted similar experiences are right.

Maybe some day you will see the light or at least open your mind to other opinions rather than your own.

ianobrien

All I'll say for the sake of €20 or so a corner extra, I'd rather have a tyre that gave me a reasonable chance of stopping in the wet if I had to do an emergency stop, as opposed to not being able to stop and hit a car (or worse). It's cheaper than loosing my no claims bonus.

As an aside, what would some posters here think if I said I was thinking of getting rid of the Dunlop SportMaxx that are under my car as they don't have enough grip in the damp for me!:

Special Circumstances

ianobrien wrote: »

All I'll say for the sake of €20 or so a corner extra, I'd rather have a tyre that gave me a reasonable chance of stopping in the wet if I had to do an emergency stop, as opposed to not being able to stop and hit a car (or worse). It's cheaper than loosing my no claims bonus.

As an aside, what would some posters here think if I said I was thinking of getting rid of the Dunlop SportMaxx that are under my car as they don't have enough grip in the damp for me!:

Wuyong aaiiii! All the way lad. They have been making wheelbarrow tyres and tyres for food carts now for 18 months but have really leapfrogged their game. The lads in the tyre place have them on all their sister in laws cars and the taxi men would rather spend 35 euro on them than a set of ARB bushings or droplinks. Which makes them pretty awesome in my book. So awesome no competent third party has ever reviewed them, they are only available to people who know people and wink a certain way.
Lifetime warranty!

Neilw

ianobrien wrote: »

All I'll say for the sake of €20 or so a corner extra, I'd rather have a tyre that gave me a reasonable chance of stopping in the wet if I had to do an emergency stop, as opposed to not being able to stop and hit a car (or worse). It's cheaper than loosing my no claims bonus.

As an aside, what would some posters here think if I said I was thinking of getting rid of the Dunlop SportMaxx that are under my car as they don't have enough grip in the damp for me!:

I had dunlop sportmaxx on a car and didn't think they were great in the wet.
Changed to Michelins and it transformed the wet weather handling.

swarlb

This is shocking altogether... hard to know what to say really. I certainly hope that the rental company in question is fitting the correct brand, make, grade of brake pads, discs, shoes, drums, oil and not some 'yellow pack' rubbish sourced from a dodgy online shop, and that the mechanics involved in fitting all these parts is fully qualified, and not some 'intern' who makes the tae, and cleans the toilets when he (or she) is not butchering a repair with a lump hammer (sourced from cheap supermarket, no doubt).
Why didn't you simply hand back the car when you hired it ? and demand (aggressively and in a high pitched tone) that you wanted only the best of tyres fitted to your (rental) car !
Do you check the brand on taxies, busses and anyone who give you a lift to see if they conform.
One thing I'll say about the Chinese... they build reasonably long lasting walls, so I'd give them the benefit of the doubt on tyres.

power pants

Neilw wrote: »

Unfortunately there are people out there who despite test results and personal experience won't accept facts.

Budget tyres are rubbish, but as I said some just can't be educated.

I've had cars with cheap tyres, nankangs, maragoni, stunner, all complete rubbish in wet or damp conditions.
Both my cars have good tyres, continental sport contact 5 on one car and michelin pilot sports on the other. I know if something happens where I need to take evasive action I can't blame the tyres if it all goes wrong.

You've had nankangs,maragoni, stunner? If you feel so strongly about cheap tyres why would you purchase them 3x?

If you say they came with the car, why didn't you ask the dealer to replace them?

Could be argued that most people have no issues putting these type of tyres on their cars.

Lastly, if you decide to say it was a friends, member of family car, did they crash?

Indricotherium

power pants wrote: »

You've had nankangs,maragoni, stunner? If you feel so strongly about cheap tyres why would you purchase them 3x?

If you say they came with the car, why didn't you ask the dealer to replace them?

Could be argued that most people have no issues putting these type of tyres on their cars.

Lastly, if you decide to say it was a friends, member of family car, did they crash?

100% agree with you here.

I'd go a step further and say that the % performance difference between two identical branded tyres is probably about the same as the difference between a branded tyre like Goodyear and a triangle.

Indricotherium

Indricotherium wrote: »

100% agree with you here.

I'd go a step further and say that the % performance difference between two identical branded tyres is probably about the same as the difference between a branded tyre like Goodyear and a triangle.

And just another thing with all the China bashing going on, go out and have a look at the branded tyres you've put on your car and Google the factory code.

You might be surprised.

toyotaavensis

So this debate has gotten heated. I have Michelin tyres on the avensis. All in I like the way the car performs with them. They were a big improvement over Hankooks and Bridgestones I had before and massively better than nexen tyres on the car when I bought it.

This video also shows the difference between a few tyre brands in wet and dry. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_j-2W2uZ8c

I have had the avensis at 120 mph (took 5 miles downhill to get there) and to be fair I don't think I would have had the confidence to do this with another brand under me.

Indricotherium

toyotaavensis wrote: »

So this debate has gotten heated. I have Michelin tyres on the avensis. All in I like the way the car performs with them. They were a big improvement over Hankooks and Bridgestones I had before and massively better than nexen tyres on the car when I bought it.

This video also shows the difference between a few tyre brands in wet and dry. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_j-2W2uZ8c

I have had the avensis at 120 mph (took 5 miles downhill to get there) and to be fair I don't think I would have had the confidence to do this with another brand under me.

Thats close to double the legal motorway limit. Hardly a fair environment to compare the relative merits of tyres designed for road cars.

toyotaavensis

I drove to Budapest and back so while driving through Germany on the Autobahn it was legal. At no point did I say it was an environment for testing tyres. I simply said I wouldn't trust anything other than the best I have experienced with that sort of driving. Also 120mph is not close to double the motorway speed limit. It is not even double the national speed limit which would be 125mph. Motorways are 75mph which doubled gives 150mph.

What do you make of the video? That was the main point I was making as they conducted tests of braking distances for a collection of tyres.

colm_mcm

Indricotherium wrote: »

And just another thing with all the China bashing going on, go out and have a look at the branded tyres you've put on your car and Google the factory code.

You might be surprised.

VW build cars in China. So do SAIC. Not the same thing.
An IPhone isn't the same as an eBay smartphone.

Pretty much any Chinese branded tyres I know of are rubbish. Doesn't matter where they're made.

Indricotherium

toyotaavensis wrote: »

I drove to Budapest and back so while driving through Germany on the Autobahn it was legal. At no point did I say it was an environment for testing tyres. I simply said I wouldn't trust anything other than the best I have experienced with that sort of driving. Also 120mph is not close to double the motorway speed limit. It is not even double the national speed limit which would be 125mph. Motorways are 75mph which doubled gives 150mph.

What do you make of the video? That was the main point I was making as they conducted tests of braking distances for a collection of tyres.

I wouldn't give the video much weight as it is conducted by a magazine that is funded by advertising. That video is more or less advertorial in my opinion.

To put it another way, ring up whatcar and tell them you want to put a full page advert for something in their magazine in every issue from now to the end of the year and see how much that costs. Then send them one to review.

If you were to show me a report published by someone like ncaap that hasn't got a dog in the selling tyres fight it would be a different story.

Special Circumstances

Indricotherium wrote: »

And just another thing with all the China bashing going on, go out and have a look at the branded tyres you've put on your car and Google the factory code.

You might be surprised.

Nobody is saying you can't get good quality product from China.

If you pay for it.

Quality materials cost money. Research on compounds costs money. Quality control costs money. Building a brand reputation over many years costs money.

Firing the cheapest of materials in, with no quality control, selling in bulk under one name this week and another next week so the stain of last weeks product doesn't follow you is much cheaper.

Only a handful of companies have stuck the course long enough to have a brand name that could be ruined by pumping out sh1te. But there seems to be a never ending supply of randomers - why take the chance with an unknown quantity?

Would you say a Great Wall is as good or better than a Land Rover? So why is a Landslide automatically as good as a Continental?

Neilw

power pants wrote: »

You've had nankangs,maragoni, stunner? If you feel so strongly about cheap tyres why would you purchase them 3x?

If you say they came with the car, why didn't you ask the dealer to replace them?

Could be argued that most people have no issues putting these type of tyres on their cars.

Lastly, if you decide to say it was a friends, member of family car, did they crash?

I never said I bought cheap tyres.
Cars I bought through private sales had cheap tyres fitted. They were replaced with real tyres :pac:

I enjoy driving, I like to have a car setup as best it can be, whether it's fresh OE suspension components or premium tyres to ensure it handles correctly.

I don't buy to a budget when it comes to something I drive, lots of people do as to them driving is a task or a chore which they don't enjoy so budget is reduced, fit the cheapest.