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PRTB judgement enforcement

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  • 10-03-2016 4:18pm
    #1
    Clampdown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭


    My previous landlord wanted to sell the house I was renting and instead of giving me the proper amount of time to leave (110 days), he illegally evicted me, changed the locks when I was out, left me homeless, kept my possessions (I eventually got the gardai to make him give most of them back) but he also kept my security deposit.

    I opened a PRTB dispute and won a judgement against him for a sum of money.

    The money was due to be paid today (7 days from the judgement) but was not, however according to the PRTB paperwork he has 21 days to appeal.

    I rang the landlord who said 'We're not finished with this.' I asked him was he intending to appeal and he said Yes. I asked on what grounds and he said 'We are going to appeal and go to small claims court.' and hung up on me.

    I thought the PRTB existed in part to keep tenant/landlord cases out of the courts. He really has no grounds for appeal, he's just trying to delay paying me. I have no idea what he thinks a small claims court would do for him anyway.

    Does anyone have any experience with this and what should my next step be (try to get it enforced through the courts?)


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    #2
    theteal
    Registered Users Posts: 7,593 ✭✭✭theteal


    FYI - Small Claims Court is nowhere relevant to this, it's for consumer issues. Complete chancer, he's just going to drag this out. You may have to get PRTB order court enforced


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    #3
    Clampdown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭Clampdown


    theteal wrote: »
    FYI - Small Claims Court is nowhere relevant to this, it's for consumer issues. Complete chancer, he's just going to drag this out. You may have to get PRTB order court enforced

    Exactly what I told him!


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    #4
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    Clampdown wrote: »
    Does anyone have any experience with this and what should my next step be (try to get it enforced through the courts?)
    What about this?

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057570384


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    #5
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,218 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Why are you talking to the landlord? Let the PRTB sort it out


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    #6
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    godtabh wrote: »
    Why are you talking to the landlord? Let the PRTB sort it out

    What are the PRTB going to do? the o/p would have to go on a queue of cases in the PRTB awaiting enforcement and the PRTB themselves decide if they will even bother with enforcement. The legal budget is used up on evictions so the o/p will be left whistling.


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    #7
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,218 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    4ensic15 wrote: »
    What are the PRTB going to do? the o/p would have to go on a queue of cases in the PRTB awaiting enforcement and the PRTB themselves decide if they will even bother with enforcement. The legal budget is used up on evictions so the o/p will be left whistling.

    And how is the OP talking to the landlord going to speed things up?


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    #8
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    godtabh wrote: »
    And how is the OP talking to the landlord going to speed things up?

    It is not. He needs to take action himself!


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    #9
    alltacht
    Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭alltacht


    Going through a similar issue as yourself OP. Determination Order was issued to our landlord. The PRTB advised us that if he doesn't pay in the allocated time then we could apply for the PRTB to bring our case to court, but that they only take on a certain number of cases. The other option was to bring the landlord to court ourselves and seek for him to pay our legal fees etc. So we sought advice from a solicitor which was very helpful. We basically sent him a message outlining some of things our solicitor told us and it sort of did the trick.. which was surprising because he has been a nightmare to deal with this past year during our dispute. I think he figured he would be throwing good money after bad.
    Perhaps run things past the PRTB again with regards to the priority of your case in your area, or pop into a solicitor.
    Good luck, and I hope you have a better experience with future rentals.


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    #10
    Cuddlesworth
    Registered Users Posts: 13,995 ✭✭✭✭Cuddlesworth


    alltacht wrote: »
    Going through a similar issue as yourself OP. Determination Order was issued to our landlord. The PRTB advised us that if he doesn't pay in the allocated time then we could apply for the PRTB to bring our case to court, but that they only take on a certain number of cases. The other option was to bring the landlord to court ourselves and seek for him to pay our legal fees etc. So we sought advice from a solicitor which was very helpful. We basically sent him a message outlining some of things our solicitor told us and it sort of did the trick.. which was surprising because he has been a nightmare to deal with this past year during our dispute. I think he figured he would be throwing good money after bad.
    Perhaps run things past the PRTB again with regards to the priority of your case in your area, or pop into a solicitor.
    Good luck, and I hope you have a better experience with future rentals.

    The thing about the process is, if you have a determination order from the PRTB you have already won the court case. You simply have to get to the hearing, which in some cases can take months.


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    #11
    Clampdown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭Clampdown


    godtabh wrote: »
    Why are you talking to the landlord? Let the PRTB sort it out

    That's what I thought but have a look at their website under dispute resolution>enforcement of orders, it actually says that the PRTB leave it to the disputing parties to arrange the payment of judgements which is ridiculous.

    Parties are obliged to deal with compliance/payment arrangements directly between each other and neither party will ordinarily receive a notice or reminder from the PRTB in this regard. (Further involvement by the PRTB will only occur on receipt of a request to consider taking enforcement proceedings on behalf of a party, where the matter cannot be settled directly between parties.)
    HOW TO COMPLY WITH A DETERMINATION ORDER
    You should contact the party to whom the payment is due to arrange an agreeable method of settlement; OR
    If you do not have current contact details for the other party, payment(s) may be submitted to the PRTB for transmission on your behalf.

    So if a landlord owes you a deposit and doesn't pay it back, or a tenant owes rent arrears, you csn take them to the PRTB and if you win, you're basically back in the same position of having to ask nicely for the money you're owed. 15 quid to submit a dispute to the PRTB by the way.

    This guy changed the locks on me, kept my deposit, left me homeless and basically stole my property that was in the house. Now he gets to sell the house and I'm left without money or a place to live even after going through the legal channels and winning the case.


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    #12
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    It looks like you've answered your own question Clampdown:
    Clampdown wrote: »
    (Further involvement by the PRTB will only occur on receipt of a request to consider taking enforcement proceedings on behalf of a party, where the matter cannot be settled directly between parties.)

    Have you made a request to the PRTB Clampdown?
    4ensic15 wrote: »
    Looks like you should do this.
    http://www.kevinfeigherysolicitors.ie/victorian-criminal-law-statute-a-useful-tool-for-modern-day-landlords/

    OP I'd take legal advice if you're considering that approach.


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    #13
    Clampdown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭Clampdown


    Graham wrote: »
    It looks like you've answered your own question Clampdown:



    Have you made a request to the PRTB Clampdown?



    OP I'd take legal advice if you're considering that approach.


    I suppose I have to wait the 21 days he has to appeal before I can request the PRTB to take any action and he has told me he plans to appeal. He just wants to drag it out.

    Yeah I might just get a solicitor involved and see if that does the trick. I could really use the money, I had to move back home with my mum in a very small town and need to get out of here as there is no work here at all and I'm unemployed and need to get a few quid together to relocate.


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    #14
    bizleads
    Registered Users Posts: 25 ✭bizleads


    My friend is in very similar situation, won judgement against landlord and he is still waiting to get his deposit back from the landlord. it has been over a year already since prtb judgement. so you better talk to solicitor asap


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    #15
    utmbuilder
    Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭utmbuilder


    (this part would take the shirt off his back, but you would have to get a solicitor to work no win no fee)

    if you appeal the amount after a tribunal with the prtb, the high court could award in the region of 30k, maybe 60k

    (this part wont cost you)

    anyhow you need to ask the prtb to get an enforcement order from the courts, and if you have no appealed to a prtb tribunal do that at least as the amount will be a lot higher.


    contact the sundayworld or the daily mail by phone,


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    #16
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    utmbuilder wrote: »
    (this part would take the shirt off his back, but you would have to get a solicitor to work no win no fee)

    if you appeal the amount after a tribunal with the prtb, the high court could award in the region of 30k, maybe 60k

    (this part wont cost you)

    anyhow you need to ask the prtb to get an enforcement order from the courts, and if you have no appealed to a prtb tribunal do that at least as the amount will be a lot higher.


    contact the sundayworld or the daily mail by phone,

    This is nonsense. The o/p cannot appeal a win. The High Court only rule on points of law. It does not award compensation of any amount in these cases.
    The o/p can enforce the award himself in the courts by way of two processes.


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