New job offer...using it to get a raise

toadfly

I have received a new job offer at a better company but because of personal reasons it's not the ideal time to take it. It's also a fixed term contract and I would be leaving a permanent position. The difference in salary is only around 4k but it would still be a lot for me as I'm not paid very well at the minute.

Anyway, just thinking of I can use this offer as a way to negotiating a higher salary where I am now. Has anyone done this with success? Obviously if they don't play ball I will have to leave. Not sure if it's worth the risk.

Any thoughts?

davo10

toadfly wrote: »

I have received a new job offer at a better company but because of personal reasons it's not the ideal time to take it. It's also a fixed term contract and I would be leaving a permanent position. The difference in salary is only around 4k but it would still be a lot for me as I'm not paid very well at the minute.

Anyway, just thinking of I can use this offer as a way to negotiating a higher salary where I am now. Has anyone done this with success? Obviously if they don't play ball I will have to leave. Not sure if it's worth the risk.

Any thoughts?

If you have decided to leave if they don't play ball, there is no risk, it's a "free swing". The risk only comes into it if you have decided to stay irrespective of their answer, then there is huge risk.

benjamin d

My feelings on that would be that no matter how nicely you approach your current bosses you're marking your card by using a new job offer as leverage, and as such your position is compromised. There's a big danger that if they agree to a raise and you let the other offer lapse it could come back to haunt you if they decide to screw you over and the opportunity to leave is gone.
Basically I'd only approach them if I was leaning towards taking the new job anyway.

Eoin

It can depend on how you phrase it so it's not so much a demand for a counter offer.

"I have a job offer and am leaving unless you pay me x,y,z"
versus
"I've had some strong interest from other companies, but I really want to stay here - can we have a chat please"

Mrs OBumble

I've done it, once.

Let my manager know that in the morning that I would be handing in my resignation that afternoon, because I'd got a better offer. Didn't say a word about alternatives.

They were ready with a counter offer by the time I approached them with the typed letter.

That said, it was a particular situation where government payscales were wayyyy below market rates. They knew they had a problem which needed to be addressed, but were only allowed to do it case-by-case when individual had offers.

Got a decent raise, and stayed happily for several years longer.

RedXIV

I'd agree with benjamin, unless you'd actually consider taking the job, I would be careful with this.
I did it once before for a job that I was very uneasy to take, and managed to wrangle a 7k raise from my existing employer but I left them anyway after that about 8 months later for another increase elsewhere.

If you know they would struggle without you, and you would be difficult to replace then obviously you've even more leverage but if it's a unskilled role, be very very careful

Speedwell

4K over a permanent position for a contract position is not really a raise. Not really. Not when you factor in the overhead of being a contractor (hiring a company to be your "umbrella", tax changes, saving for uncertainty, and so forth).

The common wisdom where I'm from is "never bluff unless you're prepared to have it called".

loyatemu

toadfly wrote: »

Obviously if they don't play ball I will have to leave. Not sure if it's worth the risk.

This is it, if you threaten to leave, you're burning your bridges if they don't make a counter-offer.

runawaybishop

loyatemu wrote: »

This is it, if you threaten to leave, you're burning your bridges if they don't make a counter-offer.

To be honest, once its known he wants to leave many managers will assume that if they meet his requests he will leave anyway a bit further down the line as he's clearly looking to move. With that in mind, unless he's business critical, he'll get a handshake and good wishes for his new job.

OP, suggest you ask for a meeting with your manager and mention when negotiating your pay that your skills are worth X, as evident in recruitment ads first - before saying you've been offered a role.

BizzyC

runawaybishop wrote: »

To be honest, once its known he wants to leave many managers will assume that if they meet his requests he will leave anyway a bit further down the line as he's clearly looking to move. With that in mind, unless he's business critical, he'll get a handshake and good wishes for his new job.

It depends on the motivation.
If someone is taking a different role for new challenges etc, then yes a counter-offer will only delay the move by 6 months.
If the motivation is purely money, then a counter offer can keep a person in their role and may be worth the investment.

OP, decide if you're willing to accept the contract for more money first.
You can't use the offer as a bluff, you have to be willing to follow through.

Senecio

Unless you are prepared to walk away if it doesn't go your way then no, you should not use it as a bargaining tool. That doesn't stop you from asking for a pay review without mentioning the offer. Then you can make a decision once you manager comes back to you.

stefanovich

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

That said, it was a particular situation where government payscales were wayyyy below market rates. They knew they had a problem which needed to be addressed, but were only allowed to do it case-by-case when individual had offers.

Wow. So the official policy was to screw over the employees for as long as they could get away with it.

Lu Tze

stefanovich wrote: »

Wow. So the official policy was to screw over the employees for as long as they could get away with it.

Employees who can earn more elsewhere can renegotiate (with the confidence that they can earn more elsewhere), or leave and earn more elsewhere. For the employees who cant earn more elsewhere, as in the market does not place a higher value on their skillset than they are currently paid, why would you pay them more again?

Pawwed Rig

stefanovich wrote: »

Wow. So the official policy was to screw over the employees for as long as they could get away with it.

An employer is not a charity. They will pay you as little as possible for the work you do and you will never get a pay increase unless you have demonstrated value to the company and positioned yourself correctly*

Mrs OBumble

stefanovich wrote: »

Wow. So the official policy was to screw over the employees for as long as they could get away with it.

Not about screwing people over. It's all about the value of skillsets in the market.

HR policies equated IT workers with ones in finance, marketing, policy, operations etc. Reality was that the market was paying IT workers more, because there were less people with the skills. But because it was public sector organisation, they had to appear "fair" about how the pay scales worked. People who really didn't like it were quite free to leave and get more elsewhere.

(Sideline: They face a similar-but-different problem now: inflation means that the standard market rate for experienced IT workers is more than 100,000 currency-units. But there's something in the public psyche which says that anyone getting over that is rich and overpaid, and asks regular parliamentary questions about how many people are in that pay bracket. Quite glad I'm not working there at the moment.)

stefanovich

Lu Tze wrote: »

Employees who can earn more elsewhere can renegotiate (with the confidence that they can earn more elsewhere), or leave and earn more elsewhere. For the employees who cant earn more elsewhere, as in the market does not place a higher value on their skillset than they are currently paid, why would you pay them more again?

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

An employer is not a charity. They will pay you as little as possible for the work you do and you will never get a pay increase unless you have demonstrated value to the company and positioned yourself correctly*

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Not about screwing people over. It's all about the value of skillsets in the market.

HR policies equated IT workers with ones in finance, marketing, policy, operations etc. Reality was that the market was paying IT workers more, because there were less people with the skills. But because it was public sector organisation, they had to appear "fair" about how the pay scales worked. People who really didn't like it were quite free to leave and get more elsewhere.

(Sideline: They face a similar-but-different problem now: inflation means that the standard market rate for experienced IT workers is more than 100,000 currency-units. But there's something in the public psyche which says that anyone getting over that is rich and overpaid, and asks regular parliamentary questions about how many people are in that pay bracket. Quite glad I'm not working there at the moment.)

Funny guys. You see, the employer should be able to gauge the employees worth and pay them accordingly. Not wait until the employee is unhappy and threatening to leave.

Basically what you are saying is that the OP must threaten to go or expect nothing. My experience is quite contrary however. Year on year increases in salary without holding anyone to ransom.

Jawgap

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Not about screwing people over. It's all about the value of skillsets in the market.

HR policies equated IT workers with ones in finance, marketing, policy, operations etc. Reality was that the market was paying IT workers more, because there were less people with the skills. But because it was public sector organisation, they had to appear "fair" about how the pay scales worked. People who really didn't like it were quite free to leave and get more elsewhere.

(Sideline: They face a similar-but-different problem now: inflation means that the standard market rate for experienced IT workers is more than 100,000 currency-units. But there's something in the public psyche which says that anyone getting over that is rich and overpaid, and asks regular parliamentary questions about how many people are in that pay bracket. Quite glad I'm not working there at the moment.)

Yep, that's the PS for you. We had our entire IT section up and leave either temporarily or permanently during the downturn because they could get better rates elsewhere.

I left about 18 months ago when the salary differential for my job just became too much to ignore, then I see the annual report for the agency I used to work for trumpeting its 'success' at trimming it's wage bill - which they did by not filling posts and recruiting in lower qualified and no experience recruits!

davo10

stefanovich wrote: »

Funny guys. You see, the employer should be able to gauge the employees worth and pay them accordingly. Not wait until the employee is unhappy and threatening to leave.

Basically what you are saying is that the OP must threaten to go or expect nothing. My experience is quite contrary however. Year on year increases in salary without holding anyone to ransom.

Unfortunately that is not how business works. An employee is paid what the market will bare and the lowest amount that the employer believes the employee is worth. For a business to pay employees any more than that results in unnecessary expenditure and reduction in profits. When an employee puts a "pay me more or I leave" ultimatum to an employer, the employer considers the employees worth to the company and the precedent giving the payment would set. If the employee is worth it, then s(he) is paid, if not, then the employer is effectively allowing him/her to leave with a view to getting a cheaper/better replacement

ted1

I've done it, and it worked.
Dies your computer make pension costs contributions? Or bonuses?
Because odds are if you are on contract you will get them. They may say they offer them but often it's on the basis that you stay for 2 years which may extend past your contract, or the bonus could be paid the after you leave

Ben Gadot

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

An employer is not a charity. They will pay you as little as possible for the work you do and you will never get a pay increase unless you have demonstrated value to the company and positioned yourself correctly*

I'd be curious to know what you mean by positioning ones self correctly? I've demonstrated my value and scored high in performance reviews yet haven't received an increase since 2014.

If you mean by positioning however that putting in yourself in the right circles is crucial then yeah I'd agree.

Pawwed Rig

Ben Gadot wrote: »

If you mean by positioning however that putting in yourself in the right circles is crucial then yeah I'd agree.

Yep, that's it. Hard work will get you a bit of the way but to get to the top you need people willing to put their neck on the line for you.