Car Sales Monopoly

ssmith6287

Im looking at buying a new car on PCP. Ive looked up the car dealer and found an RRP which I presume icludes charges, taxes etc.

I went into my local dealer and their price is about 2k more. I figured they were just being expensive. I have since emailed 5 other main dealers and have received the same price.

I cant see where the extra 2k is coming from but I taught there was a law around price setting agreements between retailers. e.g lets all bump up the price b 20% because the consumer has no other option.

Besides this theyre advertising x amount per month which doesnt show any details eg deposit, time and conditions, is this legal or is it just poor practice

colm_mcm

If you're buying an iPhone from an Apple Store and it's the same price everywhere, is that price fixing?
The distributor has an RRP for cars which excludes things like metallic paint, it doesn't take into account how much the garage pays to have the car delivered to them, it doesn't take into account things like mats, mud flaps etc which some dealers fit as part of the deal. The distributor doesn't dictate what the dealer charges for a car.
With new cars, there's almost always a discount available, but with some deals like scrappage, where the distributor is advertising a certain amount off, say €4K off a Nissan Qashqai, starting from €29,995* you expect the car to be €26k, when the dealer tells you you need to pay another few grand for delivery, related charges etc, it's a pain.
Fiat tried doing open book prices in the late 90s where they would advertise the car for the dealers at say £9995, there was no haggling, no room for manoeuvring. It didn't work.
I don't see that they're doing anything wrong here, it always states that extra charges apply. It's a pain, but it's done across the board.

I'm not a big fan of ads with "own a Dacia duster for €19 per week, or whatever. Especially on social media, they give none of the detail you have to give on a print ad.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

All retail prices quoted for cars exclude delivery and related charges, plus metallic paint is additional. Hardly price fixing if all garages are matching each other to the lowest possible price.

ssmith6287

So its not an RRP so?

If your iphone has RRP of 500€, when you go into the shop they dont charge you €500 plus delivery plus all the rest. its a retail price, this should all be included in the retail price.

I take your points though. Just annoyed me when I seen the price list at say 19995 and then you go to buy it and its 22000

colm_mcm

Usually the price on the window of the car, or on the dealership price list is the all inclusive price.

Lux23

Ayla Victorious Garden wrote: »

All retail prices quoted for cars exclude delivery and related charges, plus metallic paint is additional. Hardly price fixing if all garages are matching each other to the lowest possible price.

Or the highest possible price.

coylemj

OP, what you are complaining about is not a monopoly but price fixing. There was a court case in 2009 where two Citroen dealers pleaded guilty to price fixing (http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/two-car-dealers-await-sentencing-over-price-fixing-26508958.html) though it's very seldom that this type of case comes before the courts.

Technically, motor dealers are free to discount but in practice, if one of them does so, the other dealers selling that marque will put pressure on the distributor to bring him back into line and the distributor can do this by withholding various discounts and quarterly bonuses.

I'm sure you're aware of filling stations in small towns or across the road from each other in big cities where a price change by one of them is miraculously mirrored by the other guy within the hour. That's also price fixing but trying to prove the conspiracy to fix prices is very difficult.

unkel

colm_mcm wrote: »

Fiat tried doing open book prices in the late 90s where they would advertise the car for the dealers at say £9995, there was no haggling, no room for manoeuvring. It didn't work.

But it did work

FIAT sales (particularly the Punto and Cinquecento) skyrocketed in the mid 90s because of the scrappage scheme and the open book prices on their already cheap cars that made them look even cheaper. Cheap easily available credit helped too.

colm_mcm

It worked for people who never bought a new car before and haven't since

It was more geared towards straight deals, it wrecked fiats already weak resale value, and those finance deals that people on social welfare got accepted for (really) meant that the cars were often neglected, which compounded the reliability issue.

VincePP

The reason why delivery and related charges are extra is because if they were included they would be liable for VRT which is based on the delivered to port retail price.

These days the savings are not huge, but in the bad days of vrt the saving was a few hundred on some cars.

Technically you could ask to collect your car from the distribution yard and drive it out yourself and also take the protective wax off, do a pre delivery check and do the registration and add the number plates.

ajamesr

From the Skoda Website in the T&C's part under the section about PCP financing when you are using their Finance Calculator:

"Prices displayed are on the road prices and include a recommended retail delivery charge and related fees of €600."

I rang a Skoda Dealer today, emailed him the Car Card of the car I had spec'd which includes the price. He rang to say that price didn't include Delivery etc. - but their website says different.
I had similar issues 2 years ago when buying a new car. Different Skoda dealer tried to tell me %rate was 5.9 and not 3.9 as advertised on the Skoda Website. After 30 minutes debating it he caved and said it was an error on his computer software which is not the same as the online configurator.

Now I have a feeling I am being charged delivery twice. He also gave me a price which I believe to be low for my trade-in and then told me because he was doing me such a good deal on the trade-in price there was no room for discount of the MSRP - its a €37,000 car, no disc on MSRP?
I said "forget the trade-in. I'm selling you a car in one transaction and then buying a new car from you, stop confusing the issue. You have given me a price for my trade-in, which is low, and now I want to discuss the final price for the new car, you can't expect me to pay full MSRP." He said nothing he could do, he had used his margin on my trade in price.
Ohh and he tried to add extra for metallic paint which he said the configurator hadn't added either - I had to explain that the colour I chose, Meteor Grey, was not a metallic colour. I hate thinking it, but some of these guys must really take some people to the cleaners.

I was hoping for about 4% or 5% off MSRP. Skoda UK are offering £2000 towards your deposit and 1.9% interest rate - so their is plenty margin there. If a similar deal was running in Ireland I wouldn't expect any more discount - but no deals exist at the moment.

VincePP

ajamesr wrote: »

From the Skoda Website in the T&C's part under the section about PCP financing when you are using their Finance Calculator:

"Prices displayed are on the road prices and include a recommended retail delivery charge and related fees of €600."

I rang a Skoda Dealer today, emailed him the Car Card of the car I had spec'd which includes the price. He rang to say that price didn't include Delivery etc. - but their website says different.
I had similar issues 2 years ago when buying a new car. Different Skoda dealer tried to tell me %rate was 5.9 and not 3.9 as advertised on the Skoda Website. After 30 minutes debating it he caved and said it was an error on his computer software which is not the same as the online configurator.

Now I have a feeling I am being charged delivery twice. He also gave me a price which I believe to be low for my trade-in and then told me because he was doing me such a good deal on the trade-in price there was no room for discount of the MSRP - its a €37,000 car, no disc on MSRP?
I said "forget the trade-in. I'm selling you a car in one transaction and then buying a new car from you, stop confusing the issue. You have given me a price for my trade-in, which is low, and now I want to discuss the final price for the new car, you can't expect me to pay full MSRP." He said nothing he could do, he had used his margin on my trade in price.
Ohh and he tried to add extra for metallic paint which he said the configurator hadn't added either - I had to explain that the colour I chose, Meteor Grey, was not a metallic colour. I hate thinking it, but some of these guys must really take some people to the cleaners.

I was hoping for about 4% or 5% off MSRP. Skoda UK are offering £2000 towards your deposit and 1.9% interest rate - so their is plenty margin there. If a similar deal was running in Ireland I wouldn't expect any more discount - but no deals exist at the moment.

do 3 things

1 - Put your current car through a car auction. You'll get cash and a good chance of a better than "trade" price. The dealer is going to shunt it off to a trade buyer and will effectively want €500 in that price for his work.

2 - Find another dealer - plenty of skoda dealers about.

3 - Haggle a "cash" price with the dealer.

If the pcp is on a 0% or lower than market interest rate, the cost of the money is built in to the price. Take a low or zero rate pcp and there will be little or no discount. Organise finance yourself and you will get 7-10% discount.


In the motor trade there is no such thing as a "free offer". You pay for it somehow - either through a higher price or a lower trade-in.

If its a 0% offer - then work out how much interest you would normally pay from a bank (about 8%) and that effectively is your discount.

ajamesr

Contacted another Skoda dealer y/day and got much the same offer. A low offer for my trade in and again he added just over €600 to the MRSP that the online calculator gives although as I said in previous post the skoda website says this:

"Prices displayed are on the road prices and include a recommended retail delivery charge and related fees of €600."

So instead of getting discount of the MRSP, the MRSP goes UP whenever I get a offer. So I think I'm out until either SKODA themselves introduce a better offer ( like the one they currently have in UK) or something else happens.

VincePP

ajamesr wrote: »

Contacted another Skoda dealer y/day and got much the same offer. A low offer for my trade in and again he added just over €600 to the MRSP that the online calculator gives although as I said in previous post the skoda website says this:

"Prices displayed are on the road prices and include a recommended retail delivery charge and related fees of €600."

So instead of getting discount of the MRSP, the MRSP goes UP whenever I get a offer. So I think I'm out until either SKODA themselves introduce a better offer ( like the one they currently have in UK) or something else happens.

why don't you ask for an on the road "cash price"

Also there are many ther makes of cars out there insame price bracket

L1011

VincePP wrote: »

why don't you ask for an on the road "cash price"

Considering dealers often get commission on finance sales, a cash price may not be any cheaper.