Online dating

Foxtrol · 02-05-2016 6:09pm

Cupcake_Crisis wrote: »

I downloaded Bumble at my housemates behest. I bloody hate it. I'm not great for making the first move. My go to opener is the GIF of the bear waving hello....

FYI, Bumble was created by a woman who had an input in creating Tinder but had leave due to a sexual harassment lawsuit. Apparently.

It’s not always nice when the shoe is on the other foot. Equality :pac:

I don’t think anyone is necessarily ‘great’ at making the first move on apps. From a very limited profile it’s very hard to tell what sort of opener will work for a given person. One person might hate a cheesy pickup line, while the next might have no interest in talking about the holiday photo they’ve in their profile.

This is why I really don’t see the big issue with starting a conversation with a basic ‘Hi, how are you?’, as it leaves massive scope for different directions the conversation could go depending on the first few answers and it also gives each party a chance to test the waters. If anything, it says more about the conversation skills of the person who is asked the question if they can’t turn it down an interesting track.

At the end of the day if you find the person attractive enough then you’re going to respond even if they just say ‘Hi’.

Bumble I find is the worst app for frontloading good looking people (I presume via an algorithm for the percentage of right swipes) when you go into a new area. Every time I go to a new city it is crazy the number of attractive women there are on it for the first while compared to later on.

02-05-2016 6:43pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

It’s not always nice when the shoe is on the other foot. Equality :pac:

I don’t think anyone is necessarily ‘great’ at making the first move on apps. From a very limited profile it’s very hard to tell what sort of opener will work for a given person. One person might hate a cheesy pickup line, while the next might have no interest in talking about the holiday photo they’ve in their profile.

This is why I really don’t see the big issue with starting a conversation with a basic ‘Hi, how are you?’, as it leaves massive scope for different directions the conversation could go depending on the first few answers and it also gives each party a chance to test the waters. If anything, it says more about the conversation skills of the person who is asked the question if they can’t turn it down an interesting track.

At the end of the day if you find the person attractive enough then you’re going to respond even if they just say ‘Hi’.

I won't. Straight away I will think that this person has very little to say for himself. That's not for me. I need my intellect engaged with and stimulated.

PowerToWait · 02-05-2016 6:58pm

Deleted User wrote: »

I won't. Straight away I will think that this person has very little to say for himself. That's not for me. I need my intellect engaged with and stimulated.

And yet a potential suitor's opening gambit is unlikely to be a pithy quip involving his favourite Farsi fillum. 'Hi' can go places that no words cannot.

mickmackmcgoo · 02-05-2016 6:59pm

Deleted User wrote:

I won't. Straight away I will think that this person has very little to say for himself. That's not for me. I need my intellect engaged with and stimulated.

If a guy walked up to you in a bar and launched straight into a stimulating conversation without saying hello how are you etc , you would probably think he was a weirdo and walk away

coffee_cake · 02-05-2016 7:29pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

I mentioned this earlier in the thread but I find comments like this really ironic. I hear a lot of women complaining about the ‘Hi, how are you?’ introduction messages on dating apps, when at the same time on Bumble I’d say at least 95% of the messages I receive from women are along those lines (on Bumble women have to message the guy first when you match).

From my experience, women who complain about these messages rarely, if ever, message first if they match with a guy. In the case of tinder and other matching apps, I really get the feeling these women are more on them for an ego boost, rather than actually looking to date.

Well you can strike me off that list anyway, had no problems sending messages first

Foxtrol · 02-05-2016 7:41pm

Deleted User wrote: »

I won't. Straight away I will think that this person has very little to say for himself. That's not for me. I need my intellect engaged with and stimulated.

Again, that says more about you than it does him.

You want him to make the first move and within the first sentence intellectually engage and stimulate you. Talk about demanding or pure laziness. Obviously an interesting opener is great but I would never think to write someone off because of it (using my Bumble example I’d be working with only 5% of the women who showed mutual interest in each other).

If that’s the mindset of women who don’t respond to basic introductions then from now on I’m going to be happy with every lack of response, when I send similar. Talk about dodging a bullet!

Mister Vain · 02-05-2016 7:55pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

You want him to make the first move and within the first sentence intellectually engage and stimulate you.!

That's no easy task by any means.

I don't mind the "Hi" messages if they look nice or have an interesting profile because you never know where it could go. Beggars can't be choosers and all that.

Chain Smoker · 02-05-2016 8:06pm

Lets be honest here though, male or female, if you're at all interested in them, you're going to respond to "hi, how are you?" If you're male you'll be more likely to respond regardless purely because there's more novelty to receiving a message without sending one, but it's still fairly unlikely you're going to become more interested.

There's a limited amount of potential in talking someone into changing their initial impression for the better via short instant messages (and long instant messages just look nuts, especially if the person isn't interested), and I say this as someone who I imagine is way above average at doing that.

maudgonner · 02-05-2016 8:12pm

If I get a 'Hi' message but the guy has put effort into his profile I'll probably respond.

But that's not usually the case. More often than not the profile will be empty too. If the guy is relying on his photos to get a response, that rarely works for me. I'm not looking for a hookup, I'll need something to indicate whether we'd have any compatibility.

I don't need them to send an essay, a one-liner that makes me laugh, shows an interest in me or starts a conversation will do the trick.

tupenny · 02-05-2016 8:39pm

thattequilagirl wrote: »

To give the girl's perspective on your tinder experience, lots of guys send me a message saying "hi" and I rarely reply because he's put no effort in. I've got a variety of interesting photos up and a description that describes my interests - I'll reply to a guy who starts a conversation with me based on a place I've been (from the photos) or what I'm interested in. "Hi" is a lame message.

It also usually comes from a guy who only has one or two photos, often in a group of friends so it's hard to tell which is him, or taken in a bathroom with dodgy lighting. Your profile is your first impression so put a bit of effort in.

Having said all that, I have also considered going down the matchmaker route. I think it's probably a lot less effort than all that swiping and texting with guys who it never goes anywhere with.

I'm almost 28 and most of my friends are coupled up/married, so it's basically a way of getting set up since they don't have many single friends.

I'd consider it.

U sound like a dope though . With your "interesting" pics

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy · 02-05-2016 8:42pm

tupenny wrote: »

U sound like a dope though . With your "interesting" pics

You sound like you send lots of "hi" messages.

Mister Vain · 02-05-2016 8:44pm

The onus seems to be on the guys to be impressive, witty, original and generally put in a lot of effort. I know its kind of the same IRL but at least IRL it doesn't feel like you're auditioning for a chat. You can just say hi and see where it goes.

maudgonner · 02-05-2016 8:49pm

Mister Vain wrote: »

The onus seems to be on the guys to be impressive, witty, original and generally put in a lot of effort. I know its kind of the same IRL but at least IRL it doesn't feel like you're auditioning for a chat. You can just say hi and see where it goes.

Nope, I have no problem messaging a guy first. When I do, I'll always put in more than just a hi, normally ask him about something in his profile.

02-05-2016 8:50pm

Mister Vain wrote: »

The onus seems to be on the guys to be impressive, witty, original and generally put in a lot of effort. I know its kind of the same IRL but at least IRL it doesn't feel like you're auditioning for a chat. You can just say hi and see where it goes.

I take the onus upon myself to be witty and impressive. I can't speak for other women but if I see a man's profile that I find interesting then I will message him and it will be a message that I put thought in to.

Foxtrol · 02-05-2016 8:55pm

maudgonner wrote: »

If I get a 'Hi' message but the guy has put effort into his profile I'll probably respond.

But that's not usually the case. More often than not the profile will be empty too. If the guy is relying on his photos to get a response, that rarely works for me. I'm not looking for a hookup, I'll need something to indicate whether we'd have any compatibility.

I don't need them to send an essay, a one-liner that makes me laugh, shows an interest in me or starts a conversation will do the trick.

What’s better to indicate you’d be compatible than having the courtesy to simply responding to the other person’s attempt to have a conversation? I really don’t see what the harm could be to involve yourself in conversation for a few minutes before writing a person off that you’ve shown an interest in. If it’s not clicking then I understand not wanting to continue things.

You’ve judged the cover of the book and liked it but now you’re going to throw it away because the first sentence doesn’t have you enthralled. It is a sign of someone who is going to be incredible demanding/high maintenance.

Obviously the likes of POF is different, I wouldn’t expect someone to respond to every attempt at conversation from random people.

Tell me how · 02-05-2016 8:55pm

Deleted User wrote:

I take the onus upon myself to be witty and impressive. I can't speak for other women but if I see a man's profile that I find interesting then I will message him and it will be a message that I put thought in to.

Witty and impressive is subjective. You can attempt to be that way but it might not always hit.
Original advice regarding dating was always "Be yourself". I've no problem if for some people that's a shorter message than others.
It's not like they're original paper letters that take 3 days to arrive. More advanced conversation pieces can come in message 2, 3 or 4.

Can't they?

02-05-2016 8:55pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

Again, that says more about you than it does him.

You want him to make the first move and within the first sentence intellectually engage and stimulate you. Talk about demanding or pure laziness. Obviously an interesting opener is great but I would never think to write someone off because of it (using my Bumble example I’d be working with only 5% of the women who showed mutual interest in each other).

If that’s the mindset of women who don’t respond to basic introductions then from now on I’m going to be happy with every lack of response, when I send similar. Talk about dodging a bullet!

Firstly I send the initial message if I see a man I like. It certainly will be more than "Hi".
So I like to receive messages where the guy has put a bit of thought in to it. Something as simple as "oh you like Tom Waits, me too. What did you think of such and such an album"?

A message which I can engage with and fills me with confidence that you have something to say for yourself.

02-05-2016 8:57pm

Tell me how wrote: »

Witty and impressive is subjective. You can attempt to be that way but it might not always hit.
Original advice regarding dating was always "Be yourself". I've no problem if for some people that's a shorter message than others.
It's not like they're original paper letters that take 3 days to arrive. More advanced conversation pieces can come in message 2, 3 or 4.

Can't they?

Again if I receive a message along the lines of "Hi" it's very unlikely I will be interested.

maudgonner · 02-05-2016 9:03pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

What’s better to indicate you’d be compatible than having the courtesy to simply responding to the other person’s attempt to have a conversation? I really don’t see what the harm could be to involve yourself in conversation for a few minutes before writing a person off that you’ve shown an interest in. If it’s not clicking then I understand not wanting to continue things.

You’ve judged the cover of the book and liked it but now you’re going to throw it away because the first sentence doesn’t have you enthralled. It is a sign of someone who is going to be incredible demanding/high maintenance.

Obviously the likes of POF is different, I wouldn’t expect someone to respond to every attempt at conversation from random people.

Maybe I should have said, I'm only on POF, I don't use Tinder etc. So I wouldn't have swiped to indicate interest.

As for judging the book by the cover - what more am I meant to judge by? As I said, if a guy has info in his profile, that's different. But if he's expecting me to engage based purely on his photos and 'Hi', then I'm going to assume he's not putting in a lot of effort and is just using a scattergun approach.

I'm looking for more than looks, and I'm looking for someone who is looking for more than looks.

J Mysterio · 02-05-2016 9:04pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Again if I receive a message along the lines of "Hi" it's very unlikely I will be interested.

It makes no sense. Surely 'Hi' is how you can get the ball rolling in chatting?

When you receive a 'hi', you can check if you find the person attractive or not. If you do, surely saying 'hi' back reaffirms in your interlocutor there's mutual attraction and they can then go on to chat ('oh, your taste in music is so edgy, you are so interesting').

02-05-2016 9:05pm

J Mysterio wrote: »

It makes no sense. Surely 'Hi' is how you can get the ball rolling in chatting?

When you receive a 'hi', you can check if you find the person attractive or not. If you do, surely saying 'hi' back reaffirms in your interlocutor there's mutual attraction and they can then go on to chat ('oh, your taste in music is so edgy, you are so interesting').

Why can't the guy write more than just "hi"?

Foxtrol · 02-05-2016 9:06pm

maudgonner wrote: »

Nope, I have no problem messaging a guy first. When I do, I'll always put in more than just a hi, normally ask him about something in his profile.

Deleted User wrote: »

I take the onus upon myself to be witty and impressive. I can't speak for other women but if I see a man's profile that I find interesting then I will message him and it will be a message that I put thought in to.

I believe you but you’re both outliers on this for your gender.

It goes as far as women including statements in their profile “I don’t respond to people just saying ‘Hi’” and/or “I don’t make the first move”.

It’s pretty embarrassing and these profiles are well avoided.

coffee_cake · 02-05-2016 9:06pm

People advertising themselves with negative profiles (which includes men btw) is to be avoided, yes

Tell me how · 02-05-2016 9:10pm

Deleted User wrote:

Why can't the guy write more than just "hi"?

Maybe because what he is saying is "Hi". He's not declaring the search is over or proposing to someone.

I could understand your take on this more so in a speed dating scenario but where it's online I just don't think it's enough reason to call "Next".

I'm not suggesting it is solely down to the girl to provoke conversation either.

If someone's profile was just "Hi" then I would back off.

maudgonner · 02-05-2016 9:13pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

You’ve judged the cover of the book and liked it but now you’re going to throw it away because the first sentence doesn’t have you enthralled. It is a sign of someone who is going to be incredible demanding/high maintenance.

There's a world of difference between what you've written above and saying that you expect someone to say more than 'Hi' in their opening message.

I'm not expecting a stunning example of Wildean wit (after all if Wilde himself was to message me if wouldn't exactly lead to a healthy relationship!). But some effort isn't much to ask for. Otherwise I'll assume he's messaging scores, hundreds of women and just seeing who will bite. And that's just not the kind of guy I'm looking for.

Foxtrol · 02-05-2016 9:15pm

maudgonner wrote: »

Maybe I should have said, I'm only on POF, I don't use Tinder etc. So I wouldn't have swiped to indicate interest.

As for judging the book by the cover - what more am I meant to judge by? As I said, if a guy has info in his profile, that's different. But if he's expecting me to engage based purely on his photos and 'Hi', then I'm going to assume he's not putting in a lot of effort and is just using a scattergun approach.

I'm looking for more than looks, and I'm looking for someone who is looking for more than looks.

POF is a different kettle of fish

I thought I mentioned earlier that I was just talking about apps where you match, so you’ve already shown some level of interest in each other. I think it’s hypocritical in that situation for someone who has liked a profile with a limited bio to suddenly want to be instantaneously intellectually stimulated or they won’t respond.

For the likes of POF you do run into a situation where you could put a lot of effort into messages for them to be simply lost in the crush of mails. I can see why guys wouldn’t go into a massive amount of effort but similarly I can understand why they wouldn’t receive a favourable response.

Billy86 · 02-05-2016 9:18pm

J Mysterio wrote: »

But he did take the time to say hello? So you would ignore that message even if you liked the look of someone? You could always say 'hi' back.

Tried that before just to see how it would go, almost always something like this:

Them: Hi
Me: Hi
Them: How are you?
Me: Good, and you?
Them: OK thanks.

If they want to initiate a conversation, then they can make the effort to come up with something. Sure if it were someone I found very attractive I probably would reply, but then that would be because I also want to initiate conversation with them. If they can't get something interesting or exciting going, I'm going to take that as a red flag that they might not be the most interesting person going.

It sounds harsh, but when there are thousands of potential people to see immediately in front of you you need to be discriminatory for that kind of stuff. I'm not asking for the greatest thing I've ever read, just something -anything- to work with and get the conversation in flow.

J Mysterio · 02-05-2016 9:19pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why can't the guy write more than just "hi"?

Why do you have to make it difficult to connect?Youre on a dating site, not facebook. Its a two way thing.

maudgonner · 02-05-2016 9:23pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

For the likes of POF you do run into a situation where you could put a lot of effort into messages for them to be simply lost in the crush of mails. I can see why guys wouldn’t go into a massive amount of effort but similarly I can understand why they wouldn’t receive a favourable response.

Of course you're not going to get a response to every mail. But as I said, I'm not talking about an essay. A one-liner message is perfectly acceptable, if it's a one-liner that has even a tiny bit of thought put into it. I can only speak for myself, but there's far more likelihood of that getting a response from me than just 'Hi'.

I guess it depends what you're looking for from it - if you spot someone you really like the look & sound of, why wouldn't you put in a little bit of effort to stand out from the crowd? If they're not willing to do that much, then I doubt we're looking for the same thing. Which is fair enough - it may depend on your age/stage of life/goals etc.

Billy86 · 02-05-2016 9:24pm

Mister Vain wrote: »

The onus seems to be on the guys to be impressive, witty, original and generally put in a lot of effort. I know its kind of the same IRL but at least IRL it doesn't feel like you're auditioning for a chat. You can just say hi and see where it goes.

The massive problem with this: Have you ever seen an attractive woman's POF inbox?

A girl I know got 580 messages in one day. You try finding the time to answer 580 'hi' messages and trying to figure out who is interesting and who is not from them!

Online dating

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