John Giles to be dropped by RTE

Coat22

eagle eye wrote: »

I think Giles is doing what RTE want him to do because when you hear him on newstalk he is very good. He was an excellent writer in the Friday edition of the Evening Herald many years ago too.

Sorry to keep coming back to you but do you really think he's any use on Newstalk? I find it almost embarrassing listening to his slot - just keeps repeating the presenters name and throwing out lines about "making an effort" "being honest" "getting stuck in"

Not surprised RTE have thrown licence payers money at him all these years as they couldn't care less but really surprised Denis O'Brien allows his cash to be floundered like this.

sReq | uTeK

Coat22 wrote: »

They may well do but if you get a chance look back on the footage before kick off last night, Dunphy completely dissed Maloney and threw his eyes over to Giles in a "look what we're up against" kind of way - it was very telling

fair enough, I do that to some of my mates too when they talk sh1t

Sebastian Dangerfield

Coat22 wrote: »

Sorry to keep coming back to you but do you really think he's any use on Newstalk? I find it almost embarrassing listening to his slot - just keeps repeating the presenters name and throwing out lines about "making an effort" "being honest" "getting stuck in"

"Honesty of effort" is the phrase you're looking for. Means absolutely nothing

murpho999

Coat22 wrote: »

I think everyone (well most) are intelligent enough to see through Dunphy and his tired repartee. People also have the cop on to realise this is the formula RTE have tried to replicate over every sport with Hook on Rugby and Spillane / Brolly on GAA.

But Dunphy (and Giles) are a spent force. Have been for 15+ years. But like "Ole Ole" - it worked in Italia 90 so we won't bother our ar$e thinking up a new formula and will just keep the whole thing going.

Bill had the class to make up for the shortcomings of these lads for years. Since he left it been like watching a slow painful car crash with these 2.

Still find it beter than the majority of bland coverage on other channels.

The Davestator

Get Ken Early on the TV to replace the same old nonsense from the panel.

ricero

The Davestator wrote: »

Get Ken Early on the TV to replace the same old nonsense from the panel.

Ken has the charisma of a wet mop on tv. Does not come across well on tv

Coat22

murpho999 wrote: »

Coat22 wrote: »

I think everyone (well most) are intelligent enough to see through Dunphy and his tired repartee. People also have the cop on to realise this is the formula RTE have tried to replicate over every sport with Hook on Rugby and Spillane / Brolly on GAA.

But Dunphy (and Giles) are a spent force. Have been for 15+ years. But like "Ole Ole" - it worked in Italia 90 so we won't bother our ar$e thinking up a new formula and will just keep the whole thing going.

Bill had the class to make up for the shortcomings of these lads for years. Since he left it been like watching a slow painful car crash with these 2.

Still find it beter than the majority of bland coverage on other channels.

Well its different but not sure I'd call it better.

Spot on the coverage on the other channels (Souness excepted) has been awful in the extreme due to its blandness but the coverage on RTE is awful with these 2 due to its incompetence.

Think Brady would be a revelation if he's unshackled from having to be the diplomatic one at present

sReq | uTeK

rob316 wrote: »

I like that but I think you need atleast 2 Irish lads on the main panel.

Yup, you're probably right. Irish people would probably think they've tuned into sky sports

Anyway, IMO worst pundit of all time goes to Thiery Henry

jharr100

sReq | uTeK wrote: »

Yup, you're probably right. Irish people would probably think they've tuned into sky sports

Anyway, IMO worst pundit of all time goes to Thiery Henry

Kenny Cunningham is a close 2nd IMHO

murpho999

The Davestator wrote: »

Get Ken Early on the TV to replace the same old nonsense from the panel.

It's always ex pros that all stations use, not journalists.

The Davestator

murpho999 wrote: »

It's always ex pros that all stations use, not journalists.

and that's the problem!

They're on because they were good players - not good pundits.

In fact, Richie Sadlier got ridiculed with a RTE graphic regarding his playing career, but is far ahead of most of the more successful ex players they use IMO.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Both Souness and Lennon the other night before the England match on Monday were excellent.

pappyodaniel

Dunphy made the exact same point yesterday, before, during and twice after the Iceland game, something to the effect of "there's a bloke on the team who plays for Charlton Athletic, and they just got relegated to the 2nd division, the lowest league in professional English football."
The worst thing about it was he said it twice after the game in the space of 7 or 8 minutes. It took Liam Brady to step in and cut him off and correct him that Charlton were actually just relegated from the Championship and we're now in League One....and were not lying in the lowest league in English football.
RTE have to step in after the Euros and replace the two boys as it's getting embarrassing at this stage.

Brian?

vicwatson wrote: »

He's a chancer, end of. "Your man this, Your man that", knows feck all of the players, couldnt be arsed

It's funny, I've never seen anyone use "end of" at the end of a statement that's factually correct.


John Giles may not be the most detail oriented, but how you can call him a chamber is beyond me. His strength has never been doing previews, it's actually analysing play. His Insights at the end of games are generally great. Who cares if he can't name Hungarys starting 11.

Snickers Man

eagle eye wrote: »

I still enjoy listening to John Giles whether it's on RTE as a panelist or on the phone-in to Newstalk.

He made a very telling comment on Newstalk recently which is applicable to the world beyond football.

After a few minutes discussing positional sense and its importance to the game, and how the great players always seemed to be in the right place at the right time and how it was a product of intelligence and experience but most of all just concentration and diligence and being aware of what is going on around them he said: "The thing is, modern pundits don't talk about it much because there isn't a stat for it!"

Meeoww!!! But so true. Some very important things are very difficult to measure using statistics. And that takes us beyond football so that's all I'll say.

I'll miss him. I think he's an excellent pundit.

Billy86

I'm sorry but he can't try to mock modern pundits for actually doing research, when he doesn't so much as know the names of half the players on the pitch.

eamonpk

I like Giles but on the TV he agrees far too often with Dunphy even when he is talking rubbish. He nearly sounds like he would rather go along with Dunphy that have another fall out with him which wouldn't be hard

Brian?

Billy86 wrote: »

I'm sorry but he can't try to mock modern pundits for actually doing research, when he doesn't so much as know the names of half the players on the pitch.

Modern punditry confuses knowledge with wisdom. What's the point in knowing stats if you can't actually analyse what's happening on the pitch.

Pete Moss

Billy86 wrote: »

I'm sorry but he can't try to mock modern pundits for actually doing research, when he doesn't so much as know the names of half the players on the pitch.

I'd take John Giles any day of the week over modern pundits like Jaime Redknapp, Robbie Savage and Ian Wright, three of the most nonsensical pundits I've ever watched. Redknapp, Savage and Wright are all style, no substance and tend to make their analysis using standard punditry jargon and vowels.

"The ball's whipped into the box and Vardy's alive to it. Oooooh phenomenal."

At least Giles & Co. can offer an honest opinion, which BBC, ITV and Sky pundits can rarely muster.

Billy86

Brian? wrote: »

Modern punditry confuses knowledge with wisdom. What's the point in knowing stats if you can't actually analyse what's happening on the pitch.

What amazes me is that Sadlier typically does both, and some people hate him for it. These lads at RTE are not on min wage or anything, it's not a stretch to ask them to actually do some work outside of pretending to know who they are talking about on the pitch (which is made even worse by the fact they often seem to have their minds made up for life on a player... after 45 minutes of ever having seen them play).

If the naturally smartest kid in the class never opens a book or does a single tap for the LC, it will show in the exam - same thing here.

Wichita Lineman

I was disappointed in the lads last night as they seemed to be underwhelmed by Ireland's victory. Without Bill there to tell them to cop on to themselves they are a fast fading force.

Billy86

Pete Moss wrote: »

I'd take John Giles any day of the week over modern pundits like Jaime Redknapp, Robbie Savage and Ian Wright, three of the most nonsensical pundits I've ever watched. Redknapp, Savage and Wright are all style, no substance and tend to make their analysis using standard punditry jargon and vowels.

"The ball's whipped into the box and Vardy's alive to it. Oooooh phenomenal."

At least Giles & Co. can offer an honest opinion, which BBC, ITV and Sky pundits can rarely muster.

Those three are horrific though, and often have the same problems as Giles & Dunphy - lack of knowledge of the players. They also seriously lack charisma, personality (outside of Wright but he's a pain) and any real insight to the game.

But going back to the analogy in my post above, if the smartest kid in class fails his leaving cert because he never opened a book or made the slightest bit of effort, he can't point to a dumber kid in the class who did as little effort and say "at least I got 150 points, that guy only got 130!"

Doesn't change the fact the smart kid only got 150.

Dick phelan

Bilic on ITV is the best pundit at the Euros. I really like Didi as well hopefully RTE can give him a more permanent role going forward. I actually like Duff as a pundit as well, a panel of him, Brady and Didi would do nicely.

bucketybuck

Pete Moss wrote: »

I'd take John Giles any day of the week over modern pundits like Jaime Redknapp, Robbie Savage and Ian Wright, three of the most nonsensical pundits I've ever watched. Redknapp, Savage and Wright are all style, no substance and tend to make their analysis using standard punditry jargon and vowels.

Saying you would rather have Giles than three of the worst pundits ever is pretty meaningless to be honest.

ionadnapokot

bucketybuck wrote: »

Saying you would rather have Giles than three of the worst pundits ever is pretty meaningless to be honest.

I'd have Giles ahead any of the pundits I have EVER seen.

Ever stretches back a fair bit for me now.
Cloughie '86

Billy86

ionadnapokot wrote: »

I'd have Giles ahead any of the pundits I have EVER seen.

Ever stretches back a fair bit for me now.
Cloughie '86

So not much interest in the players, coaches or teams on the pitch, or really even how the game is going then I take it?

Mec27

IMO you need to at least try have some sort of knowledge/background on these players. I don't get it either they have sat around watching football every 2 years for years, how people like Giles haven't built up an awareness of players is boggling tbh.

surripere

" Do der stuff. Get on it & do it der lik dat, Bill/Eoin/Ger "

Spoken ad naseum for twenty years.

tastyt

I have really liked duff on the panel to be honest, no bull**** and not afraid to disagree with other panellists

ionadnapokot

Just browsing some through some recent Gilesy footage. Calling it as he sees it.
Legend

picking out arsenal players
http://m.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2015/1001/731652-video-arsenal-going-nowhere-with-dishonest-ozil/

re: Wes and his size "issue" 8 min mark
http://m.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2015/0329/690711-video/#media

Pete Moss

bucketybuck wrote: »

Saying you would rather have Giles than three of the worst pundits ever is pretty meaningless to be honest.

I wrote that in response to someone comparing Giles to modern pundits. Redknapp, Savage and Wright are modern pundits. In fact, when it comes to the Premier League, Champions League or an international tournament from an Irish TV viewer's perspective, pundits don't come much more modern than those three. They're the poster boys for Sky, BBC and BT Sport and, most likely, the mold for future pundits with flagship television stations.

tayto lover

ionadnapokot wrote: »

Just browsing some through some recent Gilesy footage. Calling it as he sees it.
Legend

picking out arsenal players
http://m.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2015/1001/731652-video-arsenal-going-nowhere-with-dishonest-ozil/

re: Wes and his size "issue" 8 min mark
http://m.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2015/0329/690711-video/#media

The problem is that thankfully other experts don't agree with him.
Giles hasn't a clue. He's from a different generation. He also made a balls of the Ireland team while in charge with his out-dated tactics.

Dots1982

Giles doing a serious about turn in his article in the Herald today. Saying Wes shouldn't start on Sunday or maybe he's just confused. http://www.herald.ie/sport/soccer/players-ready-to-die-for-the-cause-34828245.html

briany

On the subject of not starting Wes Hoolahan, I think it's certainly something worth considering. Would a tired Wes have been able to fashion that perfectly flighted pass in for Brady? Maybe not. Maybe he wouldn't even have been in that position. A lot to be said for bringing him on relatively fresh legged for the last 20 minutes or so when Ireland can exploit any tiredness the opposition are feeling. Just a thought.

XR3i

what goes around comes around, baby

Gael85

Has Sadlier been doing many games on RTE as pundit for Euros? Duff has got into ahead of him for the main games on RTE

Danye

Gael85 wrote: »

Has Sadlier been doing many games on RTE as pundit for Euros? Duff has got into ahead of him for the main games on RTE

From what I've seen, Sadlier hasn't been doing too much.

I think Duff is decent, but I think he just looks a bit awkward. Maybe with some media training he'll be grand.

Regards Giles, I thought he was an excellent pundit and I would still listen to his opinions and views but I've agreed with him less and less as time has gone on.

trashcan

briany wrote: »

On the subject of not starting Wes Hoolahan, I think it's certainly something worth considering. Would a tired Wes have been able to fashion that perfectly flighted pass in for Brady? Maybe not. Maybe he wouldn't even have been in that position. A lot to be said for bringing him on relatively fresh legged for the last 20 minutes or so when Ireland can exploit any tiredness the opposition are feeling. Just a thought.

There may well be something in what you say, and bringing Wes on late certainly worked the other evening. The only problem is, we could be 2-0 down with 20 or 25 minutes to go. I would always have said start with your best team, and he is our most creative player, but then Brady played well in the centre on Wednesday, so I just don't know.

I honestly think our best chance against the French is to keep it scoreless for as long as possible and nick a goal late on. In other words a repeat of Italy and Germany. If we were to take the lead early, I honestly couldn't see us holding on, much less adding to it.

Billy86

trashcan wrote: »

I honestly think our best chance against the French is to keep it scoreless for as long as possible and nick a goal late on. In other words a repeat of Italy and Germany. If we were to take the lead early, I honestly couldn't see us holding on, much less adding to it.

Absolutely! I think our chances are incredibly slim, but one thing people can't deny is that MONs ugly style of play does do a good job at disrupting some very good teams. France are relatively young and don't have the proven resolve of a Spain or whatnot, so if we can keep it tied to the hour mark, I might just begin to ever-so-slightly begin to believe!

Mec27

Billy86 wrote: »

Absolutely! I think our chances are incredibly slim, but one thing people can't deny is that MONs ugly style of play does do a good job at disrupting some very good teams. France are relatively young and don't have the proven resolve of a Spain or whatnot, so if we can keep it tied to the hour mark, I might just begin to ever-so-slightly begin to believe!

France play **** as well, this will be another match where the pre-game discussion will talk about the weakness of the Irish team and talk of France outclassing us like the Belgians did in Bordeaux. Unlike the Belgians, the French will be a much better version of the Italian team we faced insofar as they are not going to outrun outmuscle us(and out play us) it will be a cagey match with them pumping balls up to Giroud and us pumping balls up to Long. Matuidi and Kante are not exactly Xaviesque

Billy86

Mec27 wrote: »

Billy86 wrote: »

Absolutely! I think our chances are incredibly slim, but one thing people can't deny is that MONs ugly style of play does do a good job at disrupting some very good teams. France are relatively young and don't have the proven resolve of a Spain or whatnot, so if we can keep it tied to the hour mark, I might just begin to ever-so-slightly begin to believe!

France play **** as well, this will be another match where people try to portray the match resembling the Belgium game. Like the Italians the French are not going to outrun us and outmuscle us(and out play us) it will be a cagey match with them pumping balls up to Giroud and us pumping balls up to Long. Matuidi and Kante are not exactly Xaviesque

Against Belgium our biggest problem was we thought we would need at least a point due to the Sweden draw... Then they scored early and it fell apart. We're pretty terrible at taking the game to teams for 90 minutes in that sense, but like a pack of idiots we're very good at stifling opposition play, dragging them down to our level, and at least giving ourselves a chance with experience! :pac:

They might okay ugly too, but the pressure and onus is very much on them to win. Most Irish would probably even somewhat ok ish with losing by 2, and having just got out of the groups at all.

Mec27

We took the game to Italy though in fairness, and kept going. You can talk about B teams till the cows come home but Bonucci, Ogbonna and Barzaghli were defending(and Ogbonna actually was getting praise for his performance in the Italian media) and we kept plucking away, not creating much but we kept our composure and got the goal, and our goal was not some flukey long ball ala Germany it was the result of excellent attacking play by McGeady, Hoolihan and Brady.

Billy86

True, but Italy did not look very interested throughout, and had no reason to be. France, in France, in a knockout game... That'll be different!

surripere

Not to take away from what was a great performance & result, but that Italian team weren't great, somewhat tough to beat yes, but far from the real thing. Bonucci was on a yellow & constricted, all the Italian team were, for none would have wanted to receive a yellow. I've never seen Motta have such a quiet game, he's always up for a row, this was his type of game, he looked uninterested. When I seen the selection of his midfield partners (Sturaro a most ordinary midfielder grafter & Florenzi a winger/fb playing in the centre) plus that of Di Sciglio ( a mediocre FB ) at WB I knew we had a good chance.

keeponhurling

Is it a possibility that the reason Dunphy and Giles are so clueless is that they never go to any matches ?

You never get a whole picture on TV.

It always looks like they are stuck in the studio, even for home matches.

enzo roco

tayto lover wrote: »

Giles hasn't a clue. He's from a different generation. He also made a balls of the Ireland team while in charge with his out-dated tactics.

What are you on about?
Giles was player manager of Ireland in the 70s. So his tactics were outdated then???

PeterTheEighth

I think what really decided for me that is was time for Giles to go was when they were covering the B&H second leg. The presenter asked Giles if he felt that B&H had underperformed on the previous Friday and he said "Well I dont know cos Friday was the first time that I've seen them". Friday, in reference tot he first leg of the tie.

Giles is the one who is always giving out about people "not being good professionals", yet he shows up to studio and writes articles about ireland's clash with B&H having not even gone on to youtube and had a look at the team.

Green Fella

keeponhurling wrote: »

Is it a possibility that the reason Dunphy and Giles are so clueless is that they never go to any matches ?

You never get a whole picture on TV.

It always looks like they are stuck in the studio, even for home matches.

Dont think it would make a massive difference, they have played at the top level. Most managers watch football from TV also. You also can miss different things at the game too. Giles barely even watches the games on TV anymore anyway, really hes just old and relies on his previous knowledge.

I actually think Dunphy knows a fair bit and can analyse a game very well, but he prefers to push agendas and wind up.

Peist2007

No one better at calling the previous 45 minutes' football than Giles. Don't be asking the man to explain the ins and outs of Juventus'transfer policy. With regard to the man's age, i believe it not to be that relevant in the context of what Giles' function as a pundit on RTE is - watch the match and describe what is happening and where each team is doing well or going wrong. I havent noticed any drop off in being able to analyse what is actually happening on the pitch.

Green Fella

PeterTheEighth wrote: »

I think what really decided for me that is was time for Giles to go was when they were covering the B&H second leg. The presenter asked Giles if he felt that B&H had underperformed on the previous Friday and he said "Well I dont know cos Friday was the first time that I've seen them". Friday, in reference tot he first leg of the tie.

Giles is the one who is always giving out about people "not being good professionals", yet he shows up to studio and writes articles about ireland's clash with B&H having not even gone on to youtube and had a look at the team.

I know it was enough of Giles when he was chatting nonsense about England and N Ireland group matches that he readily admitted he didnt even watch. For the first time I thought the other night it was a very stale setup with the lads