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Tesla Model 3

18182838587

Comments

  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,802 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    ForestFire wrote: »
    EV's are mostly a viable option for the reasonably wealthy at the moment and you admit you are already getting a grant towards the cost for you...The Rich persons grant for new toys, I'll call it.

    The average person cannot afford these types of cars, even considering the Leafs, which are above the average family's budget and the second hand market is non-existent.

    On top of this, as one of your options, you now want to remove VRT only for EV's only (Remember the rich peoples toys) and keep screwing the average person....How many discounts do you want!!

    Also, if VRT was removed the government would still need to raise the VRT shortfall in some other way (General taxation) and the car companies would most likely increase their base prices due to the opportunity to hide any VRT decrease and keep their prices in line with other countries.

    (Sarcasm warning and some poetic licence for dramatic effect)
    If you want a luxury EV (model 3 Thread) with high performance, made with heavily mined rare and dangerous metals for unsustainable batteries, charged with electricity produce by burning the emblems of compressed dinosaurs..... pay for it yourself....:o

    Leaf, Zoe both available from 7k.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,236 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    kceire wrote: »
    Leaf, Zoe both available from 7k.
    That doesnt suit his "woe is me" begrudgery though ;):p


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,498 ✭✭✭ForestFire


    kceire wrote: »
    Leaf, Zoe both available from 7k.

    There are 75 leaf's in total on carzone and 47 zoe's

    Only one of the leafs e is anywhere near 7k
    The next car is at almost 9k

    My point was there is not enough available to the mass market for the average buyer.

    120 second hand ev's is not a market.


    (I know there will be more cars than this on other sites but it is still enough to supply any decent % of market)

    p.s. My post was in reply to some one who said, Paraphrasing "I want grants and even more tax savings, for my performance EV car over what everyone else gets".

    Also the fact that I warned of strong Sarcasm in my post, so try not to take every point in it too seriously and enjoy your cars you worked hard for.

    I know.... I will enjoy my new petrol car when it arrives next week, and maybe even an EV when its time to change again in 3/5 years, when they make a proper family car estate option. (No doubt all the grants will be gone by then as they will start to hit the affordable mark for the "Average" buyer and the government will not be able to afford to give everyone a perk to change)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 521 ✭✭✭username?!


    Mike9832 wrote: »
    Tesla Model 3 P is more like a 335i

    Model 3 LR = 330d/330i/330e

    Model 3 SR = 325i/325d

    BMW M3 is a different monster to M3P

    Years of research gone into get every bit of performance out of it

    M3P is just a Model 3 with more power in comparison, its like the difference between a 335i and 325i

    M3P can't go round the ring without overheating, a proper EV sports car from Porsche etc will have no such problem

    Agreed.

    Owned both a P100D and M5 and they are nowhere near comparable.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,815 ✭✭✭creedp


    KCross wrote: »
    Fatal flaw in that logic is that it takes alot less energy to heat with a HP than with oil.

    Back in 2011 when I was building the building regulations classified electricity as a 'dirty ' source of energy for home heating due to the CO2 emissions from electricity generation and the significant transmission losses of the electricity network. I installed a HP but I remember it would have been more beneficial at the time to install gas heating or even an oil boiler.

    If I have the time I must dig out the various calculations made for the BER assessment.


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  • Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mike9832 wrote: »
    Tesla Model 3 P is more like a 335i

    Model 3 LR = 330d/330i/330e

    Model 3 SR = 325i/325d

    BMW M3 is a different monster to M3P

    Years of research gone into get every bit of performance out of it

    M3P is just a Model 3 with more power in comparison, its like the difference between a 335i and 325i

    M3P can't go round the ring without overheating, a proper EV sports car from Porsche etc will have no such problem


    OK, I try to keep up, but what is m3p?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    OK, I try to keep up, but what is m3p?


    He meant MP3.....


  • Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    He meant MP3.....

    ?I still don't


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭Mike9832


    ?I still don't

    Model 3 Performance

    M3P


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭Mike9832


    username?! wrote: »
    Agreed.

    Owned both a P100D and M5 and they are nowhere near comparable.

    Nice to be you :)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 312 ✭✭catharsis


    ELM327 wrote: »
    X5 m50d and m550d would disagree.

    those aren't M cars, they are 'more' than 'M-Lite' but not a full 'M5X'


  • Subscribers Posts: 3,702 ✭✭✭TCP/IP


    catharsis wrote: »
    those aren't M cars, they are 'more' than 'M-Lite' but not a full 'M5X'

    You are correct they are not M cars.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,802 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    They are beefed up MSport versions only.
    M Performance is what BMW call them.

    On the other hand I believe the M Division (totally separate from m Performance) do get their anchors into the X5M and the M550i. Just not the diesel versions?


  • Registered Users Posts: 385 ✭✭SaintsYB


    kceire wrote: »
    They are beefed up MSport versions only.
    M Performance is what BMW call them.

    On the other hand I believe the M Division (totally separate from m Performance) do get their anchors into the X5M and the M550i. Just not the diesel versions?

    I'm pretty sure the M Division doesn't to any tinkering to the M550i. It only works on full M models.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,802 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    SaintsYB wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure the M Division doesn't to any tinkering to the M550i. It only works on full M models.

    Quite possible.
    I remember reading it a while ago but I can’t find anything now. It appears the M550i, M340i etc are part of the M Performance bracket.

    SE
    MSport
    M Performance
    M

    Is pretty much the order nowadays.
    Then they confuse you again and release little sub models in between :). We have an MSport Plus F10 which is pretty much a normal MSport with a few additional factory fitted option.

    I remember my days of M3 ownership, E36 and E46. I don’t know which M car I’d pick from the line up nowadays though. M6 Grand Coupe appears to be top of my list currently.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,238 ✭✭✭digiman


    kceire wrote: »
    Quite possible.
    I remember reading it a while ago but I can’t find anything now. It appears the M550i, M340i etc are part of the M Performance bracket.

    SE
    MSport
    M Performance
    M

    Is pretty much the order nowadays.
    Then they confuse you again and release little sub models in between :). We have an MSport Plus F10 which is pretty much a normal MSport with a few additional factory fitted option.

    I remember my days of M3 ownership, E36 and E46. I don’t know which M car I’d pick from the line up nowadays though. M6 Grand Coupe appears to be top of my list currently.

    The new 8 Grand Coupe could be amazing. I love the 6 but there is just something about the shape of the front lights that dampens it a bit for me


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 383 ✭✭jarrieta


    Will try to steer this back on topic. I was seeing the M3 in sandyford yesterday. I really liked it, interior was nice, I would have loved having a wipers control and a HUD, but overall very nice and excellent materials, much nicer feeling than my F11.

    He said we might have the configurator open in a couple of weeks, but I guess that was pure speculation. We will have to wait and see...

    Red looks amazing


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,666 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Shefwedfan wrote: »

    They delivered 3 years worth of orders in 1 quarter and cleared out the back log. How many egolfs were delivered last quarter ? We’re Tesla shipping to Norway last month or did they divert cars elsewhere and will deliver next month.

    Time will tell


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    ted1 wrote: »
    They delivered 3 years worth of orders in 1 quarter and cleared out the back log. How many egolfs were delivered last quarter ? We’re Tesla shipping to Norway last month or did they divert cars elsewhere and will deliver next month.

    Time will tell


    :p:p:p:p

    tenor.gif?itemid=9536199


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,822 ✭✭✭Old diesel


    Shefwedfan wrote: »

    In that case so do Hyundai, Nissan and basically anyone who isn't VW.

    (Tesla outsold every body bar the eGolf).

    There are some questions that might be raised......

    1) what is the order book like for Model 3 in Norway - are there still people waiting for cars that havent arrived yet

    2) how much inventory of undelivered/unsold Model 3s are sitting around in Norway.

    Those are important


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,741 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Shefwedfan wrote: »

    Didn't know VW could even produce that many eGolfs - probably all sold at a loss?

    Can't wait for the ID range. When is the first ID expected to be with a customer?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    So many questions.....very easy to set off the Tesla fans. You all get so defensive....

    The number I actually looked at was number 6, that was the most impressive.....

    From eGolf point of view, still strong sales....what will happen when ID comes out


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,666 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    So many questions.....very easy to set off the Tesla fans. You all get so defensive....

    The number I actually looked at was number 6, that was the most impressive.....

    Not really I think we all took an impartial view. You’ve just been sucking to many be tailpipes to notice.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,822 ✭✭✭Old diesel


    Look less then two years ago people were actually questioning Teslas ability to BUILD a car due to Model 3 production hell.

    My favourite was the one about welding the bodywork. MASSIVE issues I was reading at the time.

    Now Tesla can't sell a car.......

    My beef with Tesla bashing is that no one really bothers to reflect on what Tesla achieved from zero in a decade.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,822 ✭✭✭Old diesel


    Look less then two years ago people were actually questioning Teslas ability to BUILD a car due to Model 3 production hell.

    My favourite was the one about welding the bodywork. MASSIVE issues I was reading at the time.

    Now Tesla can't sell a car.......

    My beef with Tesla bashing is that no one really bothers to reflect on what Tesla achieved from zero in a decade.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,176 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Since it's usually pointed out how electrek et al are shills for Tesla, it's also worth noting that this author has skin in the game.

    Disclosure: I am/we are short TSLA. I wrote this article myself, and it expresses my own opinions. I am not receiving compensation for it (other than from Seeking Alpha). I have no business relationship with any company whose stock is mentioned in this article.


  • Registered Users Posts: 983 ✭✭✭AidenL


    Well I paid for a reservation on a Model 3 today.

    Now for the order books to open.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭Mike9832


    Shefwedfan wrote: »

    They will all have trouble selling in numbers, including VW

    Electric demand is overblown

    Majority of people don't mind filling up 30e petrol a week, especially older generation with the money who buy new cars

    Everyone is laughing at Toyota with self charging, but they'll have the last laugh yet

    I love EVs, but Toyota are right to wait till tech is ready for mass market with 5/5/5/5 they refer to ( 500km/5 min charge time/€50kW/500w/kg)

    Governments shouldnt force people into EVs till that tech is ready

    Batteries still too crap and expensive for mass introduction without incentives


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,802 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Never heard of this 5/5/5/5 slogan ???


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Mike9832 wrote: »
    They will all have trouble selling in numbers, including VW

    Electric demand is overblown

    Majority of people don't mind filling up 30e petrol a week, especially older generation with the money who buy new cars

    Everyone is laughing at Toyota with self charging, but they'll have the last laugh yet

    I love EVs, but Toyota are right to wait till tech is ready for mass market with 5/5/5/5 they refer to ( 500km/5 min charge time/€50kW/500w/kg)

    Governments shouldnt force people into EVs till that tech is ready

    Batteries still too crap and expensive for mass introduction without incentives

    Did you actually click on the link? Did you read it?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Old diesel wrote: »
    Look less then two years ago people were actually questioning Teslas ability to BUILD a car due to Model 3 production hell.

    My favourite was the one about welding the bodywork. MASSIVE issues I was reading at the time.

    Now Tesla can't sell a car.......

    My beef with Tesla bashing is that no one really bothers to reflect on what Tesla achieved from zero in a decade.

    Bashing? Come on now stop reading the Tesla PR bullsh*t

    Just because an article isn’t full of Tesla pro crap doesn’t automatically mean it’s bashing, did you read the article?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,741 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    When is the first ID expected to be delivered, Shefwedfan? And what's the timeline for RHD cars?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    unkel wrote: »
    When is the first ID expected to be delivered, Shefwedfan? And what's the timeline for RHD cars?

    RHD and LHD will be at the same time, it’s posted on thread but latest info is April next year

    Hence why article I posted said about 1 year left in eGolf sales life


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭Mike9832


    kceire wrote: »
    Never heard of this 5/5/5/5 slogan ???

    Will try and find it, some Toyota engineer mentioned it I think

    Conditions he thought EVs need to get to


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,741 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    RHD and LHD will be at the same time, it’s posted on thread but latest info is April next year

    Still a very long time away unfortunately.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    unkel wrote: »
    Still a very long time away unfortunately.

    It is but I think it could all change based on what happens with reservations


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,912 ✭✭✭Mike9832


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Did you actually click on the link? Did you read it?

    No point

    Its Norway

    Completely irrelevant what's going on there

    Its a utopia


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Mike9832 wrote: »
    No point

    Its Norway

    Completely irrelevant what's going on there

    Its a utopia

    Electric car demand is up but the choice is not available. Current option are

    eGolf: great car but been replaced in 12 months and limited range
    Bmw: really looks odd
    Leaf 2: only one with decent availability but low range
    Kona: small and expensive, under spec
    Niro: not available
    Zoe: small
    Model 3: not available and no price
    Ioniq: overpriced, limited supply, limited range
    eTron: expensive

    That’s the current choice if I want to buy a new electric. Demand has shown that if a decent electric car becomes available it will sell in Ireland


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,741 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    It is but I think it could all change based on what happens with reservations

    Not sure what you mean by that. The reservations for Tesla Model 3 turned out be be completely irrelevant. Once the cars became available, you could just order them and get the car almost immediately (within one or two weeks). Whether or not you had a reservation made no difference.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    unkel wrote: »
    Not sure what you mean by that. The reservations for Tesla Model 3 turned out be be completely irrelevant. Once the cars became available, you could just order them and get the car almost immediately (within one or two weeks). Whether or not you had a reservation made no difference.

    Tesla didn’t even have a factory when they took reservations...

    If VW get high enough demand they might move up production...you never know...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,741 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    If VW get high enough demand they might move up production...you never know...

    So you reckon VW will see how it goes with reservations to determine their production levels? And they are not yet sure about demand? :confused:

    I reckon they are going in full force. Produce all the EVs they can (limited only by battery production capacity)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 65,741 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Ioniq: overpriced

    Ah dude, you're losing all your credibility here. Ioniq EV was the best value for money EV from at its launch in 2016 and it still is now 3 years later.

    Lowest total cost of ownership EV of them all by a large margin. High spec, decent performance. Decent space for a family of 5. Of course just a FWD econobox from Korea, but a lot of value for money. The only word I would not pick to describe it is overpriced.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,666 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Electric car demand is up but the choice is not available. Current option are

    eGolf: great car but been replaced in 12 months and limited range
    Bmw: really looks odd
    Leaf 2: only one with decent availability but low range
    Kona: small and expensive, under spec
    Niro: not available
    Zoe: small
    Model 3: not available and no price
    Ioniq: overpriced, limited supply, limited range
    eTron: expensive

    That’s the current choice if I want to buy a new electric. Demand has shown that if a decent electric car becomes available it will sell in Ireland

    IPace ( saw one in the wild yesterday , nice but smaller / lower the I expected )
    Model s
    Model x


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    unkel wrote: »
    Ah dude, you're losing all your credibility here. Ioniq EV was the best value for money EV from at its launch in 2016 and it still is now 3 years later.

    Lowest total cost of ownership EV of them all by a large margin. High spec, decent performance. Decent space for a family of 5. Of course just a FWD econobox from Korea, but a lot of value for money. The only word I would not pick to describe it is overpriced.

    Overpriced at this stage for the battery size, dealers are selling above the price when it was launched and new model due out which means the current is ......


  • Registered Users Posts: 983 ✭✭✭AidenL


    unkel wrote: »
    So you reckon VW will see how it goes with reservations to determine their production levels? And they are not yet sure about demand? :confused:

    I reckon they are going in full force. Produce all the EVs they can (limited only by battery production capacity)

    I think that will be their strategy. They are a volume seeking manufacturer after all. Most are these days.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    unkel wrote: »
    So you reckon VW will see how it goes with reservations to determine their production levels? And they are not yet sure about demand? :confused:

    I reckon they are going in full force. Produce all the EVs they can (limited only by battery production capacity)


    No, I hope if the reservations go well they might move up production and start selling sooner


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    ted1 wrote: »
    IPace ( saw one in the wild yesterday , nice but smaller / lower the I expected )
    Model s
    Model x


    All in the expensive bracket....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,387 ✭✭✭glynf


    We had a look at the model 3 in Sandyford yesterday, lots of interest in it, got a few minutes to sit in it and have a play about.. the lack of a binnacle was one thing that would have put me off-but location of the speedometer on the top left of the screen is fine. One thing I would like as jarrieta mentioned in a previous thread would be a HUD; having a digital binnacle in ours and doing a lot of night/early morning driving, I would love to be able to 'black out' all screens apart from the HUD/speedo-Saab had this on 93's years ago-way easier on the eyes.

    The car on display was a LHD, dual motor & had the tesla supercharger connection-CSS as standard on EU models with up to 11kW AC charging as well as up to150 kW DC charging.. it looks a lot better in the metal, 19" wheels looked good on it, 18" will come as standard.

    The fit and finish was decent, seats were comfortable, screen response was super quick, nice chunky feel to the smallish steering wheel, the two multifunction menu buttons felt like they were decent quality. The centre console bin & phone charger covers were shiny black plastic, and look like they will be prone to scratching..AC vents and pano roof were nice touches as well.

    Apparently they will be taking orders mid July, two weeks after Tesla UK; the base model (about 300kms real world apparently) will come in under the 50K BIK, so will probably sell well. Impressive motor, and I will defo go for one as a company car when the time to change comes about. The Mrs. is still sticking a deposit on an ID as a replacement for the egolf- although she was V. impressed with the 3.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,111 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Old diesel wrote: »
    In that case so do Hyundai, Nissan and basically anyone who isn't VW.

    (Tesla outsold every body bar the eGolf).

    There are some questions that might be raised......

    1) what is the order book like for Model 3 in Norway - are there still people waiting for cars that havent arrived yet

    2) how much inventory of undelivered/unsold Model 3s are sitting around in Norway.

    Those are important

    Well there are 26 or so used Model 3s with very low mileage or sale here, so I doubt the order books are bulging.


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