New Skoda Superb vs BMW 5 series

Wailin

Augeo wrote: »

I think it looks very good for the most part but the view from behind is very ish.... Combi looks good though at the rear.

Funnily enough it's the rear of the combI that lets it down for me. Looks out of proportion to the rest of the car. Skodas have come on in leaps and bounds but I still feel they retain that "soviet" look about the styling.

maddness

Henry Ford III wrote: »

I'd have a 520d every day of the week tbh. Skoda were/are primarily a value brand which don't offer that much value anymore - much like VW.

That's the problem for Skoda now, they are too expensive. I got a superb in 2010 when the top spec Tdi 170 Elegance was only about €36,000 if I remember correctly. R.O.R might know better on the pricing from a few years ago though.
If you are buying a budget brand that's not budget what's the point?

Oafley Jones

Wailin wrote: »

Funnily enough it's the rear of the combI that lets it down for me. Looks out of proportion to the rest of the car. Skodas have come on in leaps and bounds but I still feel they retain that "soviet" look about the styling.

I like it, for me it's one of the few bright spots in the Audi/VW/Skoda family. The Passat is one of most dreary looking cars on the road. It just doesn't work at all for me. I remember reading that their current design direction was inspired by Apple. And I can sort of see it. The colours used in the advertising, the minimalism in term clean lines, the subtle changes between generations etc. But it just looks "off" to me. None of it is incredibly well resolved. Which is danger with that design, you either completely nail or it looks just bland. I've said it before, but I'd love to see a clear out in terms of design at Audi and VW.

JoeA3

The initial spy shots of the new Superb looked really good. But I've seen a few in the metal lately and it's really no looker tbh. It looks particularly awkward from the rear 3/4 view, not helped by teeny alloys tucked in under huge wheel arches. Not a good look. The Passat is a far better proportioned looking car imo.

There's night and day between the interior of an Octavia and a Golf too. I sat in my brother in law's new Octavia last week. It felt very "last generation" in terms of switchgear and general fit and finish.

I think the Skoda guys are being very ambitious if they think they'll tempt many 520d owners into a Superb.

R.O.R

maddness wrote: »

That's the problem for Skoda now, they are too expensive. I got a superb in 2010 when the top spec Tdi 170 Elegance was only about €36,000 if I remember correctly. R.O.R might know better on the pricing from a few years ago though.
If you are buying a budget brand that's not budget what's the point?

Figures from Jan 2010 tell me a Superb 2.0Tdi 170 Elegance was €32,435 ex. Works.

Equivalent today is the 2.0Tdi 190 Style at €37,655, so an increase of €5,220 over 6 years.


520d SE Auto in Jan 2010 was €44,519. Now €49,203 - increase of €4,684.

Theboinkmaster

JoeA3 wrote: »

I think the Skoda guys are being very ambitious if they think they'll tempt many 520d owners into a Superb.

That's not going to happen, there's no way you'd go from a 5 series to a superb irrelevant of spec and price. The superb is just ugly and cheap looking.

whippet

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

That's not going to happen, there's no way you'd go from a 5 series to a superb irrelevant of spec and price. The superb is just ugly and cheap looking.

I think you are missing the point that people have been making here .. skoda are looking to reinforce their message to people who might be looking at superb / Passat / mazda 6 / insignia etc.

MarcusP12

whippet wrote: »

I think you are missing the point that people have been making here .. skoda are looking to reinforce their message to people who might be looking at superb / Passat / mazda 6 / insignia etc.

+1 on this....I don't think anyone in their right mind thinks that Skoka thinks the superb is a direct competitor to the 5er. Its just a clever marketing ploy to get people through the doors to test drive. The 5 series in many people's opinion is the bench mark when it comes to executive cars so I guess what Skoda it trying to say is that the difference is not as big as you think, "come have a look for yourself". It creates a certain amount of curiosity with people who might be on the fence in terms of what to go for between superb/Passat/mazda6/insignia/etc and plants a seed. It might make a certain number of people take a look who otherwise might be put off by tradition. The more people test drive, the more people will consider buying the skoda.

I drive a 5 series myself and wouldn't consider a superb a direct rival personally unless I wanted to get something newer and better spec'ed and was less concerned about handling and performance. I rate them though within its traditional category.

CharlieCroker

I always think of the Superb along the same lines as the Ford Granada/Scorpio, Opel Omega, Toyota Camry and Nissan Maxima. Executive car, just without the same image as Merc, BMW and Audi.

Didn't make it any less capable though IMO.

freddieot

Comparing a manufacturers mainstream leading model to an 'Executive' model in this way would be a great idea. I'm surprised Hyundai or Kia have not done it already (Santa Fe compared to X3 or Q5 etc.).

However, when your 'parent company or group is also trying to sell Audi as an 'Executive' option, it smacks of madness in my opinion.

What Skoda are implying is that the difference between the Superb and the BMW 5 Series is not as great as you might think (i.e. value for money - look what you get for a fraction of the cost etc. ) Meanwhile the VAG are by implication trying to fool the world that a VW or an Audi is however worth the extra dosh, totally different scenario, you should always aspire to own Audi etc. Also, no mention of the shared components between the VAG group.

I think this may help Skoda but damage Audi. If people don't buy Audis then guess who the main benefactor will probably be. I can't see too many BMW dealers crying themselves to sleep.

There is a reason why this type of negative or implied negative advertising is rarely used or successful.

maddness

R.O.R wrote: »

Figures from Jan 2010 tell me a Superb 2.0Tdi 170 Elegance was €32,435 ex. Works.

Equivalent today is the 2.0Tdi 190 Style at €37,655, so an increase of €5,220 over 6 years.


520d SE Auto in Jan 2010 was €44,519. Now €49,203 - increase of €4,684.

Has the Style now got less standard equipment than the older model Elegance?

youtheman

maddness wrote: »

Has the Style now got less standard equipment than the older model Elegance?

Yes. I have a 2012 Elegance and it has rear electric heated seats and parking assist (which the newer model doesn't).

Drummerboy08

To be fair, the exercise has worked.

The whole idea of it was to get people talking about the product, and whether you like the Superb or not it's doing exactly that.

I've had a few people in yesterday and today on the back of this campaign.

vintagevrs

We have a f10 520d. I would be open to the idea of a skoda, but from reading some comments on here people reckon there is a big difference in the two. Is there really a big gap? I would have thought it has closed and think the superb looks like a fine car.

carsfan

Any orders drummerboy as a result of the campaign?
What is the feedback on punters comparing the two cars?

Drummerboy08

carsfan wrote: »

Any orders drummerboy as a result of the campaign?
What is the feedback on punters comparing the two cars?

No, its only three days old to be fair.

Some are impressed, none are BMW drivers interestingly, or even A6/E Class drivers.

I think it's presented the Superb to people that wouldn't have previously considered, however the numbers of people who have taken up the challenge aren't big enough to make a properly educated summary from it at this stage.

colm_mcm

What spec is the bmw ye have in?

The Bishop Basher

CharlieCroker wrote: »

I've had BMWs (albeit not new) and I'm looking at a Skoda for my next car. Then again, I'm not a sheep.

What are you driving now ? Only asking as I'm intrigued to know what a non sheep person buys...

4 of my last 5 cars have been 5 series. Last one was an X5 which I sold a few weeks ago and bought another 5. Why? Because I absolutely love the driving experience and as yet, haven't found anything to rival it.

Buying BMW means I have to go back a few years and up a bit in mileage which doesn't bother me in the slightest but I suppose if I decided to go for something newer like a Superb, Passat or Mondeo I could be accused of just chasing the reg. You just can't win in this begrudging little nation of ours...

micks_address

Swanner wrote: »

What are you driving now ? Only asking as I'm intrigued to know what a non sheep person buys...

4 of my last 5 cars have been 5 series. Last one was an X5 which I sold a few weeks ago and bought another 5. Why? Because I absolutely love the driving experience and as yet, haven't found anything to rival it.

Buying BMW means I have to go back a few years and up a bit in mileage which doesn't bother me in the slightest but I suppose if I decided to go for something newer like a Superb, Passat or Mondeo I could be accused of just chasing the reg. You just can't win in this begrudging little nation of ours...

This is the question for me to.. in a few years time... maybe 18 months i'll be looking at changing my 3 year old car.. i could buy a 5 series or e class that's a couple of years old maybe 2 years old with a nice spec and lowish mileage or buy something new like a skoda superb.. i have a friend in the same situation.. he buys a new superb every 2 years changes for about 10k but would love an e class.. to make the jump would cost him a fair bit and to change every two years would be too expensive.. it comes down to can you accept a 2 year old car or want new new new...I guess there's arguments for both scenarios..

Its also a valid point re the superb versus a6.. my friend who buys the superb says he would be hard pushed to pay the extra for an a6 as he doesnt see it as much superior to the superb... he would see the e class or jag xf as a step up...

Drummerboy08

colm_mcm wrote: »

What spec is the bmw ye have in?

520d M Sport Auto.

Idbatterim

520d SE Auto - €49,203 ex. Works. €995 for Metallic, €865 for delivery

Superb 190 Style DSG - €40,655 ex. Works. €666 metallic, €650 delivery (?)


€9,092 difference in on the road retail in metallic. Roughly similar standard specification - few more toys in the Superb probably.

honestly, Id be taking the bm, its has far more of a feel good factor and is a bmw, that price difference wouldnt get me into the skoda if I were in the market for a car that value...

Voodoomelon

MarcusP12 wrote: »

+1 on this....I don't think anyone in their right mind thinks that Skoka thinks the superb is a direct competitor to the 5er. Its just a clever marketing ploy to get people through the doors to test drive. The 5 series in many people's opinion is the bench mark when it comes to executive cars so I guess what Skoda it trying to say is that the difference is not as big as you think, "come have a look for yourself". It creates a certain amount of curiosity with people who might be on the fence in terms of what to go for between superb/Passat/mazda6/insignia/etc and plants a seed. It might make a certain number of people take a look who otherwise might be put off by tradition. The more people test drive, the more people will consider buying the skoda.

I drive a 5 series myself and wouldn't consider a superb a direct rival personally unless I wanted to get something newer and better spec'ed and was less concerned about handling and performance. I rate them though within its traditional category.

It's funny what people will stick in the same category though, especially when it comes to the Superb. Had a taxi driver pick me up in his Superb at my sisters house last year, with my '05 740Lii sitting in the drive. "Is that yours" he asks. "It is indeed". "Ach, give me the Superb any day, sure you've the same room in the back of this as that".

He then proceeds to list all the spec his has, all the way from Lucan to the city centre, pretty much trying to wind me up. We should've done the questioning the other way round. :pac: No tip for him!

BTW I always liked the Superb, lovely car to ride in.

Stallingrad

It's a sign of how far Skoda have come that this discussion or promotion is even taking place. The last gen was an ugly Passat rival with little to distinguish it bar acres of space. I'd still take a 2 year old 5 series over a new Superb, but there is not that much in it anymore.

Theboinkmaster

whippet wrote: »

I think you are missing the point that people have been making here .. skoda are looking to reinforce their message to people who might be looking at superb / Passat / mazda 6 / insignia etc.

Would they not be better off having a Passat / mazda 6 / insignia beside it then rather than a 5 series? So then next to them it should look much better?

Putting it beside a 5 series just reinforces how ugly & cheap looking it is IMO.

bazz26

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

Would they not be better off having a Passat / mazda 6 / insignia beside it then rather than a 5 series? So then next to them it should look much better?

Putting it beside a 5 series just reinforces how ugly & cheap looking it is IMO.

Probably a higher risk of planting a seed in a potential customer's head about heading off to the nearest competitor's dealership and loosing a sale. Whereas with a 5 Series the majority would probably be of the impression that a 5 Series was outside of their budget anyway so heading to the nearest BMW dealership wouldn't be on the cards but the Superb was a good alternative within their budget.

MarcusP12

Swanner wrote: »

What are you driving now ? Only asking as I'm intrigued to know what a non sheep person buys...

4 of my last 5 cars have been 5 series. Last one was an X5 which I sold a few weeks ago and bought another 5. Why? Because I absolutely love the driving experience and as yet, haven't found anything to rival it.

Buying BMW means I have to go back a few years and up a bit in mileage which doesn't bother me in the slightest but I suppose if I decided to go for something newer like a Superb, Passat or Mondeo I could be accused of just chasing the reg. You just can't win in this begrudging little nation of ours...

I'm similar,last 3 cars have been Beemers, 320ci, 318i msport, and currently 523i se....all at least 2 years old and similar money to new models, etc. Just my preference to buy more expensive cars a few years old that are drivers cars than new supposedly inferior drivers cars.plenty like us out there.each to their own!to be fair,when you take the plunge and go for some thing like a BMW, it's hard to go back to something more conventional.

CharlieCroker

Swanner wrote: »

What are you driving now ? Only asking as I'm intrigued to know what a non sheep person buys...

4 of my last 5 cars have been 5 series. Last one was an X5 which I sold a few weeks ago and bought another 5. Why? Because I absolutely love the driving experience and as yet, haven't found anything to rival it.

Buying BMW means I have to go back a few years and up a bit in mileage which doesn't bother me in the slightest but I suppose if I decided to go for something newer like a Superb, Passat or Mondeo I could be accused of just chasing the reg. You just can't win in this begrudging little nation of ours...

Don't get me wrong, I'm not blasting BMW's in any way. As I said, I've had an E36, E46, E60 (both my own, and as company cars) and enjoyed all of them without exception.

The people I'm calling sheep are those that blindly buy a boggo 316d/518d/A4 etc just because it has a certain badge on the grill without looking at other reasonable alternatives, including the Superb which may offer better spec/more power etc.

I'm pricing a new Octavia vRS at the moment working out at roughly €36k with the spec I want. I also priced an A3 saloon S-line 2.0tdi and to get it anywhere near the spec of the Octavia it'll cost at least €10k more for a smaller car. Is it worth that just for an Audi badge and associated image? Not a chance but some people will pay it because they think it's worth it, I don't. Personal choice and all that.

To answer your first question, I drive a Mk 4 Mondeo. Not for any other reason than it was the right car at the right time for the right price. Could have just as easily been a Passat/Octavia/3-series/5-series.

My point is I'm not going to blindly buy a certain car due to its badge but I won't dismiss any car either due to its badge. I'll buy whatever car suits my needs best at the time of purchase.

traco

Interesting thread but I do wonder are any of these modern cars really "drivers cars" anymore?? As far as I am concerned they aren't, they are motorway transport that is quiet and comfortable. BM might or might not be better, I was a passenger in a 10 525d (3.0l) to Belfast last week while its a nice car I don't think it was any better or worse than other rep cars at the task.

I'd say similar about the Audis and Mercs, so unless you are in an M series, AMG, R then the others (entry level 2.0 tdi guise) are all rather similar in abilities and that its really a matter of buying into teh badge and what it says.

If your looking for a drivers car then the new Mazda MX or a secondhand sports car will be far more a drivers car than a regular 5, A6 or E Series. The current 5 series is still trading on the E39 which was a massive step up in terms of driving ability of a car in that segment at that time but thise gains have all been eroded over the years.

If its executive luxury then its S, A8 or 7 series that you are into and again they aren't drivers cars as I consider them.

Personally I'd like to think the Skoda plan might make the luxury brands wake up and maybe realise that they have lost a lot of the edge that they had and more normal brands are closing the gap. Maybe I'm old but for me the badge isn't what its all about anymore, at least not unless its got teh engineering underneath to prove its pedigree.

The Bishop Basher

CharlieCroker wrote: »

My point is I'm not going to blindly buy a certain car due to its badge but I won't dismiss any car either due to its badge. I'll buy whatever car suits my needs best at the time of purchase.

But you're making an awful lot of judgments about the personal choices of others....

You can't possibly know the circumstances of, or reasons for, someone else's choice of car.

And even if they do buy a ****ty spec beemer just for the badge what's the problem ? It's their money and their choice.

Anyway, good luck with the vRS if you do decide to go for it. I've driven one and it would tick a lot of boxes for me. It's a great car.

MarcusP12

Swanner wrote: »

But you're making an awful lot of judgments about the personal choices of others....

You can't possibly know the circumstances of, or reasons for, someone else's choice of car.

And even if they do buy a ****ty spec beemer just for the badge what's the problem ? It's their money and their choice.

Anyway, good luck with the vRS if you do decide to go for it. I've driven one and it would tick a lot of boxes for me. It's a great car.

The problem here is that for guys like me who like to own a BMW but can't justify/afford to buy brand new, there's never any decent spec ones around!

CharlieCroker

Swanner wrote: »

But you're making an awful lot of judgments about the personal choices of others....

You can't possibly know the circumstances of, or reasons for, someone else's choice of car.

And even if they do buy a ****ty spec beemer just for the badge what's the problem ? It's their money and their choice.

Anyway, good luck with the vRS if you do decide to go for it. I've driven one and it would tick a lot of boxes for me. It's a great car.

I never said that there was a problem, I specifically said that some people may think a ****ty spec beemer is worth the price but I don't. It's personal choice etc.

But there is a difference between a ****ty spec beemer and a **** beemer. I dont know do you think im suggesting they're one in the same? There's been very few **** beemers over the years but there's plenty of **** spec ones.

I wonder would you be this defensive if the subject was the same and the last 5 cars you bought were Audi/Merc/Lexus.