College Green Plaza -- public consultation open

Spanish Eyes

Sam Russell wrote: »

Public service.

I don't wish to be negative, but it's out there really. Wood Quay, the Headquarters of DCC has parking for its staff, entrance on Winetavern Street where the peasants on the buses might be diverted to. No wonder they are terrified of bringing in a no car culture.

The boss is anti car totally and pro cycling, but I get the feeling he knows how far he can push it.... for his own staff, whatever about the peasants. If it wasn't so unreal it would be hilarious.

Dublin Castle forecourt is chock a block with CS staff cars. Hideous in such an historic place where visitors expect an historic experience, only to be faced with hundreds of cars in the car park. And I have no doubt there are many other hidden ps/cs free parking spaces all around us.

It won't be solved any time soon. The will is not there apart from the rules regarding the great unwashed travelling on the bus.

AndrewJRenko

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I don't wish to be negative, but it's out there really. Wood Quay, the Headquarters of DCC has parking for its staff, entrance on Winetavern Street where the peasants on the buses might be diverted to. No wonder they are terrified of bringing in a no car culture.

The boss is anti car totally and pro cycling, but I get the feeling he knows how far he can push it.... for his own staff, whatever about the peasants. If it wasn't so unreal it would be hilarious.

Dublin Castle forecourt is chock a block with CS staff cars. Hideous in such an historic place where visitors expect an historic experience, only to be faced with hundreds of cars in the car park. And I have no doubt there are many other hidden ps/cs free parking spaces all around us.

It won't be solved any time soon. The will is not there apart from the rules regarding the great unwashed travelling on the bus.

Dublin City Council has more than 10,000 staff and about 400 parking spots at Wood Quay. It has large numbers of staff who need to be mobile for their job - housing officers, building control inspectors, litter wardens and more. Is 400 parking spots really unreasonable for an organisation of that size and function?

Last time I was in Dublin Castle (last Sept/Oct I think), the front yard was largely clear, I think only disabled drivers were parking there, though I'm not 100% sure of that.

I know of three civil service locations that have <10 spaces each for the hundreds of staff based at these locations.

So where specifically are these offices with vast amounts of parking for PS/CS staff?

Stephen15

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Dublin City Council has more than 10,000 staff and about 400 parking spots at Wood Quay. It has large numbers of staff who need to be mobile for their job - housing officers, building control inspectors, litter wardens and more. Is 400 parking spots really unreasonable for an organisation of that size and function?

So maybe they'd be better off in a different location like out near the m50.

AndrewJRenko

Stephen15 wrote: »

So maybe they'd be better off in a different location like out near the m50.

So you want Dublin City Council to relocate outside of Dublin City Council’s area?

prinzeugen

cgcsb wrote: »

Because then drama queens like yourself would be gone and you are too entertaining to loose.



Shops will be stocked by appropriately timed deliveries via loading bays as they currently are on every bus only street across the entire western world, of which there are thousands.



Smithfield never served as a vehicular thoroughfare and referring to Smithfield as a wasteland is ignorance. The place is positively buzzing lots of new restaurants bars and cafés. Do you remember Smithfield before the plaza was built? You probably don't because NOBODY went there, it's now a thousand times better than it used to be and there was no need throw a load of cars in it.



Right ok :rolleyes:

Drama queen? Resorting to personal abuse. How mature.

Are you willing to pay extra for goods? The cost of having staff in a silly o'clock to take deliveries in has to be passed on somewhere.

What about the people that live near the shops? They are going to love getting woken up at 5am by delivery trucks that would usually be there between 8-10am.

The fact is that thousands and thousands of people are going to be screwed by this plaza to keep a few hundred happy.

It may may life more "livable" for the few but going into the city will be unbearable for the many.

Smithfield is full of new cafes that last a few months. One opens as one shuts down. Why? Because the footfall is not there. It looks busy because of the people in the apartments.

And yes, there is a hatred of motor vehicles by some at the top of DDC and on here. All they want is some cycledom. Move to Holland if you want is so much and leave Dublin alone.

AndrewJRenko

prinzeugen wrote: »

Are you willing to pay extra for goods? The cost of having staff in a silly o'clock to take deliveries in has to be passed on somewhere.

What about the people that live near the shops? They are going to love getting woken up at 5am by delivery trucks that would usually be there between 8-10am.

Do many people live on College Green? And if deliveries are happening in morning rush hour, how many bus, bike and car passengers are being held up?

cgcsb

prinzeugen wrote: »

Drama queen? Resorting to personal abuse. How mature.

Well you were comparing bus priority measures to Thermo-Nuclear Annihilation. Drama Queen is a very befitting title in this instance.

prinzeugen wrote: »

Are you willing to pay extra for goods? The cost of having staff in a silly o'clock to take deliveries in has to be passed on somewhere.

Like on Henry St around the corner you mean?

prinzeugen wrote: »

What about the people that live near the shops? They are going to love getting woken up at 5am by delivery trucks that would usually be there between 8-10am.

Right so all of the people who opted to live on Capel st for the quiet life will hear deliver trucks. They already hear bin trucks and delivery trucks every morning at similar times.

prinzeugen wrote: »

The fact is that thousands and thousands of people are going to be screwed by this plaza to keep a few hundred happy.

That is not a 'fact' it is hyperbolic conjecture.

prinzeugen wrote: »

It may may life more "livable" for the few but going into the city will be unbearable for the many.

That's the whole point of my post, providing serious bus priority and removing cars is what will make it work.

prinzeugen wrote: »

Smithfield is full of new cafes that last a few months. One opens as one shuts down. Why? Because the footfall is not there.

Right you obviously haven't a breeze here, 'one opens one closes down'. It's been a long time since anything in Smithfield closed down it's been on an upward trend for years, almost all units are now occupied. Footfall is good.

prinzeugen wrote: »

It looks busy because of the people in the apartments.

I'll ignore that.

prinzeugen wrote: »

And yes, there is a hatred of motor vehicles by some at the top of DDC and on here. All they want is some cycledom. Move to Holland if you want is so much and leave Dublin alone.

Why don't you move to Los Angelus if want smog and lots of cars everywhere and Dublin can continue on the path of becoming more livable.

markpb

cgcsb wrote: »

Why don't you move to Los Angelus if want smog and lots of cars everywhere and Dublin can continue on the path of becoming more livable.

You've got to pick a better example than that.

Los Angles county will spend $120 billion in local sales tax on transport projects over the next 40 years. They'll also receive state and federal funding on top of that figure so the actual capital spend will be much higher.

They spent $20 million building the new 34 acre State Historic Park in Downtown LA and have plans to rejuvinate the area alongside the river, turning it into a linear park.

We can only dream about spending that kind of money on public realm.

Stephen15

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

So you want Dublin City Council to relocate outside of Dublin City Council’s area?

Well considering they put people in hotels outside the Dublin city council area. Also you could put them out in somewhere like Finglas or Ballymun all within DCC grounds.

magicbastarder

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Dublin City Council has more than 10,000 staff and about 400 parking spots at Wood Quay.

just a correction this - DCC has about 6,000 employees and for certain they're not all based in wood quay.

AndrewJRenko

magicbastarder wrote: »

just a correction this - DCC has about 6,000 employees and for certain they're not all based in wood quay.

Apologies, you're right on the total number. Yes, they're not all based in Wood Quay, though the area offices dotted around the city are fairly small. I guess they'd have a significant number of outdoor staff based in parks and depots around the county.

Stephen15 wrote: »

Well considering they put people in hotels outside the Dublin city council area. Also you could put them out in somewhere like Finglas or Ballymun all within DCC grounds.

I'm not quite sure I see the logic there of 'punishing' the Council corporately and Council staff based on the availability of hotels who are willing to accomodate homeless people? And how will a location on the edge of the M50 in Finglas work for people in Mt Merrion or Drimnagh or Ringsend who need to do business with the Council. Or for the Council staff who come in from those areas to work at Wood Quay? There is a reason for making Council services easily accessible for most people in the Council area. What's your business case for moving this office, which has very little to do with traffic in College Green regardless?

What's the business case

monument

A general warning to all first: stop focusing on the poster and instead look at their points.

— moderator

prinzeugen wrote: »

Why don't you just drop a nuke on the city centre?

cgcsb wrote: »

Because then drama queens like yourself would be gone and you are too entertaining to loose.

prinzeugen wrote: »

Drama queen? Resorting to personal abuse. How mature.

cgcsb wrote: »

Well you were comparing bus priority measures to Thermo-Nuclear Annihilation. Drama Queen is a very befitting title in this.

I’m gussing this is at its natural end. If not: end it now, thanks.

Edit: to be clear: I’m not just saying no more name calling (drama queens) but I’m also saying that the hyperbole need to come down a few notchs from the level of dropping nukes on the city centre.

— moderator

Effects

prinzeugen wrote: »

The fact is that thousands and thousands of people are going to be screwed by this plaza to keep a few hundred happy.

You have that the wrong way around. The plaza will benefit the many.

Stephen15

prinzeugen wrote: »

And yes, there is a hatred of motor vehicles by some at the top of DDC and on here. All they want is some cycledom. Move to Holland if you want is so much and leave Dublin alone.

Is that what you want College Green to be like?

KD345

At the moment there is nothing to suggest this plaza will not affect bus passengers in a negative way. The plans, or lack of, show no priority for buses and we are looking at long established routes being removed from busy areas.

Its absolutely fine to support the plaza, I can see the attraction for many people, but you must appreciate the concerns affecting thousands of bus passengers.

For example, currently, someone traveling from Drumcondra to their office on Adelaide Road can take the 16 directly to Harrington Street. Now, it is proposed the 16 will take them up the South Quays, past Christchurch, and leave them on Clanbrassil Street, adding a 10 minute walk and possibly a much longer trip on the bus. It is not clear how the 16 will actually get onto the the quays, as there is no right turn from O’Connell Bridge. In their last proposal, DCC were not sure of this themselves. This is unacceptable, and if the NTA are now deciding to support DCC, they owe it to every bus customer to detail how buses will flow through the city centre.

Synode

A 10 minute walk. How dare they

KD345

Synode wrote: »

A 10 minute walk. How dare they

You may choose to dismiss this, but for many commuters, routes like the 9, 16 and 122 provide a rough link to Leeson Street/Harcourt Street and Stephens Green. These are busy office districts and the above routes skirt the edges. The worry is that adding another 10/15 minute walk onto commuters journeys suddenly makes the bus unattractive.

MJohnston

KD345 wrote: »

You may choose to dismiss this, but for many commuters, routes like the 9, 16 and 122 provide a rough link to Leeson Street/Harcourt Street and Stephens Green. These are busy office districts and the above routes skirt the edges. The worry is that adding another 10/15 minute walk onto commuters journeys suddenly makes the bus unattractive.

Switching to the Green Line is definitely an option for passengers of those routes, should the buses be diverted that far from their current routes (in fact, I've already said that I reckon a large amount of 122 passengers from the Northside have probably already switched to the Luas) Obviously we need much more integrated ticketing between these two modes, but that should be something we do as soon as possible anyway. This is really the future of bus transport in Dublin - move passengers onto high frequency, high capacity, high quality systems like Luas or DART (or Metro in the future), and let those modes service the city centre more efficiently.

KD345

Completely agree MJohnson, and I reckon we might start to see some of this with Bus Connects.

Unfortunately, only having two already overcrowded LUAS lines limits things slightly, but integrated transport modes need to be rolled out ASAP. Rerouting the 9, 16, 68/a and 122 away from their current routing would remove connections between George’s Street/Stephen’s Green/Camden Street/Harcourt Street with places like Walkinstown, Drimnagh, Rathfarnham and Kilmainham. These are links which have been in place for decades.

The re-routing issue aside, the lack of detail on any bus priority is even more concerning. The NTA should be presenting a detailed plan for every bus route affected. The fact they have yet to do this is a disgrace.

hmmm

MJohnston wrote: »

This is really the future of bus transport in Dublin - move passengers onto high frequency, high capacity, high quality systems like Luas or DART (or Metro in the future), and let those modes service the city centre more efficiently.

I don't disagree, but if this is the plan it's time someone in authority said this, and how LUAS, DART etc are going to cope with an influx of transferring traffic. We seem to be planning no more than one step ahead every time, and then getting surprised when there are knock-on effects.

Instead we have this limbo-land where the only discussion is how much disruption the various parties are going to cause to bus passengers.

It's not good enough to add 10-20 minutes of a walk to the commute of many bus passengers, and shrug your shoulders to say that "it's really not much of a walk for a fit person".

thomasj

I was on a 39A this morning around the time of the crash of 2 buses on ormond quay.

The end result was that the bus went via Bridgefoot Street, Christchurch and Dame Street.

It took half the time that it has been taking on the North Quays over the last few weeks (5 minutes from Bridgefoot street to College Green) and it left me closer to my work (Dame Street area). I'd take this route over the current quays route any given day!

cgcsb

I'd like to see the bus connects people come out with at least a provisional plan for the city centre in the next month so that we at least know how everything is going to work around the plaza. Ideal for me would be to keep some north-south buses running on college green with luas and then make Capel St-Parliament st-George's Street a bus corridor. Ban cars from the quays between tara station and Jervis st.

trellheim

Like it or not deliveries have to get in and out of the city. Capel st is one of the vital exit arteries for that traffic , its also been calmed to a single lane in several places.

AndrewJRenko

trellheim wrote: »

Like it or not deliveries have to get in and out of the city. Capel st is one of the vital exit arteries for that traffic , its also been calmed to a single lane in several places.

There are better ways to do deliveries - like consolidating loads at an outer location so that it is one truck visiting each Spar/Centra instead of 20 trucks.

cgcsb

trellheim wrote: »

Like it or not deliveries have to get in and out of the city. Capel st is one of the vital exit arteries for that traffic , its also been calmed to a single lane in several places.

Like it or not deliveries can be made despite car bans. This is done all over the world and indeed even in Dublin, in fact right around the corner on Mary St. Out of curiosity what would actually be wrong with banning deliveries between 07:00 and 19:00 on capel st and bringing in a 2 way bus corridor for the length of the street? How would this be a problem for anyone other than car commuters?

dashcamdanny

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

There are better ways to do deliveries - like consolidating loads at an outer location so that it is one truck visiting each Spar/Centra instead of 20 trucks.

That would not be practical in the real world. The best you could hope for is : One truck for chill and frozen,
one from the dairy,
one from the bread man
one for everything else.

Cant really mix them as they are all from different producers and all have different requirements for storage and distribution. ..

Most also come before rush hour starts

Cookie_Monster

dashcamdanny wrote: »

Cant really mix them as they are all from different producers and all have different requirements for storage and distribution. ..

you should really tell Tesco they can't manage it too...
Sure they're just wasting their time with that massive distribution hub out in Donabate

BowWow

https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2018/apr/03/prague-ban-bikes-historic-squares-streets-cyclists

This sounds like a plan! :P

KC8

With the NTA changing sides
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/nta-reverses-stance-on-college-green-plaza-plans-1.3447552

I think it is inevitable that the plaza will proceed largely as planned by DCC. Hopefully conditions of planning will include greater bus priority on other roads.

However, I don’t think it’s the end of the world. In my opinion, the issues falls into two categories:

Firstly, buses that currently move from College Green to and from Nassau Street. The plaza will make this journey much better. The only stoppage will be linked to pedestrian lights so both the capacity of the route and the speed along the route will greatly increase.

Secondly, the buses that currently use Dame Street. The buses that currently use George’s Street can reroute along the old 15s alignment through St Stephens Green. While this might discomode some who’s destination is currently around George’s Street, St Stephens Green is also a high demand destination. The buses can then rejoin their normal route at Kelly’s Corner.

The buses that currently use Cork Street can divert via Cuffe Street and St Stephens Green.

The buses that currently use James Street can divert via the Quays at Christchurch (replicting the old outbound routes for 78A and 51s).

I don’t think any of the above represent major service reductions for the majority of passengers and if anything might represent an overall positive in terms of St Stephens Green access.

One thing I think would also be worth considering is to send the likes of the 14s, 15s, 27 and 151 via Tara Street/City Quay for a more direct routing which could be helped by the following road changes: Make Westland Row bus only in both directions (cars can divert via Holles Street) and make Clare Street bus only with the bit of Nassau Street between Clare Street and Kildare Street two way for buses only. This would mean these routes would still remain reasonably central.

dashcamdanny

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

you should really tell Tesco they can't manage it too...
Sure they're just wasting their time with that massive distribution hub out in Donabate

This is how Tesco works also.

Do you honestly think they keep bread in the distribution centre?

bk

dashcamdanny wrote: »

This is how Tesco works also.

Do you honestly think they keep bread in the distribution centre?

Bread is brought to the Tesco Distribution center every day and loaded on trucks heading to each Tesco along with everything else.

Same happens with Musgraves/Supervalu, I used to work in one as a college student years ago. Just one truck would arrive every day, which we would unload and included trolleys of everything including bread, milk, frozen foods, etc. Those trucks have different sections for different food types.

This is actually the whole point of these centralised distribution centers. They don't actually keep product much product in their, instead overnight, artics from various distributors arrive and the goods get taken off those and get divided up and put on smaller trucks heading to each store.

dashcamdanny

bk wrote: »

Bread is brought to the Tesco Distribution center every day and loaded on trucks heading to each Tesco along with everything else.

Same happens with Musgraves/Supervalu, I used to work in one as a college student years ago. Just one truck would arrive every day, which we would unload and included trolleys of everything including bread, milk, frozen foods, etc. Those trucks have different sections for different food types.

This is actually the whole point of these centralised distribution centers. They don't actually keep product much product in their, instead overnight, artics from various distributors arrive and the goods get taken off those and get divided up and put on smaller trucks heading to each store.

It is getting a bit off topic so I will leave it at this.
I used to work there also as a team leader in a big store. Up until 16 months ago

Everything comes separate now . WHich is often a problem for dotcom stores as stuff does not arrive on time. Milk truck, Non food, Fresh.
Not to mention the sales reps bringing in their own brands like crisps eggs and special breads. Artics which are organised to a point. From the distro center. But just dont have everything in one go. Take Brennans for example. The come in and pack their own products.

Which means more traffic.

spockety

I see the ban on Taxis in the morning travelling South/West through College Green is being completely ignored and unenforced.

bk

dashcamdanny wrote: »

It is getting a bit off topic so I will leave it at this.
I used to work there also as a team leader in a big store. Up until 16 months ago

Thanks, been a long time since I was involved. Sounds like the Tesco bean counters trying to offload costs onto their suppliers.

No reason why the city can't put their foot down on that. Only deliveries between certain hours, only one truck per store per day, etc. Plenty of other cities do it.

Sure the Tesco, etc. bean counters might not be happy, but such is life.

AlekSmart

spockety wrote: »

I see the ban on Taxis in the morning travelling South/West through College Green is being completely ignored and unenforced.

Anything to the contrary would have been a surprise.

It remains of note that the only Law Enforcement agency in the State continues to take a totally hands-off approach to the current debate.

Nowhere in the current process,does there appear to have been any reference to,or interest in,the enforcement of the Road Traffic Acts and/or whatever associated SI's or Bye-Law provisions will be required to give effect to Dublin City Councils plans.

It is,as if we were existing in some incredible parallell Dublin,which functions without requirement for the Enforcement of Law.

It is beyond belief,that this enquiry has been addressed by,some of the best renumerated Executives and Officers in Irish Public Administration, but remains in a state of no little confusion as to what is actually their final plan.

This Enquiry,irrespective of whatever outcome it reaches,should (will) become the textbook example of how,a long-term Urban Planning/Public Transport Provision project,should NOT be handled.

The reality that not a single high profile Professional associated with this Disgrace,will suffer even a public rebuke is depressing,and not a little frightening,when one considers just how much more damage, these eejits may be facilitated to do under the Ireland 2040 projects.

The prospect of these people being allowed to bring their "Professional Acumen" to bear,on other Irish cities and Towns remains very high,and should be the cause of some concern to the ordinary population of these centres.

AndrewJRenko

dashcamdanny wrote: »

That would not be practical in the real world. The best you could hope for is : One truck for chill and frozen,
one from the dairy,
one from the bread man
one for everything else.

Cant really mix them as they are all from different producers and all have different requirements for storage and distribution. ..

Seems to work all right in Gothenburg - I don't know the detail, so maybe they have 2 trucks, one chilled or 3 trucks - but they certainly don't have 20 trucks delivering to each Spar/Centra, all 'just for a few minutes' on the bike lane or the clearway.

dashcamdanny wrote: »

Most also come before rush hour starts

So what are all those trucks I see in Rathmines and Ranelagh every rush hour?

prinzeugen

bk wrote: »

Bread is brought to the Tesco Distribution center every day and loaded on trucks heading to each Tesco along with everything else.

Same happens with Musgraves/Supervalu, I used to work in one as a college student years ago. Just one truck would arrive every day, which we would unload and included trolleys of everything including bread, milk, frozen foods, etc. Those trucks have different sections for different food types.

This is actually the whole point of these centralised distribution centers. They don't actually keep product much product in their, instead overnight, artics from various distributors arrive and the goods get taken off those and get divided up and put on smaller trucks heading to each store.

Own brand stuff perhaps. There are thousands of products that are delivered to stores by the box load, not truck load.

In reply to a post earlier. I live in Dublin 6 and my nearest Luas stop is Cowper. Once was able to walk to the stop in 25 mins, and that was to get to Dundrum.

Now I NEED the 83 or 16 bus for health reasons. Luas is no longer an option to go anywhere.

Dublin 6 is a big area as are many postcodes.

AndrewJRenko

prinzeugen wrote: »

Own brand stuff perhaps. There are thousands of products that are delivered to stores by the box load, not truck load.

And that's the problem that needs to be fixed. It's not sustainable.

trellheim

And that's the problem that needs to be fixed. It's not sustainable.

What are your plans for fixing it ? There are thousands of firms making deliveries to Dublin centre all day long, thats how the supply side of the city works.

Since its in the funny papers in this thread, consider Capel St, antiques, pubs , Louis Copeland, several ethnic restaurants , and all the rest ( pet shops)

give me an example in this country where all those stores get a single truck

Shedite27

trellheim wrote: »

What are your plans for fixing it ? There are thousands of firms making deliveries to Dublin centre all day long, thats how the supply side of the city works.

Grafton Street only allows deliveries up to a certain hour, seems to be about 10am. Easy to apply the same rule to College Green

Hurrache

bk wrote: »

Thanks, been a long time since I was involved. Sounds like the Tesco bean counters trying to offload costs onto their suppliers.
.....

Sure the Tesco, etc. bean counters might not be happy, but such is life.

Tesco don't manage all their hubs, Keeling's run most, if not all.

prinzeugen

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

And that's the problem that needs to be fixed. It's not sustainable.

There are hundreds of items that cannot be delivered in bulk for security/space reasons.

Think cigarettes to a Spar or drugs to a pharmacy. I am sure criminals would love shops to have a months worth of tobacco in a store or drug users to find 10,000 sleeping tablets in a pharmacy because the deliveries are done monthly not daily.

AndrewJRenko

prinzeugen wrote: »

There are hundreds of items that cannot be delivered in bulk for security/space reasons.

Think cigarettes to a Spar or drugs to a pharmacy. I am sure criminals would love shops to have a months worth of tobacco in a store or drug users to find 10,000 sleeping tablets in a pharmacy because the deliveries are done monthly not daily.

Thanks for reminding me how these businesses socialise their problems, and put their costs onto society as a whole. The move to just-in-time supply chains and similar has encouraged them to 'optimise' their supply chain, saving money for them, and pushed the costs onto the rest of society - through illegal parking and subsidised road transport. It's really about time that they covered these costs themselves. If they don't have enough space for secure storage, maybe they need to switch some of their retail space to storage space, instead of taking up space in bike lanes and bus lanes for their frequent shipments.

trellheim wrote: »

give me an example in this country where all those stores get a single truck

You're right, it will never get down to 'a single truck'. But there are certainly many opportunities for reducing the large number of trucks making small deliveries to each outlet to a much smaller number of trucks making larger, bulkier deliveries, outside of rush hour.

trellheim wrote: »

What are your plans for fixing it ? There are thousands of firms making deliveries to Dublin centre all day long, thats how the supply side of the city works.

Since its in the funny papers in this thread, consider Capel St, antiques, pubs , Louis Copeland, several ethnic restaurants , and all the rest ( pet shops)

Here's a mad idea - how I don't produce plans for fixing it. How about the businesses who currently rely on law-breaking for their normal day-to-day operation (frequent parking in bike lanes and bus lanes) come up with THEIR plan for fixing it? How about they do what just about every other business in the country does and find a way of operating that doesn't involve frequent law-breaking?

Hurrache

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Thanks for reminding me how these businesses socialise their problems, and put their costs onto society as a whole. The move to just-in-time supply chains and similar has encouraged them to 'optimise' their supply chain, saving money for them, and pushed the costs onto the rest of society

These issues are society lead, not foisted upon society. Society demands cheap and easily available products. 'We' encourage them to optimise their supply chain and save money.

AndrewJRenko

Hurrache wrote: »

These issues are society lead, not foisted upon society. Society demands cheap and easily available products. 'We' encourage them to optimise their supply chain and save money.

There's some truth in this, but the real issue is the lack of appetite for any effective enforcement of existing law.

Sam Russell

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

There's some truth in this, but the real issue is the lack of appetite for any effective enforcement of existing law.

It is not a societal decision to not police parking or cycle lane infringements. It is a lack of enforcement by AGS not to bother enforcing the existing law. They due attempt to enforce thalaws on speeding and in recent time they appear to target those parking in parking spaces reserved for the disabled.

Whether the lack of attention to cycle lanes and parking illegally is due to not enough Gardai or not enough Garda or Court resources, or just that they are too busy 'chasing other criminals' - well that is a political matter.

However, a sustained effort for a while could well tackle the problen such that it is less of a problem.

john boye

Saw one of those pedaltour things holding up everyone on College Green this evening. How on earth are they even allowed in the city at all, never mind at rush hour!

StreetLight

The southbound ban on taxis through College Green has been enforced by a garda the last couple of mornings. Did my heart good. One taxi driver I observed drove right up to the garda and refused to divert to Westmoreland Street until given a stern verbal warning. The entitlement attitude was almost unbelievable.

strandroad

StreetLight wrote: »

One taxi driver I observed drove right up to the garda and refused to divert to Westmoreland Street until given a stern verbal warning. The entitlement attitude was almost unbelievable.

Right, that'll teach him.

cgcsb

StreetLight wrote: »

The southbound ban on taxis through College Green has been enforced by a garda the last couple of mornings. Did my heart good. One taxi driver I observed drove right up to the garda and refused to divert to Westmoreland Street until given a stern verbal warning. The entitlement attitude was almost unbelievable.

No fine issued or penalty points perhaps?