The Kingston story: Bidders fail to pay up for auctioned cows

handlemaster

freedominacup wrote: »

Between farmers. Everything. It therefore colours how we approach all business transactions.

Will you stop pulling my leg. Its a long way from promises that ireland is. So your telling me you would borrow 2.5 million on a promise. By the way what promises were made ?

handlemaster

BoatMad wrote: »

This is true of most business relationships, more deals are done on a golf course on the back of promises then anywhere else. Trust is a vital commodity in personal business relationships and all business is between " people"

True. But investment of millions is not done on a promise.

Bass Reeves

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

It will end up being a pyrrhic victory because of the way they went about this foreclosure.

Farmers may tolerate the messing around for one farm but, if it's repeated with expenses like the hugely excessive costs of security for the farm and the firesale of expensive stock, farmers and farm organisations won't be long getting their backs up and stopping these type of sales.

I don't think many farmers like to see this type of thing going on but recognise that it may be necessary in some cases.

But the stripping and sale of assets for far less than they're worth and excessive profiteering of those involved will not be tolerated for long at all!

But to be honest would costs be as high if bank got co-operation. This is the reality of receivership and always was costs are excessive and the receiver and anyone he hires gets paid before anyone else. This is not just the case in farming.

If the owner sold these cattle would it be a better result for the bank yes, for unsecured creditors maybe, for the owner maybe if all debts are paids, However human nature being any of us would try to fustrate the process if we could.

However if you were employed in a good job outside the farm you would have no choice but to co-operate as the debts would follow you so it would be in your interest to pay off as much debt as possible.

flutered wrote: »

nama hired guys that ran their buisness into the ground, that had the cream safely removed to friends and family, then sold the buisness's back to the developers

NAMA broke some guys too and is still pursuing some that are not co-operating. Often what is presumed to be NAMA is banks doing deals. NAMA only took loans above 12 million banks had to deal with such loans themselves. If these were limited company's with no PG's then the bank had to work the best way it could out of it.

Most lads do not understand a limited company debt cannot follow you unless you trade recklessly or give a PG. Banks and NAMA pursue those that try to transfer assets beyond the receiver. There may be individual cases but that is the reality of the business.

freedominacup wrote: »

Between farmers. Everything. It therefore colours how we approach all business transactions.

Yes it colour's our approach but not all farmers honor agreements either.

Sam Kade

handlemaster wrote: »

True. But investment of millions is not done on a promise.

You'd want a very convincing business plan and healthy accounts for the previous years to borrow that much.

BoatMad

handlemaster wrote: »

True. But investment of millions is not done on a promise.

you'd be surprised, after the promise of course the " my people will contact your people " stuff begins

handlemaster

BoatMad wrote: »

you'd be surprised, after the promise of course the " my people will contact your people " stuff begins

Not a chance. No business would send out an order worth à few hundred euro to a customer on crédit without an order never mind chance their luck with a few million on a promise. It doesnt happen

BoatMad

handlemaster wrote: »

Not a chance. No business would send out an order worth à few hundred euro to a customer on crédit without an order never mind chance their luck with a few million on a promise. It doesnt happen

I once received an order for 175,000 euros of equipment by way of a telephone call while I was BBQing on a saturday. The boss man ( very well known ) rang me himself to haggle and agree. The paperwork followed weeks later. we were onsite the following monday


happens every day in ireland

_Brian

Was this resale on today ??
Any reports on it.

freedominacup

handlemaster wrote: »

Will you stop pulling my leg. Its a long way from promises that ireland is. So your telling me you would borrow 2.5 million on a promise. By the way what promises were made ?

You asked the question about the value of a promise. You don't like the answer so you ask another question entirely seemingly as some sort id diversionary tactic. I'm not interested in engaging further with you on it tbh so I'll leave it there. Boatmad and I have been on opposite sides of this argument from the outset yet we agree on this.

ABlur

_Brian wrote: »

Was this resale on today ??
Any reports on it.

The Farmers Journal website are reporting higher prices paid today.

RightTurnClyde

ABlur wrote: »

The Farmers Journal website are reporting higher prices paid today.

Ya about 50% higher. Mainly NI buyers

handlemaster

BoatMad wrote: »

I once received an order for 175,000 euros of equipment by way of a telephone call while I was BBQing on a saturday. The boss man ( very well known ) rang me himself to haggle and agree. The paperwork followed weeks later. we were onsite the following monday


happens every day in ireland

poor way to run a business . The least requirement would be a faxed order or order number given. This is how businesses get caught out not preparing for the good customer who cannot pay.

Brown Podzol

handlemaster wrote: »

poor way to run a business . The least requirement would be a faxed order or order number given. This is how businesses get caught out not preparing for the good customer who cannot pay.

I put in an order for truck load of fert today, c. 9.5k worth and it will be delivered tomorrow morning and paid for. Ringing in an order for 8 ton feed tomorrow, another 2k worth and I won't even be speaking to the manager, just the receptionist. I wouldn't know a fax from a furze bush.
The business of farming is carried on this way. An order no. is not going to get money from a person who is determined to not pay.

Water John

There's a poster up in my BOI branch telling me, the farmer, that I can borrow up to €100K over the phone, LOL.

keep going

Water John wrote: »

I'd say, keep going, you're crafty enough. I'd say the only thing you're exposed to is the Atlantic.

As I often say I cant tell how much money you have in your pocket right now never mind how much you have in the bank.

mf240

Water John wrote: »

There's a poster up in my BOI branch telling me, the farmer, that I can borrow up to €100K over the phone, LOL.

seen that its right beside the vasaline poster.

Farmer Ed

mf240 wrote: »

seen that its right beside the vasaline poster.

Is getting loans over the phone like that for real or is it like some other adult services that are being advertised over the phone? I'm not sure it would be such a good idea to be getting overly excited.

handlemaster

Brown Podzol wrote: »

I put in an order for truck load of fert today, c. 9.5k worth and it will be delivered tomorrow morning and paid for. Ringing in an order for 8 ton feed tomorrow, another 2k worth and I won't even be speaking to the manager, just the receptionist. I wouldn't know a fax from a furze bush.
The business of farming is carried on this way. An order no. is not going to get money from a person who is determined to not pay.

COD is different. No payment no goods.

BoatMad

handlemaster wrote: »

poor way to run a business . The least requirement would be a faxed order or order number given. This is how businesses get caught out not preparing for the good customer who cannot pay.

common as mud mate , common as mud , certain companies are very structured others are not. often owner run companies with a good reputation are handled on , my word is my bond

and of course all the POs in the world doesnt make in any easier to get paid neither

BoatMad

I see the herd made considerably more money this time around

melissak

It used to be farmers wouldn't buy repossessed cattle etc. They thought it would bring misfortune

Bass Reeves

handlemaster wrote: »

COD is different. No payment no goods.

No COD bought fertlizer off co-op deal done over the phone, 4 payments April-July delivered end of February. Was not in the yard when it was delivered have not had any communication since will drop in a cheque for first payment this week. Feed much the same with another co-op ring in order it and they deliver the following day or so. At present have about 7K on supplier credit.

handlemaster

BoatMad wrote: »

handlemaster wrote: »

poor way to run a business . The least requirement would be a faxed order or order number given. This is how businesses get caught out not preparing for the good customer who cannot pay.

common as mud mate , common as mud , certain companies are very structured others are not. often owner run companies with a good reputation are handled on , my word is my bond

and of course all the POs in the world doesnt make in any easier to get paid neither

Add your reply here.


thats why paddys great business goes bust. also insurance cover is not given for customer orders like this without purchase numbers etc.

Pacoa

I see the herd made considerably more money this time around

Buying um and paying for um are two different things. We shall see if they are actually sold this time.

BoatMad

melissak wrote: »

It used to be farmers wouldn't buy repossessed cattle etc. They thought it would bring misfortune

we also believed in fairies too, but we seemed to have moved on in general

mostly bought by NI farmers , as the breed is more common there

Sam Kade

BoatMad wrote: »

I see the herd made considerably more money this time around

Where did you see that?

BoatMad

Sam Kade wrote: »

Where did you see that?

a reported on the RTE 6 news, seemingly the last tim etc George Kingston was buying and few would bid against him

This time the Kingstons were not present in any capacity and the 40 ( reported ) buyers did a brisk trade each having out down a deposit of 5K,

Estimates are the herd fetched 100-200K more then last time and were described as in top condition by the Farmers journal representative

whelan2

Was there any protest today from the land league?

BoatMad

whelan2 wrote: »

Was there any protest today from the land league?

not reported on RTE, I dont think they were allowed on the land

melissak

BoatMad wrote: »

we also believed in fairies too, but we seemed to have moved on in general

mostly bought by NI farmers , as the breed is more common there

Some have moved on, thankfully not all.