N22 - Farranfore to Killarney [route options published]

marno21 · 18-05-2021 6:14pm

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

Would it make sense to send the N22 over to meet the N21 north of Farranfore? This would obviously have to be done along with an upgrade of the N21 between Tralee and Castleisland to 2+2. That would gave a good quality roads between the main town in Kerry. Doesn't make sense to have two decent parallel national roads within 2km of each other, one good quality road would be better. N70 could then be extended to meet the existing N22 and take over northern end of it.

That ship has sailed now.

Back in the late 90s, the plan was for two WS2 N21 and N22 routes to meet at the roundabout in Ballycarty outside Tralee, then a Type 1 DC would carry traffic from there to Tralee.

However there was objections to the felling of trees at Ballyseedy Woods and instead the existing route was widened to WS2 and a new offline N22 was proposed (only opened in 2013).

Regarding the N70, the gradient for a direct connection to the N22 at Farmers Bridge would be quite steep, however a majority of traffic uses the existing back road from the top of the hill on the N70 down to the N22. It's quite the timesaver but not usable for heavy vehicles

Pete_Cavan · 18-05-2021 9:14pm

marno21 wrote: »

That ship has sailed now.

Back in the late 90s, the plan was for two WS2 N21 and N22 routes to meet at the roundabout in Ballycarty outside Tralee, then a Type 1 DC would carry traffic from there to Tralee.

However there was objections to the felling of trees at Ballyseedy Woods and instead the existing route was widened to WS2 and a new offline N22 was proposed (only opened in 2013).

Ideally the houses on the northern side of the road would be CPOed for the widening, rather than landtake from the woods to the south. I talking about in the long term, we'll be lucky to see the Killarney - Farranfore section done this decade, I was looking further ahead.

embraer170 · 18-05-2021 9:47pm

marno21 wrote: »

That ship has sailed now.

Regarding the N70, the gradient for a direct connection to the N22 at Farmers Bridge would be quite steep, however a majority of traffic uses the existing back road from the top of the hill on the N70 down to the N22. It's quite the timesaver but not usable for heavy vehicles

That part of the N70 into Tralee really needs something done to it. A connection to the N22 would be one solution, and the gradient could probably be tackled with a few gentle curves.

I will never understand why Killorglin-Milltown got a new road (and they are planning Milltown and Castlemaine bypasses) when that dreadful descent into Tralee is still there.

KrisW1001 · 19-05-2021 10:20am

There's a phenomenon where "dangerous" roads are less urgent to fix from a safety perspective, because the road itself limits the danger by preventing high speeds. Speed does not cause accidents, but it does turn minor accidents into fatal ones. I'd put N70 into this category - it's a horrible road, but it's so obviously horrible that you can't get up to a dangerous speed on it.

Actually, there looks to be a relatively simple point to connect N70 to N22 and avoid the worst of the hairpins, along the road marked below, but it does go quite near to a lot of properties.

6034073

embraer170 · 19-05-2021 5:56pm

KrisW1001 wrote: »

There's a phenomenon where "dangerous" roads are less urgent to fix from a safety perspective, because the road itself limits the danger by preventing high speeds. Speed does not cause accidents, but it does turn minor accidents into fatal ones. I'd put N70 into this category - it's a horrible road, but it's so obviously horrible that you can't get up to a dangerous speed on it.

Fair point. I have come across a few accidents on the N70 descent into Tralee including one a December night where I was first on the scene after someone totally missed one of the hairpin bends.

It's true that none of them were fatal (as as I know), but I am wondering if there is any other stretch of road where I have seen so many accidents.

marno21 · 01-07-2021 12:00am

https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Supplier/PublicPurchase/191893/0/0?returnUrl=ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders&b=ETENDERS_SIMPLE

Tender out for traffic surveys

Also:

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/munster/arid-40320497.html

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/news/clarity-needed-on-n22-project-to-allay-worries-40595565.html

marno21 · 26-05-2022 9:30am

Preferred route in Q3 of this yesr according to the council.

lordleitrim · 05-11-2022 12:16am

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/news/development-of-farranfore-killarney-road-project-difficult-as-preferred-route-to-be-unveiled-42119440.html

Preferred route to be unveiled this month!

spacetweek · 04-12-2022 11:12pm

Did it happen?

By the way, quote from the article, and yes I know the Indo is a soft target for this: "Never had developing a major scheme being so difficult". Really? Do their journalists have even a basic grasp of English these days? Rant over.

lordleitrim · 05-12-2022 11:22am

Taken from Councillor Jackie Healy Rae's Facebook page yesterday.

"This evening we were advised by the road design office for Kerry that there has been yet another delay in the route selection for the new Killarney to Farranfore road.

Below is the update we received;

“Please be advised that following the TII Peer Review of the Draft Option Selection Report for the N22 Farranfore to Killarney Project which was undertaken in October, further work has since been requested by the TII. This request will delay the public display of the Emerging Preferred Route Corridor until at least Q1 2023. The additional work sought by TII includes further appraisal of the Active Travel and Public Transport modes potential to meet the scheme objectives.”

This is not good enough in my opinion, deadline after deadline has been missed resulting in lands being held up for decades at this stage. I will be raising this again with KCC and the TII."

marno21 · 05-12-2022 6:43pm

The additional work sought by TII includes further appraisal of the Active Travel and Public Transport modes potential to meet the scheme objectives

More Grade A clownery. There's a rail line beside the route which will be analysed under the rail review. The rail line is a useful asset but it, and indeed any bus related proposals, will do **** all to meet the scheme objectives. This is Killarney, not Paris or Amsterdam. There will likely be pedestrian and cycling facilities along the existing route or added to this one beside it.

It's quite obvious there is a need for an improved road between Farranfore and east of Killarney. It was obvious the last time this charade was undertaken and it's quite obvious this time. 3/4 months of an added delay for absolutely no gain again.

marno21 · 26-01-2023 9:54am

Like so many other schemes countrywide, it's such a pity hundreds of people are left waiting for these moronic hurdles to be overcome.

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/news/when-will-we-know-what-route-the-farranfore-killarney-bypass-will-take-42312321.html

lordleitrim · 10-02-2023 4:01pm

https://www.radiokerry.ie/news/killarney-councillors-to-write-to-tii-to-express-dissatisfaction-at-handling-of-n22-bypass-project-316746

The frustration continues....

marno21 · 25-02-2023 1:19pm

https://www.radiokerry.ie/news/final-route-for-farranfore-to-killarney-bypass-likely-to-take-another-few-months-318846

marno21 · 19-04-2023 10:53am

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/news/our-primary-goal-is-to-get-preferred-route-for-farranfore-killarney-bypass-42427099.html?

marno21 · 06-07-2023 11:04am

Now that Eamon Ryan has put the brakes on this, there's been significant outrage on this. The 2 Healy Raes discussed it in the Dail on Tuesday, and a delegation of councillors are seeking a meeting with the Minister.

There are 2 separate issues here:

The need for the new road is clear and unambiguous, both the N22 component and the much smaller N71 component.
There are 4 route corridors that have been sterilised since early 2021, affecting over 400 households. The preferred route has been known since late 2022, but can't be published because there's more bureaucratic jiggery pokery to be addressed put in place by the bike salesman.

A reminder to the 2 Government parties that they face enough of a challenge in this constituency off the 2020 result let alone the backlash within the constituency against several policies driven by Green Party Ministers that they will have to deal with too. Perhaps adding this on top isn't particularly wise.

Chris_5339762 · 06-07-2023 11:19am

This may reappear at the next election if it gets delayed until then - the Healy-Raes, even though I thoroughly dislike the rampant parish pump politics that they display, will be VERY effective at getting this put back on the list if whatever government need any support from independants.

marno21 · 22-09-2023 2:57am

2.5 years later no route selected. Four corridor options remain sterilised. Hundreds of landowners affected

https://www.radiokerry.ie/news/councillor-calls-for-transport-minister-to-explain-funding-delays-for-killarney-bypass-347987

What sort of incompetence is this

Also, full discussion with quite some detail

https://www.radiokerry.ie/podcasts/kerry-today/minister-why-the-delay-to-killarney-road-project-september-20th-2023-348026

orangerhyme · 22-09-2023 3:31am

Is the scale of the project absolutely necessary?

Could a bypass of Killarney be enough?

marno21 · 22-09-2023 3:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121141361#Comment_121141361

The primary reasons for the development from Killarney north to Farranfore is the safety issues on the existing road and the high traffic volumes. There’s no traffic counters along the route to my knowledge but as a regular driver on the route it’s noticeably busier between Farranfore and Killarney than Farranfore and Tralee. The route between Farranfore and Tralee was upgraded between 2000 and 2013 save for c. 2km north of Farranfore which is included in this project.

It’s fair to argue that Killarney North-Farranfore isn’t a massive national priority but if Killarney was bypassed and the existing route was maintained north of the new bypass there would be a clear safety and capacity issue, and until recently TII were trying quite hard to avoid having troublesome stretches of road between newly upgraded stretches.

marno21 · 22-09-2023 4:07am

https://www.radiokerry.ie/podcasts/kerry-today/time-to-think-trains-september-21st-2023-348152

Response from the Kerry Green rep. 12 minutes of incoherent raimeis to put it politely

Norteño · 22-09-2023 10:06am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121141371#Comment_121141371

In his case, it's simply just Time To Think.

That'd be a start.

marno21 · 04-12-2023 4:20am

• The scheme is at Phase 2 (Stage 2) – Options Selection Stage and a Peer Review of the Draft Option Selection Report took place in October 2022 by TII. • The 2023 allocation for the scheme of €100k has been subject to Section 24 of the Roads Act ie.it has been set by the Minister. • KCC have subsequently issued a request for additional funding to TII.

• Discussions between the Project Team and TII are ongoing and a meeting with the Peer Review Team was held on 27/04/2023 to discuss the advancement of the project should additional funding be made available.

• Legal Advice from Senior Counsel has been sought in relation to the release of sections of roadbased corridors which did not emerge as likely preferred routes corridors and will not form part of the final Transport Solution. The advice recommends awaiting the approval and publication of the Option Selection Report. The completion of the Report is dependent on receipt of additional funding.

Latest from the Council in September. Hopefully more clarity in TII's 2024 allocations

2.5 years later and no route picked. The people along the route getting absolutely rode by the Department on this pisstake of an exercise.

Chris_5339762 · 04-12-2023 12:07pm

They are getting Rode by Eamonn Ryan and his stalling - and the project team are digging their heels in and refusing to release route corridors until the report is complete, which needs money from Mr Ryan.

lordleitrim · 04-12-2023 4:34pm

I've driven Tralee Killarney a number of times lately and I suppose I'm so used to newer generation higher spec national primary roads with minimal or non existent private entrances (eg Tralee Castleisland/Limerick or even Tralee Farranfore ) that its quite shocking the amount of houses and private entrances between Farranfore to Killarney. It s almost like driving through urban areas at some points such is the density of homes and B&Bs...all requiring its occupants and visitors to perform many daily right hand turn maneouvers across such a busy road. It really does make it lethal for all users of the road. Also queuing from beyond the Aghadoe hotel turn off into Killarney seems to be a regular occurence now! The improved road can not come soon enough!