N22 - Macroom to Ovens [postponed until post 2027]

Chris_5339762

True, but I wonder how many people will hang back a little now... I will certainly hang back going westbound along the Ovens section before the reservoirs, knowing I'll be able to get past the doddering KY reg caravan trailing the 40 foot lorry once I get to Macroom. At the moment that sort of convoy induces panic knowing its at least 30 - 40 minutes until they can be overtaken close to the Kerry border.

marno21

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118126570#Comment_118126570

Very good point, but there will also be an increase in traffic using the route as the N22 route becomes appealing vs other routes (Tralee-Cork via Mallow becomes less appealing for one). The extra traffic may well undo any deliberate attempts by drivers to be safer.

Then there’s the sheer volume of junctions which will be even more unsafe on a busy road (the 2 at Crookstown, traffic crossing Aherla-Farran etc) and the mess of road between Crookstown and Coolcour.

And let’s not forget the terminus heading west at Ballincollig which long term is another safety issue.

The 24km in question here is a route which never gets a whole pile of attention but the reasons for it needing attention are quite clear. We’ll have to wait and see.

Pete_Cavan

I'd say the problem here is the same as the Lakeview RAB, the solution is going to piss off some people and is politically unattractive. Eventually the solution for the eastern part around Ovens could be something similar to N25 Carrigtwohill - Midleton, new N road provided along the southern side of the existing road and local road along the northern side. Over the years some houses on the southern side might become abandoned, making the process easier.

deedeedee24

Anyone know where I can find what the proposed route for N22 Macroom to Ovens was before it was suspended?

munchkin_utd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120328279#Comment_120328279

go to the cork planning maps:

https://corkcoco.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html

and on the layers options find the one for route protection corridor and you'll see where the road is planned.

KrisW1001

Here’s the preferred corridor:

deedeedee24

That was great help! Thanks so much. Got exactly what I needed.

Chris_5339762

If they did suddenly decide to build this, they'd have to start all over again - but I don't think the "new" route would be much different from that proposed. Possibly slightly more online to the old road than this, at a guess.

Junctions at Farran and Crookstown possibly.

yerwanthere123

Looking forward to driving on this sometime around 2050!

marno21

Deputy Brendan Griffin (Fine Gael-Kerry): I want to bring up the issue of the N22 Cork to Kerry road. The Tánaiste was there when he was Taoiseach, just before Christmas, to open the Macroom bypass, which is fantastic infrastructure. The remaining section between Ballyvourney and Macroom should open in the not-too-distant future. I want to ask about the section from Macroom to Ovens and place it firmly on the agenda because that remaining section of the N22, as the Tánaiste knows, is substandard and for modern purposes it requires an upgrade. I know it will not be ready for Saturday week to bring us up to Páirc Uí Chaoimh any bit quicker for the match against Cork but it is important for the future socioeconomic development of the south west that this road would be on the agenda for an upgrade. I ask the Tánaiste if it could be prioritised.

Deputy Micheál Martin (Fianna Fáil-Cork South Central): I thank the Deputy for raising this issue. What struck me when I was opening the Macroom bypass was the number of Kerry Deputies who arrived. That brought home to me the desire of Kerry Deputies and Kerry people to get closer to Cork and to have greater access to Cork. When the Deputy arrives in two weeks' time, he will see that we have lovely active greenways and a lovely park developed adjacent to Páirc Uí Chaoimh to facilitate Kerry supporters with picnics. In deference to my colleague, Deputy Eamon Ryan, you do not need to drive right into Páirc Uí Chaoimh anymore. You can park on the outskirts and walk in and it is pleasant terrain and a pleasant journey in what is now a beautiful landscape and which is evidence of the Government's commitment to providing improved amenities and so on.

I am committed to the extension of the road. We should finish the job because what came across forcefully with the Ballyvourney bypass was safety and what safety means for people on that road.

Now so.

KrisW1001

Martin made two points I agree with fully, there: the idea that everyone has a right to drive their car right into the city centre needs to end, and the N22 Ovens-Macroom road needs to be built.

Chris_5339762

I can hear the old "Save the Lee Valley" group that got this canned the last time around pre-emptively foaming at the mouth.

EnzoScifo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120678034#Comment_120678034

The Kerry parish pump vs the Cork North West parish pump, a match for the ages!

marno21

Now that the Baile Bhuirne/Macroom section is practically complete, the politicians of Kerry and Cork will move their focus eastwards to the section just east of Macroom. This particular section between Coolcower and Crookstown/R590 junction now stands out as being a particularly rubbish stretch of road.

Whilst this scheme, a whole 24km of road, identified as requiring dual carriageway along half its length was identified in the 1998 Roads Need Study, a report which advised that sections of the N6, N7, N8 and N9 would be sufficient with wide single carriageway upgrades, is too ambitious to complete at present, perhaps it may be meritorious to split the scheme and advance the western section. So, the N22 Macroom-Crookstown project

• 9-11km of Type 1/2 dual carriageway with NO junctions bar a junction at the eastern terminus/close to it
• Removal of the two bridges, the dirty S2 between them, the GP wood junction, Lissarda
• Potential to grade separate the R585, R590 and R619 junctions
• Only major structure would be a Lee crossing at Coolcower.

We can leave the lethal western terminus of the Ballincollig bypass and the 14km of road through flat land that's over capacity for a high speed road riddled with junctions and accesses for another day.

Chris_5339762

Nah, I think splitting it would mean say, 7 years to put the western section through planning and getting it started, and then another 7 for the eastern.

Its 24km, thats just about right for a scheme. And I'd say any analysis would not want a gap of say, 10km between two bits of dual carriageway.

The New Ross to Waterford section of the N25 is precisely this and is an accident magnet - which has been delayed and suspended due to you-know-who.

Oddly enough the Macroom to Ovens scheme, which is massively overcapacity, does seem to have very few or barely any accidents on it.

marno21

Its 24km, thats just about right for a scheme. And I'd say any analysis would not want a gap of say, 10km between two bits of dual carriageway.

Yes, but unfortunately analysis and experts are in the back seat for this particular journey, as we have observed recently.

Oddly enough the Macroom to Ovens scheme, which is massively overcapacity, does seem to have very few or barely any accidents on it.

I strongly suspect there to be an increase of traffic on this section post October when the N22 BBM scheme opens, as traffic that previously took other routes will start using the N22. If Killarney is bypassed before this gets going, the N22 will also attract traffic avoiding Killarney. This will likely degrade the safety performance of the road further.

tobyflenderson

I would also point out that many residents of villages such as Aherla, Cloughduv, Crookstown and as far west as Kilmurry actually use the L2216, a back road of fairly poor quality in places running parallel to the N22.

A lot of drivers from West and South Cork coming up through Beal na Bláth will avoid the N22 altogether.This is due to the fact that getting on the N22 at peak times is well nigh impossible with Cork-bound traffic so they have no alternative.

The L2216 must be beyond capacity at this point and will only get worse given the housing developments currently on going along its route.

This hopefully will push this scheme along.

Baldilocks

Was stuck behind a lovely lady doing 60kph from Macroom to Ballincollig bypass this evening........ me and many, many other cars...

this glaring omission needs to be resolved asap

kil

I live in the area and commute east bound daily. The past few mornings the traffic has been backing on the N22 so I've driven through Aherla and Killumney. Both the N22 and the L2216 have traffic counting strips currently, be interesting to see what the numbers are like.

hans aus dtschl

Lots of counting going on at the moment whatever is going on

marno21

Hopefully gathering data for the next capital investment plan after the next election which will hopefully be put forward when there adults who live on the same plane of reality as the rest of us in charge

Norteño

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121141678#Comment_121141678

I love your optimism, Marno.

KrisW1001

... the suggestion that government policy is the main thing preventing progress is surprisingly naive.

marno21

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121146617#Comment_121146617

This scheme was a rather strange omission from the 2018-2027 plan. It was clearly flagged under a particular safety parameter by TII, under which all other projects flagged under the same safety parameter were included. (Two N2 projects, one N4 project, the entire N20 and the N22 around Killarney were included; notwithstanding the Macroom bypass being close to construction)

Of course, since 2020 this has all gone out the window, for some reason

Cookiemunster

I mean, TII have literally stated that Ryan has told them to stop progressing certain projects. How people can still be saying that Ryan has nothing to do with it is beyond be.

https://www.businesspost.ie/politics/road-to-nowhere-building-ban-puts-the-brakes-on-ten-projects/

KrisW1001

This project was long-fingered long before Eamon Ryan took office, though. It was originally Ovens-Baile Bhuirne, but was split in order to prevent this eastern stretch blocking the vital safety work needed further west.

My take is that there are some well funded interests along this route who would rather not have a motorway built along it, and that previous governments, just as this one, decided to put their efforts into projects that would not face obstruction at every turn.

Chris_5339762

"Save The Lee Valley" were the campaign the last time around, but Eamon Ryan aside, there are much more important schemes than this out there.

eg: N25 Waterford to New Ross. A similarly placed S2 between two dual carriageways but with a dreadful safety record. The "problem" with this N22 stretch is that despite the very high levels of traffic it has a good safety profile. That doesn't mean it should be ignored, it certainly should be built.

KrisW1001

Yes. N22 is safe, but slow, while N25 between Waterford Port and the New Ross bypass is just dangerous (the rest of N25 is pretty safe.. even Kinsalebeg).

There are still dangerous stretches of National Primary routes that should be fixed before we spend a cent on making people's trips faster elsewhere; and the secondary network is even more in need of attention.

mouldybags

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120757976#Comment_120757976

And lo it has come to pass. Traffic is now at standstill from the Aherla/Farran crossroads to the west end of Ballincollig every weekday morning. This was never an issue before the Macroom bypass opened.

KrisW1001

Induced demand meets a shortage of accommodation in Cork city.