Baby screaming in restaurant

thattequilagirl

etoughguy wrote: »

Best post on this thread by far

I am the father of an autistic 6 year old who does now and then let out high pitch screams when he is happy (which as any father would do I try my best to make sure this is 100% of the time) and I couldn't give a rats a$$ if those around me take umbrage while eating their food. My son will still be autistic tomorrow and your food will be gone, sure you might rant and rave to others about your interrupted peace and quiet but get your off your moral high horse and have some consideration for the parents, all may not what it seems to be

This is what bugs me. You and several other parents on this thread want a huge amount of consideration to be shown to you, while simultaneously rejecting the fact that you should show consideration to others. How come this consideration only goes one way?

Imagine a couple with kids that don't get out that often book a sitter for their anniversary or a birthday. They put on nice clothes and head off to a nice restaurant for a nice meal - a lovely and all too rare treat! They get to a restaurant where they're seated beside a screaming child. Is that fair?

You don't know anyone else's circumstances any more than they know yours, so maybe be a little less presumptuous about your right to ruin someone else's evening.

thattequilagirl

goz83 wrote: »

Do you have kids? I hope not, because the worst kind of parenting (if it can even be called parenting) is the type where a toddler is given an ipad to shut them up. It's certainly not a good option.

Then go with one of the other suggestions I made or come up with your own, though there are tons of educational games for kids available for iPad.

goz83 wrote: »

You complained earlier when someone was supposedly misrepresenting your posts. Would be nice if you didn't try to represent an entire country in a single post...so I fixed it for you.
D

It was a joke buddy. I don't need anything fixed, thanks.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

I have two little cousins who are autistic. Both of them can't talk and one in particular can only scream to communicate. I've been at weddings, funerals and birthday parties with these kids, and when they start to scream their dad (most often) picks them up and carries them out until they stop screaming.

The little girl gets stressed out when she's around too many people, and when her mom brings her to her aunties house, and when the kid has enough and starts getting upset/uneasy her mother brings her out to the car and puts on a dvd in the car. She's 7 and this is how they cope when she's getting herself too upset.

She's gone missing at birthday parties because she just wants to get away from people, and she's always found in the bathroom. She gets into the bath by herself because that's her favourite place.

That's the extent of my experience of children that have autism, but it's more for the child that she's removed than for everybody else but when they're out, they are aware the kids can get upset and they have steps in place to deal with that.

It's a bit concerning that a parent would leave their autistic child in a setting that was distressing them so as they could finish their lunch, tbh

goz83

goz83 wrote: »

Do you have kids? I hope not, because the worst kind of parenting (if it can even be called parenting) is the type where a toddler is given an ipad to shut them up. It's certainly not a good option.

Utter nonsense, iPads are great tools for kids and getting used to technology at a very young age is very beneficial as their entire life will be lived using all forms of technology.

Brobromococo

I am so surprised at the amount of people who are happy to discourage any parent engaging with their child positively. I see so many parents ignoring their children because they are busy on phones and slap a tablet in front of their child instead of teaching them to engage appropriately. I think if you have a problem with a child laughing you should be the one to move. Is it more important that you eat your meal quietly at the expense of a child's happiness for a few minutes?

Keane2baMused

http://youtu.be/4Ombfnpa75E

Experiment in a restaurant to see the reactions of diners to a kid with autism.

Gives some faith in humanity.

goz83

One eyed Jack wrote: »

goz I have to ask, why do you say this?

It's not so much giving them an iPad "to shut them up", but rather to entertain themselves. They can do colouring or maths or play a game on it or whatever. I really don't see the issue some people have with children and technology.

Honestly, letting them play educational games on a pad is ok sometimes, but that was not what came across in the post I was replying to. I often see kids zoned into ipads watching peppa pig on youtube and i find it to be disturbing, lazy parenting.

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I love this thread

"Have you got kids? I certainly hope not. Only bad parents let their kids play with iPads"

Coming from the camp of where other people don't matter and should leave an establishment if they're offended by screaming children



Who are you to tell anyone how to parent??

Oh i'm not telling people how to parent. I've got my own lot to take care of. But judging by some of the responses on here, i sincerely hope they are coming from people who don't have kids. And I didn't say that only bad parents let their kids play on pads....so don't be twisting my words.

wokingvoter wrote: »

Ahh right on cue! Just the kind of passive aggressive nonsense to illustrate the point! Well done!

You're really not making any sense. Put away the wine for tonight. Come back tomorrow.

thattequilagirl wrote: »

It was a joke buddy. I don't need anything fixed, thanks.

Ability to tell jokes. It really wasn't obvious.

One eyed Jack

Brobromococo wrote: »

I am so surprised at the amount of people who are happy to discourage any parent engaging with their child positively. I see so many parents ignoring their children because they are busy on phones and slap a tablet in front of their child instead of teaching them to engage appropriately. I think if you have a problem with a child laughing you should be the one to move. Is it more important that you eat your meal quietly at the expense of a child's happiness for a few minutes?

Nobody in this thread has said, nor even suggested anything that would indicate they have any issue with children laughing. It's the attitudes of some people who believe they are entitled to act the same way in public as they do at home, without any consideration for other people!

That attitude is fine when they're in their own home, but different standards apply when they're out in a public shared space where it isn't all about them, they are obliged to be considerate of other people. If their attitude is that they don't have to be considerate of other people, then they cannot justifiably expect that other people should offer them any consideration.

It's that simple. It's not the child's behaviour that's the issue, it's the adults behaviour is the issue.

darkpagandeath

This is getting ridiculous, The baby presumably did not have any medical issue. It was the father acting the d*ck nothing more. Why the hyperbole of kids with Autism.

Spanish Eyes

Parents should shut their kids up when in a communal environment. When they are off the scale I mean.

How any parent would not be embarrassed by screaming or meltdowns is beyond me. Take them out somewhere else please. For your sake, the child's sake and everyone else's sake TBH.

And I have a nephew with CP and autism who is a lovely kid, but has his moments. His parents would always take him out of an environment where he is not happy and causing upset to those around him, who often do not understand what is going on.

He is an adorable child. But his needs are equal to others when out socialising. His parents understand this.

One eyed Jack

Keane2baMused wrote: »

http://youtu.be/4Ombfnpa75E

Experiment in a restaurant to see the reactions of diners to a kid with autism.

Gives some faith in humanity.

Those videos are set up, they're supposed to give some faith in humanity for people who have no faith in humanity. Those videos aren't necessary for people who already know that not everyone in society behaves like the world should revolve around them.

meeeeh

goz83 wrote: »

Honestly, letting them play educational games on a pad is ok sometimes, but that was not what came across in the post I was replying to. I often see kids zoned into ipads watching peppa pig on youtube and i find it to be disturbing, lazy parenting.



Oh i'm not telling people how to parent. I've got my own lot to take care of. But judging by some of the responses on here, i sincerely hope they are coming from people who don't have kids. And I didn't say that only bad parents let their kids play on pads....so don't be twisting my words.

Oh yeah the horror of technology. We went for dinner earlier and kids did play games before meal. When you have to wait for food that is very convenient way to keep them calm bad parenting as it might be. Of course that was after we had an hour and a half long walk together when the younger was allowed to scream and cry as much as she wanted because we wouldn't carry her. Unlike in restaurant there were no people around.

Keane2baMused

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Those videos are set up, they're supposed to give some faith in humanity for people who have no faith in humanity. Those videos aren't necessary for people who already know that not everyone in society behaves like the world should revolve around them.

The fact is that actually does happen, a lot. That and worse. The video is supposed to highlight it and create awareness, nothing more.

Is Carly Fleichmanns video in the same world revolves around us category?

thattequilagirl

Brobromococo wrote: »

I am so surprised at the amount of people who are happy to discourage any parent engaging with their child positively. I see so many parents ignoring their children because they are busy on phones and slap a tablet in front of their child instead of teaching them to engage appropriately. I think if you have a problem with a child laughing you should be the one to move. Is it more important that you eat your meal quietly at the expense of a child's happiness for a few minutes?

I think it's great that a dad was taking the time to play with his kid and make him laugh. All kids deserve that kind of love and attention. Do I think he could have chosen a better place to play his game? Absolutely. I'm glad you're bonding with your kid sir, but I've got 25 minutes to myself to eat lunch and I want a bit of peace for it.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Brobromococo wrote: »

I am so surprised at the amount of people who are happy to discourage any parent engaging with their child positively. I see so many parents ignoring their children because they are busy on phones and slap a tablet in front of their child instead of teaching them to engage appropriately. I think if you have a problem with a child laughing you should be the one to move. Is it more important that you eat your meal quietly at the expense of a child's happiness for a few minutes?

This wasn't about a child laughing. It was a child screeching and being encouraged to do so over and over by their father in a confined space where other people were trying to enjoy a meal.

mikeym

Love babies.

dr.fuzzenstein

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Parents should shut their kids up when in a communal environment.

Oh totally agree, sadly we can't smack kids anymore, so a more scientific method is required. Luckily there is help available, in the form of a specially designed, low voltage taser:
http://www.ufunk.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/taser-for-kids.jpg

Spanish Eyes

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Oh totally agree, sadly we can't smack kids anymore, so a more scientific method is required. Luckily there is help available, in the form of a specially designed, low voltage taser:
http://www.ufunk.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/taser-for-kids.jpg

Just taking them into the relevant jax would do TBH lol.

God help anyone there doing their bz though.

Kids are too coddled nowadays. Not like in my day har har.

One eyed Jack

Keane2baMused wrote: »

The fact is that actually does happen, a lot. That and worse. The video is supposed to highlight it and create awareness, nothing more.

Is Carly Fleichmanns video in the same world revolves around us category?

If as you say "it happens a lot" (I have no way to quantify what you mean by 'a lot'), then people are already aware of autism. In fact, so aware are some people of autism, that when my son kicked off outside a polling station because he wasn't allowed vote, my wife was giving him a stern talking to when an old lady came over to her and said -

"Leave him alone, he could be autistic!"

I had to calm my wife down before she lost it with the old lady! :pac:

I'm aware that it happens, I'm aware that people can be impatient and inconsiderate, I'm aware that everyone isn't going to understand every little tick and twitch and the multitude of other traits associated with autism. But y'know what? I'm also aware that the vast, vast, vast majority of people in society are good people!

I'm aware of the care almost to the point of smothering the children, that the children in my son's class in school, the whole school really, look out for, and are ferociously protective of a number of children that are on the spectrum. They don't do it because they have to be told to. They do it because they want to. Because they want children on the spectrum to feel like they are included and that they are cared for and that they are treated with the same dignity and respect as everyone else.

The Carly Fleischmann video is in the same "the world revolves around me" category, because the film is all about Carly Fleischmann's world, and her experience of being autistic. Her experiences may be worlds apart from someone else's experience of being autistic. That's why it's called a spectrum, because every person with autism is going to experience the world differently, from their perspective.

I've worked with adults and children with special needs/differently abled, whatever terminology you prefer to use, for much of my adult life, and because I don't define them by that one trait or ability, I treat them the same as I would anyone else. If we're in a restaurant having a meal, consideration and making allowances for other people always goes both ways.

Some people don't understand that, and they're usually people that aren't on the spectrum. Their disability is their bad attitude and their lack of consideration for other people, but thankfully that's a lot less common in society than any classified cognitive, emotional, behavioral or physical disability.

dr.fuzzenstein

And a very useful tool when people come over and give you grief is to smile politely, nod at them sagely and tell them to Foxtrot Oscar.

dialer

whatismyname wrote:

There is no right or wrong. It's all about perspective.

Perfect, +1 to poster.

tina1040

I can't believe a baby had the attention span to play peekaboo for 10 minutes. That's a long time for a baby. Are you sure it didn't just feel like 10 minutes?

Wompa1

It works both ways. We go to a fast food place once a week after the rush with our 3 month old. Get him a little vitamin D and give us a chance to get out of the house. Today when we went there were a rowdy bunch of drunk 20 somethings shouting and roaring. After a few minutes of that our lad started roaring.

I guess it's a chance you take when going to such a public place. Be it with screaming kids, drunken yobs or screeching teenagers.

gozunda

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Let's just say I only knew Ireland from AH on Boards.ie, I would now ask the question, how are there not mass brawls on every street corner every day?
How do you people actually live with each other? There should be mass casualties and civil war in this country every week.
I can only assume that apart from the absolute cranks on here, the real people of Ireland are actually somewhat tolerant of each other...

Was in Corsica years ago. Met an old man who said he liked the Irish as they were just as passionate about issues as the Corsican people were

gozunda

mikeym wrote: »

Love babies.

Yeah but could never eat a whole one ...

dr.fuzzenstein

gozunda wrote: »

Yeah but could never eat a whole one ...

Just invite some friends round:

http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/HowTo:Cook_Children

Whispered

We had lunch out with our 16 month old today. I smiled a bit thinking about this thread when a woman sitting at an opposite table started a game of peekaboo with him behind her menu. He was giving proper little belly laughs at her and she came up to say hi before she left. They made each other smile

Pac1Man

Young babies don't need to be going to restaurants.

dr.fuzzenstein

Whispered wrote: »

We had lunch out with our 16 month old today. I smiled a bit thinking about this thread when a woman sitting at an opposite table started a game of peekaboo with him behind her menu. He was giving proper little belly laughs at her and she came up to say hi before she left. They made each other smile

A lot of the posters here would probably have come over and told you to remove your baby from the restaurant because he was making noise...:rolleyes:
(Glad some people are still human)

gozunda

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Just invite some friends round:

http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/HowTo:Cook_Children

I prefer to eat out tbh

melissak

Speedwell wrote: »

I agree. My brain is wired differently from most women's, but from what I have heard and seen from mothers close to me, women react even more strongly than men (for example, one of my friends was a professional foster mother for an adoption agency who was able to breastfeed the foster babies, and she said that hearing the crying of a new foster baby usually triggered a milk letdown). Babies' cries evolved to get your attention RIGHT NOW and make you want to do something to make the baby stop RIGHT NOW. I really think that it's just more permissible for men to show their irritation. Women showing the same level of irritation would be looked at as potentially or actually poor mothers.

Where was this foster mother who breastfed? In Ireland? I heard it was possible for someone who didn't give birth to breastfeed but never encountered it, is it common?

goz83

meeeeh wrote: »

Oh yeah the horror of technology. We went for dinner earlier and kids did play games before meal. When you have to wait for food that is very convenient way to keep them calm bad parenting as it might be. Of course that was after we had an hour and a half long walk together when the younger was allowed to scream and cry as much as she wanted because we wouldn't carry her. Unlike in restaurant there were no people around.

You obviously didn't read my post. Go back, read it...maybe twice, to be sure. But just in case you decide you can't do that, or fail to understand it again...let me say it another way.

Its ok to let kids play on pads sometimes. Technology is not a horror, but sometimes lazy parents pawn their kids off to a mindless game, or youtube channel to shut them up. Its no better than feeding them junk sweets to appease them in the short term, but in the long run, both are unhealthy and cause problems.

Your description of the long walk and dinner and the (presumably) minimal gaming time is perfectly fine and nothing i would baulk at.

Pac1Man

goz83 wrote: »

You obviously didn't read my post. Go back, read it...maybe twice, to be sure. But just in case you decide you can't do that, or fail to understand it again...let me say it another way.

Yowza! Usually it's only a few words or maybe a sentence, but a whole paragraph?! Maybe dial back the passive aggressiveness if you want people to be more sympathetic to your opinion.

esforum

Pac1Man wrote: »

Young babies don't need to be going to restaurants.

either do adults, whats your point?

Parents with children should be locked away inside?

Ireland has a terrible attitude towards kids being in public spaces.

In mainy countries they will be in restaurants, pubs, etc and far from discouraging it, the places will have play areas.

gozunda

I think the point made was that adults go to restaurants for social reasons and to enjoy eating out ... babies are brought along with parents and whilst the they enjoy eating and gooing at things- they would just as happily eat and goo goo at anything anywhere ...

esforum wrote: »

...

Parents with children should be locked away inside?

....

Ireland has a terrible attitude towards kids being in public spaces.

Some parents here appear to have a terrible attitude / lack of consideration for others in public spaces

In mainy countries they will be in restaurants, pubs, etc and far from discouraging it, the places will have play areas.

Parents with children in many other countries in my experience do behave with consideration to others in restaurants, pubs etc (personally I do not like to see children in pubs)

Pac1Man

esforum wrote: »

either do adults, whats your point?

Parents with children should be locked away inside?

Yes lock them away, that's what I said.

Plenty of places for kids to enjoy themselves rather than an adult orientated eating place.

esforum wrote: »

Ireland has a terrible attitude towards kids being in public spaces.

In mainy countries they will be in restaurants, pubs, etc and far from discouraging it, the places will have play areas.

As you say, in Ireland we rarely have dedicated play areas. Parents should be aware of that.

Olishi4

Ahh seriously, the father just probably got caught up in the moment and didn't even realise how loud they were being. Id say he was just a bit taken back by the woman coming over. Some people have a low tolerance for noise so it was a bit inconsiderate but not the end of the world. Like others have said, it's not limited to children.

I personally would not have said anything. It would have to take some amount of noise for that to bother me. I can't say I've ever heard a baby laugh that I would describe as a shriek. Usually to me anyway it sounds more like an uncontrollable chuckle. Anyway the woman felt the need to go and say something and he stopped so fair enough.

gozunda

Olishi4 wrote: »

Ahh seriously, the father just probably got caught up in the moment and didn't even realise how loud they were being. Id say he was just a bit taken back by the woman coming over. Some people have a low tolerance for noise so it was a bit inconsiderate but not the end of the world. Like others have said, it's not limited to children.

I personally would not have said anything. It would have to take some amount of noise for that to bother me. I can't say I've ever heard a baby laugh that I would describe as a shriek. Usually to me anyway it sounds more like an uncontrollable chuckle. Anyway the woman felt the need to go and say something and he stopped so fair enough.

Like this perhaps?

https://youtu.be/xmLrPuToi9E

Looks like the issue is fairly widespread tbh ..

https://youtu.be/76joHX2IOFc

Olishi4

gozunda wrote: »

Like this perhaps?

https://youtu.be/xmLrPuToi9E

Doesn't sound like the reaction to a game of peekaboo!

gozunda

Olishi4 wrote: »

Doesn't sound like the reaction to a game of peekaboo!

But does sound like the OPS description of the noise the child in question made ..

The dad was playing a game where he hid behind a napkin and then peeped out and the baby would start shrieking with delight. This went on for about ten minutes and the screams were getting really ear piercing

roadrunner16

JustTheOne wrote: »

Go to a restaurant that doesn't allow kids if it bothers you.

Simple.

this seems relevant to your point


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/i-was-refused-by-d4-restaurant-in-case-my-little-girl-disturbed-diners-30930651.html

Olishi4

gozunda wrote: »

But does sound like the OPS description of the noise the child in question made ..

Ye ok in fairness it does so i can understand that. It would be a bit strange if the dad was encouraging it so yea I can see how that would be annoying.

goz83

Pac1Man wrote: »

Yowza! Usually it's only a few words or maybe a sentence, but a whole paragraph?! Maybe dial back the passive aggressiveness if you want people to be more sympathetic to your opinion.

Apparently the first time wasn't clear enough, so yes, an entire paragraph was dedicated to explaining what I meant, so not to confuse again.

gozunda wrote: »

I've checked and tbh no one said that ...

)

Someone did. He confirmed so much a minute after you posted. See below.

Pac1Man wrote: »

Yes lock them away, that's what I said.

Plenty of places for kids to enjoy themselves rather than an adult orientated eating place.



As you say, in Ireland we rarely have dedicated play areas. Parents should be aware of that.

Were you locked away as a child? I'm so sorry, because that would be one of two things that would explain your attitude. The other would be that you are just acting like a dick.

Not so much adult oriented are restaurants and cafes when the restaurant provides high chairs for babies. They are then "family friendly". If the place has a kids menu....well, then kids are welcome. Kids do make noise. If you go to a place like this, expect to hear children. If you dive into the ocean, you get wet.

I'm appalled by the intolerance of some posters here. Of course, some make good and valid points about parents attitudes and I agree, there must be a line drawn, but going by the op and the little amount of info given, the lady was out of order for approaching the father who was entertaining his child.

esforum

gozunda wrote: »

I think the point made was that adults go to restaurants for social reasons and to enjoy eating out ... babies are brought along with parents and whilst the they enjoy eating and gooing at things- they would just as happily eat and goo goo at anything anywhere ...

and adults can be happy eating at home with friends, again whats the point?

gozunda wrote: »

Parents here appear to have a terrible attitude / lack of consideration for others in public spaces

Because they think that they have a right to bring a human being to a restaurant? You have no more rights than the parent when in a restaurant. they arent bars, theres no signs prohibiting age.

gozunda wrote: »

Parents with children in many other countries in my experience do behave with consideration to others in restaurants, pubs etc (personally I do not like to see children in pubs)

In my experience they allow their children to run around like little lunatics until the early hours then bring them home.

Pubs in Ireland, yes. Abroad its fine.

Pac1Man wrote: »

Yes lock them away, that's what I said.

You implied they should not be in areas they dont NEED to be in.

Pac1Man wrote: »

Plenty of places for kids to enjoy themselves rather than an adult orientated eating place.

Restaurants are not adult orientated. They have child seats, childrens meals etc for a reason.

Pac1Man wrote: »

As you say, in Ireland we rarely have dedicated play areas. Parents should be aware of that.

agreed, they should be introduced.

HensVassal

EazyD wrote: »

I blame the parents solely in such scenarios. After all, kids are generally noisy whether happy or upset. I had one experience on an Aer Lingus flight where the toddler of the parents in front of me was restless and noisy for the duration of a 3 hour flight.

Not an issue as one could expect such but maybe half an hour before landing the child dunked a whole cup of tomato juice over me that the father had handed him. Hair/ Clothes saturated, bag etc. Of course I was unhappy but these things happen.

What really pissed me off was the lack of reaction or even shred of an apology from the parents for the inconvenience. Literally no acknowledgment. When I suggested such, the parents went off at me. It's this attitude with parents that really gets me. We appreciate you can do very little given the circumstances but at least show some mutual respect and consideration for others around you.

I blame....I blame....I blame

dr.fuzzenstein

roadrunner16 wrote: »

this seems relevant to your point


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/i-was-refused-by-d4-restaurant-in-case-my-little-girl-disturbed-diners-30930651.html

Over the years I have found out that the Irish seem to really, really hate children, more so than any other country I've been in. And of course trees and animals. As well as fish, the Brits, now the Germans (for bailing you out), the yanks, the sea, but most of all and above everything else, each other.
I've been here for over 20 years and i still don't get the place.

edit: I am not being entirely serious here.

Robsweezie

It happened at lunch the other day when I sat down for a sandwich. Two kids screaming wrestling and grabbing flowers from a display while the parents chatted away.

To me it's a form of noise pollution , but it's something you have to expect when sharing a public space. Accepting it? That's up to you. I didn't say anything and likely wouldn't.

I understand wanting peace and quiet after forking out a fortune for a nice restaurant.

Putin

goz83 wrote: »

As a father of 5, I would disagree with you. Entertaining a child most often prevents the crying most people cannot stand to listen to. Damage control.

Also known as contraception.....:pac:

ceadaoin.

gozunda wrote: »

But does sound like the OPS description of the noise the child in question made ..

No it doesn't. That's a kid screaming. The OP said this was a baby shrieking with delight.

That restaurant is very noisy in general. I can't believe someone went to the bother of filming it tbh. Relax and eat your food, maybe have some wine, for gods sake!

gozunda

esforum wrote: »

and adults can be happy eating at home with friends, again whats the point?

Read again - adults go out to enjoy eating out and socialise - babies are brought along by parents etc (+ what I said previously)

because they think that they have a right to bring a human being to a restaurant? You have no more rights than the parent when in a restaurant. they arent bars, theres no signs prohibiting age.

*The difference being parents 'should' be in charge of said children. They are not 'adults'. Parents need to act accordingly so other adults can enjoy their meals.

...Pubs in Ireland, yes. Abroad its fine.

Alcohol + drinking = no place for children

Restaurants are not adult orientated. They have child seats, childrens meals etc for a reason.

See * above

Why do you believe children should be allowed to run riot without parental control in restaurants?