Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2016, Mod Warning in OP, 10/7

BullBlackNova

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I must say that I am very satisfied with how Klopp has approached the question of assessing the squad. The decision to not bring in someone over the January window was disappointing at the time, but offers clear benefits at this stage. Everyone in the squad was given a chance and the volume of games has offered Klopp the opportunity to learn a huge amount about what he's got and what they need.

Given he approached things as he did, my suspicion is it won't be quite the radical deck cleaning some people expect. He'll understand very well the perils of changing too many players and I am hopeful the focus will on acquiring two or three quality players who go straight into the first XI rather than more project type nonsense.

You're probably right there. I am expecting a huge number of players to leave, though, because we have a really bloated squad as it is. Half a dozen players still out on loan who will make no impact to the first team if/when they come back (Wisdom, Balotelli, etc), plus the few first teamers who don't seem to be capable (Bogdan, Skrtel, Benteke, etc) so there'll be quite a few exits that will generate very little income and make very little difference to the first team.

I'd expect maybe 5/6 arrivals, including Matip and Gujic, and for the likes of Ward, Stewart, Smith, Flanagan, Brannagan, Ojo, etc to play a more prominent role next season. Rather than adding depth, I think Klopp will trust a lot of what is already there so any additions will be into the starting eleven, or the matchday 18 at worst really. I think his hand will be forced to sign a second CB now with the possibility of a ban for Sakho, but we'll have to see how that goes.

Something like this for next season then:

GK: New GK, Mignolet, Ward
RB: Clyne, Flanagan, Randall
LB: Moreno/New LB, Smith
CB: Lovren, Matip, Sakho/New CB, Toure (?), Gomez
CM: Henderson, Can, Stewart, Lucas, Grujic, Allen (?)
AM: New WG/AM, Coutinho, Firmino, Lallana, Milner, Markovic, Ibe, Ojo
FR: Sturridge, Ings, Origi, New ST

I know I'm missing a few players in there but it's not a major overhaul, just a reassessment in some areas. And, obviously, whether we get European football or not will be an important factor in determining squad size - the difference of maybe 10, 12 games next season.

mikeym

Henderson needs to go aswell.

He wasnt missed when he was injured and hes not a born leader like Steven Gerrard.

Hes ok and he would fit in well at Everton.

Utopia Parkway

mikeym wrote: »

Henderson needs to go aswell.

He wasnt missed when he was injured and hes not a born leader like Steven Gerrard.

Hes ok and he would fit in well at Everton.

Don't see the point in selling him to be honest. He's a good player when he's fit. Was rarely fully fit all season. Lots more I would get rid of ahead of him.

Agent Coulson

I wouldn't sell Henderson but I would take the club captaincy off him.

Harry Palmr

I think Henderson may yet end up leaving for his career. Obviously hard to know yet but Can and Milner are certain to stay, I think one of Lucas/Allen will remain add Grujic and NEW (Piotr Zielinski?) and that's 5 first team squad players for the central area. Throw in Stewart & Brannagan from the academy for cups and emergency cover.

Moving Hendo to a new position isn't likely to help - three AMs with Gotze a strong possibility, while he isn't a wide player by any measure.

edit Piotr Zielinski just scored for Empoli.

K-9

I'd see Henderson more as an AM if we signed another CM.

MD1990

Would like to see us target Morata. Reminds me a bit of Torres in his prime. Gotze for 20m is a good deal even if I'm not sure he is what we need. Kyrchowiak from Sevilla would be an excellent DM for us too.

8th place finish pretty embarrassing tbh. Disastrous league campaign

Gbear

mikeym wrote: »

Henderson needs to go aswell.

He wasnt missed when he was injured and hes not a born leader like Steven Gerrard.

Hes ok and he would fit in well at Everton.

We'd be some shower of retards if we sold Hendo.

The only people who want him gone have a bizarre spiteful attitude towards him. Even if he wasn't a shoe-in for our midfield, there are too many layers of stupidity in igoring his usefulness as a squad player to fathom.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Given he approached things as he did, my suspicion is it won't be quite the radical deck cleaning some people expect. He'll understand very well the perils of changing too many players and I am hopeful the focus will on acquiring two or three quality players who go straight into the first XI rather than more project type nonsense.

High in numbers but low in impact.
There's a bunch of peripheral and loan players that everyone knows won't have any impact next season and all they are is a resource to be plundered by being sold on.

Maybe Sakho's given the boot if he gets a huge ban. One of Lucas or Allen might go. Probably Skrtel and Benteke. Hopefully Balotelli.

After that it's oldies or academy players who've been lingering around without breaking through.

MentalMario

rob316 wrote: »

7 more points and we would have finished 4th. Looking at the last 4 games and teams we put out that was certainly achievable without the europa league. But klopp doesn't want 4th, klopp wants to win a trophy, you can't put 4th in a trophy cabinet, there is no medal for the players to cherish.

It's all or nothing Wednesday

If somebody told you at the start of the season, you had a one off game against a team that just finished 7th in Spain to get into the Champions League next year, what would you have said?

Wednesday is HUGE for the club. Forget about the cup and the medals, it's a way back into the main competition in Europe which with Klopp at the helm would mean we could get some real quality in.

BorneTobyWilde

RoboKlopp wrote: »

8th place finish pretty embarrassing tbh. Disastrous league campaign

Yea but if it was vital we could possibly have won today with first team.
We also thrashed Palace at home, United at home, Arsenal away and only took one point.
Then we have game at Southampton where we were cruising 0-2 only to change team and lose 3-2.
Plus we won only 3 of our first 8 league games under Rodgers. The gap to 4th is also very small.

Francie Barrett

RoboKlopp wrote: »

8th place finish pretty embarrassing tbh. Disastrous league campaign

Will be acceptable when we win the Europa this year and the Champions League next year.

BorneTobyWilde

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Yea but if it was vital we could possibly have won today with first team.
We also thrashed Palace at home, United at home, Arsenal away and only took one point.
Then we have game at Southampton where we were cruising 0-2 only to change team and lose 3-2.
Plus we won only 3 of our first 8 league games under Rodgers. The gap to 4th is also very small.

It'll matter little if we win Wednesday but if we lose its a disastrous season finishing outside the Europa places

Agent Coulson

Win or Lose on Wednesday the biggest trophy we got this year is Klopp as our manager.

BorneTobyWilde

Have to believe in victory
Its what Klopp is all about
Believing

mormank

MentalMario wrote: »

If somebody told you at the start of the season, you had a one off game against a team that just finished 7th in Spain to get into the Champions League next year, what would you have said?

Wednesday is HUGE for the club. Forget about the cup and the medals, it's a way back into the main competition in Europe which with Klopp at the helm would mean we could get some real quality in.

I would have said since we are granting wishes I would swap all of that just to get Jurgen Klopp as manager of Liverpool!!

daithijjj

We'd be complete mugs to sell Henderson. What i see is a player filling in where the club has neglected to purchase since Mascherano and Alonso left. He shouldnt be playing as deep as he does for us and needs to be moved up the pitch where his pressing for 90 mins and stamina can prove crucial like it did 2 years ago. This was obvious years ago. I'd guess some of the same folk who say they wouldnt miss him were arguing he was a right sided midfielder when he arrived and still fail to see the bigger picture with him.

We need a player to slot in beside Can and let Henderson do what he does best from 2 years ago. Allen played 100 games for this club and was virtually anonymous for most it, half a decent season and people are talking about a shiny new contract.

I'd say if i looked through the post history of those who wish for Henderson's departure i reckon i wouldnt have to go too far to find similar about Can or Firmino.

Grayditch

Regardless of where Seville are in the league, they have won the last 2 Europas. The game might be in Basel, but this final feels like it's in their back garden.

5starpool

Grayditch wrote: »

Regardless of where Seville are in the league, they have won the last 2 Europas. The game might be in Basel, but this final feels like it's in their back garden.

2/3 of the ground will be LFC fans I reckon.

ebbsy

Utd fans heading back home.







To Japan etc.

Turtyturd

If we can get someone who contributes to the football side of things while also running around a lot it would be an upgrade on Henderson and I would have no issue moving him on.


Allen's upturn in form I would say is a result of a manager knowing how to use him effectively when he isn't the focal point of the team.

5starpool

The Henderson criticism is a bit unfair I think. He has not been properly fit at all this season so it's hard to be at your best. If that Plainter Fascitis (or however you say it) is gone for next season I'd hope to see him back to how he was a couple of years ago. I don't think he'll be sold this summer.

I'd imagine this summer we'll see:
Matip (obviously)
Gotze or else someone who can play across the front line
Left back
Goalkeeper (hopefully)

The rest will probably be just what we have already with some of the excess trimmed and the likes of Skrtel gone as well. We might need another CB if Sakho gets longer than 6 months.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Harry Palmr wrote: »

I think Henderson may yet end up leaving for his career. Obviously hard to know yet but Can and Milner are certain to stay, I think one of Lucas/Allen will remain add Grujic and NEW (Piotr Zielinski?) and that's 5 first team squad players for the central area. Throw in Stewart & Brannagan from the academy for cups and emergency cover.

Moving Hendo to a new position isn't likely to help - three AMs with Gotze a strong possibility, while he isn't a wide player by any measure.

edit Piotr Zielinski just scored for Empoli.

Piotr Zieliński set to sign for Liverpool. Transfer to be finalised by Wednesday, according to @TSmokowski from @CANALPLUS_SPORT

https://twitter.com/DamianLFCpl/status/731925850585763842

Looking forward to midweek in earnest now.

Disappointing end to the league season today, tbh. I was expecting a push for 7th place to ensure European football next season but it wasn't to be.

On a positive note, though, our reserves are good enough to put up a good performance away in the league without any first team players and without a decent goalscorer.

3 or 4 players in to push first team regulars to the support cast and we should be in good enough shape next year to improve greatly on league performance and position next year.

5starpool

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Piotr Zieliński set to sign for Liverpool. Transfer to be finalised by Wednesday, according to @TSmokowski from @CANALPLUS_SPORT

https://twitter.com/DamianLFCpl/status/731925850585763842

Looking forward to midweek in earnest now.

Disappointing end to the league season today, tbh. I was expecting a push for 7th place to ensure European football next season but it wasn't to be.

On a positive note, though, our reserves are good enough to put up a good performance away in the league without any first team players and without a decent goalscorer.

3 or 4 players in to push first team regulars to the support cast and we should be in good enough shape next year to improve greatly on league performance and position next year.

Apparently confirmed on Polish TV today, no idea how true it is though.

Kerrigooney

What type of midfielder is Zielinski?

Agent Coulson

Henderson, Can, Grujic & Zielinski that's a young energetic central midfield that could be the future of the club for the next decade.

Then add in Allen, Lucas, Milner that's a whole lots of CM's.

Coutinho, Firmino, Lallana & Gotze is a whole lot of number 10's


We could be building two competitive teams in the squad.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Kerrigooney wrote: »

What type of midfielder is Zielinski?

http://www.skysports.ie/football/news/11669/10240132/who-is-liverpool-target-piotr-zielinski

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/118169

https://streamable.com/7n4m

Scoring today^^

5starpool

So if we win the EL, England lose one of their EL spots for next season, right? That means the FA Cup and 5th just qualify for it. Is that right?

corwill

5starpool wrote: »

So if we win the EL, England lose one of their EL spots for next season, right? That means the FA Cup and 5th just qualify for it. Is that right?

If Utd win the FA cup, then the "spare" EL place goes to WHU in 7th, so they'd be the ones deprived by a LFC win on Wednesday. If Palace win the cup and take the EL spot that way, then Saints would lose out in 6th spot.

The bollix in me is actually delighted by this.

Benimar

corwill wrote: »

If Utd win the FA cup, then the "spare" EL place goes to WHU in 7th, so they'd be the ones deprived by a LFC win on Wednesday. If Palace win the cup and take the EL spot that way, then Saints would lose out in 6th spot.

The bollix in me is actually delighted by this.

A Liverpool win has no impact on The number of spots. It would only impact if Liverpool had qualified for the EL through the league.

England have a guaranteed 3 teams in the EL, Man U, Southampton and either West Ham or Palace.

corwill

Benimar wrote: »

A Liverpool win has no impact on The number of spots. It would only impact if Liverpool had qualified for the EL through the league.

England have a guaranteed 3 teams in the EL, Man U, Southampton and either West Ham or Palace.

Spoilsport!

LuckyLloyd

5starpool wrote: »

So if we win the EL, England lose one of their EL spots for next season, right? That means the FA Cup and 5th just qualify for it. Is that right?

No?

Just gain a CL spot. No EL spots lost?

There's also the League Cup EL spot that City won't be using so 7th qualifies also?

5starpool

Benimar wrote: »

A Liverpool win has no impact on The number of spots. It would only impact if Liverpool had qualified for the EL through the league.

England have a guaranteed 3 teams in the EL, Man U, Southampton and either West Ham or Palace.

Ah right, I knew there was something that could have meant that England lost an EL spot. Thanks.

Umaro

I quite like the fact that it's Champions League or nothing.

Europa League has been great this year - but if you don't win it then you've played 6-15 extra games, likely dropping points in the subsequent league games, and whatever amount of extra injuries and fatigue you get too.

Here's our league record after EL games this season:

4W - 4D - 3L

(and a league cup final loss 3 days after Augsburg too)

Even the games against Chelsea and West Brom were pretty tepid as we fielded kids, or 1st team players went through the motions and tried to avoid injury.


Win the EL, and I'd say Klopp is a year ahead of schedule at getting us back into the CL.

Fail to win EL, and I think we'll have a really good shot at Top 4 next season. Klopp can work with a smaller squad, there'll be more time to train and prep for the weekend and we can have a real focus on being competitive in the league.

spockety

Umaro wrote: »

Fail to win EL, and I think we'll have a really good shot at Top 4 next season. Klopp can work with a smaller squad, there'll be more time to train and prep for the weekend and we can have a real focus on being competitive in winning the league.

Fixed

ebbsy

I think we are going to batter them on Wednesday.

Rosary beads out.

citytillidie

As of now.

Leicester are in the Champions league pot 1.
Arsenal and Spurs are also in the group stage
Man City in the play off.

5th spot Southampton/Man Utd are in the group stage of Europa Leauge
6th spot -Man Utd/Southampton have taken the League cup spot and are in the 3rd Qualifying round

If Liverpool win on Wednesday they join Leicester Arsenal and Spurs in the group stage of the Champions League, Man City will still be in the play off round.

If Man Utd win the FA Cup they will join Southampton in the Group stage of the Europa League and West Ham will take the League Cup spot of the 3rd Qualifying Round.

If Palace win the FA Cup they will join (5th Spot) in the Group stage of the Europa League and (6th spot) will be in the 3rd Qualifying round.

Man Utd can still finish top 4 with a record English win, they can also finish 5th so can swap them with Southampton if they get a point from game in hand


Only bad thing is if Liverpool miss out then there will be no climbing the rankings as the low points dropping off will be replaced by more low points

K-9

daithijjj wrote: »

We'd be complete mugs to sell Henderson. What i see is a player filling in where the club has neglected to purchase since Mascherano and Alonso left. He shouldnt be playing as deep as he does for us and needs to be moved up the pitch where his pressing for 90 mins and stamina can prove crucial like it did 2 years ago. This was obvious years ago. I'd guess some of the same folk who say they wouldnt miss him were arguing he was a right sided midfielder when he arrived and still fail to see the bigger picture with him.

We need a player to slot in beside Can and let Henderson do what he does best from 2 years ago. Allen played 100 games for this club and was virtually anonymous for most it, half a decent season and people are talking about a shiny new contract.

I'd say if i looked through the post history of those who wish for Henderson's departure i reckon i wouldnt have to go too far to find similar about Can or Firmino.

Exactly, if Henderson and even Allen are squad players, CL or not next season, well that means we have better options. I'd love to see Henderson in a more advanced role.

CM:
New CM/Can/one of Lucas or Allen/Henderson if needs be/Milner if really needs be
AM's:
Coutinho, Firmino, Lallana, Henderson, Milner, New AM

I kinda see why we might go for a new AM type.

So goalie, LB (ideally cover RB too), CB (cover Sakho and probably 1 of Toure/Skrtel going), CM, AM and striker to replace Mario and Benteke.

That would be ideal, whether we can do it in one window? Probably depends on CL. Qualify, we have to go all out, no European football we can probably be more patient.

K-9

Forgot Grujic!

5starpool

K-9 wrote: »

Forgot Grujic!

Me too. I'm sceptical that he will be anything more than a bit part player though next season, but I know next to nothing about him really.

Harry Palmr

Looks like a Polish Iniesta, lovely feet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBS6mtJbqWY

hefferboi

Not really the type of midfielder we need though.

Harry Palmr

hefferboi wrote: »

Not really the type of midfielder we need though.

Grujic is the battering ram

Grayditch

Likes to stay on his feet, anyway.

hefferboi

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Grujic is the battering ram

Will he get a lot of playing time? And is he good enough? I'd prefer to spend a lot and bring in an already top established battering ram.

Agent Coulson

Matip, Grujic & Zielinski costing about £17m combined is a good bit of business and if Gotze comes in for rumored £15m that's four players for less than Benteke.

Maybe we are learning how to do this transfer thing at last.

SlickRic

Dirk Kuyt. 35 year old Dirk Kuyt.
He's won the Eredivisie Player of the Year.

Some man.

K-9

If Ings turns into a mini Dirk we'll be doing all right.

Grayditch

Sometimes I play old Fifas just to score with Kuyt.

BorneTobyWilde

Mean while at Old Trafford