New EU roaming rates?

Bob24

TheDriver wrote: »

Wonder when we will hear from Tesco,meteor, Vodafone etc as to how they are implementing things, only short few weeksleft

Possibly last minute announcement. Just me trying to guess, but they might be waiting to see how Three's attempt to work around the rule works out for them.

Once they make an announcement it will be difficult to take it back , so if I was them I would be waiting to see if my competitor can get away with its attempt to circumvent the rule before fully committing to that rule myself.

Bob24

Orange in France just announced they are going beyond the EU requirements with customers not only allowed to use all their data allowance while travelling (i.e. no restriction based on twice the gross regulated data rates), but also they they are throwing in all European countries whether or not in the EU/EEA (so Switzerland is included).

Doubt we'll see anything like this from Irish networks aside from expensive contracts on Vodafone, but it goes to show that effective gross data rates are probably well below the regulated amounts and offering full allowances while roaming is financially possible even with large ones (Orange have sim-free contracts with large allowances for fairly reasonable prices - for example 30gb for 25 euros).

CiniO

Bob24 wrote: »

Orange in France just announced they are going beyond the EU requirements with customers not only allowed to use all their data allowance while travelling (i.e. no restriction based on twice the gross regulated data rates), but also they they are throwing in all European countries whether or not in the EU/EEA (so Switzerland is included).

Does that cover all European countries then like Albania, Moldova, Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Serbia, Bosnia, Kazakhstan, Georgia, etc????
If so - sounds a bit bizare.

Bob24

CiniO wrote: »

Does that cover all European countries then like Albania, Moldova, Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Serbia, Bosnia, Kazakhstan, Georgia, etc????
If so - sounds a bit bizare.

OK ... I double-check and it seems they mostly mean Switzerland on top of EU/EEA, fair point :-)

Exact map of covered areas:

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Bob24

Either that or the mapping skills of Orange's web design staff are limited :-)

I couldn't actually find a list written down rather than a map ...

Quackster

Same as Vodafone Ireland then which also applies EEA roaming rates to Switzerland.

Hopefully Vodafone will apply the same generosity to roaming in the UK when it leaves the EEA.

Stevek101

Vodafone going to honour the agreement fully.

https://www.vodafone.ie/roaming/#eu-roaming

From June 15, 2017, you can use your mobile plan in Europe just like you would at home for no extra cost.
So, you can touch base with home, discover things to do, and share those experiences without any worries.

Quackster

Stevek101 wrote: »

Vodafone going to honour the agreement fully.

https://www.vodafone.ie/roaming/#eu-roaming

Vodafone is not only honouring the agreement but actually going well beyond it.

Switzerland continues to be included even though it's not in the EEA.

Also, calls/texts to other Vodafone Ireland numbers while roaming are treated as domestic Vodafone calls/texts rather than as domestic other-network calls/texts.

This means if you have free Vodafone calls/texts on any Vodafone plan, you can use that when roaming. Unlike the free 3-to-3 calls with 3 AYCE...

ED E

They're doing it because it costs them next to nothing.

Majority-owned
Albania
Czech Republic
Germany
Greece
Hungary
Ireland
Italy
Malta
Netherlands
North Cyprus
Portugal
Romania
Spain
Turkey
UK

Partner networks
Austria Belgium
Bulgaria Channel Islands
Croatia Cyprus
Denmark Estonia
Finland Faroe Islands
Iceland Latvia
Lithuania Luxembourg
Macedonia Norway
Russia Serbia
Slovenia Sweden
Switzerland Ukraine

Its RED Roaming with a bump. They've always had that size advantage.

Bob24

Excellent. For people who travel in Europe regularily they will possibly offer better value than other networks (which is not often the case!)

stoksyXL

Anyone know if this new Vodafone roaming is for both bill pay and pay as you go?

I'm on pay as you go with them, would love to know if this is available for me or for bill pay customers only.

Bob24

As I read it, it is for everyone except bill pay mobile broadband customers.

Stevek101

Detail from the link

Pay as you go customers
From June 15 all PAYG Mobile Broadband customers will be able to use their full domestic allowance of data when roaming in Europe at no extra cost.
Bill pay customers*
From June 15, Bill pay customers - depending on their plan - will be able to use either their full, or a proportion of, their domestic allowance when roaming in Europe at no extra cost.
Bill pay customers will receive an SMS (sent to their Mobile Broadband dashboard) confirming the allowance of data they will be able to use in Europe at no extra cost. They will also be able to view the allowance on My Vodafone, as well as on their bill.
Data usage over these amounts when travelling in Europe will be charged as per your home out-of-bundle rates.
*Mobile Broadband plans with a current domestic allowance of 50Gb or more will remain only available to use in Ireland.

Bob24

btw I was thinking ... Vodafone's announcement is not only good new for their customers but also for peopel using other networks, as sets and precedent and shows full roaming allowance is possible in the Irish context. The need to remain competitive will pressure Three and Meteor not to try and crush the rules as much as they can more than ComReg would ever had.

MBSnr

Bob24 wrote: »

btw I was thinking ... Vodafone's announcement is not only good new for their customers but also for peopel using other networks, as sets and precedent and shows full roaming allowance is possible in the Irish context. The need to remain competitive will pressure Three and Meteor not to try and crush the rules as much as they can more than ComReg would ever had.

As ED E says though, they are have presence in nearly every country involved and their price plans are that bit more expensive enough to give them the cushion to absorb costs.

I do agree though, that this should at least perhaps help the other operators step up, since even the MVNO ID Mobile is also offering more than the basic data allowance when roaming.

ED E

Eircom Group cant compete.

Three could, by buying more networks. But then we'll have a two party system all over europe...

They have a start anyways:

Hong Kong, Australia, Austria, Denmark, Indonesia, Ireland, Italy, Macau, Sweden, United Kingdom

Bob24

MBSnr wrote: »

As ED E says though, they are have presence in nearly every country involved and their price plans are that bit more expensive enough to give them the cushion to absorb costs.

I do agree though, that this should at least perhaps help the other operators step up, since even the MVNO ID Mobile is also offering more than the basic data allowance when roaming.

Yes for sure, these new rules will favour large multinational conglomerates for whom offering Europe wide rates is easier and cheaper.

But having said that consumers don't care and competitive pressure will still push national networks to try and offer similar service.

Bob24

Back to Vodafone, I was trying to push their reps to see if there are exceptions for some allowances (as Three are doing), but they seem pretty adament that any data allowance you have in Ireland will also be fully useable in Europe no matter what: http://www.boards.ie/ttfpost/103455150

Fair play to them, I have to say I am surprised they are making it so hassle-free (and even happier with my recent move from Three to Vodafone).

Bob24

ED E wrote: »

Eircom Group cant compete.

Three could, by buying more networks. But then we'll have a two party system all over europe...

They have a start anyways:

I would actually be curious to know what data roaming rates Eircom is paying when their customers are using another European network. Surely and as you said their cost structure for this will be more expensive than Vodafone Ireland's when its customers are using other European Vodafone networks. But still I assume in most cases Eircom is paying much less than the maximum regulated gross rates.

I think in the medium term the likes of Eircom in each country will have to build some kind of Europe-wide alliance of national networks and agree on special cheap deals for each other within that alliance to remain competitive with cross border networks such as Vodafone, Telefonica, or Orange.

ED E

They're so tiny they really dont have a bargaining position. Vodafone have 140M subs, Eir/Meteor is probably 0.5M (havent checked). UK networks with 10M subs can create competition for roaming business, small fry get the listed price I would assume.

Europe-wide alliance of national networks and agree on special cheap deals

There aren't national networks as much anymore. The real problem anyways is the disparity between countries. PL/CZ have 4-5 less income and 4-5 cheaper MNOs. They've little cash, but 50M+ users that are connected by road and rail to the rest of europe. Szczecin you've got ?6/mo as a normal deal, 20km away over the German border thats ?18-21/mo.

Trying to homogenize pricing across these areas is an exercise in stupidity.

Bob24

ED E wrote: »

They're so tiny they really dont have a bargaining position. Vodafone have 140M subs, Eir/Meteor is probably 0.5M (havent checked). UK networks with 10M subs can create competition for roaming business, small fry get the listed price I would assume.

So you think they are paying the full EU regulated wholesale prices? I really doubt so, it must be in their mutual interest to negotiate bi-lateral reduced rates with other local operators (which are not their competitors because they operate in another country but with whom they can be mutually useful trading partners).

ED E wrote: »

There aren't national networks as much anymore. The real problem anyways is the disparity between countries. PL/CZ have 4-5 less income and 4-5 cheaper MNOs. They've little cash, but 50M+ users that are connected by road and rail to the rest of europe. Szczecin you've got ?6/mo as a normal deal, 20km away over the German border thats ?18-21/mo.

Trying to homogenize pricing across these areas is an exercise in stupidity.

I'm talking EU-wide alliance of national operators (as in those networks which operate in just one or a small number of countries) for wholesale roaming only (i.e. each of them remaining fully independent but taking part in a roaming deal to access each other's network at reduced costs so that the EU regulation doesn't kill their cost structure compared to continent-wide competitors). Of couse not homogenising all consumer prices everywhere which indeed doesn't make sense.

It must be in their interest to give each other discounts so that they can compete with continent-wide competitors. For exemple through that alliance Meteor could have cheaper access to the likes of KPN in the Netherland or GO in Malta in exchange for giving them cheaper access to its own network (they are all very different companies of different sizes and are not competitors as they all only operate in their home country but what they have in common is they are all competing with a local branch of Vodafone: giving each other discounted roaming rates helps them control their roaming costs compared to these Vodafone branches which as your correctly pointed out can otherwise easily drastically undercut them due to their multinational organisation).

ED E

Not saying they're paying the regulated price, but your roaming partnerships are no doubt impacted by how much the host networks want you sweet roaming rates.


There arent many national operators. Where do Irish people tend to go? Spain and France where the big lads rule the roost. Even Fenno-Scandia has the multinationals.


When you regulate that prices should be the same at home and away, what the EU are doing, you're homogenizing pricing to a large extent.


Its kinda like an insurance policy, paying every day for the odd day when you need something extra. Most of us will now just pay extra for something we under utilize and subsidise jetsetters.

JaCrispy

48 Months are one of the first budget phone operators to release details regarding the new EU roaming tariffs

https://ec.europa.eu/digital-single-...oaming-tariffs

Interestingly they are only allowing full data roaming on their cheapest package....the Guido (1GB of data, 300 mins mobile and unlimited texts)
They aren't offering it on their higher end packages. Wonder why.

https://community.48months.ie/t5/Mos...m-p/44774#M229

khamilto

JaCrispy wrote: »

48 Months are one of the first budget phone operators to release details regarding the new EU roaming tariffs

https://ec.europa.eu/digital-single-...oaming-tariffs

Interestingly they are only allowing full data roaming on their cheapest package....the Guido (1GB of data, 300 mins mobile and unlimited texts)
They aren't offering it on their higher end packages. Wonder why.

https://community.48months.ie/t5/Mos...m-p/44774#M229

They're offering no roaming whatsoever on their other plans.

Either 48 changes their mind, or Comreg (with the Commission planting a foot firmly up their behind) takes regulatory action.

I'm glad the Commission has been so public on national operators not trying to get around the new Roaming rules, as Comreg have shown themselves to be utterly disinterested at tackling bad behaviour by mobile phone networks in Ireland.

Atlantic Dawn

The public needs to give the operators a kick in the hole too and boycott/leave any provider not operating within the rules.

khamilto

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

The public needs to give the operators a kick in the hole too and boycott/leave any provider not operating within the rules.

And go where? Vodafone are as uncompetitive on price as ever (if not more so) and seem to rely on billpay+older customers who are unaware just how bad a deal PAYG is.

Meteor (and the wider Eircom group) is without parallel in Ireland for having the worst customer service. Reading a random thread on their talk to forum on Boards will generally leave one feeling a strange melange of disgust and defeat (most likely what the OP feels too), and they are ever in the news getting fined for breaking the rules. I should add, they once told me by e-mail, by letter and over the phone that they had no legal obligation to repair the phone I had bought 6 weeks prior on contract from them.

Three have been playing shenanigans with increasing their PAYG prices and trying to get around EU roaming regs.

Who knows what any of the MVNOs will do, though if Virgin Mobile implements EU regs then I will most likely go to them.

Bob24

khamilto wrote: »

They're offering no roaming whatsoever on their other plans.

Either 48 changes their mind, or Comreg (with the Commission planting a foot firmly up their behind) takes regulatory action.

I'm glad the Commission has been so public on national operators not trying to get around the new Roaming rules, as Comreg have shown themselves to be utterly disinterested at tackling bad behaviour by mobile phone networks in Ireland.

I believe not offering roaming is allowed by the regulation.

I could be wrong and stand to be corrected, but what I remember from reading the initial drafts is that it just says that if roaming service is offered it has to follow the price guidelines. I don't seem to remember it saying roaming has to be provided.

PAKNET

JaCrispy wrote: »

48 Months are one of the first budget phone operators to release details regarding the new EU roaming tariffs

https://ec.europa.eu/digital-single-...oaming-tariffs

Interestingly they are only allowing full data roaming on their cheapest package....the Guido (1GB of data, 300 mins mobile and unlimited texts)
They aren't offering it on their higher end packages. Wonder why.

https://community.48months.ie/t5/Mos...m-p/44774#M229

iD have already announced their roaming plans:
https://www.idmobile.ie/whatischanging

As the last poster mentioned, it's not a requirement to offer a roaming service outside the home country for a priceplan - that's perfectly within the regulations both now and after June.

The regulations only cover where roaming IS offered outside the home country then it must adhere to the new regulations.

JaCrispy

PAKNET wrote: »

iD have already announced their roaming plans:
https://www.idmobile.ie/whatischanging

Thanks for that. Looks like a really good plan, 4G, 30GB of data and 3.3 GB for EU roaming for 7.50 a month. Instead of 48 months which is 3G, 1GB of data and 1GB for EU roaming for a tenner a month.