Census.

vicwatson

sadie06 wrote: »

Despite you putting this forward as an accusation, that is exactly what I am saying. There is no :'Catholic, but not by the Catholic Church's Standards' box though. There is only 'No religion'.

I was baptised, made my first Holy Communion, was confirmed, married in a church. I attend (and enjoy) mass once a month and for major feast days. I attend religious Choral events. I pray quietly, but not ritualistically with my family.

Given all of the above, do you really think I should have ticked 'No Religion'.

Well you aren't catholic anyway, if you were you'd go to hear the eucharist every week.

Do you believe in Transubstantiation? Do you believe Mary was actually a virgin?

LordSutch

Question: 14
Can you speak Irish?

But what exactly does that mean?

Yes, I can speak Irish (but only about ten words)? or Yes I can speak Irish, but only the Cupla Focal?

Admittedly I can speak a few words of Irish, so does that mean a Yes in box 14

GLaDOS

I just ticked no for the speaking Irish question. I have a few words and phrases but could not hold any sort of conversation. That doesn't count as speaking a language.

sadie06

The Irish question is annoying also! There was nothing to distinguish between myself (can understand a lot, and speak far less) and my children, who are fluent in Irish!

ixoy

keano_afc wrote: »

I saw one particularly nasty image saying "If you voted YES (the Yes was in rainbow colours indicating they referring to the marriage referendum) then you must vote No!" Its bullying, pure and simple.

How is it possibly bullying when the census is confidential? Nobody will know what you put down. And it was an image on a site, hardly someone intimidating you. Not exactly nasty by any standard definition..

Seriously, the primary campaign is to ask you to just think about your answer, that's it. Even David Quinn wanted honest answers.

LordSutch

ScienceNerd wrote: »

I just ticked no for the speaking Irish question. I have a few words and phrases but could not hold any sort of conversation. That doesn't count as speaking a language.

The question (No 14) is as clear as mud.

sadie06

vicwatson wrote: »

Well you aren't catholic anyway, if you were you'd go to hear the eucharist every week.

Do you believe in Transubstantiation? Do you believe Mary was actually a virgin?

You did read the last line of my post, yes?

keano_afc

ixoy wrote: »

How is it possibly bullying when the census is confidential? Nobody will know what you put down. And it was an image on a site, hardly someone intimidating you. Not exactly nasty by any standard definition..

Seriously, the primary campaign is to ask you to just think about your answer, that's it. Even David Quinn wanted honest answers.

There's nothing wrong with a campaign asking you to analyse your answer. Its a different scenario when people like Roisin Ingle are coming out warning of false consequences if you dare to claim allegiance to a faith. The question could have been phrased better, but the scaremongering designed to push people to the "no religion" option was over the top.

intheclouds

sadie06 wrote: »

Despite you putting this forward as an accusation, that is exactly what I am saying. There is no :'Catholic, but not by the Catholic Church's Standards' box though. There is only 'No religion'.

I was baptised, made my first Holy Communion, was confirmed, married in a church. I attend (and enjoy) mass once a month and for major feast days. I attend religious Choral events. I pray quietly, but not ritualistically with my family.

Given all of the above, do you really think I should have ticked 'No Religion'.

I really did not intend it to be an accusation, it was simply a question.

If you perceived it as an accusation then you need to look inwards to find out the reason why.

Do I think you should have ticked No Religion? No - I think you should have ticked whatever you wanted to tick.

The question needs reframing imo and until it is reframed people are going to continue to choose Catholic when they are not Catholic.

Speedwell

Atheist here... my rule of thumb is that if you get upset when you think about checking a box, it is not the right box for you. If you get upset at any box, check the one that you are least upset about. Life is too short. The Census guidelines themselves say to think about how you identify today rather than how you were brought up, anyway, so the Catholics can think of some other way to inflate their membership rolls than to act like a crazy girlfriend who won't admit the relationship is over.

If you pray and practice and worship, you are religious. Pick the religion closest to the way you pray and practice and worship and no reasonable person can disagree with you. If you pray and practice and worship and don't mean a word of it for reals, then my unsolicited opinion is that you are a "no religion", but do whatever you feel comfortable with.

sadie06

intheclouds wrote: »

I really did not intend it to be an accusation, it was simply a question.

It was a rhetorical question, surely. The answer is obvious. Therefore, it was not 'simply a question', but more of a statement.

CabanSail

I did not get a Census form.

I will not fill it out.

uck51js9zml2yt

I didn't tick anything for the religious denomination box as I wasn't included.I had to write in the lines provided for other.
How can I kick up a stink for being excluded ?










I really don't have any hangups over it

uck51js9zml2yt

CabanSail wrote: »

I did not get a Census form.

I will not fill it out.

Congrats for living in a foreign country

MrMorooka

mariaalice wrote: »

I could make a reasonable attempt at an Irish conversation, so what to say about speaking Irish is difficult.

I do think it would be a better idea to have some levels of speaking languages and not just a binary "speak/not speak". Mówię po polsku dość dobrze, but I don't speak it well enough to declare officially that I "speak it at home".

Personally I think it is intentionally made muddy so as to inflate statistics for number of Irish speakers- people will tend to say Yes because they know a few words and can read road signs and things.

Harry Palmr

Just had mine collected, all she did was check it was signed off. I'm sure in the past they'll had a quick look through. Maybe as this is a "repeat" census ie not the 10 year one where they add new or tweaked questions they have been told to just get them back in quickly. Doing it on the cheap.

uck51js9zml2yt

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Just had mine collected, all she did was check it was signed off. I'm sure in the past they'll had a quick look through. Maybe as this is a "repeat" census ie not the 10 year one where they add new or tweaked questions they have been told to just get them back in quickly. Doing it on the cheap.

She has about 500 forms to collect in 2 weeks. Maybe try it next time and let's know how you get on!

intheclouds

sadie06 wrote: »

It was a rhetorical question, surely. The answer is obvious. Therefore, it was not 'simply a question', but more of a statement.

How is the answer obvious? Im not a Catholic so Im not sure if the Catholic Church considers you to be a Catholic unless you are a "full participant" (for want of a better expression).

Maybe they do? They seem happy enough to marry and baptise the children of people who never see the inside of a church otherwise. And it helps bump their numbers.

Or maybe they dont? I dont know - thats why I asked.

But thanks for telling me categorically that my question wasnt a question. Its nice when you know better than me what Im thinking.

Joe prim

cherryghost wrote: »

I have a visitor in my household tonight but shes a tourist from outside ireland. Do i put her down?

Certainly not,( unless she's in unbearable pain and looking up at you with big frightened eyes)-Just write her details on the form.

daheff

intheclouds wrote: »

So you are not a Catholic by the Catholic Churches standards?

intheclouds wrote: »

How is the answer obvious? Im not a Catholic so Im not sure if the Catholic Church considers you to be a Catholic unless you are a "full participant" (for want of a better expression).

I'm born a catholic, pushed through the whole school catholic cycle thing...but i dont see myself as a catholic.

I dont identify with any one religion, but I do see myself as believing in a higher being. I put myself as being other, with the named religion as being other.


I found the questions to be very ambiguous on the whole.

Also whats the point in asking where I work? or my job title.

sadie06

intheclouds wrote: »

But thanks for telling me categorically that my question wasnt a question. Its nice when you know better than me what Im thinking.

I don't need to ask what you ticked for the 'do you have a sense of drama' question.

intheclouds

sadie06 wrote: »

I don't need to ask what you ticked for the 'do you have a sense of drama' question.

You seem very defensive about the whole Catholic/No Religion thing - why is that?

intheclouds

daheff wrote: »

Also whats the point in asking where I work? or my job title.

Do you have a personal computer? Eh yes, several including various phones, tablets - even my tv is a smart tv!

RayM

I thought some of the questions were a bit complicated.

Eugene Norman

I said no religion. If they had lapsed Catholic I'd have picked that.

kneemos

daheff wrote: »

I'm born a catholic, pushed through the whole school catholic cycle thing...but i dont see myself as a catholic.

I dont identify with any one religion, but I do see myself as believing in a higher being. I put myself as being other, with the named religion as being other.


I found the questions to be very ambiguous on the whole.

Also whats the point in asking where I work? or my job title.

The definition of a Catholic and what a religious belief is is extremely ambiguous.

FishOnABike

GT_TDI_150 wrote: »

My missus filled out our form few weeks back, she also filled out her parent one and her uncles one ( glutenfor punichment), so ive no idea of the exact questions on the form BUT those with temporary overseas visitors .... why are ye drawing extra work upon yourselves? Surely u just leave them off the form ie nothing to see here kinda job?!?


My brkther the cheeky fecker went home for the weekend so my parents had to add him on their form

Was there a question about coeliac disease? I must look at the form again I can't remember seeing one on it.:D

LordSutch

daheff wrote: »

I'm born a catholic, pushed through the whole school catholic cycle thing...but i dont see myself as a catholic.

I suspect you were born of no religion until you're parents had you baptised as a Roman Catholic, hence you grew up in that religious tradition ..... and now I guess you're a lapsed Catholic.

smash

I fcuked up 3 or 4 questions and just scribbled them out.

Achasanai

sadie06 wrote: »

I was baptised, made my first Holy Communion, was confirmed, married in a church. I attend (and enjoy) mass once a month and for major feast days. I attend religious Choral events. I pray quietly, but not ritualistically with my family.

Given all of the above, do you really think I should have ticked 'No Religion'.

The other option would be to tick 'other' and use a term that you feel more comfortable with ('a la cart Catholic, for example, or even 'Christian' if you don't have any particular affinity with the technical aspects of Roman Catholicism). But it seems like, given the choice between Catholic and None you chose Catholic, which would have been the right answer from what I understand the census wants to know.

darced

This post has been deleted.

Samaris

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I am pretty sure that that's a no-no.

CFlat

Samaris wrote: »

I am pretty sure that that's a no-no.

Do they not take a quick look through it to make sure you haven't left anything blank?

Duckworth_Luas

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

The enumerator will check that you have filled out the form correctly when you hand it over to them. They wont read it though.

CFlat

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

The enumerator will check that you have filled out the form correctly when you hand it over to them. They wont read it though.

Yea ok. Probably wrote that wrong. I meant just a quick check so nothing has been omitted as opposed to reading it.

Samaris

Aah, okay, that makes more sense. I was picturing an enumerator reading through your form and making comments on the doorstep!

CFlat

Samaris wrote: »

Aah, okay, that makes more sense. I was picturing an enumerator reading through your form and making comments on the doorstep!

He'd be less then interested in my life!!

darced

This post has been deleted.

Samaris

You'd think you know how to spell your daughter's name (although I suppose it might have a weird spelling!) but "Is no religion your intended choice"? Sod off, it's right down at the bottom underneath all the other options and to select it accidentally would require an earthquake while the pen is poised!

dundalkfc10

Mine hasn't been picked up yet!

Augme

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Mine hasn't been picked up yet!

Each enumerator has 400 houses to cover, they wouldn't be collecting all those forms in one night.

darced

This post has been deleted.

dundalkfc10

Augme wrote: »

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Mine hasn't been picked up yet!

Well I'm off on holidays tonight, and won't be back for a month so best of luck to him or her trying to get it

Each enumerator has 400 houses to cover, they wouldn't be collecting all those forms in one night.

Add your reply here.

Witchie

Was a bit mad here, my parents both turned 70 recently so we all went away for a family weekend. This meant that my aunt and her Dutch husband were staying here before returning to France this morning and my younger brother and little sister were both home from Scotland where they lived. So basically my parents had 4 people who don't live in this country to account for.

My uncle was horrified by it all. Apparently it is not the done thing in the Netherlands.

uck51js9zml2yt

For those wondering what happens the forms when collected.

They are tallied by the enumerator who provides the CSO a summary sheet.
Number of forms, number of males/females. This information is on the front page of the form.

Everything is returned to the CSO and its scanned in and the computers digest the data and provide the figures. According to the CSO person on the news tonight they aim for 365,000 forms per day.

sadie06

intheclouds wrote: »

You seem very defensive about the whole Catholic/No Religion thing - why is that?

Now that's a question!

Allinall

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Add your reply here.

Reply added here.

Stick the form in an envelope... Write Freepost. CSO
and throw it into a postbox on your way to the airport.

Job done.

ixoy

Sofia Shrilling Windjammer wrote: »

Everything is returned to the CSO and its scanned in and the computers digest the data and provide the figures. According to the CSO person on the news tonight they aim for 365,000 forms per day.

365,000 forms a day... So why does it take six months in total, even including rounding it up and shipping?

And why does it then take so long for the figures to come out? The data set involved isn't big by any stretch and we've plenty of analytical tools tools out there. Are they doing it in Excel on somebody's PC?

Speedwell

ixoy wrote: »

365,000 forms a day... So why does it take six months in total, even including rounding it up and shipping?

And why does it then take so long for the figures to come out? The data set involved isn't big by any stretch and we've plenty of analytical tools tools out there. Are they doing it in Excel on somebody's PC?

I would give a job of this size a minimum of six months. Collecting, sorting, data entry, people not responding, errors, correcting errors... it's definitely a case of "the first 80 percent of the job takes 80 percent of the time, and the last 20 percent of the job takes the other 80 percent of the time". "Aiming" at 365K forms a day is a goal, not necessarily a realistic expectation.

Probably the reason it takes so long for the the figures to come out is because analysis requires more than just an Excel pie chart and reporting requires more than a sheet of paper with numbers on it. The gathered data has to be evaluated against various measures of internal consistency and unusual trends noted so that possible errors or misunderstandings can be caught before they cause problems. It has to be sifted and sorted and cross-checked. Analysts need to cross-reference all of the variables against each other in pairs and multiples. They need to document their conclusions using professional tools and templates. Decisions need to be made about what the most important findings are, and then decisions need to be made about how the findings are reported to the media. You can lie with data more easily than you can tell the truth with it, if only because it is so easy to misread the data and accidentally mislead yourself.

This is a horrendously complex job and it requires skill and tact.

Tigger

Speedwell wrote: »

I would give a job of this size a minimum of six months. Collecting, sorting, data entry, people not responding, errors, correcting errors... it's definitely a case of "the first 80 percent of the job takes 80 percent of the time, and the last 20 percent of the job takes the other 80 percent of the time". "Aiming" at 365K forms a day is a goal, not necessarily a realistic expectation.

Probably the reason it takes so long for the the figures to come out is because analysis requires more than just an Excel pie chart and reporting requires more than a sheet of paper with numbers on it. The gathered data has to be evaluated against various measures of internal consistency and unusual trends noted so that possible errors or misunderstandings can be caught before they cause problems. It has to be sifted and sorted and cross-checked. Analysts need to cross-reference all of the variables against each other in pairs and multiples. They need to document their conclusions using professional tools and templates. Decisions need to be made about what the most important findings are, and then decisions need to be made about how the findings are reported to the media. You can lie with data more easily than you can tell the truth with it, if only because it is so easy to misread the data and accidentally mislead yourself.

This is a horrendously complex job and it requires skill and tact.

I'd believe you k ow what you are talking about with all the numbers and stuff of the job didn't take 160% of the time