Hillsborough Inquest Verdict

Fratton Fred

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Heysel and Hillsborough are very different issues.

Hillsborough is comparable with the disasters at Burnden and Ibrox. What made Hillsborough worse, apart simply from the numbers, was the way in which the police were complicit, the lies and cover ups that must have compounded the incredible grief.

Hillsborough and Heysel are similar in as far as the unlawful killing verdict goes.

The only relevance though, is that Heysel gave the police an excuse to blame the fans.

acquiescefc

Im sorry but Heysel wasnt a factor in this. Heysel was a tragedy of a hooligan element that always existed in the English game not specific to Liverpool, especially abroad. Going to away matches were tricky affairs. Football supporters were treated as mindless thugs, caged animals because lets be honest some of them were hence the fences.
The authorities knew they could do what they wanted(Orgreave etc), and did that, when a number of horrendous decisions were made and subsequently covered up.

El Weirdo

SYP Chief Constable suspended.

David Crompton has been suspended as chief constable of South Yorkshire police, in the fallout from the Hillsborough inquest unlawful killing verdicts.
Crompton’s force had been criticised for its conduct during the inquest which delivered a damning verdict on Tuesday.

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/apr/27/south-yorkshire-police-chief-suspended-over-hillsborough-verdict

CSF

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

I was just about to post this.

One poster, and anyone else with those views should be ashamed of themselves.

Remember being a kid watching the news unfold

My da a Newcastle fan me a United fan my bro an arsenal fan and we were all shocked seeing the mayhem unfold that day.

I have no love for the pool as a United fan but I feel your clubs pain.

Still don't get why what teams you and your family support have any bearing on your feelings on the unnecessary deaths of 96 people. Weird post.

Jayop

CSF wrote: »

Still don't get why what teams you and your family support have any bearing on your feelings on the unnecessary deaths of 96 people. Weird post.

Because it was a football issue and he was saying that despite the clubs differences he shows solidarity with the Liverpool fans over this issue. Nothing weird about it as it explains why something as sad as this transcends football rivalries for most same minded people.

CSF

Jayop wrote: »

Because it was a football issue and he was saying that despite the clubs differences he shows solidarity with the Liverpool fans over this issue. Nothing weird about it as it explains why something as sad as this transcends football rivalries for most same minded people.

You'd have to be a sociopath to not be horrified and saddened by the unnecessary death of 96 people. The football side just doesn't come into it. Comes across as a real 'look at me I support the rival team and still manage to have basic human feelings' in a real negative self-promoting way IMO. You're not saddened by what happened that day as a Liverpool or a United fan, or Barca or Tokyo Verdy, you're saddened by what happened as a normal human being who finds 96 people dying anywhere in the world to be a horrible loss to the world.

Rant over.

Jayop

CSF wrote: »

You'd have to be a sociopath to not be horrified and saddened by the unnecessary death of 96 people. The football side just doesn't come into it. Comes across as a real 'look at me I support the rival team and still manage to have basic human feelings' in a real negative self-promoting way IMO. You're not saddened by what happened that day as a Liverpool or a United fan, or Barca or Tokyo Verdy, you're saddened by what happened as a normal human being who finds 96 people dying anywhere in the world to be a horrible loss to the world.

Rant over.

I'd generally agree but you only have to look at some of the postings online to show that a lot of people can't put their rivalries to one side no matter how tragic the events. Showing support and solidarity isn't a bad thing because it can help drown out the posts from those muppets who are unable to.

CSF

Jayop wrote: »

I'd generally agree but you only have to look at some of the postings online to show that a lot of people can't put their rivalries to one side no matter how tragic the events. Showing support and solidarity isn't a bad thing because it can help drown out the posts from those muppets who are unable to.

Yeah those people are subhuman but I don't think that justifys those sort of self-promoting posts 'look at me I'm a United fan and am still amnt happy to see 96 Liverpool fans for posts'. Weird like and there's been a few. Agree to disagree though because I really shouldn't be letting a page of this thread get bogged down by this sort of discussion in the first place. Just annoys me is all.

mansize

SYP getting it in the neck now- talking back the apology and obfuscation during the trail

Today in the commons was telling Burnnham held nothing back

Dempsey

Crazy that it took 27 years for it to reach this point. Delighted for the victims families that they may now get some closure but I wouldnt be happy until all those guilty of criminal negligence and conspiring to cover it up see the inside of a jail cell. Horrible bastards deserve nothing less.

LuckyLloyd

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/28/hillsborough-six-suspects-face-criminal-charges-disaster-prosecutors/

Hillsborough match commander David Duckenfield, former chief constable Sir Norman Bettison and four other people are to be prosecuted over offences relating to the Hillsborough disaster.

The Crown Prosecution Service announced that Duckenfield is to be charged with the manslaughter by gross negligence of 95 of the 96 Liverpool FC fans who died at the FA Cup semi-final in 1989 and Bettison has been charged with four counts of misconduct in public office.

Sue Hemming, head of the CPS's special crime division, said former South Yorkshire Police officers Donald Denton and Alan Foster, as well as force solicitor Peter Metcalf, are charged with doing acts with intent to pervert the course of justice. Former Sheffield Wednesday secretary Graham Mackrell is also charged with three offences relating to health and safety at sports grounds.

Finally.

Claude Burgundy

I am Utd to the core, but i remember that day, i remember those families and today I threw a fist in the air when i saw the news.

A great day for the families, the club, the players from that day and the supporters.

SEPT 23 1989

Duckenfield should do his time in Walton

ricero

Claude Burgundy wrote: »

I am Utd to the core, but i remember that day, i remember those families and today I threw a fist in the air when i saw the news.

A great day for the families, the club, the players from that day and the supporters.

So what if you are utd to the core ? As a fan of football or more as a human being everyone should be happy with justice finally happening. When people die tribal ****e should be put aside

DARK-KNIGHT

ricero wrote: »

So what if you are utd to the core ? As a fan of football or more as a human being everyone should be happy with justice finally happening. When people die tribal ****e should be put aside

was his post basically just saying he is united to the core but that is all put to the side...

ricero

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

was his post basically just saying he is united to the core but that is all put to the side...

Who cares what team we support ? Dunno why people need the gratification.


Anyway hopefully the trials go to court asap and these bastards spend the remainder of their lives behind bars

ricero

ricero wrote: »

Who cares what team we support ? Dunno why people need the gratification.


Anyway hopefully the trials go to court asap and these bastards spend the remainder of their lives behind bars

I'd be surprised if all get custodial sentences, probably 1 or 2 and it'll be less than a year in a low risk, semi-open place. That's if they're all convicted.

ricero

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'd be surprised if all get custodial sentences, probably 1 or 2 and it'll be less than a year in a low risk, semi-open place. That's if they're all convicted.

The manslaughter of 95 people for duckingfield. There would be riots if he got a sentence so leniant

ricero

ricero wrote: »

The manslaughter of 95 people for duckingfield. There would be riots if he got a sentence so leniant

It's been nearly 30 years and there's been no rioting while he's been out and about enjoying his life.
If he is convicted (massive if) a quick glance around suggests the sentencing range is in the couple of years range in other cases. The number of deaths for sentencing purposes is, unfortunately, fairly irrelevant in practice due to concurrent sentencing. His age, lack of previous convictions etc. will also help him.

DARK-KNIGHT

ricero wrote: »

Who cares what team we support ? Dunno why people need the gratification.


Anyway hopefully the trials go to court asap and these bastards spend the remainder of their lives behind bars

nobody is looking for gratification...

PhilipsR

It's not the thread for that crap lads.

ricero

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's been nearly 30 years and there's been no rioting while he's been out and about enjoying his life.
If he is convicted (massive if) a quick glance around suggests the sentencing range is in the couple of years range in other cases. The number of deaths for sentencing purposes is, unfortunately, fairly irrelevant in practice due to concurrent sentencing. His age, lack of previous convictions etc. will also help him.

You dont think he will be convicted ? Im sorry but all the evidance seems to say different. The public will be all for it. It will be outragious if they get away with what they done for a second time

ricero

ricero wrote: »

You dont think he will be convicted ? Im sorry but all the evidance seems to say different. The public will be all for it. It will be outragious if they get away with what they done for a second time

He wasn't convicted in 2000. A lot will depend on the case, how evidence is presented, what's allowed to be presented, who the judge is, all that stuff. It'll drag on for a long bloody time. Hopefully the right answer is got to in the end but it's far from certain. He's had 28 years and a previous prosecution and all the inquiries and so far is still a free man. People have been outraged for most of that time too.

acquiescefc

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd be surprised if all get custodial sentences, probably 1 or 2 and it'll be less than a year in a low risk, semi-open place. That's if they're all convicted.

The police that (allegedly) ordered the pocket books to be changed and anyone else (allegedly) perverting the truths of that day to be recorded should definitely do time.

Not sure Duckenfield had any part in that, what he did was grossly negligent and inexcusable but im not sure if its enough for a custodial sentence.

Mackrell for the H&S aspect also I dont think would define prison time based on the era, and the fences would be a factor, which doesnt excuse any of it of course.

Im an Owl, you dont ever forget what happened, I also remember where i was that day. Its ridiculous how long this has taken not forgetting theres no winners today but if not for the perseverance of the families some atrocious crimes would have stayed unpunished. Until now.

Ben Gadot

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'd be surprised if all get custodial sentences, probably 1 or 2 and it'll be less than a year in a low risk, semi-open place. That's if they're all convicted.

I felt this also initially but I'd like to take the courts at face value for once. People aren't stupid, especially these families who have been messed about for so long, so I'm sure they're aware of what smoke being blown up their backside looks like.

They've made a serious statement here by charging 6 people so they better follow through. Otherwise people will see straight through it for the farce it is.

It's not over yet by a long shot.

Claude Burgundy

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

was his post basically just saying he is united to the core but that is all put to the side...

Yes. No debate.

bucketybuck

ricero wrote: »

There would be riots if he got a sentence so leniant

ricero wrote: »

The public will be all for it.

What the public wants should make no difference whatsoever to any sentence handed down.