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    #1232
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    smash wrote: »
    I couldn't really care less about the 9/11 thread. Or if there was a memorable threads forum. And I didn't say I wanted a snapchat boards. What I would like is a boards that either allows users control over their own content or at least takes control over the content themselves and nukes old stuff.

    Is it any wonder that user numbers are down when whatever you post is portrayed as being finite? Because there's a very limited market for people who actively seek out to use such services. On the flip side there seems to be an increasing number of people who seek out this content for malicious reasons.

    Is best practice removing content automatically after a year or 10's of thousands of posts going back years. I don't think so, you do. Fair enough.

    The closed account function is there.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #1233
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    K-9 wrote: »
    Is best practice removing content automatically after a year or 10's of thousands of posts going back years. I don't think so, you do. Fair enough.
    For user engagement, yes. It encourages users to create fresh content and discourages the trolling of members.
    K-9 wrote: »
    The closed account function is there.

    And as mentioned a few times now, it is useless.


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    #1234
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,350 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    smash wrote: »
    I still don't understand why people are so precious about holding on to old content. It's just hoarding for the sake of it.

    I totally disagree. It can be an interesting historical record / perspective on key events and sometimes you can discover old discussions on a topic you're just getting to grips with and the debate on same going back over years can be fascinating.

    Again, this is a discussion forum. It shouldn't be treated like a social media account. It should serve a different purpose.


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    #1235
    Insect Overlord
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭Insect Overlord


    smash wrote: »
    I still don't understand why people are so precious about holding on to old content. It's just hoarding for the sake of it.

    It would be akin to burning down a library or a museum or a gallery, at this stage. The whole site is an amazing historical document.


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    #1236
    Tipperary Fairy
    Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭Tipperary Fairy


    Let's not pretend that the close account function was anything more than a legal obligation.

    I've been looking over reddit the last few days, to consider my options, cause ya know, all the issues with boards, and it seems they delete posts there along with the username, presumably when someone closes their account. Doesn't really make much difference to the thread.

    I really can't see any problem with deleting the posts of a user either by request or as standard when they close their account. Not a single problem.


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    #1237
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    I totally disagree. It can be an interesting historical record / perspective on key events and sometimes you can discover old discussions on a topic you're just getting to grips with and the debate on same going back over years can be fascinating.

    Again, this is a discussion forum. It shouldn't be treated like a social media account. It should serve a different purpose.
    Yes discussion on old threads isn't allowed. As such, all they do is cause bloat.
    An File wrote: »
    It would be akin to burning down a library or a museum or a gallery, at this stage. The whole site is an amazing historical document.
    No, it really isn't akin to those scenarios.


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    #1238
    TherapyBoy
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 4,341 Mod ✭✭✭✭TherapyBoy


    Have a look through one of the old threads, something popular & interesting. Every time you see a poster with 'closed account' under their name skip their post & any posts who quote it. It makes the thread very hard to make sense of.

    Moderator: Non Drinkers Group & Grand Theft Auto



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    #1239
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    You use a pseudonym on boards though, that's the difference with Facebook or many Twitter accounts.

    Obviously as has been said numerous times on this thread and previously personal identifiable stuff will get deleted.

    *My personal opinion of course.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #1240
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    K-9 wrote: »
    You use a pseudonym on boards though, that's the difference with Facebook or many Twitter accounts.

    Obviously as has been said numerous times on this thread and previously personal identifiable stuff will get deleted.

    *My personal opinion of course.
    What happened when someone with a closed account would like some of their content removed?


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    #1241
    KERSPLAT!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,152 ✭✭✭✭KERSPLAT!


    Tipperary Fairy wrote: »
    Let's not pretend that the close account function was anything more than a legal obligation.

    I've been looking over reddit the last few days, to consider my options, cause ya know, all the issues with boards, and it seems they delete posts there along with the username, presumably when someone closes their account. Doesn't really make much difference to the thread.

    I really can't see any problem with deleting the posts of a user either by request or as standard when they close their account. Not a single problem.

    Ruining the flow of a thread. There's one. The main one.


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    #1242
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    TherapyBoy wrote: »
    Have a look through one of the old threads, something popular & interesting. Every time you see a poster with 'closed account' under their name skip their post & any posts who quote it. It makes the thread very hard to make sense of.

    Yeah, it isn't just the actual posts, it's those quoting it, it would leave many threads making no sense.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #1243
    Tipperary Fairy
    Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭Tipperary Fairy


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    Ruining the flow of a thread. There's one. The main one.

    Not a big enough one though. I mean, you could make the argument that if I duck out of a thread in the middle of a proper discussion I'm ruining the flow of the thread. What you gonna do about that. Plus the majority of closed accounts only appear in dug up threads, so there's hardly any flow to ruin is there


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    #1244
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    Ruining the flow of a thread. There's one. The main one.
    It has already been suggest that when an account is closed, the account page is inaccessible and all references to the username could be set to something generic like "User404". The flow of a thread wouldn't be disrupted. And it would make all closed account posts indistinguishable. Everyone wins.


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    #1245
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    smash wrote: »
    What happened when someone with a closed account would like some of their content removed?

    I refer the honorable gentleman to my previous reply.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #1246
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    smash wrote: »
    It has already been suggest that when an account is closed, the account page is inaccessible and all references to the username could be set to something generic like "User404". The flow of a thread wouldn't be disrupted. And it would make all closed account posts indistinguishable. Everyone wins.

    That's fair enough if it's possible to do it.

    Insert hamster joke.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #1247
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    K-9 wrote: »
    That's fair enough if it's possible to do it.

    Insert hamster joke.

    It's entirely possible with a few queries. It would involve taking the site offline for a few hours but it would be done ate at night.


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    #1248
    blackwhite
    Registered Users Posts: 8,829 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    smash wrote: »
    It has already been suggest that when an account is closed, the account page is inaccessible and all references to the username could be set to something generic like "User404". The flow of a thread wouldn't be disrupted. And it would make all closed account posts indistinguishable. Everyone wins.

    I'd imagine that wouldn't be too difficult to do, but it wouldn't solve the problem of any quoted posts.


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    #1249
    Liam McPoyle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,846 ✭✭✭✭Liam McPoyle


    It will be a crying shame if the touch site is nuked.

    The majority of my browsing is done on phone or tablet, as I'm sure is the case with many users.

    It also has the best feature across any platform in that if you have a user on ignore their posts are COMPLETELY invisible unless they are quoted, that doesn't happen with the main site.


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    #1250
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    smash wrote: »
    It's entirely possible with a few queries. It would involve taking the site offline for a few hours but it would be done ate at night.

    Changing user names does cause some bother so one for the tech guys really.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #1251
    KERSPLAT!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,152 ✭✭✭✭KERSPLAT!


    Tipperary Fairy wrote: »
    Not a big enough one though. I mean, you could make the argument that if I duck out of a thread in the middle of a proper discussion I'm ruining the flow of the thread. What you gonna do about that. Plus the majority of closed accounts only appear in dug up threads, so there's hardly any flow to ruin is there

    In your opinion.

    Posts disappearing would ruin a thread, in my opinion.

    Smash's idea is a good one though I'm not sure if it's possible. One for the dev team


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    #1252
    Tipperary Fairy
    Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭Tipperary Fairy


    K-9 wrote: »
    Changing user names does cause some bother so one for the tech guys really.

    I don't see how, surely it could just be changed to the UID on the account.


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    #1253
    Tipperary Fairy
    Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭Tipperary Fairy


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    In your opinion.

    Posts disappearing would ruin a thread, in my opinion.

    Smash's idea is a good one though I'm not sure if it's possible. One for the dev team

    Well of course in my opinion, isn't everything on here a matter of opinion, unless stated otherwise?


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    #1254
    KERSPLAT!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31,152 ✭✭✭✭KERSPLAT!


    Tipperary Fairy wrote: »
    I don't see how, surely it could just be changed to the UID on the account.

    It causes issues, that's why they're done first thing in the morning when the site isn't busy. It might be fine for changing the username of someone with a few posts but when it runs into hundreds and thousands, I assume it can put a strain on


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    #1255
    duffman13
    Registered Users Posts: 8,952 ✭✭✭duffman13


    Saul T Nutzz wrote: »
    It will be a crying shame if the touch site is nuked.

    The majority of my browsing is done on phone or tablet, as I'm sure is the case with many users.

    It also has the best feature across any platform in that if you have a user on ignore their posts are COMPLETELY invisible unless they are quoted, that doesn't happen with the main site.

    Hang on are they nuking the touch site? The only version I use, best version of the site as you've mentioned. I couldn't be arsed starting again if the user interface is as complicated and laborious as the new one.


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    #1256
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    Ruining the flow of a thread. There's one. The main one.

    But there is a time frame whereby users can delete their posts and ruin the flow of threads already in place. I think its 2 days?

    So thats not really a solid argument seeing as it already happens.


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    #1257
    Tipperary Fairy
    Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭Tipperary Fairy


    KERSPLAT! wrote: »
    It causes issues, that's why they're done first thing in the morning when the site isn't busy. It might be fine for changing the username of someone with a few posts but when it runs into hundreds and thousands, I assume it can put a strain on

    What can put a strain on? All you have to do is, if the users account has been closed then display the UID instead of the username. And something similar for a quote.


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    #1258
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    blackwhite wrote: »
    I'd imagine that wouldn't be too difficult to do, but it wouldn't solve the problem of any quoted posts.

    It could easily be run on quoted posts too as the database entry contains the original post number and account name. Like your one here "blackwhite;99882007"
    K-9 wrote: »
    Changing user names does cause some bother so one for the tech guys really.
    It shouldn't. The username is just an attribute of the member ID which is unique.


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    #1259
    blackwhite
    Registered Users Posts: 8,829 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    smash wrote: »
    It could easily be run on quoted posts too as the database entry contains the original post number and account name. Like your one here "blackwhite;99882007"

    AFAIK, the "Originally posted by" is simply a text record of whatever the quoted username was at the time the post was quoted. The post number is also stored in the qouting post as text, but also contains a lookup link to the database.

    The quote function would need to be re-written to now contain a live link/lookup of the database for whatever the new iteration of the username is, which I'd imagine would add quite a lot of new/incremental strain on the servers.


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    #1260
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    I've seen a lot of people talk about moderators and the prison forum since I posted and I just want to clarify what I meant by it:

    *trolling the prison forum isn't really a problem, but what it shows me is an aspect of moderating culture on the site. -look how great and funny our admins and moderators are as they take the piss out of some dribbling re-reg.

    *it is an example of nigh on everything on this website being about administrating and moderating at some point. There is a massive culture on this website to do with moderators and moderation. I think the transparency is half the problem here and things go on and on and can just drag out all based on what actions a mod takes on a forum/thread. It should just be done and everything taken up either via pm or on the dispute resolution forum (which should have the threads only be seen by the relevant people).

    *I've asked people who aren't really on boards or rarely post what they think of the site. "Moderators.ie" was a name used by one. All their answers pretty much said how its moderated into the ground (exaggeration imo) or mentioned the moderators in one way shape or form. There is a definite culture of it here and its the first thing people think of if they don't know the site too well. I asked another who used to use the site quite a lot and he agreed, saying how it bleeds into almost every aspect of the site. I realise these are just kinda random opinions from people you don't know, but it goes to show what the general attitude and reception of the site is.


    To me this is fixable:
    -Get rid of the special tags and names et al on a moderators visible profile. Have the names of the mods on forum they moderate, aside from that make them invisible.

    -Remove the 'boys club' (and girls Im sure!) mentality among the admins and mods. Seems to be the same clique of people doing multiple jobs who all know each other. You can see it on this thread. Im not saying "dont be friends" - what I am saying is don't take over and make conversations seem on a higher level than those 'below' you. You often see it on other forums (Soccer for me namely) that certain users get away with it because they've been around long enough or know a mod (deleting troll posts for them etc. We do see it...).

    -Don't be afraid of being less transparent if it means a smoother running website. I see so much bureaucracy and nonsense (this thread again is a prime example) and a site stunted by the endless blablabla between two or three people that know each other taking over a thread like this or a conversation about something else site related. I had a look at that feedforward forum... f**k me, what a load of absolute crap, just seemed like a little tugfest with pretty much nothing ever said. Ban trolls, keep the conversations moving, keep in the rules but stop making a massive deal about it. The *worst* thing is when a mod interjects in a thread 'reminding' someone to keep it civil or something like that. Why? Why not just send a pm or ban them from the thread? Instead there just seems to be a conversation and then BAM! ROADBLOCK! and what do you say as well? kills threads and kills conversation and is over-moderation. The right tool for the right job, stop making a presence everywhere for little or no reason.


    I realise its easy to say "blame the moderators!" on a thread like this, but thats kind of the thing, they shouldnt be in a position to be blamed. The whole thing is over-exposed and there is a deep culture of it on the website. It hurts the website and while there might be more than one reason the site is reducing in numbers, this to me is a big aspect of that problem - especially when there are a ton of options available


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    #1261
    Wibbs
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,159 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    BMMachine wrote: »
    *it is an example of nigh on everything on this website being about administrating and moderating at some point. There is a massive culture on this website to do with moderators and moderation.
    +1000

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



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