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Calling for a NO to TUI ballot

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    #182
    mirrorwall14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,751 ✭✭✭mirrorwall14


    And it comes just as Pascal Donahoe says there is nothing more to be allocated during this agreement and those on the new pay scales will have to suck it up. So much for the TUI's 'oh LRA is the best way to negotiate'...


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    #183
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,247 ✭✭✭✭km79


    mirrorwall14 wrote: »
    And it comes just as Pascal Donahoe says there is nothing more to be allocated during this agreement and those on the new pay scales will have to suck it up. So much for the TUI's 'oh LRA is the best way to negotiate'...

    Awaits response from someone trying to put a positive spin on that
    "But but but they promised "
    Jesus some people NEVER learn and NEVER will
    This was/is the last chance. If /when this is accepted by the sheep in the ASTI membership after a few more threats about money then we can all just forget about it.
    Voting away our working conditions for a few euro in the short term. Cos that's what it comes down too no matter what people are saying. Money.


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    #184
    deiseindublin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,263 ✭✭✭deiseindublin


    How effective would a mass exodus from TUI be? Would they even care?

    I can't decide if I'm better being a member of this half wit organisation or if I'd be better off knowing that I'm officially not represented and so have €400ish extra in my pocket each year.


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    #185
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    Gutted,but not surprised.The TUI are a joke!


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    #186
    NufcNavan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,833 ✭✭✭NufcNavan


    It'll be the same teachers bitching online on pages like Voice For Teachers about their working conditions that have probably just voted to accept the agreement. What a farcical result from the TUI.


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    #187
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    Who is outside LRA? ASTI,Unite and the Guards, is that it?


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    #188
    The_Valeyard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,452 ✭✭✭✭The_Valeyard


    Da f*ck



    Turkeys voting for Christmas. Why am I in this union.


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    #189
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 52,009 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Teachers who don't agree with the result should withdraw membership of TUI.


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    #190
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,247 ✭✭✭✭km79


    Not seen one comment here or on Facebook from a single person who voted for it.
    Why is that? They should be delighted.They voted in favour of it and it was passed so should be delighted . Why is nobody coming out and saying they voted YES and telling us all why its going to be a great thing .
    I mean they voted YES so they must have their reasons and be looking forward to the new school year now with this new "deal" .
    Strange ........


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    #191
    MacGyver007
    Registered Users Posts: 860 ✭✭✭MacGyver007


    acequion wrote: »
    Who is outside LRA? ASTI,Unite and the Guards, is that it?

    To the best of my knowledge, ASTI, GRA, AGSI, IMO and PDFORRA (who will not ballot members on LRA "until the pay scales of the 2013 entrant Privates have been negotiated to a satisfactory conclusion")


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    #192
    r93kaey5p2izun
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,962 ✭✭✭r93kaey5p2izun


    Once again I find myself asking why I am in this union. Apart from the recommendation to vote no to LRA the first time I can't remember being pleased or even satisfied with any of their actions. Apart from the general issues, in ten years they have failed to address the disgraceful abuse of part time contracts prevalent in my school, allowing many careers to be destroyed in the process.

    I have been involved and attended meetings but at this stage I have no faith in the current leadership or the union mechanisms and procedures. It actually sickens me to continue to contribute to an organisation that never seems to meaningfully represent my views or issues and which continues to accept inequality for members.

    I've always believed strongly in unions and workers standing together, but I feel something is rotten in our union at this stage.


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    #193
    man_no_plan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,018 ✭✭✭man_no_plan


    km79 wrote: »
    Not seen one comment here or on Facebook from a single person who voted for it.
    Why is that? They should be delighted.They voted in favour of it and it was passed so should be delighted . Why is nobody coming out and saying they voted YES and telling us all why its going to be a great thing .
    I mean they voted YES so they must have their reasons and be looking forward to the new school year now with this new "deal" .
    Strange ........

    What do you want them to say?


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    #194
    man_no_plan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,018 ✭✭✭man_no_plan


    Regina Warm Thump wrote: »
    Once again I find myself asking why I am in this union. Apart from the recommendation to vote no to LRA the first time I can't remember being pleased or even satisfied with any of their actions. Apart from the general issues, in ten years they have failed to address the disgraceful abuse of part time contracts prevalent in my school, allowing many careers to be destroyed in the process.

    I have been involved and attended meetings but at this stage I have no faith in the current leadership or the union mechanisms and procedures. It actually sickens me to continue to contribute to an organisation that never seems to meaningfully represent my views or issues and which continues to accept inequality for members.

    I've always believed strongly in unions and workers standing together, but I feel something is rotten in our union at this stage.

    There are a couple of things there.

    Firstly we need one union not two.

    Secondly the members voted, they're not braindead, they tick the box themselves if they felt there was nothing there, as 35% which is sizeable did, they should vote accordingly.

    I voted yes for reasons outlined before. As i said before I'd happily strike if that was the way it went to support colleagues.

    The problem with the unions is that we hear all these voices at times of ballots etc and then they disappear. If members want to bring about changes they need to campaign constantly in an organised way. ASTI members have done so, TUI may be heading the same direction.


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    #195
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,247 ✭✭✭✭km79


    man_no_plan wrote: »
    What do you want them to say?

    The reasons why this is a good thing!
    The reasons why they voted yes.
    Lots of people have CLEARLY outlined why they were voting no but it seems many more voted yes.
    I'd be interested to hear the reasons. To see if these reasons were short term / long term. To see if these reasons were predominantly influenced by monetary gain / loss or by working conditions .
    To see if they voted yes out of fear due to propaganda from outside and within . Propaganda which ALREADY has been shown for what it is......of course most people had voted by this morning and influenced accordingly.


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    #196
    r93kaey5p2izun
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,962 ✭✭✭r93kaey5p2izun


    I just feel TUI is so weak on the ground. There is very little teachers in precarious employment can do to stand up for themselves. We are afraid of campaigning or being organised because the union is so weak in schools. Directives are breached, rules are ignored, NPTs are threatened and intimidated and livelihoods are on the line if you even try to question anything. It seems to suit some to allow that to continue.

    I don't believe TUI represents me or my fellow NPTs but there is little support or protection for us, for all the calls of "go to meetings, campaign for change". If fellow members are allowed to threaten and intimidate us for attending meetings and voicing our concerns then where do we turn?


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    #197
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    MacGyver007 wrote: »
    To the best of my knowledge, ASTI, GRA, AGSI, IMO and PDFORRA (who will not ballot members on LRA "until the pay scales of the 2013 entrant Privates have been negotiated to a satisfactory conclusion")

    Well we're [ASTI] not so isolated so.Obviously it would be so much better to have the two second level unions on the same page and there will be pressure on us to cave now too. But lets hope everybody sticks to their guns and stays strong.


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    #198
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,247 ✭✭✭✭km79


    acequion wrote: »
    Well we're [ASTI] not so isolated so.Obviously it would be so much better to have the two second level unions on the same page and there will be pressure on us to cave now too. But lets hope everybody sticks to their guns and stays strong.

    It's going towards one inevitable conclusion
    We may have had a massive majority last time but some members were stil murmuring about losing the 1000 euro and increments etc
    This will sway them and we have seen a massive turnaround in the TUI vote
    Deja vu
    And we will all be together again so TUI members will be happy.
    Silly Asti members isolating ourselves like this anyway ;)


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    #199
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    Anyone coming over to join the ASTI ???


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    #200
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,247 ✭✭✭✭km79


    Gebgbegb wrote: »
    Anyone coming over to join the ASTI ???

    They can't during a dispute
    They can leave TUI but not join Asti


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    #201
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    km79 wrote: »
    It's going towards one inevitable conclusion
    We may have had a massive majority last time but some members were stil murmuring about losing the 1000 euro and increments etc
    This will sway them and we have seen a massive turnaround in the TUI vote
    Deja vu
    And we will all be together again so TUI members will be happy.
    Silly Asti members isolating ourselves like this anyway ;)

    Not necessarily km79. We have a different president now, our CEC are quite militant, we seem to be more organised and unified than TUI judging by the comments here and judging from what I hear on the ground. I'm not for one minute saying you're wrong and of course I'd be wary too based on recent trends,but more hopeful this time. Chin up! :)


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    #202
    mirrorwall14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,751 ✭✭✭mirrorwall14


    I wish we could switch but ASTI have no negotiating rights for us


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    #203
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    km79 wrote: »
    They can't during a dispute
    They can leave TUI but not join Asti

    Ya that's the big problem. And we're eternally in dispute these days. Still many members feel deeply unhappy with and unrepresented by TUI and it's a shame they can't move.


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    #204
    doc_17
    Registered Users Posts: 6,927 ✭✭✭doc_17


    I voted yes.


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    #205
    fridayfeeling
    Registered Users Posts: 7 ✭fridayfeeling


    35 TUI members in my school voted. 34 No votes because they were quite blatant about it. In our place there is huge resentment about the Croke Park hours. I blame the Executive. They should have allowed an open vote without making a recommendation. They always do this coming up to the Summer break when teachers are not clued in to what they are actually voting for. We will regret this short term gain for 30 pieces of silver. Our conditions are worsened again and people do not/will not see it.


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    #206
    fridayfeeling
    Registered Users Posts: 7 ✭fridayfeeling


    Gebgbegb wrote: »
    Anyone coming over to join the ASTI ???

    There will be quite a few


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    #207
    footrush
    Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭footrush


    man_no_plan wrote: »
    Regina Warm Thump wrote: »
    Once again I find myself asking why I am in this union. Apart from the recommendation to vote no to LRA the first time I can't remember being pleased or even satisfied with any of their actions. Apart from the general issues, in ten years they have failed to address the disgraceful abuse of part time contracts prevalent in my school, allowing many careers to be destroyed in the process.

    I have been involved and attended meetings but at this stage I have no faith in the current leadership or the union mechanisms and procedures. It actually sickens me to continue to contribute to an organisation that never seems to meaningfully represent my views or issues and which continues to accept inequality for members.

    I've always believed strongly in unions and workers standing together, but I feel something is rotten in our union at this stage.

    There are a couple of things there.

    Firstly we need one union not two.

    Secondly the members voted, they're not braindead, they tick the box themselves if they felt there was nothing there, as 35% which is sizeable did, they should vote accordingly.

    I voted yes for reasons outlined before. As i said before I'd happily strike if that was the way it went to support colleagues.

    The problem with the unions is that we hear all these voices at times of ballots etc and then they disappear. If members want to bring about changes they need to campaign constantly in an organised way. ASTI members have done so, TUI may be heading the same direction.
    This vote is exactly why there has to be two unions, one for those who agree and one for those who don't its really very simple and democratic ?.


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    #208
    acequion
    Registered Users Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭acequion


    Saw this comment over on thejournal.ie. Thought it interesting!

    I expect TUI to split now. IT lecturers were hammered with 2 extra lecturing hours, and voted overwhelmingly against the proposal. I suppose secondary school teachers voted for it, and that is how it was accepted. I will be leaving TUI, and I guess a lot of other lecturers will as well.


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    #209
    footrush
    Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭footrush


    acequion wrote: »
    Saw this comment over on thejournal.ie. Thought it interesting!

    I expect TUI to split now. IT lecturers were hammered with 2 extra lecturing hours, and voted overwhelmingly against the proposal. I suppose secondary school teachers voted for it, and that is how it was accepted. I will be leaving TUI, and I guess a lot of other lecturers will as well.
    Its a democratic process why can't people accept it ?.


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    #210
    fridayfeeling
    Registered Users Posts: 7 ✭fridayfeeling


    acequion wrote: »
    Saw this comment over on thejournal.ie. Thought it interesting!

    I expect TUI to split now. IT lecturers were hammered with 2 extra lecturing hours, and voted overwhelmingly against the proposal. I suppose secondary school teachers voted for it, and that is how it was accepted. I will be leaving TUI, and I guess a lot of other lecturers will as well.

    I'm a secondary teacher and voted NO as did most of the Cork Branch if the last branch meeting was anything to go by. I've received a number of calls tonight and members of the TUI who voted NO are quite raw about this decision. Again the majority blindly put their trust in the Executive


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    #211
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,247 ✭✭✭✭km79


    footrush wrote: »
    Its a democratic process why can't people accept it ?.

    absolutely .........hopefully the govt will accept the ASTI memberships decision to reject so with it being a democracy and all :D
    A democracy where we keep getting sent back and threatened until we vote the right way!
    The govt interfered with the democratic process for these votes with their carefully timed threats


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