Donald Trump

Joxer_Daly

Billy86 wrote: »

You are aware that building such a wall would bankrupt the US in no time at all, right?

Building a wall to keep out criminal trespassers is going to bankrupt the world's largest superpower and a country that has spent trillions on its military over the past decade?

No.

Joxer_Daly

Legal Action wrote: »

Why wouldn't it be? Billions and Billions have been spent on Freeways and aircraft carries.

Plus illegal immigration already costs the US over $100 billion per year. The wall will cost a fraction of that.

This report estimates the annual costs of illegal immigration at the federal, state and local level to be about $113 billion; nearly $29 billion at the federal level and $84 billion at the state and local level. The study also estimates tax collections from illegal alien workers, both those in the above-ground economy and those in the underground economy. Those receipts do not come close to the level of expenditures and, in any case, are misleading as an offset because over time unemployed and underemployed U.S. workers would replace illegal alien workers.

Key Findings

Illegal immigration costs U.S. taxpayers about $113 billion a year at the federal, state and local level. The bulk of the costs — some $84 billion — are absorbed by state and local governments.The annual outlay that illegal aliens cost U.S. taxpayers is an average amount per native-headed household of $1,117. The fiscal impact per household varies considerably because the greatest share of the burden falls on state and local taxpayers whose burden depends on the size of the illegal alien population in that localityEducation for the children of illegal aliens constitutes the single largest cost to taxpayers, at an annual price tag of nearly $52 billion. Nearly all of those costs are absorbed by state and local governments.At the federal level, about one-third of outlays are matched by tax collections from illegal aliens. At the state and local level, an average of less than 5 percent of the public costs associated with illegal immigration is recouped through taxes collected from illegal aliens.Most illegal aliens do not pay income taxes. Among those who do, much of the revenues collected are refunded to the illegal aliens when they file tax returns. Many are also claiming tax credits resulting in payments from the U.S. Treasury.

With many state budgets in deficit, policymakers have an obligation to look for ways to reduce the fiscal burden of illegal migration. California, facing a budget deficit of $14.4 billion in 2010-2011, is hit with an estimated $21.8 billion in annual expenditures on illegal aliens. New York’s $6.8 billion deficit is smaller than its $9.5 billion in yearly illegal alien costs.

Cheerful Spring

Zillah wrote: »

Trump doesn't need policies. He's stoked bitter, scared people and taken advantage of the climate of worry and frustration to such an extent that he's the product, not his policies. Voters like him, they like how he blames third parties for their problems, they like how he seems tough and disrespects an institution they've grown sick of. He can say anything he wants and call on them to do anything he wants and they'll do it.

Which is how fascists always come to power.

German high society in the 30's laughed and mocked Hitler and thought he was clown. Its like history repeating itself again.

If we lived in sane world Trump would never be president he does not have the character to hold high office.

MadYaker

I can't believe were having a serious debate about the wall. I don't think it's going to happen but if it does Mexico definitely won't be paying for it and anyone who thinks they will is a moron.

Joxer_Daly

MadYaker wrote: »

I can't believe were having a serious debate about the wall. I don't think it's going to happen but if it does Mexico definitely won't be paying for it and anyone who thinks they will is a moron.

Cut their USAID and put a tariff on their $28 billion in remittances they receive annually. Then they've as good as paid for it.

Cheerful Spring

He does not want equality for gays and lesbians. Are they next to be banned?

Trump Said He Would “Strongly Consider” Appointing Judges To Overturn Same-Sex Marriage Decision. Asked on Fox News Sunday “WALLACE: But -- but just to button this up very quickly, sir, are you saying that if you become president, you might try to appoint justices to overrule the decision on same-sex marriage?” TRUMP: “I would strongly consider that, yes

[Fox News Sunday, 1/31/2016

The Randy Riverbeast

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

He does not want equality for gays and lesbians. Are they next to be banned?

Trump Said He Would “Strongly Consider” Appointing Judges To Overturn Same-Sex Marriage Decision. Asked on Fox News Sunday “WALLACE: But -- but just to button this up very quickly, sir, are you saying that if you become president, you might try to appoint justices to overrule the decision on same-sex marriage?” TRUMP: “I would strongly consider that, yes

[Fox News Sunday, 1/31/2016

One of the judges he is considering thinks a state should be able to criminalise homosexuality so it's quite possible.

beach_walker

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

So you don't think its racist to ban a entire group of people who follow a different religion?

Errm...

Joxer_Daly

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

So you don't think its racist to ban a entire group of people who follow a different religion?

It is not racist, no. Bigoted but not racist.

tea and coffee

MadYaker wrote: »

Or

I'm always slightly bemused by people who support Trump. It's impossible to get an in depth detailed answer from anyone as to why they want him to be President. He hasn't really outlined any policies in detail, he constantly contradicts himself and says things that are demonstrably false but none of his supporters seem to care? Most people who seem to support him say that he doesn't mean half the things he says, but if that's the case then how can you agree with him?? How do you know what you are voting for???
.

I don't think people care- that is the sad truth. they are angry and they just want to be angry at "someone" and have someone to blame. Trump gets that anger and he is using it to gain traction. He doesn't need policies, he needs people who feel (either justified or not) they have been let down by "the system" and this is their two fingers to the whole thing. It's a large scale inability to take responsibility for your own actions in some cases,

Joxer_Daly

He has plenty of policies. Put Donald Trump policies into Google and there you go. Very easy to find.

Cheerful Spring

Trump leads Hilary in one national poll released today time to panic. There is speculation Trump will reduce the corporation tax from 35 per cent to 20 per cent maybe even as low as 15 per cent. A Trump presidency is bad for the Irish economy.


http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/23/donald-trump-poll-hillary-clinton-presidential-election-2016

BoatMad

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Trump leads Hilary in one national poll released today time to panic. There is speculation Trump will reduce the corporation tax from 35 per cent to 20 per cent maybe even as low as 15 per cent. A Trump presidency is bad for the Irish economy.


http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/23/donald-trump-poll-hillary-clinton-presidential-election-2016

more poll of polls nonsense however

RobertKK

CNN last night showed polls and the trends. Clinton is losing support, Trump is gaining support.

They also did tests on people to see if their unconscious minds were different to the positions people held and to see what people's brains were thinking.
For a group of Democrat supporters - the top thing it showed was they found Trump 'likeable'.
For a group of Republican supporters - their minds showed they thought Clinton was 'scary', 'non presidential' and 'bad judgement'.

CNN had a big debate on the two candidates, and the consensus was while it is still only May, Hillary Clinton has a lot to be worried about.
A trend has started with her losing support, while Trump has gained.
Trump who had higher unpopular percentages in the polls is now level with Clinton at 57%.

One of the things Clinton is weak on as shown by the polls is she has high figures for not being trusted.

I still go with Trump winning the election as I think people wanted change before and didn't get it with Obama, while Romney was not a change candidate.
Trump will bring change for better or worse.

Shurimgreat

There is no depth to Trump, everything is on a superficial level.

Which is exactly why he appeals to so many in America.

Cina

Joxer_Daly wrote: »

He has plenty of policies. Put Donald Trump policies into Google and there you go. Very easy to find.

He has only one policy - say whatever it takes to get these votes.

His opinions on basically everything he's advocated have varied wildly from State to State and speech to speech. Now that he is the Republican frontrunner he's backtracking and changing loads in order to get them on his side.

The man just says whatever the feck he has to in order to go further and further in the race. I suspect we won't know what his actual policies are until the day (shudder) he's in the oval office. Which is actually a more terrifying prospect than any.

lee_baby_simms

Joxer_Daly wrote: »

He has plenty of policies. Put Donald Trump policies into Google and there you go. Very easy to find.

You might be confusing populist slogans with actual policies.

A policy needs strategy and substance behind it, not simply shouting:

"We're gonna replace obamacare with something terrific"

"We're gonna build a big wall and mexico is gonna pay for it"

riclad

He, appeals to white americans ,and the working class ,cos he,s blunt ,
used to appearing on tv, he
uses colourful language .
hes says the us needs to change,
ordinary workers are getting screwed .
And he has a since of humour.
He,s not a religious extremist.
He would be an awful president .
like reagan was.
he uses simple language,
bring factorys back to the us ,etc easy to understand concepts .
he said before abortion should be legal .
HE does not seem obsessed with controlling womens rights to abortion,
contraception etc
He may be sexist but he,s not against women,s rights .
It seems a trend ,reagan, started off as an actor .
eg appear on tv, be famous,
you might become the president of america.
The middle class ,working class is falling apart in the usa,declining wages
losing jobs, automation,offshoring,high health care cost ,
they need to express their anger .
They want change .
not another obama,clinton mor bland president .
No one has come up with a simpler or better insurance scheme than obamacare ,
it increased the coverage of health insurance to 90 per cent of americans ,
and it decreases the cost to the states of medical care .
any other scheme would be more expensive and more complex to operate .

RobertKK

Trump was going on about the Pfizer/Allergan tax inversion deal which would have made Pfizer effectively an Irish company, and saving them a lot on taxes.
Every campaign speech Trump was bringing this up.

Now if you are an American and you have seen other US companies make themselves an Irish registered company which moves their tax from the US to Ireland, or some other country with lower corporation taxes, what would you be thinking when the US then finally closes off the route by making it not worthwhile, and done specifically to stop the Pfizer deal and any future deals?
You will have have seen Trump make it an issue, to the point it was dealt with to remove the issue. People say Trump has no policies, yet in this one area we can see how one of his campaign issues which was resonating with voters was dealt with.
Trump believes the corporation tax level is too high and he will reduce it to further incentivise American companies and others to create jobs in the US.
I also expect he will make it easier for US companies to bring back money they are holding abroad to avoid the high taxes they would have to pay by bringing it back to the US.

tigger123

Joxer_Daly wrote: »

Plus illegal immigration already costs the US over $100 billion per year. The wall will cost a fraction of that.

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/05/donald-trumps-economy/481743/

You should the read the link. It quotes a right wing think tank that did analysis on some of Trump's electioneering nonsense ...

From the article linked above ...

"Trump has promised to make America great again. But a closer look his policy proposals, such as they are, suggests that within his first few years as president, he would more likely make American recessionary again.

The problem begins with his outspoken approach to Mexican immigration. His “plan” to deport 11 million undocumented immigrants would shrink the economy by about 2 percent, according to American Action Forum (AAF), a conservative and pro-business think tank. The sudden subtraction of 7 million workers would cause an immediate shock to thousands of businesses, triggering a GDP collapse ranging from $400 billion to $600 billion in production, AAF’s analysis found, with the worst of the slump occurring in industries like construction and hospitality. “The things Donald Trump has said are utterly unworkable,” Douglas Holtz-Eakin, an economic adviser to Senator John McCain’s 2008 presidential campaign and the forum's president, told Reuters."

The man's a f*ckin idiot and a bafoon.

Potatoeman

lee_baby_simms wrote: »

You might be confusing populist slogans with actual policies.

A policy needs strategy and substance behind it, not simply shouting:

"We're gonna replace obamacare with something terrific"

"We're gonna build a big wall and mexico is gonna pay for it"

You mean like Obama with 'yes we can' and 'Change'.

lee_baby_simms

Potatoeman wrote: »

You mean like Obama with 'yes we can' and 'Change'.

Yes, they were slogans. Not policies.

tigger123

Potatoeman wrote: »

You mean like Obama with 'yes we can' and 'Change'.

At least he came up with the concept of Obamacare.

Trump's response to Obamacare is "something that's not Obamacare".

Potatoeman

tigger123 wrote: »

At least he came up with the concept of Obamacare.

Trump's response to Obamacare is "something that's not Obamacare".

Which is not popular and poorly implemented.

Speedwell

Potatoeman wrote: »

Which is not popular and poorly implemented.

Which is very popular indeed and implemented as well as such a large program can be in its initial stages (says this IT database professional and American citizen).

Naturally it still s*cks as far as so-called First World health systems go, but baby steps.

The Randy Riverbeast

lee_baby_simms wrote: »

You might be confusing populist slogans with actual policies.

A policy needs strategy and substance behind it, not simply shouting:

"We're gonna replace obamacare with something terrific"

"We're gonna build a big wall and mexico is gonna pay for it"

Actual policies will have big words and long sentences. May even require some thought. Policies would be bad as few of his supporters are capable of understanding them but everyone else can tear them to shreds.

KomradeBishop

tigger123 wrote: »

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/05/donald-trumps-economy/481743/

You should the read the link. It quotes a right wing think tank that did analysis on some of Trump's electioneering nonsense ...

From the article linked above ...

"Trump has promised to make America great again. But a closer look his policy proposals, such as they are, suggests that within his first few years as president, he would more likely make American recessionary again.

The problem begins with his outspoken approach to Mexican immigration. His “plan” to deport 11 million undocumented immigrants would shrink the economy by about 2 percent, according to American Action Forum (AAF), a conservative and pro-business think tank. The sudden subtraction of 7 million workers would cause an immediate shock to thousands of businesses, triggering a GDP collapse ranging from $400 billion to $600 billion in production, AAF’s analysis found, with the worst of the slump occurring in industries like construction and hospitality. “The things Donald Trump has said are utterly unworkable,” Douglas Holtz-Eakin, an economic adviser to Senator John McCain’s 2008 presidential campaign and the forum's president, told Reuters."

The man's a f*ckin idiot and a bafoon.

This doesn't jive with what he said regarding the countries national debt though - what he publicly stated, hints that he's not averse to using the full power of the US currency, to engage in a good old fashioned Keynesian Stimulus - something that the US (and most western countries tbh) need very badly.

He can use that power, for good (jobs, boost the economy) or for ill (to benefit a select/powerful class of people - not unlike QE - or his own causes/power).

Everything he says is so conflicted, that I don't think we can honestly say anything about his level of intelligence - only that he is a complete opportunistic liar at every opportunity, and that god/FSM knows what will happen, if he gets into power.

Knasher

RobertKK wrote: »

You will have have seen Trump make it an issue.

Trump didn't make it an issue. The US congress started making noise about this issue back in 2014, and the US government started introducing regulations to prevent it in 2014, with more in 2015 and again in 2016, which finally killed off the Pfizer deal.

Cheerful Spring

Riots at a Trump Rally last night, just shows how divided American is right now.

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/24/politics/donald-trump-albuquerque-protesters-police/index.html

beach_walker

These protesters (rioters) are morons. Do they really think that attacking the police, Trump supporters and attempting to shut it all down (while waving Mexican flags...) actually makes them look good? What do they think your average Joe seeing all this on the news makes of it? Trump must be laughing his ass off.