Donald Trump

K-9

Red King wrote: »

Newsflash: The "experts" said that when he ran for the Republican nomination.

He won, with relative ease and crushed seasoned politicians like Jeb Bush who had the full weight of the Republican party behind him.

He is far from an idiot, and in the latest opinion polls is neck and neck with Hillary Clinton amongst likely voters.

In fairness Trump didn't really think he'd get it at the start either. Not many took him seriously, a few Democrats did but were laughed at.

Speedwell

K-9 wrote: »

In fairness Trump didn't really think he'd get it at the start either. Not many took him seriously, a few Democrats did but were laughed at.

The Republicans did not field any credible candidates. Not one.

Permabear

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ohnonotgmail

Permabear wrote: »

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the voters didnt seem to think so.

K-9

Speedwell wrote: »

The Republicans did not field any credible candidates. Not one.

Kasich maybe but even his much lauded economic credentials don't look that great when people dig deeper into them. Anybody "moderate" looked boring and it ended up Cruz vs. Trump. Maybe we are better with boring?

His comments about John McCain in Vietnam just put me right off him. We all know he's crass and uncouth but that was just vile and shows he has no decency or empathy at all.

My favourite story about him is he took over a budget airline in the 90's and he proceeded to put in wooden flooring and gold plated taps, it wasn't long going under. Another was getting into the mortgage business in 06/07.

He'll fight to not disclose any financial information at all, but the pressure will build up when Clinton sends the attack dogs on him.

She is a terrible campaigner and I could see momentum building for him and who knows after that?

KomradeBishop

Permabear wrote: »

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You're being more than a bit hyperbolic there - there's a big difference between telling someone to e.g. fúck off, and using a swear word as I did - you're in the habit yourself of heavily dialling up the condescension when things aren't turning your way in a debate, which is an ugly habit that destroys quality of debate very quickly - pushing people into 'Us vs Them' trenches, and turning an argument into 'who can win by sneering the most' instead of arguments being evaluated on logic or the credibility of competing sources.

Having a tendency to engage in heavy condescension like that, while having a snobbish attitude towards swear words, shows pretty big double standards - condescension is way more uncivil and harmful to debate, than (unless used for abuse) a few swear words...

That's not much better than picking at someones posts, for getting the spelling wrong really.

Permabear wrote: »

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Western economies are heading towards deflation - and need a good dose of inflation - they have more than enough room for switching away from select foreign goods, for locally produced ones. I haven't even advocated such a change either, simply noted the practical capability.

You know how the population sees the value of its wages and savings plus living standards eroded? Negative interest rates and stagnant or slashed wages - or simply not getting enough money in wages to save through being unemployed or underemployed - as well as asset bubbles and stupidly high property prices, driving people into heavy debt or excessive rents - i.e. through the lions share of the gain in our economies, increasingly going to the upper echelons, because they get to rig almost everything in their favour.

There is a simple way to fix things in the western and developing world: Fix the fúcking distribution of wealth and income, so it's not so ridiculously lopsided...


So you think we should support all the sweatshop workers in the third world, so they don't have to be prostitutes...as if there is absolutely no possible middle ground, such as e.g. western nations co-operating to only buy from producers who uphold good working/health/regulatory/pay standards etc...

Again you race towards ridiculous black and white hyperbolic representations of stuff - it's not an issue of Prostitution vs Sweatshop Labour...

Are you suggesting there's a lack of infrastructural needs in SE Asia? Considering that we are talking mostly in the context of developing countries, that predominantly coincides with countries that have a massive amount of infrastructural catching up to do, with the developed world.


The world isn't there to be run by and in favour of rapacious multinational corporations - it's there to be run by governments and in the favour of the people who democratically elect them - and all of these governments can co-operate on international platforms, to raise standards for other countries.

Using developing world labour, primarily as cheap labour - instead of primarily as a hand-up towards increased self-sustainability/autonomy and introduction to the developed world - is a choice that the governments of western worlds have made (with the co-operation of developing world elites, who don't have much of a reason to give a shít about their workers - much the way our own elites would happily return us to developing-world status); it's perfectly and completely changeable, and it's really only a political problem, not an economic one.

Permabear

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DEFTLEFTHAND

Could we see a situation develop in the States where people vote for a third party candidate in large numbers?

ohnonotgmail

Permabear wrote: »

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I'm not saying they are right but it is the voters who decide.

The Randy Riverbeast

Permabear wrote: »

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The republican voters think he is credible, as was Carson and Cruz. Surely they wouldn't be wrong?

Permabear

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JackieBauer

I wonder how big his cock really is and do his pubes match his hair

youreadthat

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

And there's the issue. Do you think Trump will "manage the economy properly?" He thinks he can coerce Mexico to finance his wall despite there being net emigration to Mexico. He also proposes to exclude nearly a quarter of the world's population from the US. And this is before we even look at his attitudes to women and ethnic minorities. I conclude that Trump hasn't the capacity to manage the economy properly and and anyone looking at his business career as evidence to the contrary might wish to take a closer look.



How do they grow locally when domestic costs are so much higher? So much so as to be prohibitive. I live in SouthEast England where rents are soaring because vested interests and NIMBYs have managed to freeze housebuilding for their own ends and to the detriment of everyone else so rents here are extortionate. Companies move abroad for a reason.

South East England is one of the densest areas in Europe. People want to have some semblance of quality of life. Making it all London Zone 6 may be the neoliberal greedy dream but it's an affront to the average joe's life.

Arghus

Permabear wrote: »

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The same ones, yes.

Define credible.

BalcombeSt4

JackieBauer wrote: »

I wonder how big his cock really is and do his pubes match his hair

If there anything like his fingers probably very small.

Antar Bolaeisk

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Could we see a situation develop in the States where people vote for a third party candidate in large numbers?

Doesn't work, a third party will only hurt the candidate closest in ideology to themselves leaving the other candidate a clear path to victory.

Joxer_Daly

He beat the **** out of sixteen governors and senators and made it look easy.

The entire American media edifice is working to destroy him and he's using their efforts for his goals instead of paying for TV ads(that people would just skip over anyway.)

He ****posts and trolls people on a level that even 4chan can't fully comprehend. 

He's routinely made bold pronouncements that can't possibly be true. Obvious bravado and exaggeration. AND THEN HE ACHIEVES THOSE GOALS. He said he'd get 1400+ delegates when people doubted he'd get 1200. (Now he may get closer to 1500.) He said he'd win the Hispanic vote. (A recent poll shows him at 55% among Hispanics.)

And lol at people calling him an idiot. I originally thought he entered the race for publicity and marketing reasons. Now, it's quite possible that he could win the damn thing.

It's incredible.

Speedwell

Joxer_Daly wrote: »

He beat the **** out of sixteen governors and senators and made it look easy.

Because beating the crap out of people is exactly the virtue that will bring about a just and equal society. :rolleyes:

The entire American media edifice is working to destroy him

Oh, no, they're not, sugar. He's their once-in-a-lifetime huge theatrical draw. Entertainment!

He ****posts and trolls people on a level that even 4chan can't fully comprehend. 

How... statesmanlike.

He's routinely made bold pronouncements that can't possibly be true. Obvious bravado and exaggeration. AND THEN HE ACHIEVES THOSE GOALS.

Oh, well, as to that, we're all familiar with the blowhard's lies about himself. If people are stupid and gullible enough to believe him and give him money and loyalty, then no amount of disaster and damage and debt left in the man's wake is going to get their attention. His goal in every endeavour so far has been to suck what he can out of the enterprise and leave its bleeding, gaudy corpse behind him. He is good at it. If you think he's actuated by noble, selfless, and patriotic goals, then you're as deluded as the rest.

He said he'd win the Hispanic vote. (A recent poll shows him at 55% among Hispanics.)

There are reasons for that that I understand as a South Texas resident (until recently) whose brother married a Mexican immigrant. There are quite a lot of Hispanics with the attitude of "I got mine, screw you", and who hate the poor, immigrants (yes!), women, and other races. There are a lot of religious Hispanics who would rather see the end of the world than a transman or transwoman use the bathroom, a gay man teach their children in school, a woman live instead of have to die of sepsis from a failed pregnancy (something that I'm sure could never happen here :rolleyes: ), or a needy person get hospital treatment at public expense. Those paragons are your Hispanic Republican supporters.

And lol at people calling him an idiot. I originally thought he entered the race for publicity and marketing reasons. Now, it's quite possible that he could win the damn thing.

It's incredible.

Incredible is a good word for it, all right.

Many of the people who give this joker grudging admiration in public are part of the problem, or they outright admit that they want Trump to win because he's "disruptive". So is a major hurricane or an economic depression or a world war. Don't be one of those people.

K-9

That 55% is Republican Hispanics, not all Hispanics.

Bazzo

Joxer_Daly wrote: »

He said he'd win the Hispanic vote. (A recent poll shows him at 55% among Hispanics.)

Another lie/mistruth from Trumps side, and it again it takes about 10 seconds to completely rubbish. If only more of his supporters decided to sit down at a computer and google the torrents of **** that come pouring out of his mouth rather than blindly believing.

He's MASSIVELY unpopular among Hispanic voters. He claimed to be "number one" with them in Nevada except that 93% of Hispanics didn't actually vote for him. I mean, be real: why would they? He called Mexican immigrants "criminals, drug dealers and rapists" then went back to correct himself saying "some are good." Right, only mostly criminals, drug dealers and rapists then.

Polls nationwide put him as being viewed unfavourably by between 80 and 90 percent of Hispanics.

Seriously, 2 minutes on google.

take everything

OP here again.
Tbh the guy is a clown. And I think it's more the enjoyment of seeing a dishonest political system being taken apart by a clown that amuses me. And the hope that an anarchic meaningless trolling figure might change how politics is done. Sounds nihilistic and irresponsible but a presidency with this guy might at least be interesting. And entertaining.

I dunno. I must've been drunk when I wrote the OP.

K-9

Indeed, the shockingly poor figures need to be spun. NPR reckon if the different demographics vote the usual way and Clinton can take 30% of the male vote, that should clinch it.

She is pretty unpopular among men but that's balanced by Trump being even more unpopular among women. Likeable couple these 2!

Waits for, but I know women who love Trump!

Capt'n Midnight

K-9 wrote: »

That 55% is Republican Hispanics, not all Hispanics.

The big problem is getting your supporters to actually vote.

Only slightly more than half that percentage (28%) of the electorate voted for Obama.

Speedwell

Trump can't even manage his own money, let alone a whole economy: http://www.vox.com/2016/5/14/11671650/how-rich-is-trump

MadYaker

Joxer_Daly wrote: »

He beat the **** out of sixteen governors and senators and made it look easy.

The entire American media edifice is working to destroy him and he's using their efforts for his goals instead of paying for TV ads(that people would just skip over anyway.)

He ****posts and trolls people on a level that even 4chan can't fully comprehend. 

He's routinely made bold pronouncements that can't possibly be true. Obvious bravado and exaggeration. AND THEN HE ACHIEVES THOSE GOALS. He said he'd get 1400+ delegates when people doubted he'd get 1200. (Now he may get closer to 1500.) He said he'd win the Hispanic vote. (A recent poll shows him at 55% among Hispanics.)

And lol at people calling him an idiot. I originally thought he entered the race for publicity and marketing reasons. Now, it's quite possible that he could win the damn thing.

It's incredible.

Originally he did enter for publicity reasons, like he has done in the past. That changed when people starting taking him seriously.

Do you have a link for that poll that puts him at 55% with Hispanics? I find that hard to believe.

The Washington Post have assigned 20 full time journalists to go through the last 40 years of his business dealings in detail. I imagine much dirt will be dug up. Not sure how much good it will do unless they find something colossal, Trump supporters have a blind spot when it comes to negative stories about him. Clinton has an advantage here in that she has spent her whole life in the public eye meaning there can't really be any significant skeletons in her closet, nothing new anyway.

I'm always slightly bemused by people who support Trump. It's impossible to get an in depth detailed answer from anyone as to why they want him to be President. He hasn't really outlined any policies in detail, he constantly contradicts himself and says things that are demonstrably false but none of his supporters seem to care? Most people who seem to support him say that he doesn't mean half the things he says, but if that's the case then how can you agree with him?? How do you know what you are voting for???

Over in the politics forum there was a debate going on about the mexico wall. A Trump supporter was arguing that although he said "wall" what he really meant was using the army to keep illegal immigrants out, including a military buffer zone INSIDE the mexican border, absolutely bizarre stuff. I really can't get my head around it.

Shawn Michaels

He is dangerous in my view but should implode at some stage during what will be a nasty campaign.

My name is URL

Speedwell wrote: »

Trump can't even manage his own money, let alone a whole economy: http://www.vox.com/2016/5/14/11671650/how-rich-is-trump

That article touches on something a lot more serious than how much he claims to be worth.

He (mostly unsuccessfully) sues anyone critical or not-speaking-highly of him. Imagine him with actual political power, the ability to execute and veto laws and the chilling effect it would have on free press.

K-9

A military buffer zone wouldn't go down well either, FEMA trying to take my land the NRA would be all over it.

Turnout will be important, Clinton doesn't really inspire many except those wanting a first female President, whereas Trump excites a lot. It could come down to who people hate most!

wakka12

Bazzo wrote: »

Another lie/mistruth from Trumps side, and it again it takes about 10 seconds to completely rubbish. If only more of his supporters decided to sit down at a computer and google the torrents of **** that come pouring out of his mouth rather than blindly believing.

He's MASSIVELY unpopular among Hispanic voters. He claimed to be "number one" with them in Nevada except that 93% of Hispanics didn't actually vote for him. I mean, be real: why would they? He called Mexican immigrants "criminals, drug dealers and rapists" then went back to correct himself saying "some are good." Right, only mostly criminals, drug dealers and rapists then.

Polls nationwide put him as being viewed unfavourably by between 80 and 90 percent of Hispanics.

Seriously, 2 minutes on google.

Strange that he could even get as much 20% of the hispanic vote considering what he said

wakka12

Also I think he says a lot of the things he says for publicity reasons. Like some of the things he says are just so off the wall, and anybody would know that saying a lot of the things he has already would are career ending. But they only boosted his career and fame