E3 2016 - June 12th to 14th

lawlolawl

wes wrote: »

I honestly would be ok with 1440p at 60fps. Throw in some up scaling for 4K TVs, and I am sure it would look great.

Go away with your realistic targets!

"The highest quality pixels anybody has seen" is what we are aiming for here.

MiskyBoyy

wes wrote: »

You brought up MS head office, and I taught it prudent to point out, that they don't seem to have a clue what there doing themselves.

Nope wasn't me. I never mentioned MS head office. You're confusing me with someone else.

Varik

wes wrote: »

I honestly would be ok with 1440p at 60fps. Throw in some up scaling for 4K TVs, and I am sure it would look great.

Or supersample/downsample to 1080 from 1440 to improve quality there.

FAILSAFE 00

K.O.Kiki wrote: »

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

AMD has less than half of Nvidia's marketshare in gaming GPUs, and is severely outclassed in CPU marketshare by Intel.

http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/press-release-2016apr21.aspx

They're also still losing money.

You do realise that AMD hardware is in both the Xbox One and PS4.

If we even just look at PS4 sales remember that each unit has AMD components.

AMD is dominating the console market.

jcd5971 wrote: »

I assume your talking about the new 14nm chipset polaris?.

If so 3dcenter have spotted shipment leaks pointing at a price ranging from 1400-1700.

There is a cheaper budget polaris for 140 price but is less impressive on stats, but I'm under the impression this is for laptops and cheaper pc's(open to correction).

Again I'm not saying that it's technologically unachievable in a console just it's cost prohibitive

No. I am talking about Vega, not Polaris.

MiskyBoyy

The other part of E3.....

https://twitter.com/PMaka1991/status/743228771256438784

FAILSAFE 00

lawlolawl wrote: »

Awful sales figures and desperate scrambling to give people any reason to buy a One aren't enough reason for you?

18-20 million consoles is far away from awful sales figures. The console isn't even in its 3rd year yet. I am impressed they managed to turn things around.

If you call giving gamers what they want "any reason to buy an Xbox One" then I guess they are guilty. They gave gamers the most requested feature on both PS4 & XB1. Backward compatibility and made it completely free.
You have to pay to rent titles from PS Now if you want to play titles from PS3.

lawlolawl wrote: »

You do realize that MS are more than likely using to Scorpio as a last gasp attempt at capturing the console market before they pull out of it entirely? Head office have been keeping a very close eye on the division according to insiders.

lol, sure.

lawlolawl wrote: »

This forum is about the only place that isn't treating the whole thing as an embarrassing laughing stock. A guy in their mic-drop E3 video said "the highest quality pixels anybody has seen" without a hint of irony.

Its funny.

If thats a reason to not purchase the most powerful console ever I worry for people

Digital Solitude

I dunno where you're going with the most powerful console ever argument. Sure theres a 33% chance of having that with every release anyways, basically 50% now as Ninty has pulled out of the specs pissing contest

"Wow most powerful console ever"

Yeah no ****, they'll hardly release something less powerful than what they have

FAILSAFE 00

Digital Solitude wrote: »

I dunno where you're going with the most powerful console ever argument. Sure theres a 33% chance of having that with every release anyways, basically 50% now as Ninty has pulled out of the specs pissing contest

"Wow most powerful console ever"

Yeah no ****, they'll hardly release something less powerful than what they have

Its just a statement with a limited time frame. Prior to the PS4 launch they were advertising it has the most powerful console ever.

I don't know if Ninty pulled out or was thrown out lol. Like everyone I hope Nintendo can get their next console right. Everyone wants Nintendo to do well. Sadly they have been doing everything they can to annoy their fans. Taking down fans videos on Youtube for playing Nintendo games is just one annoying example.

lawlolawl

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

If you call giving gamers what they want "any reason to buy an Xbox One" then I guess they are guilty. They gave gamers the most requested feature on both PS4 & XB1. Backward compatibility and made it completely free.
You have to pay to rent titles from PS Now if you want to play titles from PS3.

No one is buying a new console to play last gen games.

It's a "whatever" bullet point on a consoles feature list. The Wii U has full back compatibility with the Wii (the 5th biggest selling console of all time) since day one and it is in last place in sales despite coming out a year before both the PS4 and Xbox One. It has been outsold by another noted failure, the PS Vita.

CiDeRmAn

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Yes, and the games will look incredible in glorious native 4k. Sounds great to me.

You don't see PC games that are ONLY for 4k. They work on a wide variety of PCs from entry level to enthusiast.

What they are saying is that all the Scorpio games will run on the Xbox One also. Much the same as a PC games developer making a game that can be played from 4K all the way down to 720p without changing the gameplay experience.

They will simply optimise games to run on the Xbox One.



Your example is ridiculous though. How do PC games do it then.

PC games and gaming has nothing to do with it.
The home console format is XB1.
They want to release a console with a common software format with the XB1 called Scorpio.
They say that any game on Scorpio will also work on the XB1 and, unless you have a 4k display you won't need a Scorpio.
There will not be games on the Scorpio that won't run on the XB1, with the difference being the visuals.
So, if you own an XB1 you will play every game for the Scorpio albeit at a maximum of 1080p.
The Scorpio's only "next gen" credential is the visuals, the games will be the same.
No new exclusive titles.

A PC is a constantly evolving mish mash of hardware and software, with all sorts of legacy issues handled to varying degrees of success.
But a new PC is going to play games that an older PC simply cannot play, there is no compulsion on the part of the developer, publisher or hardware producer to ensure that the PC you buy next year has to play games that run on the PC you bought 3 years ago.
To do so would be to hamstring innovation and result in little more than stagnation.

So, as an example, 4 years hence, GTA7 is released, is it going to be playable on a Scorpio, with all the improvements made possible by the hardware, because if you think so, forget it, it's going to have to run on an XB1 as well.
A PC release doesn't give a monkey's about your 6 year old PC, though due to its architecture at least you could upgrade your PC, no upgrading an XB1 so that is going to be the lowest common denominator in terms of software development.
It would be like if every Xbox 360 game had to run on an original Xbox, albeit graphically simpler, otherwise no dice, it can't be released without breaking with the initial promises.

FAILSAFE 00

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

PC games and gaming has nothing to do with it.
The home console format is XB1.
They want to release a console with a common software format with the XB1 called Scorpio.

Yes, the Xbox OS runs on Windows 10.

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

They say that any game on Scorpio will also work on the XB1 and, unless you have a 4k display you won't need a Scorpio.

Correct. The Xbox One version of any game will run at a much lower resolution. The gameplay experience wont change but the graphics will.

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

There will not be games on the Scorpio that won't run on the XB1, with the difference being the visuals.

There will obviously come a time when the Xbox One is replaced by another Xbox One revision. Not difficult to see.

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

So, if you own an XB1 you will play every game for the Scorpio albeit at a maximum of 1080p.
The Scorpio's only "next gen" credential is the visuals, the games will be the same.

Which is huge benefit. When you play games at 1440p and 4k native you'll understand.

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

No new exclusive titles.

There will of course be new Xbox exclusives. They will be amazing with 4K visuals and still quite nice at 1080p.

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

A PC is a constantly evolving mish mash of hardware and software, with all sorts of legacy issues handled to varying degrees of success.
But a new PC is going to play games that an older PC simply cannot play, there is no compulsion on the part of the developer, publisher or hardware producer to ensure that the PC you buy next year has to play games that run on the PC you bought 3 years ago.
To do so would be to hamstring innovation and result in little more than stagnation.

Well its much simpler than that on Xbox. A base model and a premium model.
All running Xbox OS on Windows 10.
You would have to go many years ahead to find a title that Xbox Scorpio can run that Xbox One cannot.

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

So, as an example, 4 years hence, GTA7 is released, is it going to be playable on a Scorpio, with all the improvements made possible by the hardware, because if you think so, forget it, it's going to have to run on an XB1 as well.
A PC release doesn't give a monkey's about your 6 year old PC, though due to its architecture at least you could upgrade your PC, no upgrading an XB1 so that is going to be the lowest common denominator in terms of software development.
It would be like if every Xbox 360 game had to run on an original Xbox, albeit graphically simpler, otherwise no dice, it can't be released without breaking with the initial promises.

There could be a revision of the base model at that stage. Its happens with ranges of tech like smartphones all the time.

FAILSAFE 00

lawlolawl wrote: »

No one is buying a new console to play last gen games.

It's a "whatever" bullet point on a consoles feature list. The Wii U has full back compatibility with the Wii (the 5th biggest selling console of all time) since day one and it is in last place in sales despite coming out a year before both the PS4 and Xbox One. It has been outsold by another noted failure, the PS Vita.

The Wii U is a bad example. Nintendo's lack of third party support was one of the major nails in the coffin for it.

The Xbox 360 sold 84 million units so It's a major benefit to be able to play Xbox 360 games on the Xbox One and PS4 users wanted the same thing when it came to PS3.

Digital Solitude

Where is 1440p entering the equation? I must have missed that, not a hope they'll have 1440p native, who owns a 1440p TV, never mind 4k

Its dead Jim

Don't own either console (yay master race) but Sony were probably my favourite out of the big 3. Microsoft showing all games going to PC was good but they wouldn't have convinced me to buy an Xbox. God of war, the android heavy rain game and horizon are interesting.

I wish EA would stop teasing us with mass effect. Either show something new or don't get my hopes up. VR is being accepted by some major companies. Hope we'll see skyrim VR or ES6 VR. Currently VR is a bit gimmicky but has promise.

Deano7788

I don't think he's saying no new Xbox exclusives, although if they are also on PC technically that's true.

There'll be no Scorpio exclusives, i.e. no games for Scorpio that aren't playable on an X1 also. Hence they'll be hamstrung in areas other than graphics by the lowest common denominator.

FAILSAFE 00

Deano7788 wrote: »

I don't think he's saying no new Xbox exclusives, although if they are also on PC technically that's true.

There'll be no Scorpio exclusives, i.e. no games for Scorpio that aren't playable on an X1 also. Hence they'll be hamstrung in areas other than graphics by the lowest common denominator.

I understood and mentioned that most likely we will see Xbox One revisions. Which will take care of any future needs as they arise.

Deano7788

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I understood and mentioned that most likely we will see Xbox One revisions. Which will take care of any future needs as they arise.

And what has Phil Spencer said that has led you to this belief can I ask? Because all we have got to go on is what he has said currently and there's no mention of that. It would in fact seem to go against the spirit of what he's said.

I'd love the Scorpio to be a success, just like any console to be honest, but would be worried they may be limiting the games developed for it in the future. I'd prefer clean breaks between generations to a degree.

I'll wait for more info though before I think anything conclusive but would not be sold on it yet personally.

FAILSAFE 00

Deano7788 wrote: »

And what has Phil Spencer said that has led you to this belief can I ask? Because all we have got to go on is what he has said currently and there's no mention of that. It would in fact seem to go against the spirit of what he's said.

I'd love the Scorpio to be a success, just like any console to be honest, but would be worried they may be limiting the games developed for it in the future. I'd prefer clean breaks between generations to a degree.

I'll wait for more info though before I think anything conclusive but would not be sold on it yet personally.

When he speaks about blurred lines between gens and the way that he talks about having no further traditional generations but instead having upgrades. Remember the interview weeks ago where people thought the Xbox One going to get upgrades.

This is from back in February.

http://www.polygon.com/2016/5/25/11774294/xbox-one-slim-one-two-scorpio

Xbox head Phil Spencer, during a keynote at an event in February of this year, suggested the possibility of new Xbox hardware that followed a different path from previous generational transitions. "We can effectively feel a little bit more like we see on PC, where I can still go back and run my old Doom and Quake games that I used to play years ago but I can still see the best 4K games come out and my library is always with me," Spencer said. "Hardware innovation continues while the software innovation is able to take advantage and I don't have to jump a generation and lose everything that I played on before."

Makes perfect sense and I'd expect Sony to do the same if they come out with a 4k Playstation.

FAILSAFE 00

FAILSAFE 00 wrote:

Microsoft have said its a native 4k gaming machine so we know thats what the finished product will be. Their promo video right out of the gate says native 4K gaming. They will work with their partners AMD to come up with hardware to do so.

Don't be so naive... it's called hype. 4K is the latest buzzword and Phil Spencer is dropping that buzzword as much as he can.

FAILSAFE 00 wrote:

The Xbox One version of any game will run at a much lower resolution. The gameplay experience wont change but the graphics will.

That's debatable... I would say the game content won't (or shouldn't) change, but I really find it hard to believe the experience won't change. Perhaps this one is a little subjective - personally I find better graphics (meaning framerate/resolution) provide a far more immersive experience.

FAILSAFE 00 wrote:

There will obviously come a time when the Xbox One is replaced by another Xbox One revision. Not difficult to see.

And the fanboys will whore themselves out to that one too :P

FAILSAFE 00 wrote:

The Wii U is a bad example. Nintendo's lack of third party support was one of the major nails in the coffin for it.

Not to mention complete lack of clarity on what it actually was - many people thought it was an add-on for the original Wii. To be fair, Microsoft have been very transparent that they have two new console variations in the pipeline. It would have been terrible had they announced Scorpio a few months after people had stumped up the cash for Xbox One S.

FAILSAFE 00 wrote:

Xbox head Phil Spencer, during a keynote at an event in February of this year, suggested the possibility of new Xbox hardware that followed a different path from previous generational transitions. "We can effectively feel a little bit more like we see on PC, where I can still go back and run my old Doom and Quake games that I used to play years ago but I can still see the best 4K games come out and my library is always with me," Spencer said. "Hardware innovation continues while the software innovation is able to take advantage and I don't have to jump a generation and lose everything that I played on before."

Makes perfect sense and I'd expect Sony to do the same if they come out with a 4k Playstation.

Absolutely. Makes perfect sense to me too. (Aside: it's easy to read Phil's quote and think he's only talking about backwards compatibility there.)

FAILSAFE 00

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't be so naive... it's called hype. 4K is the latest buzzword and Phil Spencer is dropping that buzzword as much as he can.

If he was saying 5k then we could say its hype but 4k isn't such a shocker. Fair play to Microsoft for taking the initiative and risk to go for it and not just create a slight revision like the PS Neo.

Deleted User wrote: »

That's debatable... I would say the game content won't (or shouldn't) change, but I really find it hard to believe the experience won't change. Perhaps this one is a little subjective - personally I find better graphics (meaning framerate/resolution) provide a far more immersive experience.

You already see examples of it such as Battlefield 4. At 4k it looks amazing and at 900p on PS4 it doesn't as good but it doesn't takeaway from the gameplay experience.

Penn

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

When he speaks about blurred lines between gens and the way that he talks about having no further traditional generations but instead having upgrades. Remember the interview weeks ago where people thought the Xbox One going to get upgrades.

Once again, Phil Spencer in that Euro gamer interview from this week, said the exact opposite of that:

"And we want to make sure just like when you're buying your music today, you don't worry about upgrading to a new phone that somehow won't play your old songs or your new songs. We think about your Xbox One collection of games that will move with you between those different consoles."

_Redzer_

FAILSAFE, you appear to only hear what you want to hear and make up what you want to believe

dunworth1

_Redzer_ wrote:

FAILSAFE, you appear to only hear what you want to hear and make up what you want to believe

And many posters appear to be Pro Sony and enjoy bashing Microsoft every chance they get.

I can fully understand the points failsafe has stated

It's ps4 owners who don't want to believe that Microsoft are making a better console

Retr0gamer

dunworth1 wrote: »

And many posters appear to be Pro Sony and enjoy bashing Microsoft every chance they get.

I can fully understand the points failsafe has stated

It's ps4 owners who don't want to believe that Microsoft are making a better console

In terms of hardware yes. The problem people have is if the console even has a purpose. Also the best hardware has never guaranteed success in the market and mid gen console upgrades have traditionally ended un tears.

CiDeRmAn

I'm format agnostic, I go where the games go.
I've all the current formats and pretty much all the formats up to this point.
I have an abiding affection for Nintendo, but the MS, Sony, Sega, Atari and all the others have been my goto consoles over the years.
With that in mind....

Unless you own a 4k TV there will be no advantage in owning a Scorpio, with no games there that you cannot experience on a XB1.
So, a bit like if you don't have a 4k monitor your games are going to play just fine on your PC, albeit at 1080p.

But, a PC with such power as to push 4k visuals and innovative gameplay is going to not need to be limited by a need to run the same games as the 6 year old ancestor.
The Scorpio will.

Better that the Scorpio is a whole new format, with backwards compatibility.
Just consider the lifespan of the XB1 to have been ended with the Scorpio launch and allow the new machine to spread it's wings.
A console with the power to push high framerate visuals at 4k could be devastating and unassailable if it was pushing 1080p at 60fps instead, with all that power doing something more useful, like gameplay.

CiDeRmAn

Retr0gamer wrote: »

In terms of hardware yes. The problem people have is if the console even has a purpose. Also the best hardware has never guaranteed success in the market and mid gen console upgrades have traditionally ended un tears.

32X FTW!

Penn

dunworth1 wrote: »

And many posters appear to be Pro Sony and enjoy bashing Microsoft every chance they get.

I can fully understand the points failsafe has stated

It's ps4 owners who don't want to believe that Microsoft are making a better console

Nobody is denying the Scorpio will be a better console in terms of performance etc. I have absolutely no qualms about saying so and have said that or similar several times.

What I strongly disagree with though are some of the claims being thrown about which are the complete opposite of what MS themselves are saying. Completely hypobolic and devoid of any basis in fact.

Why? Why not just celebrate the Scorpio and what MS are planning for it? Why try and claim the Scorpio is more than it is? More than Phil Spencer and MS are claiming it is?

Grayditch

dunworth1 wrote: »

It's ps4 owners who don't want to believe that Microsoft are making a better console

It's kinda just most people who straight up don't believe it's going to be great.

dunworth1

Grayditch wrote:

It's kinda just most people who straight up don't believe it's going to be great.

But why is that?

Remember the original xbox and xbox 360? Remember how great they were?

Is it really difficult to think that Ms could make another great console?

The console war is a good thing for consumers. No doubt Ms know that Sony are beating then this time around
Just like Ms beat Sony last time with the 360

The people who design these things are normally pretty Smart Microsoft took a gamble and tried something with the xb1 it wasn't a great success

So i would think that they went to the drawing board/ market research and came up with Hank (yes that's what I think it should have been called)

Microsoft have a lot of money I don't think its crazy to think that they could subsidise a product for it to become a loss leader

Grayditch

I'm mean from a technical standpoint, they will make a beast console. The Xbox one is a fine console from a technical standpoint too. But the company lost love due to being shady. Pushing the Kinect on people, then pulling it. Sending mixed messages with this one.

They're slacking on strong exclusives as always. When you're on part 4 of a series like Gears Of War, I stop getting excited. When I say I don't believe this to be great, I mean the deal as a whole. I reckon people will stick with PS4, or move to PC. It has not enticed me, but I might look at at One S down the line sometimes if they come out with some must have games.