E3 2016 - June 12th to 14th

FAILSAFE 00

Penn wrote: »

Nobody is denying the Scorpio will be a better console in terms of performance etc. I have absolutely no qualms about saying so and have said that or similar several times.

What I strongly disagree with though are some of the claims being thrown about which are the complete opposite of what MS themselves are saying. Completely hypobolic and devoid of any basis in fact.

Why? Why not just celebrate the Scorpio and what MS are planning for it? Why try and claim the Scorpio is more than it is? More than Phil Spencer and MS are claiming it is?

What claims have been made??

How am I claiming Scorpio is more than it is?

Its a 4k gaming console. Simples.

FAILSAFE 00

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Fair play to Microsoft for taking the initiative and risk to go for it and not just create a slight revision like the PS Neo.

What can you possibly have based that statement on...? Nobody has idea what the final machines will be like; MS have an incredibly vague spec, and Sony have no spec at all.

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

You already see examples of it such as Battlefield 4. At 4k it looks amazing and at 900p on PS4 it doesn't as good but it doesn't takeaway from the gameplay experience.

And at 720p on Xbox One, it's worse again. Anyway, like I said, it's subjective.

dunworth1 wrote: »

And many posters appear to be Pro Sony and enjoy bashing Microsoft every chance they get.

While you do have a point, it's damn good fun.

dunworth1 wrote: »

I can fully understand the points failsafe has stated

So can I. What I can't understand is what he's basing those points on (see his quote in this post).

dunworth1 wrote: »

It's ps4 owners who don't want to believe that Microsoft are making a better console

Better is way too vague. Technically superior - absolutely. But it's still a Windows 10 OS... it'll still be a chore to use. We'll have to wait and see about the games.

FAILSAFE 00

Penn wrote: »

Once again, Phil Spencer in that Euro gamer interview from this week, said the exact opposite of that:

"And we want to make sure just like when you're buying your music today, you don't worry about upgrading to a new phone that somehow won't play your old songs or your new songs. We think about your Xbox One collection of games that will move with you between those different consoles."

You can keep quoting Phil all week

He's trying to reassure people that their older games from older Xbox One consoles will still be supported in the future. Read the last sentence you posted.
It's a very simple strategy to insure they keep Xbox One and Xbox One S selling.

Falthyron

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

You can keep quoting Phil all week

He's trying to reassure people that their older games from older Xbox One consoles will still be supported in the future. Read the last sentence you posted.
It's a very simple strategy to insure they keep Xbox One and Xbox One S selling.

Has there ever been a time when executives promise too much, forced to backtrack on some features, or simply overstated something? You are getting extremely excited for something we know very little about. Is '6 Teraflops' the new unstoppable buzzword whereby invoking it ends the discussion? PC graphics cards surpassed that years ago and we still can't get 4K at 60fps, why does a company, which has on occasion let its customers down, all of a sudden make you think this is the second coming?

Here are the facts: 6 Teraflops; December 2018; Project Scorpio; games will play on both systems. How can you deduce this as a world beater from such minimal information? Moreover, PCs will be achieving 4K at 60fps by the time it is out and I would bet 100 euro right now, no console, be it Hank Scorpio or PS4.5 will be doing that unless you see a serious downgrade of visual quality to achieve those numbers.

Your approach to this is quite bizarre. Be excited, sure. But speculation can only take you so far before you start to look a bit...crazy? :P

lawlolawl

dunworth1 wrote: »

No doubt Ms know that Sony are beating then this time around
Just like Ms beat Sony last time with the 360

It was pretty much even by the end, despite the 360 launching a year earlier and being cheaper than the PS3 through most of its life cycle.

It wasn't <20 million Ones vs. >40 million PS4s barely 3 years in. MS are getting demolished and are getting run out of the console business because they don't have a clue when faced with real competition.

And rightly so because the One is a godawful console on multiple levels with no good exclusive games. Halo, Gears et al are dated garbage that most people couldn't give two ****s about. The Wii U hammers both the PS4 and One for good exclusives at the moment but Nintendo aren't taken seriously by anyone other than handheld gamers any more.

Sony are killing it by just letting PlayStation be PlayStation like the good old days. MS trying to change the console market to suit their vision is failing miserably and it will cause them to take their ball and go home.

FAILSAFE 00

Falthyron wrote: »

Has there ever been a time when executives promise too much, forced to backtrack on some features, or simply overstated something? You are getting extremely excited for something we know very little about. Is '6 Teraflops' the new unstoppable buzzword whereby invoking it ends the discussion? PC graphics cards surpassed that years ago and we still can't get 4K at 60fps, why does a company, which has on occasion let its customers down, all of a sudden make you think this is the second coming?

Here are the facts: 6 Teraflops; December 2018; Project Scorpio; games will play on both systems. How can you deduce this as a world beater from such minimal information? Moreover, PCs will be achieving 4K at 60fps by the time it is out and I would bet 100 euro right now, no console, be it Hank Scorpio or PS4.5 will be doing that unless you see a serious downgrade of visual quality to achieve those numbers.

Your approach to this is quite bizarre. Be excited, sure. But speculation can only take you so far before you start to look a bit...crazy? :P

I am not excited at all

My first thought while watching the promo was no way that comsole will do native 4k and then they just came out and said those very words :eek:

Microsoft should be commended for making a bold leap forward.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwFvJog2dMw

FAILSAFE 00

lawlolawl wrote: »

It was pretty much even by the end, despite the 360 launching a year earlier and being cheaper than the PS3 through most of its life cycle.

It wasn't <20 million Ones vs. >40 million PS4s barely 3 years in. MS are getting demolished and are getting run out of the console business because they don't have a clue when faced with real competition.

And rightly so because the One is a godawful console on multiple levels with no good exclusive games. Halo, Gears et al are dated garbage that most people couldn't give two ****s about. The Wii U hammers both the PS4 and One for good exclusives at the moment but Nintendo aren't taken seriously by anyone other than handheld gamers any more.

Sony are killing it by just letting PlayStation be PlayStation like the good old days. MS trying to change the console market to suit their vision is failing miserably and it will cause them to take their ball and go home.

Wow, you really dislike the Xbox One

Pack it in Microsoft lol

johnny_ultimate

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I am not excited at all

Having at this point written a novella's worth of content about the console, you could have fooled us all

FAILSAFE 00

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Having at this point written a novella's worth of content about the console, you could have fooled us all

I simply enjoy a good debate about new gaming tech and its impact and just any good discussion about gaming in general.

ItsHoggie

Is there any inbetween with 1080p and 4K? Like didn't PS4 and Xbox One say they would get 1080p and failed (on some games) and had to drop down to 900 or 720.
Can that happen with 4K or will it be a case of they have to hit 4K?.

Retr0gamer

1440p is a decent compromise.

Or you could go super wide like me with 3440 x 1440p... which my 970 can't handle with new games

Penn

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

What claims have been made??

How am I claiming Scorpio is more than it is?

Its a 4k gaming console. Simples.

You've claimed it's a next gen console (it's not)

You've claimed they'll replace the Xbox One with new entry models to keep up with games with higher requirements (they've clearly said games will be playable on the existing Xbox Ones)

You've claimed they'll keep upgrading the same system in the same way phones do (they specifically said they won't)

You've claimed there'll be Xbox exclusives which will run on Scorpio and new revisions of Xbox One (they've clearly said games will be playable on the existing Xbox Ones, not revisions)

You've claimed Phil Spencer keeps the promises he makes while also dismissing stuff he's said as PR Speak and Hype which will likely change

Venom

Retr0gamer wrote: »

1440p is a decent compromise.

Or you could go super wide like me with 3440 x 1440p... which my 970 can't handle with new games

Scaling resolutions would be the way to go you would think except MS have said this wouldn't happen for some insane reason.

Doge

Retr0gamer wrote: »

The Xbox 360 and PS3 were native 1080p machines that promised 1080p gaming. How many triple A games hit that target?

Even the Xbox one Struggles to hit that target ffs!

FAILSAFE 00

Penn wrote: »

You've claimed it's a next gen console (it's not)

What you mean is I have shared my opinion regarding these points.

For me its a next generation console. Its never been done before and its breaking new ground.

Penn wrote: »

You've claimed they'll replace the Xbox One with new entry models to keep up with games with higher requirements (they've clearly said games will be playable on the existing Xbox Ones)

Opinion dude
That is how I believe Microsoft will sell future console hardware.

Penn wrote: »

You've claimed they'll keep upgrading the same system in the same way phones do (they specifically said they won't)

Nope, they didn't unless you can prove otherwise.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-06-15-xbox-boss-phil-spencer-the-big-interview

Read Phil's answer below. You have even posted it here many times already.

Phil Spencer wrote:

don't worry about upgrading to a new phone that somehow won't play your old songs or your new songs. We think about your Xbox One collection of games that will move with you between those different consoles.

He isn't saying they wont be updating like phones he is saying you don't have to worry about updating because you can bring your library with you.

Penn wrote: »

You've claimed there'll be Xbox exclusives which will run on Scorpio and new revisions of Xbox One (they've clearly said games will be playable on the existing Xbox Ones, not revisions)
Yes thats correct but that will change in a few years. A revision is still an Xbox One.

I say there will always be an entry model and a premium model. Its really the only way this can work in the future. Especially with their blurry lines between gens statement.

Penn wrote: »

You've claimed Phil Spencer keeps the promises he makes while also dismissing stuff he's said as PR Speak and Hype which will likely change

Thats right. He has delivered consistantely since taking over the Xbox division so he has earned much respect from Xbox gamers. Well earned in my opinion.

His role requires major PR skills. I expect him to talk the talk. Its all part of the job.

FAILSAFE 00

Great watch.

Microsoft gets a very decent nod from Total Biscuit. More specifically the Scorpio. He also compliments the Sony show.

Enjoy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Qg_93l1v5s

tok9

Going through the last few pages of this thread has been a serious struggle.

There was a lot more to E3 than the Scorpio announcement.

MiskyBoyy

tok9 wrote: »

Going through the last few pages of this thread has been a serious struggle.

There was a lot more to E3 than the Scorpio announcement.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057610336

lertsnim

It's great that I won't have to buy an XBox One for upcoming "exclusives". Good move Microsoft as I am looking forward to the new Forza.

Benzino

lertsnim wrote: »

It's great that I won't have to buy an XBox One for upcoming "exclusives". Good move Microsoft as I am looking forward to the new Forza.

Yeah, it's great news. No need to buy an Xbox to play Gears now Probably not the best news for the Xbox platform, but great for consumers.

dunworth1

lawlolawl wrote:

It wasn't 40 million PS4s barely 3 years in. MS are getting demolished and are getting run out of the console business because they don't have a clue when faced with real competition.

Ah here do you work for Sony?

It's well known that the 360 beat the ps3
And you are comparing something that was on sale for almost 10 years with something on sale for 3

Retr0gamer

dunworth1 wrote: »

It's well known that the 360 beat the ps3

No, it's not well known because it's not correct. The 360 initially hammered the PS3 but it caught up and in the end the PS3 has sold a lot more than the 360.

Grayditch

I'm not sure how it affected sales, but most people I know were on their second Xbox 360 at least . I know I had 2 give up on me.

Retr0gamer

Probably pushed up sales quite a bit but there were similar issues with the PS3 even if it wasn't as prevalent.

I'm sure it contributed a hell of a lot to the PS2 sales which had near 360 level failure rates as well

Penn

Grayditch wrote: »

I'm not sure how it affected sales, but most people I know were on their second Xbox 360 at least . I know I had 2 give up on me.

I had 3 360s (well, only bought 2, my first one RROD'd so was sent away and replaced) and 2 PS3s (not for failure though, bought second for the 500GB HDD and gave my old one to my brother as his did fail).

I always thought that by the end the sales of 360 and PS3 were pretty much equal (within a few percent anyway) Both around the 85m mark. I suppose you could argue it either way between how long each was on the market, hardware failures for both, where sales were strongest etc, but I think you'd be hard pushed to really consider it anything other than a draw in terms of console sales.

K.O.Kiki

Penn wrote: »

I had 3 360s (well, only bought 2, my first one RROD'd so was sent away and replaced) and 2 PS3s (not for failure though, bought second for the 500GB HDD and gave my old one to my brother as his did fail).

I always thought that by the end the sales of 360 and PS3 were pretty much equal (within a few percent anyway) Both around the 85m mark. I suppose you could argue it either way between how long each was on the market, hardware failures for both, where sales were strongest etc, but I think you'd be hard pushed to really consider it anything other than a draw in terms of console sales.

IMHO people think the Xbox 360 sold better are because most reports are from the US.

Penn

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Nope, they didn't unless you can prove otherwise.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-06-15-xbox-boss-phil-spencer-the-big-interview

Read Phil's answer below. You have even posted it here many times already.

He isn't saying they wont be updating like phones he is saying you don't have to worry about updating because you can bring your library with you.

I saw Aaron Greenberg tweeted to say there will be no Scorpio exclusives. Is that right?

Phil Spencer: That's right. When you're buying a console game from us, you know that console game will run on your original Xbox. No-one gets left behind. We said that on stage. Your Xbox One S and Scorpio. That's an important design point for us. They're all part of the same family. And we want to make sure just like when you're buying your music today, you don't worry about upgrading to a new phone that somehow won't play your old songs or your new songs. We think about your Xbox One collection of games that will move with you between those different consoles.

In fact, somebody today will have an Xbox One, and when Scorpio comes out they will buy Scorpio and they will put Xbox One in a different room, and we're obviously going to make sure that as they move between rooms that they've got access to the same games.

He's clearly saying the games for the Scorpio will have to work on your existing XB1 too. He's not just talking about older games being playable on the Scorpio, he's talking about newer games being playable on the existing XB1.

FAILSAFE 00

Penn wrote: »

He's clearly saying the games for the Scorpio will have to work on your existing XB1 too. He's not just talking about older games being playable on the Scorpio, he's talking about newer games being playable on the existing XB1.

Ageed. However you were saying that they'd never be upgarding like phones which is actually their new console sales model. In a few years all the models will be replaced.

If they wanted to blur the lines even more they could simply update the existing consoles like a revision so the Xbox One gets a new model and the Scorpio gets a new model.

There has been a further clarification from Phil Spencer from a separate interview after Eurogamer so I'll post that here.

Falthyron

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

My first thought while watching the promo was no way that comsole will do native 4k and then they just came out and said those very words :eek:

But, why do you believe them? They haven't shown us a game running on it in 4K. Surely you should be applying some critical thinking here and questioning their claims? Of course they are going to oversell themselves. Unfortunately 'truth' is subjective in the world of big corporations. Phil Spencer was unlikely to come out on stage and announce Hank Scorpio as: "Probably the most powerful console. Its what we are aiming for, but who knows? We might have to backtrack to save on costs and we don't have a clue what Sony are doing, so we are really just hoping for the best."

Microsoft also came out and said TV is going to be a key pillar in the next generation of consoles (this generation). Did you believe that? They said HD-DVD was the future for a number of reasons. They said the Xbox wouldn't support second hand games and that you will need to be always online.

I'm not ragging on MS, I quite liked their show - it was decent. But, I don't understand your blind defence of MS and Project Second Coming? Surely the sensible approach would be: "Hopefully, it will do what they say, but with almost no evidence so far, and a history of fúck-ups, I am inclined to be skeptical?"

FAILSAFE 00

Falthyron wrote: »

But, why do you believe them? They haven't shown us a game running on it in 4K. Surely you should be applying some critical thinking here and questioning their claims? Of course they are going to oversell themselves. Unfortunately 'truth' is subjective in the world of big corporations. Phil Spencer was unlikely to come out on stage and announce Hank Scorpio as: "Probably the most powerful console. Its what we are aiming for, but who knows? We might have to backtrack to save on costs and we don't have a clue what Sony are doing, so we are really just hoping for the best."

Microsoft also came out and said TV is going to be a key pillar in the next generation of consoles (this generation). Did you believe that? They said HD-DVD was the future for a number of reasons. They said the Xbox wouldn't support second hand games and that you will need to be always online.

I'm not ragging on MS, I quite liked their show - it was decent. But, I don't understand your blind defence of MS and Project Second Coming? Surely the sensible approach would be: "Hopefully, it will do what they say, but with almost no evidence so far, and a history of fúck-ups, I am inclined to be skeptical?"

Its not that difficult to see.

If Sony came out and said they'd be doing a 4K games console I'd think the same way. I wouldn't doubt it for a second.

Microsoft is clearly trying to put a machine together that will not be dated for sometime. Look at Sony who will now have to sell a further 2 updated consoles to come close to the Scorpio. I am sure a move like this is saving Microsoft money in the long run.

As gamers we all expected a 4K gaming console just not this soon.