Gardai identify new speed enforcement zones in Limerick

Mc Love

The money making racket argument is when they are straight roads or around a bend or in a place where the speed limit drops from 100 to 60 etc "shooting fish in a barrel"

LimerickCity

Mc Love wrote: »

The money making racket argument is when they are straight roads or around a bend or in a place where the speed limit drops from 100 to 60 etc "shooting fish in a barrel"

.

LimerickCity

They can only operate in so called zones. Accident black spots All advertised zones. Be they around a corner, on a straight road or when the speed limit drops, my argument stands. We all know where the zones are. Stick to the speed limit and you have nothing to worry about. If people did that the vans would not generate a cent. The Gardai show zero tolerance on speeding or dangerous driving and rightly so. Too many people dying on our roads.

phill106

LimerickCity wrote: »

There was a guy killed on the Condell Road a few years ago. Had their been a speed detection van on the road then someone's brother, father or son could still be alive. Speak to that man's surviving family members and see how they feel.

The zones are made public for a reason, to save lives.

We all know where these speed zones are so nobody should ever get caught speeding.

Pretty simple.

As a person who has lost a loved one to a fatal accident I cannot for the life of me understand the money making argument with these go safe vans.

We all know where the zones are.

Slow down and stick to the speed limit.

While speed can be a contributing factor, do you know for a certainty that speed was a factor in that crash?
Could just as easy be bad overtaking?

LimerickCity

There is a continuous white line the length of the Condell Road so you cannot overtake however if it was bad overtaking then the presence of a go safe van would most likely have prevented this as people flash lights and the general behaviour of drivers immediately improves.

All of the go safe vans operate on road where people have been killed or seriously injured.

Speak to any member of the emergency services who has had to attend the scene of a fatal accident.

Speed kills.

Slow down.

hobie14

Coming into town from Setrights you will often see a Van, just before the road splits for the Shannon Tunnel ...... the fast guys all slow down as they approach the Van parking area and as soon as they pass it they floor it!!!! ..... :rolleyes:

Cookiemunster

phill106 wrote: »

While speed can be a contributing factor, do you know for a certainty that speed was a factor in that crash?
Could just as easy be bad overtaking?

I'm pretty sure that crash had nothing to do with speed. IIRC an artic driver fell ill and swerved across the road into a car, killing the driver. http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/irish-news/man-dies-following-limerick-road-crash-26553753.html

Cookiemunster

LimerickCity wrote: »

There is a continuous white line the length of the Condell Road so you cannot overtake however if it was bad overtaking then the presence of a go safe van would most likely have prevented this as people flash lights and the general behaviour of drivers immediately improves.

All of the go safe vans operate on road where people have been killed or seriously injured.

Speak to any member of the emergency services who has had to attend the scene of a fatal accident.

Speed kills.

Slow down.

There's a camera stationed inbound on the Condell Rd on the 60km section. There's never been a fatal accident there.
I've been driving to Shannon for 20 years. I've never seen a fatal accident on the dual carriage way before the new junction. There have been a few fatal accidents a few kms back at Setrights, but I've never seen the van before Setrights.
There is no justification for a speed camera where it is stationed on the dual carriageway. It's a money racket.

LimerickCity

A collision between and arctic and the deceased car. I remember the day it happened.

My reference to the speed van is that driver behaviour improves immediately when they are made aware that they are in the vicinity.

LimerickCity

Cookiemunster wrote: »

LimerickCity wrote: »

There is a continuous white line the length of the Condell Road so you cannot overtake however if it was bad overtaking then the presence of a go safe van would most likely have prevented this as people flash lights and the general behaviour of drivers immediately improves.

All of the go safe vans operate on road where people have been killed or seriously injured.

Speak to any member of the emergency services who has had to attend the scene of a fatal accident.

Speed kills.

Slow down.

There's a camera stationed inbound on the Condell Rd on the 60km section. There's never been a fatal accident there.
I've been driving to Shannon for 20 years. I've never seen a fatal accident on the dual carriage way before the new junction. There have been a few fatal accidents a few kms back at Setrights, but I've never seen the van before Setrights.
There is no justification for a speed camera where it is stationed on the dual carriageway. It's a money racket.

The justification is to prevent people breaking the law by speeding.
If people drive within the speed limit there is no money to be made only lives to be saved.

Cookiemunster

LimerickCity wrote: »

A collision between and arctic and the deceased car. I remember the day it happened.

My reference to the speed van is that driver behaviour improves immediately when they are made aware that they are in the vicinity.

Driver behaviour had nothing to do with that accident so a speed van would have made no difference.

LimerickCity wrote: »

If people drive within the speed limit there is no money to be made only lives to be saved.

On a dual carriageway the speed limit 100km. If you hit someone at that speed you will kill them. At the current speed trap on the Condell Road the speed limit is 60km. You can kill someone if you hit them at 60kmph. Driving withing the speed limit does not mean that lives will be saved.

It's way too simplistic to say that speed kills. There are many reasons for fatal crashes such as bad driving, bad roads, conditions and speed.

Some roads are 80kmph when they should be nowhere near that, but you'll see no vans on them because it's too dangerous to put them there. Some roads have ridicously low speeds limits, but are guaranteed to have vans on them.

Special Circumstances

LimerickCity wrote: »

A collision between and arctic and the deceased car. I remember the day it happened.

My reference to the speed van is that driver behaviour improves immediately when they are made aware that they are in the vicinity.

That had nothing to do with speed, unless you define inappropriate speed to be anything above walking or cycling speed? Maybe you want everyone to drive with a manservant walking ahead of them with a flag or a lamp. Ban trucks maybe?

You can never remove all accidents from the roads. Using that accident to justify a speed van there is like using a fatality due to someone driving the wrong way on a motorway as justification for one. It undermines the credibility of the system completely.

Mc Love

Driver behaviour doesnt improve at all. Some of the speed limits on the roads are ridiculous too. 60 zones on roads that should be 80 etc.

phill106

i've been driving from shannon to limerick for 20 years, dont recall any fatal crash at ballymorris. Well except for a cow. I'm not sure how fast the cow was moving though, so speed could have been a factor.
One is permanently parked by castlecabin on the dublin road coming into the national technological park, dont recall any crashes there, although i do remember one by the kilmurray roundabout.

Mc Love

phill106 wrote: »

i've been driving from shannon to limerick for 20 years, dont recall any fatal crash at ballymorris. Well except for a cow. I'm not sure how fast the cow was moving though, so speed could have been a factor.
One is permanently parked by castlecabin on the dublin road coming into the national technological park, dont recall any crashes there, although i do remember one by the kilmurray roundabout.

Exactly but as our LimerickCity says if you are doing the speed limit you wont get caught. But thats a prime spot for the cash van

phill106

Mc Love wrote: »

Exactly but as our LimerickCity says if you are doing the speed limit you wont get caught. But thats a prime spot for the cash van

I dont dispute that, i passed them today with no issue. My issue is the false reasoning that they are putting it where fatal accidents have occured.

LimerickCity

Let me clear things up lads.

The go safe vans are located in areas that have had fatal or or serious accidents.

I totally understand what you are saying with respect to where they are positioned, driver behaviour, speed limits on excellent road surfaces etc.

In fact i had the very same opinion up until a few years ago when i rang the Gardai at Henry Street to complain about the go safe van outside the post office on the Dock Road.

A high ranking member of the traffic division called me back a few days later and spent almost 45 minutes on the phone educating me in the ways of the road, why the need for go safe vans and what it was like to experience a scene of a fatal crash involving kids, men, women et al.

Basically what it boils down to is if you obey the speed limit then you have nothing to worry about. How can the go safe vans be out to catch people when they are located in areas that we are all made aware of.

No matter what argument i put forward his answer was the same "obey the speed limit and you have nothing to worry about".

This member of the Gardai didn't have to waste his time calling me to discuss this matter but he did, it is something that he takes extremely seriously and the conversation changed my opinion entirely.

marno21

Special Circumstances wrote: »

That had nothing to do with speed, unless you define inappropriate speed to be anything above walking or cycling speed? Maybe you want everyone to drive with a manservant walking ahead of them with a flag or a lamp. Ban trucks maybe?

You can never remove all accidents from the roads. Using that accident to justify a speed van there is like using a fatality due to someone driving the wrong way on a motorway as justification for one. It undermines the credibility of the system completely.

Believe it or not, one of the new zones on the M18 is in a region where there's been one fatal accident, caused by an elderly person driving the wrong way down the dual carriageway after being confused by the compact grade separated junction layout.

LimerickCity

phill106 wrote: »

Mc Love wrote: »

Exactly but as our LimerickCity says if you are doing the speed limit you wont get caught. But thats a prime spot for the cash van

I dont dispute that, i passed them today with no issue. My issue is the false reasoning that they are putting it where fatal accidents have occured.

Fatal and serious incidents.

LimerickCity

How will people know where the cameras will be?

GoSafe will only operate on sections of road which have a history of collisions occurring where speed was a contributory factor. The areas where the cameras are operating are available on this Garda website www.garda.ie.

Is this a revenue-generating exercise?

No. The key objective of the project is to reduce the number of speed related collisions and therefore save lives. GoSafe will be paid on the basis of enforcement hours and survey hours conducted. The hourly rates to be paid are not linked in any way to the number of detections made.

What if I believe the speed limit on a road is inappropriate?

Setting speed limits is the statutory function of the local authorities. As part of this project, speed surveys are carried out in all speed enforcement zones. An Garda S och na, the National Roads Authority and local authorities will work together to determine the appropriateness of speed limits within zones.

leakyboots

My issue isn't necessarily with the speed vans, although I do think they pick busy periods to catch more people out - it's the punishment.

You could be marginally, say, 9 kph over the limit (maybe not braked hard enough coming into a lowered zone, or your mind drifts and then you suddenly realise too late that you're doing 70 kph instead of 60 kph) and you get treated the same as someone who is blatantly 30 kph over the limit. Fine and points for 3 years.

I think it should be scaled on the seriousness - less points points for one/two years or something if you're on the lower end.

Poxyshamrock

A man died at Setrights a couple of years back when trying to cross the road by the pedestrian bridge.

Special Circumstances

marno21 wrote: »

Believe it or not, one of the new zones on the M18 is in a region where there's been one fatal accident, caused by an elderly person driving the wrong way down the dual carriageway after being confused by the compact grade separated junction layout.

I know.... I was giving the "speed camera locations are logical and justified" crowd a bit of rope with that one.

LimerickCity

leakyboots wrote: »

My issue isn't necessarily with the speed vans, although I do think they pick busy periods to catch more people out - it's the punishment.

You could be marginally, say, 9 kph over the limit (maybe not braked hard enough coming into a lowered zone, or your mind drifts and then you suddenly realise too late that you're doing 70 kph instead of 60 kph) and you get treated the same as someone who is blatantly 30 kph over the limit. Fine and points for 3 years.

I think it should be scaled on the seriousness - less points points for one/two years or something if you're on the lower end.

You don't get treated the same as someone who is blatantly over the speed limit. A driver going 30 kph over the limit in a 50 or 60 zone would most likely face a court appearance, a hefty fine and possibly a ban.

I am not sure what exactly the leniency is with the go safe vans but the majority of Traffic Cops will give you an extra couple of kph depending on the speed limit.

People are p**sed about points on their license for 3 years but at the end of the day this is designed to save lives.

There has to be zero tolerance for it to work.

LimerickCity

For anyone interested follow @GardaTraffic on Twitter to understand what type of idiots they have to deal with using our roads on a daily basis.

Special Circumstances

LimerickCity wrote: »

People are p**sed about points on their license for 3 years but at the end of the day this is designed to save lives.

There has to be zero tolerance for it to work.

If the area is that dangerous, if zero tolerance is essential - enforce the limit there 100% of the time 24/7. Fixed cameras. Make them ANPR as well, checking tax, insurance, NCT.

moleyv

LimerickCity wrote:

People are p**sed about points on their license for 3 years but at the end of the day this is designed to save lives.

This is just a little too far along the SJW scale for me

Special Circumstances

LimerickCity wrote: »

For anyone interested follow @GardaTraffic on Twitter to understand what type of idiots they have to deal with using our roads on a daily basis.

I'd be far more worried about the "no seatbelts, bald tyres, no insurance" type catches than "170kph in perfect conditions on a dual carriageway".

LimerickCity

Stick to the speed limit mate. Nothing SJW about it.

Special Circumstances

LimerickCity wrote: »

Let me clear things up lads.

The go safe vans are located in areas that have had fatal or or serious accidents.

I totally understand what you are saying with respect to where they are positioned, driver behaviour, speed limits on excellent road surfaces etc.

In fact i had the very same opinion up until a few years ago when i rang the Gardai at Henry Street to complain about the go safe van outside the post office on the Dock Road.

A high ranking member of the traffic division called me back a few days later and spent almost 45 minutes on the phone educating me in the ways of the road, why the need for go safe vans and what it was like to experience a scene of a fatal crash involving kids, men, women et al.

Basically what it boils down to is if you obey the speed limit then you have nothing to worry about. How can the go safe vans be out to catch people when they are located in areas that we are all made aware of.

No matter what argument i put forward his answer was the same "obey the speed limit and you have nothing to worry about".

This member of the Gardai didn't have to waste his time calling me to discuss this matter but he did, it is something that he takes extremely seriously and the conversation changed my opinion entirely.

You certainly have had a "road to damascus" moment, going from ringing up to complain about a van to being a true believer.
To me, this particular post of yours is just a little weird, a bit too pat.