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Any foreign langauge teachers - what should my child know at end of 1st year?

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  • 22-05-2016 5:28pm
    #1
    Jane98
    Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭


    OK I am looking for some advice regarding how to fully assess my child's learning in the foreign language she is studying ( i am purposely omitting the language for fear of identifying the teacher at this time).

    I have serious reservations about this teacher's teaching ability arising from discussions with my child and discussions with other parents. In summary the teacher doesn't do any aural work. They have never listended to any native speakers just the teacher herself. They have used very little of the book that I spent €30 on and it seems to be more about taking down pages and pages of notes.

    So, before I go down the route of making an official complaint, I really want to get my facts straight, so if anyone can give me some advice about what a 1st year should know after one year and what does good teaching of a foreign language look like.

    I am a teacher myself although in Maths.


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    #2
    Kristopherus
    Registered Users Posts: 11,907 ✭✭✭✭Kristopherus


    What kind of results has that teacher been getting?


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    #3
    Jane98
    Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Jane98


    Kristopherus wrote: »
    What kind of results has that teacher been getting?

    Apparently the results are good but i's only because every child is doing grinds.


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    #4
    man_no_plan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,018 ✭✭✭man_no_plan


    Jane98 wrote: »
    Apparently the results are good but i's only because every child is doing grinds.

    Apparently they are getting grinds or tgey are all getting grinds?

    Why don't you ask a colleague?


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    #5
    Jane98
    Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Jane98


    man_no_plan wrote: »
    Apparently they are getting grinds or tgey are all getting grinds?

    Why don't you ask a colleague?

    Ask a colleague what?


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    #6
    man_no_plan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,018 ✭✭✭man_no_plan


    Jane98 wrote: »
    Ask a colleague what?

    In your school what should be covered


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    #7
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    What does their copybook look like? Any stuff corrected, is there much homework given in the journal


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    #8
    Jane98
    Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Jane98


    man_no_plan wrote: »
    In your school what should be covered

    I'm not working in the same school as my daughter and I have tried to broach the subject with a few teachers in my own school and have got some answers but I was looking for some other opinions too


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    #9
    Jane98
    Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Jane98


    Gebgbegb wrote: »
    What does their copybook look like? Any stuff corrected, is there much homework given in the journal

    Nothing corrected by teacher. There is very little in their exercise copy. Very little homework if any given. The notes copy has pages of what I would see as not very useful e.g. the numbers 1 - 100 written down, about 50 different occupations etc.

    The teacher gave them an aural test last week, from the Junior Cert. My daughter said no one in the class had a clue what was being said as it was the first time they ever listened to someone other than their teacher speaking the language.


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    #10
    byhookorbycrook
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 12,498 Mod ✭✭✭✭byhookorbycrook


    You say no aural, but what about oral?It's only the 1st year of a new language so I wouldn't be panicking yet. I remember how we all felt a French teacher at school wasn't up to much, because she didn't use the text much, but in hindsight she was way ahead of her time.


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    #11
    mtoutlemonde
    Registered Users Posts: 2,134 ✭✭✭mtoutlemonde


    Jane98 wrote: »
    OK I am looking for some advice regarding how to fully assess my child's learning in the foreign language she is studying ( i am purposely omitting the language for fear of identifying the teacher at this time).

    I have serious reservations about this teacher's teaching ability arising from discussions with my child and discussions with other parents. In summary the teacher doesn't do any aural work. They have never listended to any native speakers just the teacher herself. They have used very little of the book that I spent €30 on and it seems to be more about taking down pages and pages of notes.

    So, before I go down the route of making an official complaint, I really want to get my facts straight, so if anyone can give me some advice about what a 1st year should know after one year and what does good teaching of a foreign language look like.


    I am a teacher myself although in Maths.

    Language teacher here. I hope to answer some of your questions.

    Firstly with relation to the book - I only use it as an extra resource - I make my own presentations and handouts with vocabulary and related info i.e. if I was teaching the clothes, students would have vocab, the verb to wear, what they wear in school and the weekend etc. as it is relevant to the JC and LC. I use the book for homework and the aural exercises and depending on the content of the chapter i.e. is to worthwhile reading a comprehension etc. I will do that.

    If you are concerned about aural skills - there are two books available and the exams/marking schemes are available online. If you're child is only in first year, I would suggest doing ordinary level papers this year and higher next year.

    At the end of first year, I would expect my students to have a grasp of all the chapters in the first year book. They should also know the present tense and irregular verbs. They should be able to describe themselves and their families.

    As you are a teacher, do you think making an official complaint is necessary? Do you always listen to the gossip from students or other parents who are taking everything their little Johnny says. Put yourself in their position - how would you feel? The teacher is obviously making some effort with the students having a comprehensive notes copy.

    Hope this helps.


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    #12
    Jane98
    Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Jane98


    mtoutlemonde wrote: »
    Language teacher here. I hope to answer some of your questions.

    Firstly with relation to the book - I only use it as an extra resource - I make my own presentations and handouts with vocabulary and related info i.e. if I was teaching the clothes, students would have vocab, the verb to wear, what they wear in school and the weekend etc. as it is relevant to the JC and LC. I use the book for homework and the aural exercises and depending on the content of the chapter i.e. is to worthwhile reading a comprehension etc. I will do that.

    If you are concerned about aural skills - there are two books available and the exams/marking schemes are available online. If you're child is only in first year, I would suggest doing ordinary level papers this year and higher next year.

    At the end of first year, I would expect my students to have a grasp of all the chapters in the first year book. They should also know the present tense and irregular verbs. They should be able to describe themselves and their families.

    As you are a teacher, do you think making an official complaint is necessary? Do you always listen to the gossip from students or other parents who are taking everything their little Johnny says. Put yourself in their position - how would you feel? The teacher is obviously making some effort with the students having a comprehensive notes copy.

    Hope this helps.

    Thanks, that helps alot and prob. compunds alot what I was thinking. My daugher wouldn't know much from many of the chapters of the 1st year book and she is a v. good student in all other areas.

    I would definitely think long and hard before making a complaint to the school but I am worried. I had long heard rumours before my child started in the school but choose to ignore them and allow myself to be the judge. Another determining factor regarding whether I should complain or not is that this is the only teacher in the school for this langauge so my daughter will have her for the full 6 years.


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    #13
    mtoutlemonde
    Registered Users Posts: 2,134 ✭✭✭mtoutlemonde


    Jane98 wrote: »
    Thanks, that helps alot and prob. compunds alot what I was thinking. My daugher wouldn't know much from many of the chapters of the 1st year book and she is a v. good student in all other areas.

    I would definitely think long and hard before making a complaint to the school but I am worried. I had long heard rumours before my child started in the school but choose to ignore them and allow myself to be the judge. Another determining factor regarding whether I should complain or not is that this is the only teacher in the school for this langauge so my daughter will have her for the full 6 years.

    I know you are worried but I don't listen to rumours. I was in a school a few years ago and there was a fantastic teacher but always got the lower ability classes because there were stories that this person was not a good teacher and when a teacher gets a name it is very hard to shake it off. This teacher was very committed but the gratitude was not returned. You should know this yourself - I'm sure there is one in your school - probably a good teacher but has a bad reputation. How do you deal when students give out about them in front of you?

    Why did you not bring up your concerns earlier? What was on the Christmas exam? Did you discuss your concerns at the PTM? Its a bit late in the day to be complaining.


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    #14
    Jane98
    Registered Users Posts: 570 ✭✭✭Jane98


    mtoutlemonde wrote: »
    I know you are worried but I don't listen to rumours. I was in a school a few years ago and there was a fantastic teacher but always got the lower ability classes because there were stories that this person was not a good teacher and when a teacher gets a name it is very hard to shake it off. This teacher was very committed but the gratitude was not returned. You should know this yourself - I'm sure there is one in your school - probably a good teacher but has a bad reputation. How do you deal when students give out about them in front of you?

    Why did you not bring up your concerns earlier? What was on the Christmas exam? Did you discuss your concerns at the PTM? Its a bit late in the day to be complaining.

    I didn't bring up my concerns earlier as I was trying to give it plenty of time and not make any rush judgement. When I asked at the PTM about listening to the cd to go with the text book I was told that wasn't necessary at this stage.

    My daughter's PTM meeting clashed with one in my school so I sought permission from my child's teachers to attend the week before when the school was having a PTM for a different year group. Despite this teacher saying that was fine, when I turned up she had forgotton about it and had no results for my child to discuss with me so my discussion with her was very short.

    I am not dillusional about this, even another teacher of the same language (who was teaching in a school I subbed in for a while) mentioned to me a couple of years ago that the teacher in my daughter's school was bad and she regularly gave grinds to students from that school. I can speak the language in question to an intermediate level but when I try to converse with my child she mostly doesn't have a clue what I am saying.


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    #15
    RealJohn
    Registered Users Posts: 2,099 ✭✭✭RealJohn


    Jane98 wrote: »
    Apparently the results are good but i's only because every child is doing grinds.
    I would have thought that this sort of thing would immediately ring alarm bells for you, as a maths teacher. Many of my maths students get grinds and I'm sure many of them and many of their parents credit the grinds for the marks they get but the fact is that they learn their maths from me and in many (most) cases, the grinds actually hold them back because they use them as an excuse to do less work in class.

    Granted, I'm not a language teacher but I wouldn't have thought that the aural component is vital in first year. They'd still be learning the structures of the language and getting comfortable trying to speak it I would have thought. Hearing native speakers is hardly vital in first year, is it?


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    #16
    ngunners
    Registered Users Posts: 635 ✭✭✭ngunners


    RealJohn wrote: »
    Hearing native speakers is hardly vital in first year, is it?

    As a language teacher I'd have to say...it depends. Babies learn to speak first by hearing so listening is a vital element in learning a new language.

    Having said that, if the teacher themselves has a decent accent and ear for the language (which, especially at that level, they should) then I see no problem with avoiding the CD work for now.


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