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landlord - notice to quit - have lease!

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  • 27-05-2016 12:38pm
    #1
    didisilly
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭


    Hi,

    My landlord wants to refurbish the apartment building complex and has told us that he is increasing the rent by 25%.

    He is offering us the chance to stay and accept the increase or move out within the next 8 weeks.

    Can he do this? We have a lease for 12 months, and are only in month 5?

    Any help?


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    #2
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    If you've a 12 month fixed lease signed 5 months ago he can't increase ye're rent or evict ye.

    The rent can't be increased until 24 months have passed from the start of the tenancy.


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    #3
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Check your lease and make sure there is not a clause stating that the landlord can end the lease to undertake refurbishment of the building.


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    #4
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    If you've a 12 month fixed lease signed 5 months ago he can't increase ye're rent or evict ye.

    Incorrect. Any landlord can end a tenancy in the first 6 months for any reason, provided sufficient notice is given.


    After that, they can only end it for a set number of reasons, refurbishment being one of those valid reasons.


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    #5
    testaccount123
    Registered Users Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭testaccount123


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Incorrect. Any landlord can end a tenancy in the first 6 months for any reason, provided sufficient notice is given.


    After that, they can only end it for a set number of reasons, refurbishment being one of those valid reasons.
    Landlord can indeed end the tenancy without reason in the first six months.

    He cannot end a fixed term tenancy to refurbish, only a part four tenancy.

    He cannot increase the rent in the first two years.


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    #6
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Part 34 notice does not apply to a fixed term lease.

    Even if it did, the fact the landlord has already suggested the refurbishment does not necessitate an empty property would also suggest the requirements for a part 34 notice (for renovation) have not been met.

    OP, talk to the RTB sooner rather than later.


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    #7
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Incorrect. Any landlord can end a tenancy in the first 6 months for any reason, provided sufficient notice is given.


    After that, they can only end it for a set number of reasons, refurbishment being one of those valid reasons.

    Incorrect. A lease cannot be terminated during a fixed term.


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    #8
    salamanca22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭salamanca22


    4ensic15 wrote: »
    Incorrect. A lease cannot be terminated during a fixed term.

    Unless there is a break clause.


    Read your lease OP


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    #9
    Giblet
    Registered Users Posts: 11,980 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    Break clause only applies in tenants favour, otherwise it reduces rights for the tenant, which you cannot do via a lease.

    OP, he cannot raise the rent for 2 years, with 3 months notice, and three examples of similar rent in the area.


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    #10
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    Giblet wrote: »
    Break clause only applies in tenants favour, otherwise it reduces rights for the tenant, which you cannot do via a lease.

    OP, he cannot raise the rent for 2 years, with 3 months notice, and three examples of similar rent in the area.

    The lease can provide for early termination and it does not just favour the tenant.


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    #11
    Giblet
    Registered Users Posts: 11,980 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    4ensic15 wrote: »
    The lease can provide for early termination and it does not just favour the tenant.

    Only if the tenant agrees to leave when asked, but no, there is not an enforceable break clause which gives the landlord more rights over the tenant. Does not exist, and any lease with one is invalid.

    Again, no-one seems to know their rights.


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    #12
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    Giblet wrote: »
    Only if the tenant agrees to leave when asked, but no, there is not an enforceable break clause which gives the landlord more rights over the tenant. Does not exist, and any lease with one is invalid.

    Again, no-one seems to know their rights.
    Residential Tenancies Act 2004

    58.—(1) From the relevant date, a tenancy of a dwelling may not be terminated by the landlord or the tenant by means of a notice of forfeiture, a re-entry or any other process or procedure not provided by this Part.

    (2) Accordingly, the termination by the landlord or the tenant of—

    (a) more beneficial rights referred to in section 26 that the tenant enjoys under a tenancy than those created by Part 4, or

    (b) a tenancy to which section 25 applies,

    must be effected by means of a notice of termination that complies with this Part.

    (3) Each of the following—

    (a) a tenancy referred to in subsection (2)(a) (unless it expressly excludes this means of termination),

    (b) a tenancy referred to in subsection (2)(b), and

    (c) a tenancy of a dwelling created before or after the relevant date in so far as its operation is not affected by Part 4,

    shall be construed as including a term enabling its termination by means of a notice of termination that complies with this Part (but, in the case of a tenancy that is for a fixed period, unless it provides otherwise, only where there has been a failure by the party in relation to whom the notice is served to comply with any obligations of the tenancy).


    Maybe some people don't know the law.


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    #13
    Giblet
    Registered Users Posts: 11,980 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    Well, if you read that, it pretty much says what I said.

    http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2004/act/27/section/26/enacted/en/html#sec26

    You cannot take away rights, only provide more beneficial ones. It literally mentions what you pasted above in the below link.

    http://www.prtb.ie/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution/terminating-a-fixed-term-tenancy

    Please, guys, for your own sake. Read up on this.


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    #14
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    Giblet wrote: »
    Well, if you read that, it pretty much says what I said.

    http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2004/act/27/section/26/enacted/en/html#sec26

    You cannot take away rights, only provide more beneficial ones. It literally mentions what you pasted above in the below link.

    http://www.prtb.ie/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution/terminating-a-fixed-term-tenancy

    Please, guys, for your own sake. Read up on this.

    It does not.If the lease provides for a break then the tenancy can be terminated. The lease cannot shorten notice period but it can allow for a break. You are not reading Section 58 correctly. You should do more reading.


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    #15
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    4ensic15 wrote: »
    It does not.If the lease provides for a break then the tenancy can be terminated. The lease cannot shorten notice period but it can allow for a break. You are not reading Section 58 correctly. You should do more reading.

    A lease cannot remove a tenants part 4 rights. A lease may only enhance those rights.


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    #16
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    Graham wrote: »
    A lease cannot remove a tenants part 4 rights. A lease may only enhance those rights.

    I never said it could.


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    #17
    Giblet
    Registered Users Posts: 11,980 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    Accordingly, if a landlord sought to exercise the break clause after 18 months, the tenant could rely on his rights under Part 4 to remain in the dwelling for the remainder of the 4 year period. A tenant on the other hand may exercise a break clause provided for in a fixed term tenancy agreement, where it has been agreed between the landlord and the tenant. There is nothing in the Act preventing the tenant from doing so, unlike Part 4 in the scenario where the landlord seeks to terminate the tenancy.

    In 4 weeks he'll be Part 4.


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    #18
    salamanca22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭salamanca22


    A break clause can certainly exist in a lease that would allow a landlord to terminate a lease. Just because a lease is terminated does not mean the tenancy is, just the contract that contained supplementary conditions.

    If there is a break clause allowing the landlord to break the lease tomorrow then they may do so and end the tenancy under the conditions that a part 4 allow or if there is no part 4 then by just giving the required notice.


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