Cycle Lanes in Phoenix Park

P_1

Pinch Flat wrote: »

According to another thread, the gardai send 4 of their members if you’re using a human cordon to stop this happening to a similar cycle lane in rathmines. Wonder how many would show up if you called them here?

But it’s typical ireland. Motorists will literally park anywhere given the opportunity, they’re unbelievably selfish. My only solution would be plastic bolliards, although they get knocked easily. Perhaps a 6” kerb would be require in this scenario?

They really missed a trick with the recessed brickwork on that cycle lane. Not only does it do the Scottish Football Association to stop Wayne Kerrs from parking in it, it is bloody awful to cycle over when you inevitably have to cycle over it to avoid the parked Wayne Kerrs.

beauf

ED E wrote: »

If you built a skyscraper without permission in front of An Board Planala you'd hear about it. If you set up a barracks outside the Curragh you'd hear about it.

So why the F UCK is the law so irrelevant in sight of the Garda HQ. More competency in a class of Junior Infants.

https://twitter.com/aoifegall/status/993568931343405056

I wonder how many Garda passed this in a normal day and just ignore it.

Chips Lovell

The other cycle lanes in the Phoenix Park aren't statutory cycle lanes. I'm not sure these ones are either.

beauf

Baron de Charlus wrote: »

The other cycle lanes in the Phoenix Park aren't statutory cycle lanes. I'm not sure these ones are either.

Covered under By laws? Maybe?

RacoonQueen

Selfish car owners, being selfish. What a surprise. The sun brings out the total and utter selfishness in car owners. I need to park my car so I can get out and enjoy the sun and I don't give a sh*t where I park it as I want to enjoy the sun.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/11388560359/permalink/10160472466250360/
https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/993857302506635264

magicbastarder

am i right in thinking that the gardai have no responsibility for policing parking in the phoenix park, that it's up to the park rangers?

Chips Lovell

magicbastarder wrote: »

am i right in thinking that the gardai have no responsibility for policing parking in the phoenix park, that it's up to the park rangers?

That's my understanding.

RacoonQueen

magicbastarder wrote: »

am i right in thinking that the gardai have no responsibility for policing parking in the phoenix park, that it's up to the park rangers?

From what I've seen online, they say it is up to OPW and OPW say it's up to the guards.

Seve OB

beauf wrote: »

I wonder how many Garda passed this in a normal day and just ignore it.

well sure until they got their own little parking bay last year, they were the worst offenders of the lot.

actually, they still are, regularly parked on paths and the cycle lane inside park gates & their parking on corners, taxi ranks, double yellows, wheelchair spots all around parkgate street is nothing short of shocking.... and it is every single day

Chips Lovell

beauf wrote: »

Covered under By laws? Maybe?

magicbastarder wrote: »

am i right in thinking that the gardai have no responsibility for policing parking in the phoenix park, that it's up to the park rangers?

RacoonQueen wrote: »

From what I've seen online, they say it is up to OPW and OPW say it's up to the guards.

There's some ambiguity in the bye-laws alright. They say nothing about the status of cycle lanes but do say this:

4.(3) Drivers of vehicles in the Park shall comply with the provisions of these bye-laws and shall conform to such orders for the regulation of traffic in the Park as may be given by any member of the Garda Shiocanna or any park constable or contained in any notice by the Commissioners exhibited in the Park.

4.(4) No vehicle shall remain stationary on any road in the Park except at such places thereon as the Commissioners shall authorise and shall specify in a notice exhibited at such places.

Penalties are:

18. Every person who shall do any act or thing which is a breach or in contravention of any of these bye-laws shall be guilty of an offence against these bye-laws and may be removed from the Park and shall on summary conviction of such offence be liable to a penalty not exceeding five pounds.

They also say this:

(11) No person shall commit any act contrary to public morality or decency in the Park, or use any profane, indecent, or obscene language to the annoyance of other persons using the Park.

ED E

RacoonQueen wrote: »

From what I've seen online, they say it is up to OPW and OPW say it's up to the guards.

Whoever its up to if this were Germany or France they'd both be embarrassed if their little shared patch was such a mess. "Its not my job" is far too prevalent here.

AGS are prime "offenders" too.

Annie get your Run

magicbastarder wrote: »

am i right in thinking that the gardai have no responsibility for policing parking in the phoenix park, that it's up to the park rangers?

Baron de Charlus wrote: »

That's my understanding.

I passed a Garda on a motorbike stopped on the cycle lane just inside Parkgate street entrance last Thursday evening, it looked like he was ticketing a car that was parked there (regular occurrence...). I smiled and gave him the thumbs up and he smiled back. Given it was all over twitter that AGS were going to target drivers who put cyclists in danger this seemed like a brilliant start to the weekend. I also regularly see notices plastered to the side of cars that are parked on the cycle lane just beyond Monument roundabout however.... I noticed the good weather meant this number quadrupled overnight and no stickers there on Thursday :rolleyes:.

buffalo

This may have been posted elsewhere already, but apparently...

Paschal Donohoe described six possible changes to make Chesterfield Avenue safer, during a Dáil debate on cycling facilities last Thursday.

https://www.dublininquirer.com/2019/02/27/six-options-on-table-for-making-phoenix-park-safer-for-cyclists-and-pedestrians

Seve OB

option 3 for me.
can get rid of parking and you need cycle tracks on both sides of the road because if you only have a footpath on one side, bikes will still use it

Dr_Colossus

buffalo wrote: »

This may have been posted elsewhere already, but apparently...

https://www.dublininquirer.com/2019/02/27/six-options-on-table-for-making-phoenix-park-safer-for-cyclists-and-pedestrians

Some good suggestions in there but some utter lunacy also. Option 2 looks the best and most practical, Options 1 & 5 look the same while option 4 & 6 are ridiculous and anyone proposing that cyclists criss cross the main avenue to gain access to the designated cycle track and cycle contra flow to traffic obviously haven't thought through on the potential dangers especially at roundabouts which are already terrible in the phoenix park. Option 3 looks the same as existing set up and probably encourages even more pedestrians onto the designated cycle tracks.

Who is Jason Bell and why is he given 13 lines of text in that article with possibly the worst suggestion of all, lighting is not or at least shouldn't be a problem for any cyclist and the existing gas lamps are nice and quaint. No need to light pollute the Phoenix Park such as with the Phoenix Nights or Wild Lights in Dublin Zoo from November. Give the park a sense of country within the city.

checky88

I would be very surprised if the removal of the parking was to happen... i know the cycle lane in the park has its problems but to be honest if the cycle lanes fed down into the roundabouts i would be happy.... A good bike light sorts out any of the lighting issues

Weepsie

There are at least 11 car parks in the phoenix park as it is, possibly 12. That doesn't count the car park in Farmleigh either. There are a load of people who treat it as a free park and walk/ride, whatever facility.

It is one of Dublin most attractive things, yet it is spoiled by the volume of traffic allowed through it, and more so the sheer amount of public space given over to people occupying with their private vehicles.

I'm not sure if the the rules around corporate/business vehicles still apply either, but I rarely see them enforced

Weepsie

Using the very unscientific googlemaps counting, and knowing from experience that the entirity of Chesterfield avenue could be full of parked either side on a mile day, there are conceivably 1000 cars parked on Chesterfield Avenue alone when at it's busiest. That is quite frankly absurd.

That there isn't a shuttle service from the city centre to various parts of the park too seems a bit odd.

beauf

Weepsie wrote: »

...That there isn't a shuttle service from the city centre to various parts of the park too seems a bit odd.

They tried it and it was just stuck in gridlock at peak.

beauf

Its a big park. Accessibility is a problem if you remove parking.

Also it carries about a quarter of the M50 toll bridge volume daily. Its a major route from all points of the compass.

That said they closed the main for almost a year before when they rebuilt the road.

Dr_Colossus

Weepsie wrote: »

Using the very unscientific googlemaps counting, and knowing from experience that the entirity of Chesterfield avenue could be full of parked either side on a mile day, there are conceivably 1000 cars parked on Chesterfield Avenue alone when at it's busiest. That is quite frankly absurd.

That there isn't a shuttle service from the city centre to various parts of the park too seems a bit odd.

Agree that the number of parked cars on Chesterfield avenue is absurd. They shouldn't be encouraging people to drive through it and there is amble parking elsewhere in the park as indicated for those visiting and using the facilities for a few hours.

The problem is all the people using it as a free park and walk/ride with their vehicles abandoned there (often in the same spots) for 8+ hrs everyday. If there was a shuttle service or even a Dublin Bus stop then the whole park would become a car park. I suspect it's one of the reasons there isn't even a Dublin Bikes station within the park beside the zoo.

Don't see why the OPW would be so adverse to removing parking on Chesterfield avenue, it's not like their earning parking fees on it and all the traffic has a pretty detrimental affect on road surfaces

beauf

OPW are very opposed to any cars in the park. They close parts of it on a regular basis. The close part of the Chesterfild Ave every weekend during the summer.

Are ye not aware of that?

Chips Lovell

Weepsie wrote: »

It is one of Dublin most attractive things, yet it is spoiled by the volume of traffic allowed through it, and more so the sheer amount of public space given over to people occupying with their private vehicles.

This is kind of a bugbear of mine. It's one thing driving through the park, but if you're going to do that, don't drive like a cock. It's a leisure amenity first and foremost. Its purpose isn't supposed to be an alternative to the N3 and N4

Dr_Colossus

beauf wrote: »

OPW are very opposed to any cars in the park. They close parts of it on a regular basis. The close part of the Chesterfild Ave every weekend during the summer.

Are ye not aware of that?

Yes but it would make more sense to close it midweek to curtail commuting traffic or at least make it less convenient and open it at weekends where generally people have more time to go to the park for a run/cycle or visit the zoo.

reg114

Baron de Charlus wrote: »

This is kind of a bugbear of mine. It's one thing driving through the park, but if you're going to do that, don't drive like a cock. It's a leisure amenity first and foremost. Its purpose isn't supposed to be an alternative to the N3 and N4

Why dont they just toll the traffic driving through the park ?? All the revenue could go back into the maintenance of the park and to build cycle ways etc

Chips Lovell

reg114 wrote: »

Why dont they just toll the traffic driving through the park ?? All the revenue could go back into the maintenance of the park and to build cycle ways etc

I think imposing a toll would make people consider it more akin to the M50, not less.

beauf

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

Yes but it would make more sense to close it midweek to curtail commuting traffic or at least make it less convenient and open it at weekends where generally people have more time to go to the park for a run/cycle or visit the zoo.

You want to only open the park at weekends?

Most people who use the park for recreation drive there. The Zoo car park is overflowing at the weekends far and wide.

Lots of people drive there and go for a walk, cycle run, walk the dog. Then back in the car and home.

Pinch Flat

Weepsie wrote: »

Using the very unscientific googlemaps counting, and knowing from experience that the entirity of Chesterfield avenue could be full of parked either side on a mile day, there are conceivably 1000 cars parked on Chesterfield Avenue alone when at it's busiest. That is quite frankly absurd.

That there isn't a shuttle service from the city centre to various parts of the park too seems a bit odd.

Happens all over the city. We prioritize the storage of private property over providing decent cycling infrastructure.

It’s the same around the Georgian squares. Bags of room for cycling that’s hampered by parked cars. And why there’s not a dedicated cycle lane down Griffith Avenue is beyond me. It must be about 50 meters wide in places.

Weepsie

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Happens all over the city. We prioritize the storage of private property over providing decent cycling infrastructure.

It’s the same around the Georgian squares. Bags of room for cycling that’s hampered by parked cars. And why there’s not a dedicated cycle lane down Griffith Avenue is beyond me. It must be about 50 meters wide in places.

All the more baffling on Griffith Avenue is that nearly every house can comfortably have 2 parked cars within their own property,some more.

I suspect there are too many houses with 3+ cars, my own neighbours at one time had 6, which was one for everybody, they were not all necessary whatsoever, but they came to believe they were.

I'd also suspect people are parking on Griffith and walking on in to city centre.

Haithabu

There should be bollards in the middle of the Park so every entry is ending in a cul-de-sac somewhere. Then people can still drive into the Park if they want to bring their family or go jogging or have a BBQ. But it would stop all through traffic for cars.

That way traffic will be well reduced, cyclists can use the roads and pedestrians could get access to some cyclepathes.