Cabinet fed vs direct exchange fed

Brandaan

[font=Walsheim-Regular, Arial, sans-serif]Hello,
I recently moved from a rural area where I lived close to a fibre fed cabinet, where the line achieved >100Mb download speeds, to a central Dublin location (Dublin 9). It appears that this line is direct fed from the exchange (whitehall) and that there are no fibre fed cabinets in my area. Download speed is 22Mb at best. Needless to say I'm very disappointed at the drop in service levels moving from a rural area to the city - I would expect it is normally the other way around. Moreover I was forced to sign a new contract term on moving to avoid paying cancellation penalties, so now I am caught in a new contract with a significantly reduced service level, a service level which customer support in advance of installation could not advise on.
Can i ask eir to help me by providing the following:
Plans for installing fibre fed cabinets in my location - (Courtlands Estate - Dublin 9). 
Other options for increasing my service level.
Thanks.[/font]

eir: Tracey

Brandaan wrote: »

[font=Walsheim-Regular, Arial, sans-serif]Hello,
I recently moved from a rural area where I lived close to a fibre fed cabinet, where the line achieved >100Mb download speeds, to a central Dublin location (Dublin 9). It appears that this line is direct fed from the exchange (whitehall) and that there are no fibre fed cabinets in my area. Download speed is 22Mb at best. Needless to say I'm very disappointed at the drop in service levels moving from a rural area to the city - I would expect it is normally the other way around. Moreover I was forced to sign a new contract term on moving to avoid paying cancellation penalties, so now I am caught in a new contract with a significantly reduced service level, a service level which customer support in advance of installation could not advise on.
Can i ask eir to help me by providing the following:
Plans for installing fibre fed cabinets in my location - (Courtlands Estate - Dublin 9). 
Other options for increasing my service level.
Thanks.[/font]

Hi Brandaan, 

I'm sorry to hear you have dropped your speed with moving, I understand this is frustrating.

I'm afraid speeds are never guaranteed so there would be no more I can do in relation to this, this is out of my control unfortunately.

Feel free to PM me your account details and I'll clarify the plans for eFibre at your address and make sure you are on the maximum package you can avail of. 

Thanks 

Tracey 

Brandaan

Hello Tracey,
Thanks for your response and I understand your point on speed guarantees, although this is not the core issue (on that point I would say that an "up to 100Mb" marketing statement should not be used on lines in areas that can only support around one fifth of that speed). My biggest frustration in this is that I was forced to sign up at my new address with a new contract term but with a reduced service level which only became apparent after contract was entered into - eir was not able to advise me before entering into the contract what my service level would be and would have forced me to pay a termination penalty had I chosen not to continue with eir. A vicious circle if you like.
It would be more palatable if I had been allowed to carry over my existing remaining contract term - now I am stuck with service that is not fit for purpose and a lengthy contract term to serve. I only had a couple of months left on my previous contract.
I will PM you both my current and previous account numbers and would kindly ask you to provide details on the plan for the area and options relating to how to progress my contractual issue, which I believe is a fair way forward.
Thanks!

eir: Tracey

Brandaan wrote: »

Hello Tracey,
Thanks for your response and I understand your point on speed guarantees, although this is not the core issue (on that point I would say that an "up to 100Mb" marketing statement should not be used on lines in areas that can only support around one fifth of that speed). My biggest frustration in this is that I was forced to sign up at my new address with a new contract term but with a reduced service level which only became apparent after contract was entered into - eir was not able to advise me before entering into the contract what my service level would be and would have forced me to pay a termination penalty had I chosen not to continue with eir. A vicious circle if you like.
It would be more palatable if I had been allowed to carry over my existing remaining contract term - now I am stuck with service that is not fit for purpose and a lengthy contract term to serve. I only had a couple of months left on my previous contract.
I will PM you both my current and previous account numbers and would kindly ask you to provide details on the plan for the area and options relating to how to progress my contractual issue, which I believe is a fair way forward.
Thanks!

I understand your frustration with this.  We do advertise as 'up to' speeds as we can't guarantee speeds and every house is individual to a speed test and results. We wouldn't be aware of what speed the new house qualifies for until the line is active and working I'm afraid. 

Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to change the contract of your account, this is out of my control. 

I've received your PM, I will come back to you soon through PM's. 

Thanks 

Tracey 

Brandaan

Hello Tracey,
I understand that you are not in a position to change a contract, however, I would kindly ask you to:

• To provide details on the plan for the area - via PM is fine thanks
• Provide options relating to how to progress my contractual issue, i.e. I'm not asking you to change it, as this is not within your remit, I'm asking you on the options on how to progress this issue within your organisation. I would expect a process for dealing with these issues following on from this online conversation - please advise.
  

Thanks

eir: Tracey

Brandaan wrote: »

Hello Tracey,
I understand that you are not in a position to change a contract, however, I would kindly ask you to:

• To provide details on the plan for the area - via PM is fine thanks
• Provide options relating to how to progress my contractual issue, i.e. I'm not asking you to change it, as this is not within your remit, I'm asking you on the options on how to progress this issue within your organisation. I would expect a process for dealing with these issues following on from this online conversation - please advise.
  
  
  

[*]

Thanks

[*]
No problem Brandann, 

I've responded to your PM there now.

Thanks 

Tracey 

Brandaan

Summary of the PMs for the record in this thread:

Line speed:

• "I've checked your current service and the maximum speed your line is capable of is up to 25MB service. This would be to do with the distance from the cabinet and I'm afraid this can't be amended. If you wish you can log a formal complaint in relation to your contract issue, you can contact them on 1901."
  

[*]
Upgrades for the area:

• "no plans for your area in the near future"
  

[*]
Escalation point:

• "I've added a note to the account to advise of this conversation. You can speak with the customer care team on 1901 to escalate this."
  

Eir: Pamela

Brandaan wrote: »

[font=Walsheim-Regular, Arial, sans-serif]Hello,
I recently moved from a rural area where I lived close to a fibre fed cabinet, where the line achieved >100Mb download speeds, to a central Dublin location (Dublin 9). It appears that this line is direct fed from the exchange (whitehall) and that there are no fibre fed cabinets in my area. Download speed is 22Mb at best. Needless to say I'm very disappointed at the drop in service levels moving from a rural area to the city - I would expect it is normally the other way around. Moreover I was forced to sign a new contract term on moving to avoid paying cancellation penalties, so now I am caught in a new contract with a significantly reduced service level, a service level which customer support in advance of installation could not advise on.
Can i ask eir to help me by providing the following:
Plans for installing fibre fed cabinets in my location - (Courtlands Estate - Dublin 9). 
Other options for increasing my service level.
Thanks.[/font]

Thanks for keeping us updated Brandaan, 


-Pamela 

Brandaan

Keeping this thread as a public record regarding this issue.
Spoke to customer service yesterday - nice agent called Tommy. Explained the situation as per thread above - very understanding and sympathetic to the uniqueness of the situation - had not encountered this particular situation before, seems to be an edge case. Advised to write to Complaints Department as policy is strictly enforced an edge case not catered for.
At this stage I would be looking for some movement on the contract penalty fee as a compromise.

Eir: Pamela

Brandaan wrote: »

Keeping this thread as a public record regarding this issue.
Spoke to customer service yesterday - nice agent called Tommy. Explained the situation as per thread above - very understanding and sympathetic to the uniqueness of the situation - had not encountered this particular situation before, seems to be an edge case. Advised to write to Complaints Department as policy is strictly enforced an edge case not catered for.
At this stage I would be looking for some movement on the contract penalty fee as a compromise.

That's no problem  Brandaan.
Once complaints has fully investigated this they will contact you with the outcome.

-Pamela 

Brandaan

For the record, I posted my complaint letter this morning.
Key complaint as follows:
"That eir were not in a position to supply me with appropriate information at the time of moving house to allow me to make an informed decision
That I am now being punished for my loyalty with a long contract term and poor service level
That I am being charged an excessive cancellation fee should I wish to exit the contract"


I also make the point that my house is still being advertised as being enabled for "Superfast broadband", "Up to 100Mb"
"The advertised packages in my area can be interpreted as misleading – eir have been and, as per the screenshots attached taken on June 3 2016, are still advertising my home and neighbours’ home as being located in a “fibre enabled” area even though you can only support 25MB service.

"The statement >100Mb service is a misleading statement in an area with lines that can only support 25% of the theoretical maximum"

I will keep the thread posted on response.

kelledy

If you are fed straight from exchange , then you are not routed through a cabinet , which means u cannot avail of fibre 

retepnosnikta

Brandaan wrote: »

For the record, I posted my complaint letter this morning.
Key complaint as follows:
"That eir were not in a position to supply me with appropriate information at the time of moving house to allow me to make an informed decision
That I am now being punished for my loyalty with a long contract term and poor service level
That I am being charged an excessive cancellation fee should I wish to exit the contract"


I also make the point that my house is still being advertised as being enabled for "Superfast broadband", "Up to 100Mb"
"The advertised packages in my area can be interpreted as misleading – eir have been and, as per the screenshots attached taken on June 3 2016, are still advertising my home and neighbours’ home as being located in a “fibre enabled” area even though you can only support 25MB service.

"The statement >100Mb service is a misleading statement in an area with lines that can only support 25% of the theoretical maximum"

I will keep the thread posted on response.

I hear you Brandaan. I've spent 22 years with Telecom Eireann/Eircom/Eir and have never encountered such "spin" about this fictional product called eFibre in my life.

Eir do not have a credible high speed product to sell to their customers in my area and I really wish they would stop referring people to this now infamous eFibre rollout map on their website when they receive a genuine enquiry.

I've been promised that it is coming to my area soon but nobody knows when. A bit like the end of the world prophecy and I'm getting the feeling that the latter will happen first.

I agreed three years ago to remain with Eir on the basis that eFibre would be available within each of those years. I even witnessed three separate planning applications for cabinets at the top of my estate posted and disappear as quickly and nothing. Frankly a landline and 10mbs broadband download speed and a 0.5mbs upload speed for €60 per month is a joke at this stage. Luckily Virgin Media are offering the same bundle with up to 340mbs and the infrastructure is in place locally.

I've spoken to so many people within the Eir organisation over the last three years and have finally thrown in the towel and decided to make the move.

Apologies for hijacking your post Brandaan but your story sounds so familiar as does the platitudes you are receiving. All the PMs in China won't make any difference and it's best to air these difficulties publicly for all to see. No amount of rebranding will fix these problems either.

Brandaan

kelledy wrote: »

If you are fed straight from exchange , then you are not routed through a cabinet , which means u cannot avail of fibre 

Well, it's more the distance from the house to the exchange that causes the issue - cabinets just reduce the distance between the fibre feed and the premises. My grievance is not about having an exchange fed line, and the limitations thereof, but that eir could not advise me on this or the service level until after contract was signed for 18 months and if I hadn't gone down that route, I would have been charged a contract exit fee for the priviledge - Catch 22. Also, my area is still advertised as "eFibre" enabled, the term "Superfast Broadband" is also applied which is misleading on a 25Mb theoretical max.

Brandaan

retepnosnikta wrote: »

I hear you Brandaan. I've spent 22 years with Telecom Eireann/Eircom/Eir and have never encountered such "spin" about this fictional product called eFibre in my life.

Eir do not have a credible high speed product to sell to their customers in my area and I really wish they would stop referring people to this now infamous eFibre rollout map on their website when they receive a genuine enquiry.

I've been promised that it is coming to my area soon but nobody knows when. A bit like the end of the world prophecy and I'm getting the feeling that the latter will happen first.

I agreed three years ago to remain with Eir on the basis that eFibre would be available within each of those years. I even witnessed three separate planning applications for cabinets at the top of my estate posted and disappear as quickly and nothing. Frankly a landline and 10mbs broadband download speed and a 0.5mbs upload speed for €60 per month is a joke at this stage. Luckily Virgin Media are offering the same bundle with up to 340mbs and the infrastructure is in place locally.

I've spoken to so many people within the Eir organisation over the last three years and have finally thrown in the towel and decided to make the move.

Apologies for hijacking your post Brandaan but your story sounds so familiar as does the platitudes you are receiving. All the PMs in China won't make any difference and it's best to air these difficulties publicly for all to see. No amount of rebranding will fix these problems either.

Thanks, for your comments. My preference is to keep this interaction on record for this purpose and comments are always welcome. There are two related issues in my opinion:

• The technical issue:  the rollout of eFiber and availability of quality broadband services
• The business issue: eir business process does not provide a consumer with adequate information to make an informed decision based on the actual technology available at a premises - only way of finding out is to enter a contract with eir.
  

[*]
This is the key issue for me. The only party who ends up paying at the moment for finding out what technical solution was available at my address is me.
I'll keep the thread updated on responses.

KIERAN1

Unfortunately Eir exchange to the house efibre is not what i thought it would be. Eir wants everyone to connect and be able to have efibre (fair enough they're a business) What i have noticed is that will often lead to a situation where lot of homes in build up estates will have lower download and upload speeds.. I was expecting least 50+ meg from my house to the exchange, about 450 metres away.

If the cabinet was located in my estate or in the heart of the village i would be at 50+ meg same. Locating the cabinet at the exchange made know sense unless you trying to have people on the outskirts of the village connect to it? But how many people connect on the outskirts for it to be worthwhile stationing the cabinet at the exchange?

 I found out though the copper cable extends from my exchange, down through the village,  a loop of 1km instead of 430 metres and i will only  receive 25meg at that distance. Its not a terrible speed, but realistically how good will 25 meg be in 5 to 10 years. My house is not close to a blue line so this speed is what i be on for awhile. 

Fibre to the Cabinet to me is just ASDL2  Do anyone know when vectoring will be enabled heard it increases the speeds at 1km?

Brandaan

As an update on this saga, I received a response on June 10 2016 clarifying the following in writing:
"While there is nothing wrong with the line it is not suited to high speed broadband". I responded to this letter, which explained technical reasons for why the line is not suitable with the following:

When moving house, I was given two options:

• Cancel my contract and pay a penalty for the remaining term, which was approximately 5 months
• Remain loyal to eir, sign up at my new house, but reset the contract to an 18 month term
• The agent was not in a position to advise me on the speed my new line would achieve before ordering, but that I lived in an “up to 100Mb” area.
• The only way of ascertaining the speed of the line was to get the line installed and see what it would achieve. When looking on your website then, as remains the case now, my address still says I am in an “eir Fibre” enabled area with packages “up to 100Mb” – this was the only information available to me.
• Assuming an equivalent service level and to avoid paying cancellation penalties, I was compelled to sign a new contract term. It has now become apparent that my line is “not suited to high speed broadband”, I am caught in a contract with a significantly reduced service level, a service level which customer support in advance of installation could not advise on and for which there are no plans to improve upon.
• I am being punished for my loyalty and it will, as it stands, cost me €250 to get out of this contract.
  

Customer Services have advised me my situation is quite unique. The combination of moving house, renewing a contract term and eir not being able to advise on service level before installation is very unusual.
I am now again writing to you to formally complain about the following and would appreciate your specific responses on these complaints

• That eir were not in a position to supply me with appropriate information at the time of moving house to allow me to make an informed decision
• That the onus and responsibility for finding out the fact that my line is “not suited to high speed broadband” was laid solely on me and me alone
• That I am now being punished for my loyalty with a long contract term and poor service level
• That I am being charged an excessive cancellation fee should I wish to exit the contract
  
  

I would therefore kindly request you to consider my complaint with a view to coming to mutually agreeable resolution in this matter – I would kindly request you to address these matters without referring to any further technical reasons, as these are quite clear to me – my complaint is related to the business process, which allowed me to end up in this most unfortunate situation. 

I have not received a response to this letter.
Needless to say the letter I received this morning on the change in contract related to the sports stuff, led me to swiftly cancel the contract without penalty.

retepnosnikta

Brandaan wrote: »

As an update on this saga, I received a response on June 10 2016 clarifying the following in writing:
"While there is nothing wrong with the line it is not suited to high speed broadband". I responded to this letter, which explained technical reasons for why the line is not suitable with the following:


I have not received a response to this letter.
Needless to say the letter I received this morning on the change in contract related to the sports stuff, led me to swiftly cancel the contract without penalty.

Clearly the right course of action in this case. Personally I cancelled with Eir three weeks ago and have VM 360mb/s broadband in the house now. I won't say everything went swimmingly smooth with the installation but with a VM 360mb/s v an Eir 10mb/s broadband connection for the same price, it's only a fool or an old sentimentalist that would remain with Eir.

For what it's worth, as an additional rebranding exercise for Eir and a free piece of advice, don't promise something you know you can't deliver.

Brandaan

retepnosnikta wrote: »

Brandaan wrote: »

As an update on this saga, I received a response on June 10 2016 clarifying the following in writing:
"While there is nothing wrong with the line it is not suited to high speed broadband". I responded to this letter, which explained technical reasons for why the line is not suitable with the following:


I have not received a response to this letter.
Needless to say the letter I received this morning on the change in contract related to the sports stuff, led me to swiftly cancel the contract without penalty.

Clearly the right course of action in this case. Personally I cancelled with Eir three weeks ago and have VM 360mb/s broadband in the house now. I won't say everything went swimmingly smooth with the installation but with a VM 360mb/s v an Eir 10mb/s broadband connection for the same price, it's only a fool or an old sentimentalist that would remain with Eir.

For what it's worth, as an additional rebranding exercise for Eir and a free piece of advice, don't promise something you know you can't deliver.

Agreed - problem is when you are moving house when still in contract they pretty much force you to be sentimental :-) and reset the sentimentality timer button as well... Their main cable competitor have 12 month contract terms, and allow you to carry any remaining contract period to your new address - so technically superior as well as much more customer friendly Ts and Cs.

Brandaan

As an update, I am waiting for my final statement now to make sure no strange charges have been applied following cancellation.
Also, I received a phone call from the Complaints department during the week the sports notice went out, to discuss my complaint and to offer me a release from my contract - I thanked the person who called me and said I had already been offered a free release due to the Ts and Cs change re eir sport.