Will TUI now issue new circular on CP hours?

deiseindublin

Seems our members have accepted this and unless there's a way for me to join ASTI I'm stuck with them. I don't want to do them at all, but if I must would like to follow the directive to the letter of the law, flex hours, staff consensus, 33 hours and not a minute more etc.

Will there be a new circular? Or should I be working from this old document for fine print?
http://www.tui.ie/_fileupload/Revised%20usage%20of%2033%20hours%20for%20post-primary%20schools.pdf

And https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://circulars.gov.ie/pdf/circular/education/2014/43.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwjAxrPm-ILNAhXJAMAKHQkuBQYQFggcMAE&usg=AFQjCNEzuzOhPKR6Kojcyr_TmOksrgZDpQ&sig2=pAfQxnEQPYp7eDUgxXrCGQ

What exactly does staff consensus mean?
What exactly does flex mean? Some school seem to have a few different open nights and you pick a, b, c, or d - is that actually considered flex?
If open night goes over allocated time, do staff leave or counts extra hours?

Any help on fulfilling directive and no more welcome.

deiseindublin

Anybody?

TheDriver

Its the DES issue circulars, not the TUI. They issue directives.

I am finding that once I fill in the staff meetings, PT meetings etc, there is very little left to play with. Staff consensus is always open to debate but I would take it to mean that staff would discuss and suggest any changes, subject to majority ruling and that it is ok to do them (i.e. staff cant vote to have a 2 hour BBQ using CP hours)

deiseindublin

Sorry, meant TUI issue a document about the new flex hours etc which relates back to circular 43/14!

How exactly are 'flex' hours run in other schools. Would love to hear how they are actually used on the ground.

political analyst

Richard Bruton said in the Dáil on 26 May:

http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2016052600038?opendocument

I am aware of union concerns regarding the usage of the Croke Park hours. In response to those concerns, my Department recently agreed with the INTO and the TUI that the usage would be reviewed, having regard to teacher professional judgement, system and school requirements and experience to date of best practice in the utilisation of the hours. As an immediate first step in that review, the maximum period of time available for planning and development work on other than a whole-school basis will be increased from five hours to eight hours from the beginning of the 2016-2017 school year and to ten hours from the beginning of the 2017-2018 school year.

deiseindublin

I got the change to 8 flex hours PA but was hoping they'd give an actual brass tacks doc of how they might be used.

How does do other school use the flex hours? Most schools I've heard of actually use them as individuals doing XYZ work and logging the time. Ours is a lot more prescriptive and I'm wondering how exactly flex is defined? Does it mean scheduled open nights where most of the school are involved or is that pure CP core hours?

ASTI had a really good doc on it last time but no such luck with TUI. I should know better than to expect anything of them though.

r93kaey5p2izun

Yes I would like to see a document giving clear guidance on how tgese hours should be used. And a hard line taken if principals refuse to follow the spirit of these "concessions". All 33 of the hours are completely prescriptive in my school. There is zero choice, no staff input or concensus. Principal dictates every minute of their use.

evolving_doors

Would it be true to say that everyone is on temp. Low hour Contracts in your school A.?

r93kaey5p2izun

Gebgbegb wrote: »

Would it be true to say that everyone is on temp. Low hour Contracts in your school A.?

One third of the staff are, yes, and growing with retirements. I believe we'll have no full time permanency/CID other than Irish, Home Ec, French and Woodwork within 5/6 years.

political analyst

"man no plan" said in post 93 of the following thread:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057595620&page=7

As i recall the department wanted them to be one hour teaching per week initially but the unions weren't having it.

If the unions had accepted that then the teachers would be taking extra classes in the period from 9 a.m. to 4 p.m. instead of doing the Croke Park hours.

Obviously, the unions did their members no favours on the Croke Park deal.

deiseindublin

Trace Numerous Nitpicker wrote: »

All 33 of the hours are completely prescriptive in my school. There is zero choice, no staff input or concensus. Principal dictates every minute of their use.

I think lots of schools are the same, no matter what the circular says about consultation! Flex hours don't really work as flex in our place, it's a case of doing X, Y, or Z.

What annoys me the most about CP hours is that I often can't start my own work until they finish. I've been in work until after 8pm 3 days this week, last nt was 9.30, it's nonsense to be ticking a box 3-4 or 4-5 etc and then have to stay REALLY late to get work done that absolutely needs doing.

I'm not saying I'm unique by the way, just that the problem with CP hours is that management seem to determined that EVERYBODY does the required 33 that there's no leeway for necessary work that you're not doing as part of a team.

deiseindublin

Just found these on ASTI and TUI sites. What a difference there is:

ASTI - Informative, helpful, pertinent Q & As -
http://www.asti.ie/fileadmin/user_upload/ss_re_33_hours_-_cpa.doc
or even http://www.asti.ie/croke-park-agreement-how-will-it-work/croke-park-questions-and-answers/

TUI Tick box exercise, as clear as mud with no help on the new flex hours - http://tui.ie/news-events/usage-of-the-33-croke-park-agreement-hours-update-.8517.html