Should finding a job be this hard?

feelgoodlost

I just moved to Dublin this past winter from Canada and I received my visa to work and live here. I've been looking for a job for three months now and I've been finding the whole experience ridiculous and frustrating. I'm just looking for something in customer service, retail or the hospitality industry as I don't have a degree. I have many years of different customer service experience. I've gone over my CV and made it as nice as I possibly can. I have had people look it over and so on. I really don't know what I'm doing wrong. I've never had a problem finding this type of job back home and usually can find something within a matter of weeks. I have turned down some really horrible offers as well and the numerous part time offers. It seems that nobody wants to hire for full time workers.

I'm getting really tired of this whole trial shift garbage that I'm getting offered all the time. I kind of feel like these managers are just needing someone to come in on a busy day to help out and then they never call you back again. I feel like nobody is willing to train anybody anymore for these types of jobs. It's a minimum wage job! Jesus, I can see if you're applying for a job that requires some type of education or skills but I think it's a complete joke that many managers are too lazy any more to provide you with very simple training. I've also been trying to get my foot in the door for some bar work. I've taken some well regarded courses online for beer serving. I probably know more about the proper way to pour a beer and different beer styles than a good portion of the people I see working behind the bar. Any time I go in for an interview for this type of job I'm told by the manager that they have their guys behind the bar doing that type of work. They can offer me a trial shift in serving though.

Sorry for the long rant but I'm just wondering if there are other people in this type of situation. Should it really take this long to get a job in Dublin? I'm also by no means trying to complain about being in Ireland. I know nobody is forcing me to be here and I really enjoy living here.

ebbsy

Ironically Op half of my friends are in Canada and have no intention of returning here.

Hunchback

Did you do any trial shifts anywhere?

feelgoodlost

CKonetheonlyone wrote: »

Did you do any trial shifts anywhere?

Yes, I was offered a trial shift at a cafe. I was expecting to be given some type of responsibility but was just forced to clean for 8 hours a day. So obviously I turned that down.

I had another shift in a gastropub but was just completely ignored after they told me they would call me in a few days. I personally think I performed pretty well considering I hadn't served since I was 18.

Haha, maybe I'm being too picky but I don't see any reason I should do something I don't like.

Mrs OBumble

There was a lot of this during the worst of the recession, though I thought it had died down now.

You are an immigrant, so you will face discrimination - this isn't unique to Ireland.

But the issue is that you (like me) are an English speaking immigrant. You know what the minimum wage rate is, and you expect to get paid it. Your also expect your employer will follow the law, and won't be slow to speak up if you get no breaks, not long enough between shifts, messed around with holidays etc. Whereas others with English as a 2nd language are less likely to insist on their rights.

Do you have any languages (other than the Canadian version of French, which I hear doesn't work so well for communicating with people who speak French-French). They would help you get some contact centre roles.

Other than that, you need to work whatever connections you can make. Presumably you have a visa because you have a spouse - is there any chance of getting a job via their connections? Have you joined any clubs or done any volunteer work - any connections thru this that might help?

Also, focus on larger multi-nationals rather than local companies. They are more likely to have explicit anti-discrimination polices and to enforce these.

And make it 100% clear to people that you already have a visa to work here and don't need sponsorship: they will be used to people on WHV's (who disappear quickly) or who want to be sponsored (impossible for minimum wage jobs), so may routinely discount you just based on your accent.

BreadnBuddha

Non-national immigrant (as I am, where I live), no third level education in a country full of unemployed or under-employed graduates, who thinks taking some 'well regarded' online courses for serving beer should give you a foot in with somebody who has served their time as an apprentice, while turning down part time work and trying to blame lazy managers for how they won't train you and how generally unattractive/uncompetitive you may be as a prospective employee?

Get a hold of yourself there and look around at Ireland the way it is today. This isn't 10 years ago. If you want to get a fulltime job you either bring a skill that's in demand or you take the attitude and ditch it, take pretty much any job that provides experience and meets minimum required standards of pay and conditions. Turning down part-time jobs when you have no job is moronic.

It's no different to Canada in those respects. The visa means nothing if you bring totally the wrong attitude to the task at hand.

Senna

I hope you don't go in with the attitude that these are simple jobs that anyone can do. Regarding the bartenders courses, they are pretty much a joke and a few days experience is worth a 100 of those.

A trial is as much for your benefit as it is to the company, if you have the attitude that a trial is a way for the business to have staff on duty without paying them, then I can see how your attitude is stopping you from finding work.

As with all industries, get your foot in the door whatever way possible and then let you abilities take you to the next step. In the service industry in Ireland, that could be got taken on for a trial, with the chance of part time work, to getting full time work within a week.

livedadream

try to hit up some recruitment companies if its skilled work you are looking for.

like other OP's have said Ireland at the moment thank god is similar to Canada in terms of employment levels. Ireland 8% Canada 7& roughly... that doesnt mean there arnt jobs there though and its always easier to get a job from a job.

im not going to try to cause an argument but the immigrant comment is ridiculous, some people just have a chip on their shoulder obviously. its not that you are an 'immigrant' that you dont have a job.

alot of jobs in the city in terms of service jobs are who you know, so maybe try asking the friends youve made if they know of anyone hiring...

if you speak Québécois then a job in a call centre would probably be the easiest for you, i know theres differentiation but not that much.

BreadnBuddha

feelgoodlost wrote: »

Yes, I was offered a trial shift at a cafe. I was expecting to be given some type of responsibility but was just forced to clean for 8 hours a day. So obviously I turned that down.

I had another shift in a gastropub but was just completely ignored after they told me they would call me in a few days. I personally think I performed pretty well considering I hadn't served since I was 18.

Haha, maybe I'm being too picky but I don't see any reason I should do something I don't like.

You turned down the job in a cafe because they had you cleaning? Yet, you think you'll manage barwork because you've done an online course?

The gastropub would have called you back if they saw anything they wanted back. Harsh, but true.

Yeah. You are being too picky. You're also being completely unrealistic. You can not, in fact, be anything you want to be. Sometimes you just have to accept things the way they are. Uneducated, unemployed, unskilled (customer service is not a high value skill in the absence of any others) yet still clings to a sense of entitlement. :rolleyes:

I don't mean to be so harsh but the sooner you get a dose of common sense the better for you and the sooner you'll get a job you stand a chance of keeping for a while.

feelgoodlost

Ok, no need to get worked up. I'm not trying to offend anyone. I was never once offered a trial shift while back home. This was something completely new to me. I was always hired in the past and then given more than one shift to prove myself to the employers and given full training. It usually takes more than one shift to learn everything and show your full potential.

I never go in to a shift with a bad attitude. I'm just frustrated on a personal level. That's not something I would ever bring into the workplace. So please don't tell me otherwise.

I also shouldn't need a higher education to obtain a minimum wage low skill job. That's the whole point of going to university, is it not?

I also wasn't expecting to get work in a bar with a certificate I earned online. I thought it might help but never assumed it would get me the job. There's such a thing as getting a job with no prior experience and being trained. I was just hoping for the best. I also regularly go into craft beer bars in Dublin and watch as a lot of the bartenders pour me my beer wrong, give me dirty glasses, give me the wrong glass and don't have a clue about what they are serving. This is in a bar that specializes in craft beer and should take it seriously.

BreadnBuddha

livedadream wrote: »

im not going to try to cause an argument but the immigrant comment is ridiculous, some people just have a chip on their shoulder obviously. its not that you are an 'immigrant' that you dont have a job.

She's an immigrant. If you think that's completely irrelevant, you're wrong. I am a recent immigrant where I now live. My wife was an immigrant in Ireland. I'm living it and previously saw my other half live it, from right up close.

Culturally, her experiences are different, as as her expectations it would appear. Mine certainly were.

Acknowledging that does not mean anyone has a chip on their shoulder. We all come from different places and see the world in different ways.

So no, it's not BECAUSE she's an immigrant that she doesn't have a job. But it doesn't help. That's real world, not semi-accurate employment law pseudo waffling train the trainer rubbish.

livedadream

BreadnBuddha wrote: »

She's an immigrant. If you think that's completely irrelevant, you're wrong.

Culturally, her experiences are different, as as her expectations it would appear.

Acknowledging that does not mean anyone has a chip on their shoulder. We all come from different places and see the world in different ways.

So no, it's not BECAUSE she's an immigrant that she doesn't have a job. But it doesn't help. That's real world, not semi-accurate employment law pseudo waffling train the trainer rubbish.

wana edit out that personal attack there mate?

she doesnt have a job because she turned down one and wasnt called back from the other one...

being Canadian or an immigrant had nothing to do with that...

her ability and attitude did, so unless you saying all Canadians are like that (which their not) then its nothing to do with her being Canadian.

If an Irish person had that attitude they wouldnt have a job either.

feelgoodlost

Thanks for the advice from those with good tips.

I should have known better and not posted this in the first place. It's obviously stirring things up more than I wanted. It was just a frustrated rant. I don't expect anything from anyone and don't assume jobs will just be handed over to me. It shouldn't matter where I'm from as well.

Stop assuming you know what my attitude is when I go in for a job interview or shift. Thanks.

livedadream

feelgoodlost wrote: »

Thanks for the advice from those with good tips.

I should have known better and not posted this in the first place. It's obviously stirring things up more than I wanted. It was just a frustrated rant. I don't expect anything from anyone and don't assume jobs will just be handed over to me. It shouldn't matter where I'm from as well.

Stop assuming you know what my attitude is when I go in for a job interview or shift. Thanks.

you'll get a job, chin up, just saturate the market.. CV's everywhere.
it will happen eventually, if you can suit up and pop in and out of the recruitment companies once they have a face for the name it helps them place you.

Best of luck.

FiannaSuccess

It's amazing how people on this site jump on posters and attack them without knowing their personal circumstances.

I wish you well in your search for a job.

drunkmonkey

Where does sexism enter into the equation?

Sapphire

A big part of the service industry jobs is cleaning. Adhering to HACCP regulations. If you think that it's not, then you are mistaken.

I'm really distracted by your online certification in beer pouring. Virtual beer pouring is not something a bar manager would be interested in I'd say. They don't want you to sculpt the perfect head. They want you to take multiple orders, prepare them, and get the money for them, fast.

I knew someone who could take about 15 complicated orders in a row and have them dished up and take money for them all in the time it took to settle and top off the Guinness. Oh, and he was able to count up in his head and tell each person what they owed without going near the till. He was a serious genius at it. Any decent bar worker could do half of that. Similarly with waitressing or food service. There is a certain about of training and skill needed and lots of soft skills you utilise.

This country is awash with unemployed graduates who might have summer work experience that tops yours. You might encounter the employer who wants to give the work to his own countryfolk but it is probably down to the fact that the other applicants simply have more experience. You are coming in at the tail end of the biggest recession in Irish history, so I'm a bit surprised at why you think there would be lots of jobs to pick and choose from.

What kind of work experience do you have? You might have more luck applying for jobs in whatever you got your degree in than for hospitality positions.

feelgoodlost

Thank you guys for your kind responses. I appreciate it.

If I could delete this thread I would. I feel like I may have unintentionally offended some people. I didn't mean to by any means.

I also have no problem with cleaning. I'm quite good at it and have done it in the past on many occasions. I just don't want to do it as my only responsibility. I want more of a challenge. I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

I never said I would be better than experienced bartenders. I was also only applying at craft beer pubs where pouring a proper head is actually an important thing. It is like going into a cafe where you pay good money for an espresso or coffee and you expect a quality product with maybe some nice latte art on top. You're going there for this particular product and service. I'm not going into craft beer bars looking for sloppy quick service. I would rather they take their time to do it properly.

VincePP

As said above, go to recruitment agencies.
Most larger retailers and bars use recruitment agencies - they can also tell you what they think is suitable for you.

Knocking on doors of smaller companies will not get great response as they get people knocking every day especially as school and college terms have ended

Mrs OBumble

livedadream wrote: »

being Canadian or an immigrant had nothing to do with that...

I believe it's highly relevant.

In this country, in some companies, some CVs routinely get binned because they have the wrong address on them. Some people don't get interviews because they have the wrong accents.

And there are some jobs which immigrants are more likely to get. But usually it's non-English-speaking-background immigrants, who can be exploited more easily.




Also, someone tried to say that a trial shift if for the potential employee's benefit too. Sorry - that's nonsense. There is no need for trial shifts in this country, where probation lasts for up to a year, and people can be let go for no reason and with no notice in the first 13 weeks. The only reason that employers use trial shifts is to get free labour out of job-seekers. (Yes, I can name certain hospitality employers who did this when the job-situation was really bad.)

Roscoe P Coltrane

Hi OP. As someone who works in the hospitality industry, I can see your frustration in what you see as jobs you could do. But to be totally honest with you, the majority of employers dont want full time staff- casual & part time can fill the same roles and the employer doesnt owe them nearly as much. As a few previous posters have mentioned, register with an agency that provides hospo staff to companies- you can at least earn while looking and have some (paid) work on your cv. Also apply for general catering/hospo jobs (as that seems to be where you see yourself) with companies at stadiums, racecourses etc- these companies usually have a big pool of staff but provide training & if you show yourself to be valuable they will offer more work. A willingness to work at the basic level and showing you strive for more is the best way forward in this business. Or frame your supervisor for theft. Always have a plan B!

irishmoss

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

The only reason that employers use trial shifts is to get free labour out of job-seekers. (Yes, I can name certain hospitality employers who did this when the job-situation was really bad.)

They are still doing it so op beware of working those trial shifts. most are nothing more than a scam to get free labour