Pegida Demonstration in Limerick

Mark Tapley

stefanovich wrote: »

What are you two doing in a thread about Limerick? Stirring things up to get the thread shut down no doubt.

You will have to build a wall around Limerick to protect yourself. Don't be getting upset when people don't want to buy your bullshìt.

johnnyryan89

stefanovich wrote: »

The demonstration is against the Islamification of the west so Sharia law would be part of said Islamification would it not? Anyways, I was just making the point that our laws could be a lot worse than they are in response to a poster who suggested that it was our politicians who are to blame and not refugees.

I also think refugees are not at fault for wanting a better life for themselves and their families but the influx is now unsustainable. The fact that we are not sending back boats is encouraging them to attempt this perilous journey and there are radical violent extremists arriving with legitimate people.

You asked people what was there opinion on this demonstration and would they go and support

I'm sure if you want to get in depth about the views of this group and immigration then there's probably a thread about them in after hours.

But to answer the questions you asked, they are entitled to speak their minds whether I agree with them or not and as long as they stay away from my house peddling the anti immigration tripe then they can do as they like because I've got as much time for the far right as I do far left which isn't much.

JupiterKid

I have absolutely no problem with the headscarf but the niquab face veil is, to me, a symbol of oppression and also of a total lack of any integration with the host society. That is not acceptable in my opinion.

Of course there are moderate Muslims but there are also many radical, fundamentalist Islamists who want nothing more than to destroy the West. Do we really want this in Ireland just after throwing off the shackles of Catholic oppression?

panda100

stefanovich wrote:

Yes, there are quite a lot these days. I find it worrisome.

Why? Why are you so worried about women choosing the niqab? A women's autonomy to choose to dress however she wants doesn't impinge on your rights in any way and should be her choice. All evidence from the UK indicate that most women wear the niqab only selectively and have chosen to adopt the wearing of it themselves.

Unfortunately we still in live in a society that is obsessed and has a faux concern for what women choose to wear or not to wear.

I've mentioned this before on these forum but there appears to be a worrying increase in street harassment in Limerick city over the last year. It always gets worse for women when the weather is nice and we (due to hot weather) start wearing less clothes. I got so many comments thrown at me while walking around town the last two weeks, a few nice and many not so nice. I think men need to stop commenting and feigning faux concern over what women choose to wear be that a burka or a bikini.

stefanovich

panda100 wrote: »

Why? Why are you so worried about women choosing the niqab? A women's autonomy to choose to dress however she wants doesn't impinge on your rights in any way and should be her choice. All evidence from the UK indicate that most women wear the niqab only selectively and have chosen to adopt the wearing of it themselves.

Yes, its a choice between being shunned by their family or not. Don't dress this up as an expression of female rights. It's not. You would absolutey not be allowed freedom of expression in a muslim society.

panda100 wrote: »

I've mentioned this before on these forum but there appears to be a worrying increase in street harassment in Limerick city over the last year. It always gets worse for women when the weather is nice and we (due to hot weather) start wearing less clothes. I got so many comments thrown at me while walking around town the last two weeks, a few nice and many not so nice. I think men need to stop commenting and feigning faux concern over what women choose to wear be that a burka or a bikini.

Quite a bit of street harassment happening in Germany too by the looks of it.

What exactly are you trying to say? Men are so bad that maybe burkas aren't such bad idea?

As a heterosexual male I enjoy looking at women when they dress sexy. I'm sure there are a lot of women who dress that way because they want male attention.

Making comments at strange women on the street is creepy alright though.

panda100

stefanovich wrote:

Quite a bit of street harassment happening in Germany too by the looks of it.

This is the Limerick forum not the Berlin forum. The only street harassment I experience here is from white Irish males (maybe they are Muslim I can't tell).

stefanovich wrote:

What exactly are you trying to say? Men are so bad that maybe burkas aren't such bad idea?

No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying this has nothing to do with religion convictions but societal expectations that men can say whatever they want and freely express their opinions on what women choose to wear. The worry and concern for Muslim women's choice of dress appears to be coming from a patriarchal notion that men can control how little or much clothing a women wears.
Can women just not wear whatever the f*ck they like please without men feigning 'worry' for them.

stefanovich

panda100 wrote: »

No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying this has nothing to do with religion convictions but societal expectations that men can say whatever they want and freely express their opinions on what women choose to wear. The worry and concern for Muslim women's choice of dress appears to be coming from a patriarchal notion that men can control how little or much clothing a women wears.
Can women just not wear whatever the f*ck they like please without men feigning 'worry' for them.

Nope. Not in my case at all. The veil bothers me alright because I do think it is forced on women for the most part or the women that choose to wear it tend to take other parts of the Koran literally.

Edit: And its not even in the Koran, they are just copying what their prophet did with his wives.

stefanovich

panda100 wrote: »

This is the Limerick forum not the Berlin forum. The only street harassment I experience here is from white Irish males (maybe they are Muslim I can't tell).

What kind of harassment exactly? Words or more than that?

jbkenn

JupiterKid wrote: »

I have absolutely no problem with the headscarf but the niquab face veil is, to me, a symbol of oppression and also of a total lack of any integration with the host society. That is not acceptable in my opinion.

Of course there are moderate Muslims but there are also many radical, fundamentalist Islamists who want nothing more than to destroy the West. Do we really want this in Ireland just after throwing off the shackles of Catholic oppression?

Islam or it's proponents have no place in modern Ireland, anyone thinking differently is a deluded fool.

TonyCliftonEsq

If only people were this vocal and exercised about the people here that actually cause trouble for the rest of us.

It sure as hell isn't the Muslim community here in Limerick whose behaviour has tainted our city image with the moniker "Stab City" or whose gang violence has left numerous dead and injured from gun violence. It isn't Muslims that you see racing sulkies into traffic and beating horses half to death in the name of their culture boss.

And it isn't Muslims that roam the countryside in gangs beating pensioners to a pulp for the few Bob they have under the mattress.

But no, 25 Syrian refugees fleeing a gang of savages is enough for some people here to drag out the black uniform and start goosestepping around the place.

Frankly you lot are an embarrassment and whatever legitimate concerns about the problem in Europe with the refugee crisis is lost thanks to your thinly veiled xenophobia and hysterical fear mongering.

So no I won't be going to your silly Pegida demonstration. No I don't welcome your silly Pegida friends and I hope you lot get run out of town. If we could swap you lot for refugees I'd do it in a heartbeat.

scream

panda100 wrote: »

Why? Why are you so worried about women choosing the niqab? A women's autonomy to choose to dress however she wants doesn't impinge on your rights in any way and should be her choice. All evidence from the UK indicate that most women wear the niqab only selectively and have chosen to adopt the wearing of it themselves.

Unfortunately we still in live in a society that is obsessed and has a faux concern for what women choose to wear or not to wear.

I've mentioned this before on these forum but there appears to be a worrying increase in street harassment in Limerick city over the last year. It always gets worse for women when the weather is nice and we (due to hot weather) start wearing less clothes. I got so many comments thrown at me while walking around town the last two weeks, a few nice and many not so nice. I think men need to stop commenting and feigning faux concern over what women choose to wear be that a burka or a bikini.

There are 40 something Muslim countries where they can wear a veil/niqab, Ireland however is not a Muslim country. The veil/Niqab have been banned in Egypt and 1 other Muslim country, which I can't remember. Wearing them is a very clear statement that they do not want to interact with the community and if they don't like modern Western Europe, well as I've said there are 40 something other Muslim countries which they can toddle off to.

As for comments on clothing, there are primary schools in Europe where migrant camps are located close by and the Principals have sent home letters to parents warning them to have their children not expose their skin, less the migrants ''misunderstand''. Apparently children showing bare skin could be interpreted as a signal to these men that they are sexually available. Of course while not all Muslim men are pedophiles/rapists, there is very clear evidence that many many many male Muslim migrants have a very serious problem with controlling themselves around Western women and children, resulting in a huge increase in rape and child molestation.

scream

Mark Tapley wrote: »

Debating with you is pointless you are as deeply entrenched as your counterparts in the far left. Extremists of all hues are a pain in the arsė and counterproductive to finding a viable solution.

The most viable situation is a long term strategy that aims to rebuild Syria and return people to their homes as quickly as possible. In order to do that people need to be living as close to their homes as possible and that means that they should be in the UN camps in Jordan and Lebanon. The money being spent now, while it's vast amounts, is a mere drop in the ocean to what it will become if people continue to come to Europe looking for a better life.

The money should be spent on improving conditions in the UN camps, on providing decent education for children, practical skills for adults, decent medical treatment and accommodation. Everyone who has entered Europe illegally should be deported automatically to these UN camps and it will send a message that Europe is not ripe for picking.

iguana

stefanovich wrote: »

As a heterosexual male I enjoy looking at women when they dress sexy. I'm sure there are a lot of women who dress that way because they want male attention.

Making comments at strange women on the street is creepy alright though.

Tbh, so is starting a thread on after hours about how wonderfully hot and bothered we're all making you when we dress to stay cool in hot weather.

stefanovich

iguana wrote:

Tbh, so is starting a thread on after hours about how wonderfully hot and bothered we're all making you when we dress to stay cool in hot weather.

Being a heterosexual male is now creepy. Maybe I need to order some gender fluid clothes for myself so I'll be less threatening.

TonyCliftonEsq

Interesting to see that Identity Ireland, who invited this unsavoury Pegida leader to Limerick, have recently been meeting with Tommy Robinson of the English Defence League.

Lol

If Identity Ireland don't want to be seen as xenophobic racist thugs then they sure as hell have a funny selection of friends

zulutango

Townie_P wrote:

I really hate to say it but Islam is a religion for cavemen.

Most religion is for cavemen, to be fair.

panda100

iguana wrote:

Tbh, so is starting a thread on after hours about how wonderfully hot and bothered we're all making you when we dress to stay cool in hot weather.

Brilliant! Well spotted. Guess some users here want us wimmin to be scantily clad all the time to perve on us.

Look I appreciate what people on here are saying. The niqab is an oppressive garment. If you have an issue with the niqab then is banning it or the people who wear it from coming to limerick really going to solve women's oppression? If you are really interested in women's liberation then surely integration into our society where Muslim women are meeting other women in their daily jobs and lives is the way forward. Most women than will probably choose to give up the niqab all together then but if they decide not to I have no problem with the wearing whatever they want.

iguana

stefanovich wrote: »

Being a heterosexual male is now creepy. Maybe I need to order some gender fluid clothes for myself so I'll be less threatening.

If you think that posting on a public forum about delightedly perving on women is what makes you a heterosexual male, then you have a warped and disturbing idea about your gender and sexuality.:eek:

panda100 wrote: »

Look I appreciate what people on here are saying. The niqab is an oppressive garment. If you have an issue with the niqab then is banning it or the people who wear it from coming to limerick really going to solve women's oppression? If you are really interested in women's liberation then surely integration into our society where Muslim women are meeting other women in their daily jobs and lives is the way forward. Most women than will probably choose to give up the niqab all together then but if they decide not to I have no problem with the wearing whatever they want.

It's absolutely an oppressive garment, as is a hijab, and there is no argument made by supposedly feminist muslim women that justifies either. The problem with banning them is that the women who wear them may then find themselves forced to stay home and unable to interact at all with anyone not approved of by their husbands/fathers. I do however think it's reasonable for businesses who have rules about customers covering their faces and heads to enforce those rules even if the people breaking them, break them for religious reasons. So if it's not ok for me to wear a hat and face cover when I go into the bank, it shouldn't be ok for a muslim woman to either. I don't think that rules made for sensible reasons should have exceptions for religious reasons, which are by very definition the opposite of sensible.

TonyCliftonEsq

5 posts, closes account

scream

panda100 wrote: »

Brilliant! Well spotted. Guess some users here want us wimmin to be scantily clad all the time to perve on us.

Look I appreciate what people on here are saying. The niqab is an oppressive garment. If you have an issue with the niqab then is banning it or the people who wear it from coming to limerick really going to solve women's oppression? If you are really interested in women's liberation then surely integration into our society where Muslim women are meeting other women in their daily jobs and lives is the way forward. Most women than will probably choose to give up the niqab all together then but if they decide not to I have no problem with the wearing whatever they want.

You're missing the point, women who wear the niqab don't work at least not within the Western community. You're making a common mistaken assumption that living in the West is going to somehow ''rub off'' on Muslims and make them just like Europeans, it doesn't work like that with most of them, especially the ones coming over who have lived in the back of beyond. Saying a woman should be able to wear a bikini in a city and get no comments is very silly and smacks of the Millennial idea that the world should be some sort of Safe Space.

Like it or not, if a woman walks around a city centre in a bikini it sends a very definite message that she's looking for attention, argue it what ever way you like, but it's still attention seeking. Wearing a niqab makes a polar opposite statement that the wearer wants nothing to do with you.

OfTheMarsWongs

scream wrote: »

Like it or not, if a woman walks around a city centre in a bikini it sends a very definite message that she's looking for attention, argue it what ever way you like, but it's still attention seeking.

Have you considered that it's been 22C the past week and they are just trying to stay cool. Saw some guys walking around with no tops on during the week, are they looking for attention?

scream

OfTheMarsWongs wrote: »

Have you considered that it's been 22C the past week and they are just trying to stay cool. Saw some guys walking around with no tops on during the week, are they looking for attention?

In a bikini? The guys are usually of the skanger persuasion and often found wearing a wife beater in lieu of the bare chest, neither is a particularly attractive sight. Come on now, any woman wandering around Limerick city in a bikini is going to attract comments, good bad and indifferent.:D

stefanovich

TonyCliftonEsq wrote: »

Interesting to see that Identity Ireland, who invited this unsavoury Pegida leader to Limerick, have recently been meeting with Tommy Robinson of the English Defence League.

Lol

If Identity Ireland don't want to be seen as xenophobic racist thugs then they sure as hell have a funny selection of friends

Tommy Robinson is no longer the leader of the EDL, he is actually a member of Pegida now.

You know that in the last 10 years he has actually grown up quite a lot and is now a very reasonable person. He saw Luton wrecked by immigration growing up.

If you have the guts then try watching his Oxford Union address.

iguana wrote: »

If you think that posting on a public forum about delightedly perving on women is what makes you a heterosexual male, then you have a warped and disturbing idea about your gender and sexuality.:eek:

Admiring women is now perving. What about that ad for diet coke where the women are all looking at the guy washing the windows? That's also perving is it or is perving only when a man you dislike admires you?

You know there is a very important biological reason men find woman attractive.

iguana wrote: »

It's absolutely an oppressive garment, as is a hijab, and there is no argument made by supposedly feminist muslim women that justifies either. The problem with banning them is that the women who wear them may then find themselves forced to stay home and unable to interact at all with anyone not approved of by their husbands/fathers. I do however think it's reasonable for businesses who have rules about customers covering their faces and heads to enforce those rules even if the people breaking them, break them for religious reasons. So if it's not ok for me to wear a hat and face cover when I go into the bank, it shouldn't be ok for a muslim woman to either. I don't think that rules made for sensible reasons should have exceptions for religious reasons, which are by very definition the opposite of sensible.

If someone is being kept at home against their will then its a criminal matter for the police.

OfTheMarsWongs wrote: »

Have you considered that it's been 22C the past week and they are just trying to stay cool. Saw some guys walking around with no tops on during the week, are they looking for attention?

It's usually women who pass comment when a scantily clad girl walks by actually.

magma69

panda100 wrote: »

Brilliant! Well spotted. Guess some users here want us wimmin to be scantily clad all the time to perve on us.

Look I appreciate what people on here are saying. The niqab is an oppressive garment. If you have an issue with the niqab then is banning it or the people who wear it from coming to limerick really going to solve women's oppression? If you are really interested in women's liberation then surely integration into our society where Muslim women are meeting other women in their daily jobs and lives is the way forward. Most women than will probably choose to give up the niqab all together then but if they decide not to I have no problem with the wearing whatever they want.

Agreed. I've no problem with the niqab in and of itself. It's how it's enforced by law in countries and how women are pressured into wearing it against their will in Islamic cultures that I have a problem with. If a woman genuinely wants to wear it, go for it. Though I have no problem with businesses having a policy to remove it for security purposes also.

magma69

I just hope that if there is a counter demonstration that they do it peacefully. Trying to silence the Pegida types only strengthens their supporters beliefs and if anything, makes them more popular because they feel they aren't getting their fair say.

stefanovich

magma69 wrote: »

I just hope that if there is a counter demonstration that they do it peacefully. Trying to silence the Pegida types only strengthens their supporters beliefs and if anything, makes them more popular because they feel they aren't getting their fair say.

What Pegida are saying is reasonable. Therefore the only argument the ironically named "antifa" have is violence. You can be nearly guaranteed that they are already planning to "bash the fascists". They will be made up of anarchists, open borders types and sinn fein types bussed down from the north.

TonyCliftonEsq

The counter demonstration should just openly mock and laugh at Pegida and their supporters.

stefanovich

TonyCliftonEsq wrote: »

The counter demonstration should just openly mock and laugh at Pegida and their supporters.

How about listening and then expressing their own opinion? Why the need for schoolyard tactics?

TonyCliftonEsq

stefanovich wrote: »

Tommy Robinson is no longer the leader of the EDL, he is actually a member of Pegida now.

You know that in the last 10 years he has actually grown up quite a lot and is now a very reasonable person. He saw Luton wrecked by immigration growing up.

If you have the guts then try watching his Oxford Union address.

Lol a member of Pegida, of course he would be

If he has grown up so much why does he still continue to use the fake name Tommy Robinson and other fake names?

His real name is Stephen Yaxley. Both of his parents are Irish Immigrants

He has a conviction and jail sentence for assaulting an off-duty policeman that intervened in a domestic case between himself and his girlfriend. Lovely chap then.

Hilarious that you lot cosy up to a guy who attacked a police officer who tried to stop him assaulting a woman and then profess concern about Muslims and how they treat women.

He is also a former member of the BNP and the name Tommy Robinson comes from the name of a prominent football hooligan member of the MIGS (Luton Town Football Hooligan Crew)

These guys have been responsible for the police having to warn Asian shops and homes in Luton that they were about to be attacked by the MIG crew.

This is the crowd of thugs that Stefanovich and his Pegida chums cosy up to and admire.

TonyCliftonEsq

stefanovich wrote: »

How about listening and then expressing their own opinion? Why the need for schoolyard tactics?

Because I have already listened to enough bile pouring out of the mouths of Polish Pegida supporters I know here in Limerick. Your own posts here merely confirm my belief that Pegida are a bunch of xenophobic fear-mongering thugs.