The death of Harambe the gorilla

CaptainInsano

MadDog76 wrote: »

In my view, an endangered ape becomes even more endangered if a human life is at risk, ie. ape dies so human can live, just as it should be ........ there is no justification for the reverse, that's just a warped way of seeing things.

Poachers are often shot for attempting to kill endangered animals by armed conservationists in parks in African countries. Surely a definite justification of the reverse.

MadDog76

CaptainInsano wrote: »

Poachers are often shot for attempting to kill endangered animals by armed conservationists in parks in African countries. Surely a definite justification of the reverse.

Yeah, sure .......... I have no objections to criminals, who put themselves in harm's way, being killed whilst committing a crime.

CaptainInsano

CaptainInsano wrote: »

Poachers are often shot for attempting to kill endangered animals by armed conservationists in parks in African countries. Surely a definite justification of the reverse.

True. And the death of animals sometimes draws more reaction and empathy than the death of African people.

Manic Moran

No charges against the mother.

Quoting the prosecutor: "[font=CNN, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, Utkal, sans-serif]"By all accounts, this mother did not act in any way where she presented this child to some harm"[/font]

[font=CNN, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, Utkal, sans-serif]"She had three other kids with her and turned her back. ... And if anyone doesn't believe a 3-year-old can scamper off very quickly, they've never had kids."[/font]
[font=CNN, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, Utkal, sans-serif]http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/06/us/harambe-gorilla-death-investigation/[/font]

steddyeddy

Deleted User wrote: »

The ape was born in captivity and was not going to leave captivity, contributing nothing to the species' endangered status. What real use is a captive ape's life? Is this zoo involved in breeding programs to increase wild populations?

I think the worst comment I've heard about this event is "three year old boys aren't endangered". If the child is deemed replaceable, so is the captive bred ape.

I don't fall into that camp. However I don't think it's a child or gorilla situation. I definitely don't fall into the "shoot the endangered hominid" as a first option. It completely reduces the importance, intelligence and empathy of these creatures.

They're far less dangerous and far more intelligent than dogs for instance and people seem to have an easier time disposing of them than a dangerous dog.

osarusan

steddyeddy wrote: »

I definitely don't fall into the "shoot the endangered hominid" as a first option.

Who does have that as a preferred 'first option' though, on here or elsewhere? I'd say virtually everybody is in agreement that it is a last resort.

The discussions about whether they should be in zoos, and whether the enclosures should have been better built (from the view of keeping people out, not only animals in) are separate topics to what options were available once the situation had developed as it did.

Maireadio

Candie wrote: »

If Pandas had been left to their own devices, there would be no Pandas.

Pandas seem to be on a death wish. Yes, their habitats have been depleted but honestly, they don't help themselves.

scdublin

Is it sad he was killed? Yes. Was the child in danger, particularly if they had angered it by shooting sedatives at it? Yes. Should the parents have been watching the child more closely? Yes. Should the surrounding areas have been better protected so the kid could never have got in there in the first place? Yes.

I think they made the right decision given the circumstances and it would have been a very hard one considering they worked closely with the animal. If the kid had been torn apart in front of an audience they would have been absolutely crucified for not stepping in before that happened so I can't see how they had any other choice.

People are being overly critical of the parents - no parent out there is perfect and no parent can honestly say they keep their eyes on their kid 100% of the time when they're out. I see kids acting up and running away from their parents all the time. Distractions happen and I personally think the zoo is more to blame for not having the appropriate fencing to keep people out.

Discodog

steddyeddy wrote: »

I don't fall into that camp. However I don't think it's a child or gorilla situation. I definitely don't fall into the "shoot the endangered hominid" as a first option. It completely reduces the importance, intelligence and empathy of these creatures.

They're far less dangerous and far more intelligent than dogs for instance and people seem to have an easier time disposing of them than a dangerous dog.

Really ? :rolleyes:

We kill thousands of dogs every year compared to one Gorilla. It's strange how you can have such understanding of the characteristics & intelligence of Apes & so little for dogs.

steddyeddy

Discodog wrote: »

Really ? :rolleyes:

We kill thousands of dogs every year compared to one Gorilla. It's strange how you can have such understanding of the characteristics & intelligence of Apes & so little for dogs.

Dogs are more intelligent than apes?

Discodog

steddyeddy wrote: »

Dogs are more intelligent than apes?

Yes in some ways. Their ability to understand human emotions is one obvious example. A number of dogs have been trained to recognise over 300 items by name. Assistance dogs have been trained to recognise when their owner is in distress & call for help.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/46319430/ns/technology_and_science-science/t/dogs-understand-us-better-chimps-do-scientists-say/#.V1fM0IQrJiw

steddyeddy

Discodog wrote: »

Yes in some ways. Their ability to understand human emotions is one obvious example. A number of dogs have been trained to recognise over 300 items by name. Assistance dogs have been trained to recognise when their owner is in distress & call for help.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/46319430/ns/technology_and_science-science/t/dogs-understand-us-better-chimps-do-scientists-say/#.V1fM0IQrJiw

Ability to be trained vs intelligence. Dogs do not approach apes in intelligence.

cowboyBuilder

I'm just glad God protected the childs life until they could shoot the Gorilla ...

Good work God ! Next time though, just make the Gorilla hide in the corner away from the kid - everyones a winner that way !

Maireadio

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Very sad that the gorilla lost his life because some fool wasn't watching her kid properly.

Not every human life is worth more than an animals either.

A toddler's would be though, seeing as they are not old enough to have done any of the things that would make a gorilla's life worth more.

BorneTobyWilde

America doesn't negotiate with Gorilla's who take hostages. It sends out a message to all other Gorilla's.

Discodog

steddyeddy wrote: »

Ability to be trained vs intelligence. Dogs do not approach apes in intelligence.

I am not going to start a dogs versus gorillas debate but animal intelligence can be measured in many ways. An ability to be trained is a strong indicator of intelligence, after all it's what we do with our own children when we educate them.

If you applied the same research to dogs that you do to apes & ignore your obvious dislike of dogs, you would find plenty of evidence to show that they have remarkable instinctive intelligence. Your lack of understanding just reinforces your dislike & fear.

MadDog76

Discodog wrote: »

I am not going to start a dogs versus gorillas debate but animal intelligence can be measured in many ways. An ability to be trained is a strong indicator of intelligence, after all it's what we do with our own children when we educate them.

If you applied the same research to dogs that you do to apes & ignore your obvious dislike of dogs, you would find plenty of evidence to show that they have remarkable instinctive intelligence. Your lack of understanding just reinforces your dislike & fear.

Paws versus Opposable Thumbs .............. dogs lose!!