2016-17 UEFA Champions League

TheCitizen

irishman86 wrote: »

Sure buddy, btw I am neutral, couldnt give a toss who won it, infact like many other Id live Buffon to win it while he plays, why not now.
I find you pretending to a neutral hilarious though you mention "decisions" but never once have commented on Barcelonas "decisions" in a negative light.
Im here to watch enjoyable football and yes I cheered Real on against Bayern every French man does

You're a French man?

irishman86

~Rebel~ wrote: »

And now they have one of the best attacks to go with it. They keep clean sheets, and score plenty of goals.

Real, meanwhile, score goals, but very much don't keep clean sheets. One of the worst records of keeping a clean sheet in Spain this year - i think they've managed something like 7 or 8 in total.

They have had a decent strike force for a few years though.
Im not arguing with you mind, I just think they are capable of scoring against Juventus

NIMAN

2 best teams look like they will meet in the final.

Everyone in the media tonight saying dream final, I wouldn't be so sure. Most CL finals aren't classics.

Juve have a history of bottling it in CL finals.....will this be their year to change that?
Real tend to turn up for finals they are in. There's always a first time they don't of course.

Looking forward to it either way.

The Talking Bread

Dunphy waffling. "I transferred the bet"? Why in Gods name would you cash out on a 16/1 bet at this stage. Thats The Golden Miller betting nuance.

Billy86

corny wrote: »

The RTE lads constantly do Juventus a disservice. Yes they defend well but the image they peddle of a workmanlike and rugged team is way off the mark. Juve scored two brilliant goals this evening and at times played some wonderful football. They're a brilliant all round side.

If Barcelona scored those two goals this evening you wouldn't be able to shut them up.

It just shows the general cluelessness over there. They give out about defending for years on end, but can't actually recognise some great defensive work when they see it unless it's packed with glitzier names like Italy in the 2006 WC. Just shows their attempts "purist" bulls*** up the the absolute farce that it is and that they are at this stage.

Had this been a team 30 years ago, they'd be comparing modern day sides yammering on about "you just don't see that anymore". Juve are almost a throwback in that sense - extremely disciplined an organised, cynical when they need to be, methodical almost to the point of being lethargic at times, patient and extremely interesting to watch compared to what most sides aim for nowadays because of it.

Christ, even just pop Pirlo in front of the backline and they'd probably be bouncing up and down like lemmings and fawning over this team.

Billy86

TheCitizen wrote: »

You're a French man?

Frenchman, Irishman, must have been autoc----

*looks at where F and I are on keyboard*

Hhhhmm...

jacool

Real's year I think. I can see Kroos, Asensio and Modric creating enough for Ronaldo to grab a goal. A lot could depend on who the referee is. I thought Juve got away with a few tonight. Barzagli made a few challenges which weren't down as fouls as the referee played advantage to Monaco. I can see the Madrid players just going down and stopping play in those situations. I'll put my house on a red card with candidates in both defences.
Do the second legs have to be played!!!!!

irishman86

TheCitizen wrote: »

You're a French man?

Yes why. Its the username isnt it, tends to confuse people

Armchair Andy

I'd love to know what Hamann thinks of the whole set up. He's surely always singing some diddly aye song in his head before realising Jesus I better say something here.

~Rebel~

irishman86 wrote: »

They have had a decent strike force for a few years though.
Im not arguing with you mind, I just think they are capable of scoring against Juventus

I think they are too - but all in all, I think Juve are the more complete, balanced team. Real have more cracks that can be exploited.

TheCitizen

irishman86 wrote: »

Yes why. Its the username isnt it, tends to confuse people

So you meant to say every Irishman would prefer to see Real win over Bayern? What are you blathering about, why would an Irishman prefer Real over Bayern? Nonsense

irishman86

TheCitizen wrote: »

So you meant to say every Irishman would prefer to see Real win over Bayern? What are you blathering about, why would an Irishman prefer Real over Bayern? Nonsense

Im not Irish, Im French. Ive said so before on this thread. My username is a inside joke on the fact at home in France they call me the irishman as I live in Ireland.

Turtwig

Real Juve is very much Juventus vs Juventus. Both style of play are remarkably similar. Which probably says a lot for the adage of attack wins games; defence wins title. Real's counter attack though is far more potent than Juventus'. Juve's back line is far more rigid than Real's. Monaco really lacked a defensive mid tonight. Casemiro needs to get injured to really bump up Juventus's chances as they don't look near as potent in attack.

Of course, neither team have technically made the final yet.

Andersonisgod

Real Madrid are winning this competition, aren't they?

Ulysses Gaze

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Real Madrid are winning this competition, aren't they?

It's set up for a Sergio Ramos header to win it.

Turtwig

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Real Madrid are winning this competition, aren't they?

History is largely against them. (Then again history is kind of against Juve in finals at the moment too. Something's gonna give. )

But yeah they have the best chance any side has had in a long time of doing the coveted double in the UCL.

pudzey101

Is it safe to say Buffon has been the best keeper this year ? Give Neuer and De Gea their credit but surely he has to be up there this year .

Wonder what odds id get on him keeping a clean sheet and Juve to win the final .

~Rebel~

Turtwig wrote: »

Real Juve is very much Juventus vs Juventus. Both style of play are remarkably similar. Which probably says a lot for the adage of attack wins games; defence wins title. Real's counter attack though is far more potent than Juventus'. Juve's back line is far more rigid than Real's. Monaco really lacked a defensive mid tonight. Casemiro needs to get injured to really bump up Juventus's chances as they don't look near as potent in attack.

Of course, neither team have technically made the final yet.

Hmmm, though Real are definitely a lot less capable of keeping it tight at the back. Only 8 league clean sheets all season - only 2 clean sheets in their last 17 games. Conceded more goals this season than in 6 of their last 7 seasons.

Goals scored have definitely papered over their defensive frailties.

The Talking Bread

pudzey101 wrote: »

Is it safe to say Buffon has been the best keeper this year ? Give Neuer and De Gea their credit but surely he has to be up there this year .

Wonder what odds id get on him keeping a clean sheet and Juve to win the final .

Juventus to win to nil next week is 17/10 and 0-0 draw is 9/1.

So all you have to do is split those bets by proportion of your overall stake (75/80 % on "win to nil" and rest of your funds on the nil all draw.)

MisterAnarchy

Armchair Andy wrote: »

I'd love to know what Hamann thinks of the whole set up. He's surely always singing some diddly aye song in his head before realising Jesus I better say something here.

He loves working with RTE ,has said it numerous times before ,he can say what he wants unlike on the UK channels .

Armchair Andy

MisterAnarchy wrote:

He loves working with RTE ,has said it numerous times before ,he can say what he wants unlike on the UK channels .

Fair play. Follow him on social media he's a witty guy for a fella speaking his second language.

BorneTobyWilde

Real to win it 3 time in a row. Has anyone done that?

Ronaldo likes this competition , lucky him as he has not won a league title in years, and has only ever one won league title with Madrid.

Ulysses Gaze

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Real to win it 3 time in a row. Has anyone done that?

Ronaldo likes this competition , lucky him as he has not won a league title in years, and has only ever one won league title with Madrid.

Shocking statistic isn't it?

Just shows how dominant Barca have been domestically over the last 8 years since he joined Real.

Skylinehead

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Real to win it 3 time in a row. Has anyone done that?

Ronaldo likes this competition , lucky him as he has not won a league title in years, and has only ever one won league title with Madrid.

Nobodies won it twice in a row, never mind 3...

pudzey101

Last time Juve conceded a CL goal - Obama was president , gary rowett was birmingham manager and Man Utd where 6th .

irishman86

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

It's set up for a Sergio Ramos header to win it.

You are obsessed with Ramos headers

BorneTobyWilde

Skylinehead wrote: »

Nobodies won it twice in a row, never mind 3...

Cool
I was a bit confused with the 2013/2014 winner and 2015/2016 winners and missed out the 2014/2015 winner.

MisterAnarchy

Armchair Andy wrote: »

Fair play. Follow him on social media he's a witty guy for a fella speaking his second language.

I was flicking through the tv channels a few weeks ago and I came across him on the German version of A League of our Own ,I think he is a team captain.

764dak

Cringey thread

snowblind

An excellent performance from Juventus. Have to say I was a bit taken aback by the initial formation revelation of Barzagli at RB and Alves at RW but it was naive from me. Allegri knew exactly what's up, it was a chess move basically

The Golden Miller

The last time Real took any sort of a scalp off Juve was back in the mid 90's. Hard to see that changing anytime soon

Billy86

The Golden Miller wrote: »

The last time Real took any sort of a scalp off Juve was back in the mid 90's. Hard to see that changing anytime soon

"Madrid fans around the world wait with bated breath in the hopes of TGM putting a boards bet on Juve lifting the cup..."

jacool

The Golden Miller wrote: »

The last time Real took any sort of a scalp off Juve was back in the mid 90's. Hard to see that changing anytime soon

1998 - late 90's (pedantic, yes)

Overall the sides have met 18 times (ignoring Peace Cup!!) and its 8 wins apiece. The only two draws were in the last 3 games. If you took the two group games in 2013 as having being home and away legs (which is untrue, I know, but humour me!) then Real Madrid would have won 4-3 on aggregate. Juve won when it mattered in 2015, progressing 3-2 on aggregate.
I just have a feeling that the "one off" game will suit Real Madrid.

The Golden Miller

jacool wrote: »

1998 - late 90's (pedantic, yes)

Overall the sides have met 18 times (ignoring Peace Cup!!) and its 8 wins apiece. The only two draws were in the last 3 games. If you took the two group games in 2013 as having being home and away legs (which is untrue, I know, but humour me!) then Real Madrid would have won 4-3 on aggregate. Juve won when it mattered in 2015, progressing 3-2 on aggregate.
I just have a feeling that the "one off" game will suit Real Madrid.

I think when you word it like above, it flatters Real greatly. Before 86 Real won all their tie's, but since 96 Juve have knocked them out of the tournament 4 times in straight match-ups. They've met in the group 4 times (I wouldn't place much of an onus on these meetings) with Juve winning 3 times and a draw. Of course Real beat them in the 98 final, and this next meeting will be a final. Overall, Real's record is extremely poor against Juve, and I'd put it down to the stylistic match up. To me this Real team are a jack of all trades, master of none when compared to Juve. Juve play with a real purpose and direction and everyone is on the same wavelength. They all pull together to get a job done in a very cohesive and clinical manner. And it doesn't hurt that they hold a bit of an indian sign over Real

The Talking Bread

Who cares about the past. Especially in a neutral venue. They are two different teams to the past.

I never understand some of the analysis on past records between two teams, even up until 2/3 years ago! ! Beyond it being just stating facts!

Billy86

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Who cares about the past. Especially in a neutral venue. They are two different teams to the past.

I never understand some of the analysis on past records between two teams, even up until 2/3 years ago! ! Beyond it being just stating facts!

2-3 years ago can kind of sort of make sense, but yeah I otherwise agree "a completely different group of players in a different system with a different manager beat another completely different group of players in a different system with a different manager but both were wearing similar clothes to what these players will be wearing" isn't exactly a great way to predict the outcome of a game.

The Golden Miller

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Who cares about the past. Especially in a neutral venue. They are two different teams to the past.

I never understand some of the analysis on past records between two teams, even up until 2/3 years ago! ! Beyond it being just stating facts!

Well in this case, I don't think it's a coincidence that Juve generally get the upper hand on Madrid. It's relevant in the sense that the stylistic match up will be quite similar to past meetings.

GavRedKing

This Juventus side is better equipped to win the CL than the one who lost 2 years ago to Barca.

Assuming its a Real v Juve final and its looking bloody likely, I'd fancy Juventus to get over the line this time.

The Talking Bread

The Golden Miller wrote: »

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Who cares about the past. Especially in a neutral venue. They are two different teams to the past.

I never understand some of the analysis on past records between two teams, even up until 2/3 years ago! ! Beyond it being just stating facts!

Well in this case, I don't think it's a coincidence that Juve generally get the upper hand on Madrid. It's relevant in the sense that the stylistic match up will be quite similar to past meetings.

Juve have came up against plenty of teams in history in such a "stylistic match up" scenario and came up losers. I don't think Madrid have this historical general "style" you refer to anyway.

Comparing historical results to analyse the game is a waste of your time!

The Golden Miller

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Juve have came up against plenty of teams in history in such a "stylistic match up" scenario and came up losers. I don't think Madrid have this historical general "style" you refer to anyway.

Comparing historical results to analyse the game is a waste of your time!

I agree with the general sentiment of what you are saying, and my original comment was made more in passing. If I was to do a bet on a certain game, I never really look at what the results were from their past 5 meetings etc. Although that isn't to say there aren't certain trends where a similar result does keep popping up which can often give a good idea of what may happen.

Psychology can play a part too, even if the teams are by and large different. The Madrid fans will of course be aware of their record against Juve, and would really love to get one over on them. The team and management will be aware of this expectation, and it could cause extra doubt, urgency,... etc making the mountain to climb that bit bigger. I wouldn't say it's much of a coincidence that Benfica sh!t their cacks everytime they get to a European final, psychologically the weight of history can weigh heavy once there's such huge expectancy in their own fanbase to achieve a certain result or finally overcome a certain team. Not saying it will be a factor, but it doesn't mean it won't potentially play a part either.

The way Madrid and Juve set up isn't all that different than how they set up 2 years ago, nor even 15 for that matter. A lot of similarities still in both teams.

Dirty Dingus McGee

The Golden Miller wrote: »

I agree with the general sentiment of what you are saying, and my original comment was made more in passing. If I was to do a bet on a certain game, I never really look at what the results were from their past 5 meetings etc. Although that isn't to say there aren't certain trends where a similar result does keep popping up which can often give a good idea of what may happen.

Psychology can play a part too, even if the teams are by and large different. The Madrid fans will of course be aware of their record against Juve, and would really love to get one over on them. The team and management will be aware of this expectation, and it could cause extra doubt, urgency,... etc making the mountain to climb that bit bigger. I wouldn't say it's much of a coincidence that Benfica sh!t their cacks everytime they get to a European final, psychologically the weight of history can weigh heavy once there's such huge expectancy in their own fanbase to achieve a certain result or finally overcome a certain team. Not saying it will be a factor, but it doesn't mean it won't potentially play a part either.

The way Madrid and Juve set up isn't all that different than how they set up 2 years ago, nor even 15 for that matter. A lot of similarities still in both teams.

Real have Morata this time though.

The Talking Bread

The Golden Miller wrote: »

I agree with the general sentiment of what you are saying, and my original comment was made more in passing. If I was to do a bet on a certain game, I never really look at what the results were from their past 5 meetings etc. .

We have noticed!

The Golden Miller

The Talking Bread wrote: »

We have noticed!

Touche ha. I meant the past 5 meetings in a direct head to head. Tbh, that was the first time I ever done a bet on a goalscorer market, generally avoid all those sinkhole markets. I'll just stick to my doubles and singles from now on. As we all know I'm fairly shrewd when it comes to who will win in a direct match up, the only person who predicted the final 4 mo chara;)

The Golden Miller

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Real have Morata this time though.

Would of liked to see him stay at Juve had it been an option

The Golden Miller

Irishman always likes every post "against" me. As I said Irishman (Frenchman?) its all too personal for you.

irishman86

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Irishman always likes every post "against" me. As I said Irishman (Frenchman?) its all too personal for you.

Just the Ronaldo ones, have a look on this page and you will see I dont otherwise.
The Ronaldo ones for me are just to funny and I think I like most of The Talking Breads posts as hes one of the posters I feel has a similar view mostly to me
You also never predicted the results like I asked you to, funny that

The Golden Miller

irishman86 wrote: »

Just the Ronaldo ones, have a look on this page and you will see I dont otherwise.
The Ronaldo ones for me are just to funny and I think I like most of The Talking Breads posts as hes one of the posters I feel has a similar view mostly to me
You also never predicted the results like I asked you to, funny that

I didn't see your post asking for semi final victors and since I missed it I apologise. I'll be honest since I'm a betting man, I would have said Atletico as I wasnt aware they were such a spent force despite their La Liga showings, I thought they were gunning for the Champions League and would of put in a huge performance. But alas, years of playing to that level with a limited squad has taken its toll. Although as I've stated several times, Juve will win it as history has shown us they regularly best Madrid and they have the best cohesive team, lest not because Real will play straight into their hands no matter what tactic they deploy. A perceived slight on Ronaldo is personal for you, despite regularly saying he's a world class goal scorer?

irishman86

The Golden Miller wrote: »

I didn't see your post asking for semi final victors and since I missed it I apologise. I'll be honest since I'm a betting man, I would have said Atletico as I wasnt aware they were such a spent force despite their La Liga showings, I thought they were gunning for the Champions League and would of put in a huge performance. But alas, years of playing to that level with a limited squad has taken its toll. Although as I've stated several times, Juve will win it as history has shown us they regularly best Madrid and they have the best cohesive team, lest not because Real will play straight into their hands no matter what tactic they deploy. A perceived slight on Ronaldo is personal for you, despite regularly saying he's a world class goal scorer?

Me liking posts where someone points out how wrong you were is personal for you. This could go back and forth, I hope we both agree that would be stupid
I dont argue with you regards Juventus, I think they could win it.
Ive already said there difference in style is minimal both have similar tactics, I think it will be a corner to win it or else penalties.

Andersonisgod

Fully expect Madrid to cross Juventus to death. 2-0, at least 1 goal via a high cross.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Fully expect Madrid to cross Juventus to death. 2-0, at least 1 goal via a high cross.

If Madrid do win that way, it will be some achievement and speak to their excellence given how good Juve are at defending against that type of attack.