2016-17 UEFA Champions League

citytillidie

Results
Group A
Paris Saint-Germain (FRA) 2 V 2 Ludogorets Razgrad (BUL)
Basel (SUI) 1 V 4 Arsenal (ENG)

Group B
Dynamo Kyiv (UKR) 6 V 0 Beşiktaş (TUR)
SL Benfica (POR) 1 V 2 Napoli (ITA)

Group C
FC Barcelona (ESP) 4 V 0 Borussia Mönchengladbach (GER)
Manchester City (ENG) 1 V 1 Celtic (SCO)

Group D
FC Bayern München (GER) 1 V 0 Atlético Madrid (ESP)
PSV Eindhoven (NED) 0 V 0 Rostov (RUS)

Group E
Bayer Leverkusen (GER) 3 V 0 Monaco (FRA)
Tottenham Hotspur (ENG) 3 V 1 CSKA Moskva (RUS)

Group F
Real Madrid (ESP) 2 V 2 Borussia Dortmund (GER)
Legia Warszawa (POL) 1 V 0 Sporting CP (POR)

Group G
Club Brugge (BEL) 0 V 2 FC København (DEN)
Porto (POR) 5 V 0 Leicester City (ENG)

Group H
Lyon (FRA) 0 V 0 Sevilla (ESP)
Juventus (ITA) 2 V 0 GNK Dinamo (CRO)

Round of 16
Seeded
Arsenal (ENG)
Napoli (ITA)
FC Barcelona (ESP)
Atlético Madrid (ESP)
Monaco (FRA)
Borussia Dortmund (GER)
Leicester City (ENG)
Juventus (ITA)

Unseeded
Paris Saint-Germain (FRA)
SL Benfica (POR)
Manchester City (ENG)
FC Bayern München (GER)
Bayer Leverkusen (GER)
Real Madrid (ESP)
Porto (POR)
Sevilla (ESP)

Dropped into Europa League
Ludogorets Razgrad (BUL)
Beşiktaş (TUR)
Borussia Mönchengladbach (GER)
Rostov (RUS)
Tottenham Hotspur (ENG)
Legia Warszawa (POL)
FC København (DEN)
Lyon (FRA)

Andersonisgod

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Tuchel cost them against Liverpool last year. Didn't instruct his team to suck the life out of the game and kill it off when they had the chance when the well in front.Defensively they've been absolutely ****e in since he's been there, he has to take the blame for that regardless of how good they are going forward.Their defence will probably cost them in the later stages of the champions league again.

Worth considering though that unlike most of the other top teams in Europe, Tuchel is working with an extremely young group of players, a good number of whom are untested at this level. On top of that this is a club that, when they do produce the finished article, they have to sell their top players. Hummels gone, Gundogan gone, missing the fantastic Guerreiro tonight at left back, missing their first choice goalkeeper.

Their press is brilliant, I'd say one of the best in all of Europe, when teams get past that their individual quality in defending isn't of the class of the likes of Barcelona, Real Madrid or Bayern Munich.

Agent Coulson

There will be new Europa League Champions this year at least.

Harry Palmr

Yes its the draw for the knock out stages and Arsenal winning their group means they'll be no better off than they usually are when running up 2nd.

Group winners

Arsenal can play: Benfica, Bayern Munich, Bayer Leverkusen, Real Madrid, Porto, Sevilla.

Atletico Madrid can play: PSG, Benfica, Manchester City, Bayer Leverkusen, Porto.

Barcelona can play: PSG, Benfica, Bayern Munich, Bayer Leverkusen, Porto.

Borussia Dortmund can play: PSG, Benfica, Manchester City, Porto, Sevilla.

Juventus can play: PSG, Benfica, Manchester City, Bayern Munich, Bayer Leverkusen, Real Madrid, Porto.

Leicester can play: PSG, Benfica, Bayern Munich, Bayer Leverkusen, Real Madrid, Sevilla.

Monaco can play: Benfica, Bayern Munich, Real Madrid, Manchester City, Sevilla, Porto.

Napoli can play: PSG, Manchester City, Bayern Munich, Bayer Leverkusen, Real Madrid, Porto, Sevilla.

Runners up

Bayern Munich can play: Arsenal, Napoli, Barcelona, Monaco, Leicester City, Juventus.

Bayer Leverkusen can play: Arsenal, Napoli, Barcelona, Atlético Madrid, Leicester City, Juventus.

Benfica can play: Arsenal, Barcelona, Atlético Madrid, Monaco, Borussia Dortmund, Leicester City, Juventus.

Manchester City can play: Napoli, Atlético Madrid, Monaco, Borussia Dortmund, Juventus.

PSG can play: Napoli, Barcelona, Atlético Madrid, Borussia Dortmund, Leicester City, Juventus.

Real Madrid can play: Arsenal, Napoli, Monaco, Leicester City, Juventus.

Porto can play: Arsenal, Napoli, Barcelona, Atlético Madrid, Monaco, Borussia Dortmund, Juventus.

Sevilla can play: Arsenal, Napoli, Monaco, Borussia Dortmund, Leicester City.

Johner

Great draw for City.

LuckyGent88

Tough match for Man City. Monaco are flying in Ligue 1 scoring goals for fun.

mansize

Not Real!

LuckyGent88

Johner

lol.

mansize

Bayern boom

GLaDOS

PSG v Barca should be good

LuckyGent88

Psg v barca once again

Harry Palmr

Sevilla v Leicester

PSG v Barcelona

Bayer Leverkusen v Atletico Madrid

Porto v Juventus

Bayern Munich v Arsenal

Benfica v Borussia Dortmund

Real Madrid v Napoli

Manchester City v Monaco

Great bunch of ties I have to say. They really should get rid of the group stage! :pac:

Johner

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Sevilla v Leicester

PSG v Barcelona

Bayer Leverkusen v Atletico Madrid

Porto v Juventus

Bayern Munich v Arsenal

Benfica v Borussia Dortmund

Real Madrid v Napoli

Manchester City v Monaco

Great bunch of ties I have to say. They really should get rid of the group stage! :pac:

Sevilla
Barca
Atletico
Juventus
Bayern
Dortmund
Real
Manchester City

Could be a cracking quarter final lineup.

GLaDOS

Can see Monaco causing City problems, especially if they don't sort their defence out.

mansize

Ive every confidence Arsenal can beat Bayern

GavRedKing

I reckon all the English sides will be beaten.

City have the "easier" draw but Monaco rright now are in fine form and if they played this week would probably put them out.

Unfortunately they have to wait a few weeks before they play them but I still fancy Monaco to do a job on City.

Andersonisgod

Could well end up with 4 Spanish teaks in the quarter finals, top league. It could also be that there's no English sides in the last 8. While Real Madrid didn't draw Leicester, Napoli was probably the next best option. PSG for Barça again!?!?

inforfun

****.... wanted to take a punt on Sevilla. Odds gone down now i suppose.
Sampaoli won the copa sudamericana with U de Chile against Argentinians and Brazilians so why not win the CL with a proven cup fighter as Sevilla is.
They seem to start to click, even starting to win away games.

Dots1982

When did Rudi Gullit become Ruud Gullit?

inforfun

After he was Ruud Dil

Turtwig

Sevilla are great to watch at the moment. They'll actually suit Leicester a little though.Hopefully though they'll finally get the respect they deserve from English pundits. The attitude towards them in last season's Europa league final was a joke!

Thanks to their Spanish comprades Barcelona had significantly greater chances of getting either Bayern or PSG than anyone else.

Apart from Real and Dortmund the rest of ties aren't near as clear cut.

KaiserGunner

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Could well end up with 4 Spanish teaks in the quarter finals, top league. It could also be that there's no English sides in the last 8. While Real Madrid didn't draw Leicester, Napoli was probably the next best option. PSG for Barça again!?!?

Well seeing how teams from the same country can't play each other, there could well end up being 3 English teams in the quarter finals, top league. Could also be that there's no Spanish sides in the last 8.

citytillidie

Round of 16 Draw
Manchester City (ENG) V Monaco (FRA)
Real Madrid (ESP) V Napoli (ITA)
SL Benfica (POR) V Borussia Dortmund (GER)
FC Bayern München (GER) V Arsenal (ENG)
Porto (POR) V Juventus (ITA)
Bayer Leverkusen (GER) V Atlético Madrid (ESP)
Paris Saint-Germain (FRA) V FC Barcelona (ESP)
Sevilla (ESP)V Leicester City (ENG)

Turtwig

On the bright side for Arsenal their match may actually be televised live on free to air in Ireland.

SlickRic

Arsenal will beat Bayern IMO.

inforfun

2 months and a transfer window to go.
Hard to predict anything the English teams should not fear going all out this round.
UEFA got their back by giving the "big 4" 4 guaranteed places

The Golden Miller

It will be between Juventus, Monaco and Atletico imo, with Juventus winning outright. Napoli, Barca, Bayern, Man City, PSG and Dortmund will all be done by a good defensive counter attacking team. Arsenal, Porto, Benfica, Sevilla, Leicester and Bayer aren't good enough. Madrid may cause Juve, Atletico and Monaco trouble in a one legged final as they play in a more direct and pragmatic fashion than your Barca's or Bayern's but would also be undone over 2 legs imo and Juve seem to hold the indian sign over them

Dirty Dingus McGee

The Golden Miller wrote: »

It will be between Juventus, Monaco and Atletico imo, with Juventus winning outright. Napoli, Barca, Bayern, Man City, PSG and Dortmund will all be done by a good defensive counter attacking team. Arsenal, Porto, Benfica, Sevilla, Leicester and Bayer aren't good enough. Madrid may cause Juve, Atletico and Monaco trouble in a one legged final as they play in a more direct and pragmatic fashion than your Barca's or Bayern's but would also be undone over 2 legs imo and Juve seem to hold the indian sign over them

Juve have only beaten Real Madrid once out of 4 meetings this decade in the champions league.

I think you're overrating Monaco they're a good team with a top quality coach but they shouldn't be put up with the favourites for the competition until they actually prove themselves in the knockout stages or beat some genuine high quality opposition.

Flint Fredstone

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Arsenal look like topping their group, Bayern are finishing second. Just saying...

Ahem...

Skylinehead

The Golden Miller wrote: »

It will be between Juventus, Monaco and Atletico imo, with Juventus winning outright. Napoli, Barca, Bayern, Man City, PSG and Dortmund will all be done by a good defensive counter attacking team. Arsenal, Porto, Benfica, Sevilla, Leicester and Bayer aren't good enough. Madrid may cause Juve, Atletico and Monaco trouble in a one legged final as they play in a more direct and pragmatic fashion than your Barca's or Bayern's but would also be undone over 2 legs imo and Juve seem to hold the indian sign over them

Monaco have been very impressive this season but put them up against Barcelona and I know where my moneys going. As for Bayern, they've not been fantastic this season but if Ancelotti knows anything, it's European knockout competition. You're completely overlooking some pretty damn good teams for fairly spurious reasons IMO

The Golden Miller

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Juve have only beaten Real Madrid once out of 4 meetings this decade in the champions league.

When is the last time Madrid came out on top against Juve when it's really mattered? 98 was it? They've played quite a bit since then

The Golden Miller

Skylinehead wrote: »

Monaco have been very impressive this season but put them up against Barcelona and I know where my moneys going. As for Bayern, they've not been fantastic this season but if Ancelotti knows anything, it's European knockout competition. You're completely overlooking some pretty damn good teams for fairly spurious reasons IMO

Barca could well win it but they really have to get the finger out. If they keep going the way they are, they'll be picked off by a good defensive unit without too much trouble. Bayern haven't a hope. Still messing about with the tiki-taka stuff left over from the Guardiola era. There's only one team who can play it and win a Champion League and it's Barca at their best, all other teams trying to emulate it will come up short against good defenses

Dirty Dingus McGee

The Golden Miller wrote: »

When is the last time Madrid came out on top against Juve when it's really mattered? 98 was it? They've played quite a bit since then

What happened in the past is irrelevant.Almost none of the players playing now would have played in any of the games apart from the one a couple of season sago which was only won narrowly by Juve.

Bayern have a terrible record against AC Milan in Europe but it wouldn't matter at all right now.

Dirty Dingus McGee

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Barca could well win it but they really have to get the finger out. If they keep going the way they are, they'll be picked off by a good defensive unit without too much trouble. Bayern haven't a hope. Still messing about with the tiki-taka stuff left over from the Guardiola era. There's only one team who can play it and win a Champion League and it's Barca at their best, all other teams trying to emulate it will come up short against good defenses

I wouldn't completely write off Bayern. It'll be a great tie between them and Arsenal but I think they'll get through. Ancelloti's record is brilliant in the champions league much better than his domestice record and their players are still quality, I'd imagine they'll up there game in the second half of the season.Difficult to motivate yourself of the group stages when you know you are going through and also difficult to motivate themselves for the Bundesliga now when they have won 4 in a row.

Skylinehead

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I wouldn't completely write off Bayern. It'll be a great tie between them and Barca but I think they'll get through. Ancelloti's record is brilliant in the champions league much better than his domestice record and their players are still quality, I'd imagine they'll up there game in the second half of the season.Difficult to motivate yourself of the group stages when you know you are going through and also difficult to motivate themselves for the Bundesliga now when they have won 4 in a row.

You doth flatter us too much

Mr.Nice Guy

Tough ties for the Premier League teams.

If the games were next week I'd fancy Monaco to beat Man City. Monaco are great to watch at the moment and deservedly beat Spurs home and away in the group stages (they would have battered Spurs a few weeks back had Lloris not produced a world class display). As I understand it the games are in February and March though so maybe City will be a tougher outfit by then. I think they need to bolster their defence in January.

I think Sevilla will be too much for Leicester to deal with. The Arsenal/Bayern game is a tough one to call but going on recent history you'd have to favour Bayern.

I had to laugh when I saw PSG landed Barcelona. Emery will get a lot of flak if they go out of Europe at the round of 16 since he was brought in to improve them in this competition, but then again if they had won the group they would have landed Bayern which would have been almost as bad. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that PSG could win but if the tie were next week I'd give them little chance. If they purchase a quality forward in January and pick up some steam then this could be a close tie.

I'm keen to see how the Portuguese sides get on. They've got tough ties but there's quality in their sides. Porto imo could spring an upset against Juventus. I saw them deservedly beat Roma in the Champions League play-off back in August and they're not a side that tends to give away many goals. If the game were next week I'd be tempted to bet on them, but by the time we get to February, March I might have second thoughts on that.

I agree with others that there's some great matches to look forward to.

ironingbored

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

What happened in the past is irrelevant.Almost none of the players playing now would have played in any of the games apart from the one a couple of season sago which was only won narrowly by Juve.

Bayern have a terrible record against AC Milan in Europe but it wouldn't matter at all right now.

Juve are a better team than when they got to the final in 2015 and that Barca team were unplayable.

Higuain is deadly anyway near the box and Dybala is an extraordinary talent. Defensively Juve are rock solid. You always need a bit of luck to win the UCL and if Juve get a bit it could be theirs in 2017!

ERG89

The Golden Miller wrote: »

It will be between Juventus, Monaco and Atletico imo, with Juventus winning outright. Napoli, Barca, Bayern, Man City, PSG and Dortmund will all be done by a good defensive counter attacking team. Arsenal, Porto, Benfica, Sevilla, Leicester and Bayer aren't good enough. Madrid may cause Juve, Atletico and Monaco trouble in a one legged final as they play in a more direct and pragmatic fashion than your Barca's or Bayern's but would also be undone over 2 legs imo and Juve seem to hold the indian sign over them

Bayern, Barca & Atletico have all dipped in form this season from what I watched of them. PSG have really fallen off the cliff tho, Emery has done an awful job there. City and Dortmund are just so badly organised defensively it'd give a neutral watching them a headache.
Juve still haven't got going this season. They were deservedly beaten in Serie A by Milan & Inter this season. They'll be fine against a very bad Porto team. Even though I'm not a fan of them I'd like to see them win it. Have huge respect for Allegri.

Dirty Dingus McGee

ironingbored wrote: »

Juve are a better team than when they got to the final in 2015 and that Barca team were unplayable.

Higuain is deadly anyway near the box and Dybala is an extraordinary talent. Defensively Juve are rock solid. You always need a bit of luck to win the UCL and if Juve get a bit it could be theirs in 2017!

I want either Juve,Dortmund or Atletico to win (Atletico being my first option) so I'd love to see them win but I wouldn't put them at Madrids level yet simply because they haven't been able to win it.Should they meet I think the confidence Madrid have from winning the competition in recent years will be a big boost , though I suppose you could counter it by saying Juve's hunger would be greater.

beakerjoe

I feel sorry for Arsenal. Finally winning there group and still face Bayern. However, 2nd placed PSG got a tougher draw in my opinion against Barca. I reckon Arsenal have grown stronger this year while Bayern, while still very hard to beat, are slightly weaker this time round. Id fancy Arsenal to go through but its very close to call.

The Golden Miller

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

What happened in the past is irrelevant.Almost none of the players playing now would have played in any of the games apart from the one a couple of season sago which was only won narrowly by Juve.

Bayern have a terrible record against AC Milan in Europe but it wouldn't matter at all right now.

I said the thing about an indian sign more in passing. Whether it will make a difference to the match is neither hear nor there to the fact they do have an indian sign over Real as it currently stands.....well until Real beat them in a meaningful match/tie. Unless you have a different meaning to the term?

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I wouldn't completely write off Bayern. It'll be a great tie between them and Arsenal but I think they'll get through. Ancelloti's record is brilliant in the champions league much better than his domestice record and their players are still quality, I'd imagine they'll up there game in the second half of the season.Difficult to motivate yourself of the group stages when you know you are going through and also difficult to motivate themselves for the Bundesliga now when they have won 4 in a row.

As you say I wouldn't completely write off Bayern, but they've gone backwards from last year imo, and that's going backwards from a period in which they were never going win it either. I'd expect them to beat Arsenal, but the hangover from Guardiola's attempts to get them to play like Barca is still there. Sideways passing and blunt attacks going nowhere. Ancelloti is yet to put his mark on the team and will need another year at least I feel.

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I'm keen to see how the Portuguese sides get on. They've got tough ties but there's quality in their sides. Porto imo could spring an upset against Juventus. I saw them deservedly beat Roma in the Champions League play-off back in August and they're not a side that tends to give away many goals. If the game were next week I'd be tempted to bet on them, but by the time we get to February, March I might have second thoughts on that.

Whatever about Benfica, Porto don't have a hope. They are a poor team by their own standards. They have been a distant 3rd in Portugal for some time now. A solid and well balanced Benfica may cause Dortmund trouble in their dodgy defense, but you'd still fancy Dortmund to just do enough. Porto haven't a hope. Dunno what match you thought you were watching when they played Roma, but a 9 man Roma were all over them

Mr.Nice Guy

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Whatever about Benfica, Porto don't have a hope. They are a poor team by their own standards. They have been a distant 3rd in Portugal for some time now. A solid and well balanced Benfica may cause Dortmund trouble in their dodgy defense, but you'd still fancy Dortmund to just do enough. Porto haven't a hope. Dunno what match you thought you were watching when they played Roma, but a 9 man Roma were all over them

I was watching the match where Porto beat Roma 3-0 in their own backyard (4-1 on aggregate), having gone 1-0 up after 8 minutes before Roma pushed the self-destruct button and saw two red cards (deserved ones).

Not even Roma claimed they were all over them:

"We didn't control the ball well, which was what I had been planning and why I made certain choices. We didn't manage it, just as we were re-organising ourselves after the goal, we went down to 10 and it all became more difficult.

"The three red cards were naïve, because finishing the games with 11 men was our characteristic last season. We never gave the referee the chance to send us off. Now it's happening a lot and I can't understand why, as we could've been a lot calmer."

"We lost the ball too often with silly errors, which were unforced, and that made Porto feel more comfortable to play their game. We got irritated, as we were unable to move the ball around well, then after the goal and red card it all fell apart. - Luciano Spalletti

"We had prepared for it well, but we started badly," Strootman said. "We played one game in 10 and the other in nine. It could be a mental problem because physically we are fine. We knew what we had to do on the pitch, but we didn't do it. We didn't play well and I don't know why.

"Even with nine men we tried everything. But when we went 2-0 down it was all over. Now it's difficult to get back up, we are all angry. But we have to think about the league because we have to do better. No one is to blame, we lost together." - Kevin Strootman

Conversly, Porto coach Nuno Espirito Santo hailed his side for having the proper mental approach.

"We stepped on to the field with the right approach and mentality," said Espirito Santo. "We did well to control the game against a great team, also playing good football. We were able to neutralise Roma, a great team from a big club.

"We were concentrated and I have to publicly congratulate my players, as they did a fantastic job against a quality opponent.

"I could see they were helping each other out and truly believed. It was important to defend with discretion and play in a relaxed fashion.

"We deserved this qualification, cancelling out Roma's strong points and ensuring they never felt at ease. This is the Porto we want."

http://www.espnfc.com/as-roma/story/2936290/roma-boss-luciano-spalletti-calls-team-naive-for-red-cards-in-ucl-exit

And Porto aren't a distant third right now. They currently are in second place, four points off Benfica. And as I said in my previous post they don't concede many goals: just 5 goals conceded in Portugal as things stand, which is the best defence in the league.

I'm not suggesting they will beat Juventus but I think it's a possibility. To write them off as no-hopers is ridiculous. I saw the game between Lyon and Juventus which Lyon would have won had Lacazette not missed his penalty. In my view there's not a lot of difference between Porto and Lyon so far this season and I've seen both play on plenty of occasions. Lyon were competitive against Juventus and if the game were next week I'd be confident Porto would be as well. Who knows what the dynamic will be early next year, but with a solid defence that doesn't give many goals away, and quality in attack through Andre Silva and Diego Jota, I would fancy them to give Juventus problems, as they did Roma.

The Golden Miller

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I was watching the match where Porto beat Roma 3-0 in their own backyard (4-1 on aggregate), having gone 1-0 up after 8 minutes before Roma pushed the self-destruct button and saw two red cards (deserved ones).

Not even Roma claimed they were all over them:








And Porto aren't a distant third right now. They currently are in second place, four points off Benfica. And as I said in my previous post they don't concede many goals: just 5 goals conceded in Portugal as things stand, which is the best defence in the league.

I'm not suggesting they will beat Juventus but I think it's a possibility. To write them off as no-hopers is ridiculous. I saw the game between Lyon and Juventus which Lyon would have won had Lacazette not missed his penalty. In my view there's not a lot of difference between Porto and Lyon so far this season and I've seen both play on plenty of occasions. Lyon were competitive against Juventus and if the game were next week I'd be confident Porto would be as well. Who knows what the dynamic will be early next year, but with a solid defence that doesn't give many goals away, and quality in attack through Andre Silva and Diego Jota, I would fancy them to give Juventus problems, as they did Roma.

As Strootman alludes to, Roma were the better team with 9 men until the 75th minute, when having 9 men and pushing for an equaliser became too much and they were hit on the break. Had Roma kept 11 men, Porto would be out now. Porto did set up defensively and done what they needed to do, but they've started playing in that manner out of necessity. They have only reclaimed 2nd place due to the Lisbon derby at the weekend and a patch of bad form by Sporting a few weeks back. Like last year, they two Lisbon teams will pull away as they contain better players and are simply better teams at this moment in time. Porto are punching well above their weight to be here and will be knocked out with relative ease by Juve. Benfica will be dark horses, they are a level above Porto

Mr.Nice Guy

The Golden Miller wrote: »

As Strootman alludes to, Roma were the better team with 9 men until the 75th minute, when having 9 men and pushing for an equaliser became too much and they were hit on the break. Had Roma kept 11 men, Porto would be out now. Porto did set up defensively and done what they needed to do, but they've started playing in that manner out of necessity. They have only reclaimed 2nd place due to the Lisbon derby at the weekend and a patch of bad form by Sporting a few weeks back. Like last year, they two Lisbon teams will pull away as they contain better players and are simply better teams at this moment in time. Porto are punching well above their weight to be here and will be knocked out with relative ease by Juve. Benfica will be dark horses, they are a level above Porto

Come on mate, quit digging.

"We knew what we had to do on the pitch, but we didn't do it. We didn't play well and I don't know why."

That's Strootman's take on it and there's no hint of him alluding to Roma being the better team.

As for had Roma kept 11 men, Porto would be out - they had 11 men when they went 1-0 down after 8 minutes. The reason Roma lost the head was because they were second-best. Something Roma manager Spalletti alluded to:

"We lost the ball too often with silly errors, which were unforced, and that made Porto feel more comfortable to play their game. We got irritated, as we were unable to move the ball around well, then after the goal and red card it all fell apart.

So he acknowledged they were being outplayed before the red cards and the indiscipline kicked in, which was a symptom of their poor display - and not the cause of it.

And the stuff about 'well, if Sporting hadn't had a bad patch' etc. can be applied to all leagues. The reality is they're second now and not a distant third.

citytillidie

It's back Round of 16 1st Legs

Tuesday Feb 14th
SL Benfica (POR) V Borussia Dortmund (GER)
Paris Saint-Germain (FRA) V FC Barcelona (ESP)

Wednesday Feb 15th
FC Bayern München (GER) V Arsenal (ENG)
Real Madrid (ESP) V Napoli (ITA)

Tuesday Feb 21st
Bayer Leverkusen (GER) V Atlético Madrid (ESP)
Manchester City (ENG) V Monaco (FRA)

Wednesday Feb 22nd
Porto (POR) V Juventus (ITA)
Sevilla (ESP)V Leicester City (ENG)

764dak

The Champions League ruined European football.

mansize

764dak wrote: »

The Champions League saved European football.

Fyp

eagle eye

mansize wrote: »

Champion's league ruined European football

FYP

Dirty Dingus McGee

The champions league is the greatest competition of them all.It's the one true test of greatness for players and managers at club level.

European football was interesting when the game wasn't flooded with money as teams from all countries had a chance.The champions league didn't ruin anything it's just a reaction to the changing realities of the sport.