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How common are bad tenants?

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    #32
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    Siipina wrote: »
    Oh no not just ONE Landlord, except of two all of them in nearly ten years and I can tell you the same is for my friends.
    I do well know that there are as well s..t tenants ( I belive the wore houses are not THAT many) but what I dont get is and that was one of the questions of the OP, if you have good tenants why do you try to squeeze more and more out of them but dont deliver your part?
    And then when the tenants are getting frustrated and dont care anymore either start winging about the bad tenants?
    I had a lot of LL who actually behaved like LL from the 1800 century. No joke, one LL told me I am just living in the house because of her grace :eek: Yep and I payed a lot of money for her grace, oh and before you think it was my fault, she wanted to put up the rent illegally and I told her about the law. In my first rental I didnt even have a proper bed and only really old mattresses and was told this is normal from the LL. I have so many storys like that. Start treating the good tenants better and you wont have so many bad tenants in the future.

    I don't get this or why people find themselves in this position, surely you were aware of the condition of the place before moving in? Yet people still seem to take these places.

    There are good and bad Landlords like tenants, it's not overly difficult to spot a bad LL tbh.


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    #33
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    There are good and bad Landlords like tenants, it's not overly difficult to spot a bad LL tbh.

    I wouldn't agree on that last point. Many LLs will hire agents to advertise their property and find a tenant, and the behaviour of the agent is not an indication of how good the LL is (two brilliant landlords I had were employing rubbish agents which never showed up on time or completed the paperwork properly, but in both cases things dramatically improved when the agent got out of the picture and I got direct access to the LL).

    Then of course if the property itself is in very bad condition, it is not a good sign :-)


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    #34
    CloudCumulus
    Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭CloudCumulus


    In some cases it's pretty much you get what you givemy first experience of renting was an eye opener, and that was due to < Mod snip - No names permitted >

    They were grand in many ways but unbeknownst to us we were signing our rights away every time we renewed the lease so when we were forced to leave due to a drop in income (it was either that or squat, which I wouldn't do) they refused to give back our deposit. They even made us go to the bank to increase the deposit when the rent was being increased.

    My parents on the other hand are landlords of several properties. Present the place well, treat tenants with respect and don't get formal about signing this and that, and they'll respect you back. They've never had a bad tenant.


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    #35
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,239 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Property tends to get the tenants it deserves. High calibre tenants will avoid run down properties in run down locations. Bad properties in bad locations will get bad tenants.


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    #36
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    CloudCumulus wrote: »
    In some cases it's pretty much you get what you givemy first experience of renting was an eye opener,

    They were grand in many ways but unbeknownst to us we were signing our rights away every time we renewed the lease so when we were forced to leave due to a drop in income (it was either that or squat, which I wouldn't do) they refused to give back our deposit. They even made us go to the bank to increase the deposit when the rent was being increased.

    My parents on the other hand are landlords of several properties. Present the place well, treat tenants with respect and don't get formal about signing this and that, and they'll respect you back. They've never had a bad tenant.

    It's a business and a LL has to protect themselves by being formal and business like with the required paperwork. Signing fixed term leases is entirely down to the tenant and the tenant should do their research before signing anything.


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    #37
    athtrasna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,420 ✭✭✭✭athtrasna


    Claw Hammer wrote: »
    Property tends to get the tenants it deserves. High calibre tenants will avoid run down properties in run down locations. Bad properties in bad locations will get bad tenants.

    Absolutely not true. Sweeping generalisations are not helpful.


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    #38
    Ms Doubtfire1
    Registered Users Posts: 1,422 ✭✭✭Ms Doubtfire1


    CloudCumulus wrote: »

    They were grand in many ways but unbeknownst to us we were signing our rights away every time we renewed the lease so when we were forced to leave due to a drop in income (it was either that or squat, which I wouldn't do) they refused to give back our deposit.

    You can't sign your rights away.EVER. The contract has to abide to the tenancy act, if it doesn't, the whole thing or parts of thereof are not valid


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    #39
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    Ms Doubtfire1 wrote: »
    CloudCumulus wrote: »

    They were grand in many ways but unbeknownst to us we were signing our rights away every time we renewed the lease so when we were forced to leave due to a drop in income (it was either that or squat, which I wouldn't do) they refused to give back our deposit.

    You can't sign your rights away.EVER. The contract has to abide to the tenancy act, if it doesn't, the whole thing or parts of thereof are not valid

    They can contract in addition to their right though. That's what tenants are doing every time they sign a new 12 month lease. There is zero benefit to tenants to do this unless they're coming the end of a Part IV or the LL is willing to omit a break clause.


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    #40
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    CloudCumulus wrote: »
    My parents on the other hand are landlords of several properties. Present the place well, treat tenants with respect and don't get formal about signing this and that, and they'll respect you back. They've never had a bad tenant.

    Sure why be formal, pay them in change and vegetables, maybe barter a few goods?

    Are you for real? You actually think that people should allow someone to rent their asset with nothing signed because they "shouldnt get formal"?

    You know who gets very formal very fast? The Revenue Commissioners. Yep, they like to see documentation, plenty of it, and signatures.

    You know who else likes to keep the paperwork in order? The Department of Social Protection. So maybe when a tenant asks the landlord to sign something for them for the Department of Social Protection the landlord should be saying "ah lads, lets not get formal".

    And you know who else likes formality? PRTB.

    Seriously - are you living in a pre civilised society or something that you think signing relevant paperwork is "getting formal"?


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    #41
    Ms Doubtfire1
    Registered Users Posts: 1,422 ✭✭✭Ms Doubtfire1


    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    They can contract in addition to their right though. That's what tenants are doing every time they sign a new 12 month lease. There is zero benefit to tenants to do this unless they're coming the end of a Part IV or the LL is willing to omit a break clause.

    Agreed.But only if in line with the tenancy act. Fore instance, my LL included a clause in his contract that I was to pay for maintenance of the heating system and septic tank. Wen straight to threshold with it and he got his wrist slapped big time. Basically, the law overwrites anything in a contract that is not in line with it.


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    #42
    CloudCumulus
    Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭CloudCumulus


    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    They can contract in addition to their right though. That's what tenants are doing every time they sign a new 12 month lease. There is zero benefit to tenants to do this unless they're coming the end of a Part IV or the LL is willing to omit a break clause.

    This is exactly it. Obviously we were young and ignorant of our rights, but probably wouldn't have even known about the stuff we didn't 'have to' do, because we were great tenants who kept the place well, gave them 6 weeks notice we'd have to go but they did nothing about it and were really rude. Anyway I got PRTB to keep badgering them.
    Basically, good experirnce dealing directly with landlords < mod snip - you have already been told NOT to name companies on here >


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    #43
    CloudCumulus
    Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭CloudCumulus


    intheclouds wrote: »
    Sure why be formal, pay them in change and vegetables, maybe barter a few goods?

    Are you for real? You actually think that people should allow someone to rent their asset with nothing signed because they "shouldnt get formal"?

    You know who gets very formal very fast? The Revenue Commissioners. Yep, they like to see documentation, plenty of it, and signatures.

    You know who else likes to keep the paperwork in order? The Department of Social Protection. So maybe when a tenant asks the landlord to sign something for them for the Department of Social Protection the landlord should be saying "ah lads, lets not get formal".

    And you know who else likes formality? PRTB.

    Seriously - are you living in a pre civilised society or something that you think signing relevant paperwork is "getting formal"?

    Right, you clearly misunderstood. Draw up a tenancy, list the relevant info, everyone signs it.
    Do you then need to go back to them after two years and say in accordance with the act, you are now entering part whatever and will need to sign the following? Yes if you want, but the choice is yours to do so as a LL. This is what I mean about being less formal, if you so choose. Did I say less formal or do away with formalities altogether?
    Breathe and reboot dear.


    Edit- sorry to the Mod, I didn't see the warning.


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    #44
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    CloudCumulus wrote: »
    Did I say less formal or do away with formalities altogether?

    This is what you said:
    CloudCumulus wrote: »
    ...don't get formal about signing this and that, and they'll respect you back.

    Nowhere does that say "less formal". It implies that you never get formal to BEGIN with.

    Only an idiot would not follow the "formalities".


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    #45
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Claw Hammer wrote: »
    Property tends to get the tenants it deserves. High calibre tenants will avoid run down properties in run down locations. Bad properties in bad locations will get bad tenants.

    That's just not true.

    My sister had (she has since sold it) a nice property- in a nice area- which she let to a solicitor. The solicitor- doubtless having learnt from some of her clients- overheld, without paying rent- for almost 2 years- before she abandoned the property.

    You can't automatically say that a professional won't overhold- or social welfare tenants are the sole type of tenant who destroy property- it simply doesn't hold water.


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    #46
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    That's just not true.

    My sister had (she has since sold it) a nice property- in a nice area- which she let to a solicitor. The solicitor- doubtless having learnt from some of her clients- overheld, without paying rent- for almost 2 years- before she abandoned the property.

    You can't automatically say that a professional won't overhold- or social welfare tenants are the sole type of tenant who destroy property- it simply doesn't hold water.

    I'd have been very tempted to make a complaint to the Law Society. It probably wouldn't have gone anywhere but there has to be an ethical issue there.


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    #47
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    I'd have been very tempted to make a complaint to the Law Society. It probably wouldn't have gone anywhere but there has to be an ethical issue there.

    Possibly. However, it wasn't the route she took. Ethics seem to be in short supply across the board........


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    #48
    Shelflife
    Registered Users Posts: 3,074 ✭✭✭Shelflife


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    Possibly. However, it wasn't the route she took. Ethics seem to be in short supply across the board........

    Or sit in her office and wait, making sure you tell everyone that comes in " no you go ahead im just waiting to collect my rent that wasnt paid for 2 years "


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    #49
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,714 ✭ [Deleted User]


    DubCount wrote: »
    What is the difference between net profit and net rental income?

    Net profit would be what's left over after all expenses and mortgage has been paid. Net rental income is the amount left which is taxable after allowable expenses have been deducted.


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    #50
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Registered Users Posts: 7,223 ✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    Possibly. However, it wasn't the route she took. Ethics seem to be in short supply across the board........

    Did she go down the RTB route? I'm sure a solicitor would have the means to pay back the rent after a determination order (or try and settle it without having name come up in the RTB published disputes).

    Part of the problem is that most people overholding don't have the means to pay back what they owe so it's fruitless to even chase them through the system.


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    #51
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »
    Did she go down the RTB route? I'm sure a solicitor would have the means to pay back the rent after a determination order (or try and settle it without having name come up in the RTB published disputes).

    Part of the problem is that most people overholding don't have the means to pay back what they owe so it's fruitless to even chase them through the system.

    She didn't want the hassle- she was in the process of moving to Joburg (and indeed is still there)- she didn't want to leave me (or another sibling) to sort out the mess. I've bumped into the individual concerned through work, since then- and reminded her of how I knew her- and how I was aware of the situation. She excused herself from the case........


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