Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016 - Mod Warning Post #6863

TheDoc

RobertKK wrote: »

On Sky News during the sport section they said Pogba will be in Manchester on Saturday and the deal officially announced on Monday.

At this point I'm simply accepting its a done deal. While I'm not clicking the links or searching the stories, it would be pretty shambolic if it collapsed this close to kick off, and would put real pressure on getting fallback options.

Who by next week could have moved, not impressed with being second fiddle, or clubs involved jacking pricing knowing United are desperate.

My feelings would be Woodward knows he needs to deliver what Mourinho wants to avoid any hassles, and Mourinho clearly knows who he wants. That we havn't even heard a rumbling of another CM, nevermind the club havn't gone and got one, indicates to me that Pogba is happening, just a matter of time.

Normally provide the first line of defence for Woodward and his people when the pitchforks come out during the last few windows, but I'd be very much on the side of "you moron" if this doesn't pan out. Simply based on the time wasted and other targets that could have been secured. Neverminding the outrageous fee that arguably could still be spent best elsewhere.

Flint Fredstone

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

I think it's unlikely Rashford will get the opportunity at Utd to fulfill his potential. I can't see him becoming a Utd great. It's such early days and I can't see Jose having much patience if he's not scoring. With football these days, short-term thinking wins. I hope I'm wrong.

If he's good enough he will play and he's been consistently excellent every time I've seen him play.

Trigger

yermandan wrote: »

Morning lads and lassies,

It's Fantasy league time.

If you wanna plod along without any ambition then join the free league here

-> 49231-17540

Alternatively if you want to rise to the challenge in the paid league it is 10 euros
entry so PM me for my paypal deets and I'll get the code over to ya.

VIVA LE POGBA

Nice one Dan, I'll set up later and hit you up for the details.

yermandan wrote: »

Cannot wait for the new season. Especially Rashford linking up with Ibra

Oblig United related post

master-t

TheDoc wrote: »

At this point I'm simply accepting its a done deal. While I'm not clicking the links or searching the stories, it would be pretty shambolic if it collapsed this close to kick off, and would put real pressure on getting fallback options.

Who by next week could have moved, not impressed with being second fiddle, or clubs involved jacking pricing knowing United are desperate.

My feelings would be Woodward knows he needs to deliver what Mourinho wants to avoid any hassles, and Mourinho clearly knows who he wants. That we havn't even heard a rumbling of another CM, nevermind the club havn't gone and got one, indicates to me that Pogba is happening, just a matter of time.

Normally provide the first line of defence for Woodward and his people when the pitchforks come out during the last few windows, but I'd be very much on the side of "you moron" if this doesn't pan out. Simply based on the time wasted and other targets that could have been secured. Neverminding the outrageous fee that arguably could still be spent best elsewhere.

I'm taking the exact opposite stance on it.

I feel I've been here before - Cesc, Thiago, Pedro - to name but a few.

Deals done, just waiting on the announcement......then bam. Nothing.

I really hope with Jose there things like this won't happen.....but until he's standing there holding the shirt or an official club announcement, I'm trying to not think about it.

magnumbud

RobertKK wrote: »

On Sky News during the sport section they said Pogba will be in Manchester on Saturday and the deal officially announced on Monday.

if he flies to manchester on saturday bring him to wembley and announce it there on sunday would add a great buzz to the charity shield

Trigger

Poster says this was in the official Adidas store in Paris.. as will all of Twitter. Pinch of salt needed

https://twitter.com/M4nUtd_/status/760817685034860544

Adamcp898

Pro. F wrote: »

Because you tried to make out that LVG making Fellaini "a focal point," as you put it, helped him look like a better possession CM than he actually is. When I asked you what games you were talking about that Fellaini was made a focal point, you pointed to the ones where he was asked to get forward and act as a target man.

So your evidence that LVG helped Fell to look a better possession CM than he really is turned out to be the fact that in some games he pushed him forward and asked him play as a target-man. Which is ridiculous since that would hamper anybody from showing CM possession skills.



So we can't point out positives from any players' performances last season as a reason to believe they can be good this season?

This is going nowhere but.....

You made the point that Fellaini looked good, in certain aspects, under LvG and blamed his shortcomings on poor management. I made the point that the inverse argument can be made a few posts ago and thus how little you can take from that but you continue to ignore it and keep coming back with various versions of the above.

And you're just continuing to attempt to skew and move the goalposts by breaking up a single point into several quotes and addressing them separately. And before you ask, position is of no odds to this.

Pro. F wrote: »

A single sentence my hole. You have made several posts on Fellaini and his abilities today and from the first you have expressed the opinion that he can't play in CM in a team who want to play attractive football (presumably meaning a team who use possession well) and that his strengths lie in being a target man.

You centred in on a single sentence in my initial post and everything you have said since has been based on the inferences you made from it. Hence why I said like the whole thing as felt a little copy and pasted.

Pro. F wrote: »

You forgot the important factor of doing those things while under pressure. It is far from a ubiquitous skill, even among top flight CMs. Certainly Schneiderlin and Carrick don't have it. Herrera and Fellaini do.

I would've thought that went without saying to be perfectly honest It's not quite as rare as you're making out either I feel. Find it a bit odd that you think Michael Carrick has never been able to receive and distribute a ball in pressure too.

Pro. F wrote: »

"I suspect that you are conflating CM with the two sitting CMs in a 4231, hence you not being able to remember all the times Fell played in CM (edit) that I'm talking about. He got most of his CM games as one of two box-to-box CMs in front of a DM."

I said this when you tried to deny that Fell had played CM in any significant number of games. I was not saying that the roles are distinct, but rather I was checking if you thought they were.

Since then you have gone on to argue as if you think that the CMs in a 4231 and a 433 are so different as to be incomparable. It is a ridiculous stance to take, but then you haven't actually stuck by it, but rather tried to discuss all sorts of other things.

When you accuse someone of conflating things you do realise you're saying that they're mistakenly thinking them to be one and the same?

This would then infer that you believe them to be different. Like I said, just wanted to know where it was going.

Pro. F wrote: »

I think this discussion has been severely side tracked is where it's headed.

So I'm just going to ask you three simple questions:

Do you agree that Fellaini played in central midfield (not as a target man further forward) during the last two seasons in a reasonable number of games, so that we can judge his performances there?

Do you agree that the box-to-box CMs in a 433 are extremely compareable to the box-to-box CM in a 4231?

What do you think Fellaini's strengths and weaknesses are?

And here have reached the fallacious stage of your reasoning. Deciding you can dictate questions in a discussion in an effort to appear like you hold some authority on the subject.

But here is one for you out of curiosity. How many of these masterful midfield performances came in the past season and how many came in the second half of LvG's first season? No need for exact numbers rough % is fine.

bangkok

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

I think it's unlikely Rashford will get the opportunity at Utd to fulfill his potential. I can't see him becoming a Utd great. It's such early days and I can't see Jose having much patience if he's not scoring. With football these days, short-term thinking wins. I hope I'm wrong.

Why not, if he takes his chance, which he did last season he can do anything he wants. Some players are so good you just cannot hold them back, rashford looks like he has everything in his locker to be a massive player for United for years to come

Pro. F

TheDoc wrote: »

Yeah so far so good, hes looked pretty good. Be interesting to see how it goes in the PL in a competitive environment.

He was class in the competitive environment of La Liga and the EL, so I have high hopes.

TheDoc wrote: »

Kinda wondering what is happening with Rojo, staying or going. Was watching this documentary thing on him at the weekend. Granted on MUTV so clearly biased, it painted a really good picture of this guy, and providing his history and background kind of made me hope he stays and succeeds. Somewhat of a meteoric rise and a feeling that there is another few levels in him to go through.

Me too. I think he's a decent CB, but not good enough at FB. I think he'd be a fine back-up but there may not be room for him to get enough games when the shopping is done, so I suspect he'll go.

Maximus Alexander

master-t wrote: »

Zlatan - how many goals do you think he could score this season?

What's realistic? 10+? 15+? 20+?

One can only imagine we will play ALOT of games this season, potentially with a combo of Rooney / Martial / Miki / Rashford / Mata / Depay behind him at different stages of the season - that's a lot of talent supplying the main forward with chances.

My prediction would be 20+ in all competitions - assuming he'll play mainly PL, FA Cup and a handful of EL matches. Don't see him playing too much in League Cup unless we reach latter rounds.

PL goals, I'd say around 7 or 8.

TheDoc

master-t wrote: »

I'm taking the exact opposite stance on it.

I feel I've been here before - Cesc, Thiago, Pedro - to name but a few.

Deals done, just waiting on the announcement......then bam. Nothing.

I really hope with Jose there things like this won't happen.....but until he's standing there holding the shirt or an official club announcement, I'm trying to not think about it.

Considering it was the prime reason for his last Chelsea fallout, I can only speculate Woodward with half a brain knows to give Mourinho his perfect environment, it means getting transfers he wants done, or backup options done quickly after.

Mourinho has been pretty complimentary about Woodwards dealings thus far, and seems to be confident of Pogba happening.

I think everyone knows the quickest way to send him into a tizzy is **** around with pre-season, mainly with transfers. Could already see him vexed by the tour. So I'd imagine the club will move mountains for him, and it was probably a big point of the negotiations for Mourinho to even come.

I'd say Pogba collapsing would be the most shambolic of all. The rest were just pot shots in the hope of making a statement, that really didn't hamper preparations or other targets, just our ego and disappointment.

For all the straight forward talk from Van Gaal, can't recall him talking **** about Woodward that much, or conveying disappointment with transfers. He seemed happy with his lot, and to be honest who wouldn't be after his first summer window(that most turned out **** is hindsight)

Bradz213

secman wrote: »

Are we sorted at right full?
Are we sorted at centre of defence ?
Are we sorted in centre midfield ?

Still think we are a bit short in those areas.

RB we are fine. Darmian and Valencia. TFM will probably feature there although he is a CM. Young can cover there too. LB is more of a problem IMO. Shaw and Rojo are unreliable to stay fit. CBJ is still inexperienced. Blind hasn't the pace and don't like Young there as he is right footed.

CB, maybe one experienced fellow. Seen Fonte linked which would do a job. RS Wiliams and Tuanzebe can provide cover to new CB, Bailly, Blind, Smalling, Jones. There is something I like about Rojo and don't see him finished just yet.

Midfield is fine if Pogba arrives

Mitch Connor

As pessimistic as I have been on the Pogba deal - at this point I think it is basically done. If it wasn't,imo, we'd still be hearing in the press about agent fees, transfer fees, image rights, woodward stalling etc. We've heard nothing over the last few days - and in this case I am taking it as no news is good news.

master-t

TheDoc wrote: »

Considering it was the prime reason for his last Chelsea fallout, I can only speculate Woodward with half a brain knows to give Mourinho his perfect environment, it means getting transfers he wants done, or backup options done quickly after.

Mourinho has been pretty complimentary about Woodwards dealings thus far, and seems to be confident of Pogba happening.

I think everyone knows the quickest way to send him into a tizzy is **** around with pre-season, mainly with transfers. Could already see him vexed by the tour. So I'd imagine the club will move mountains for him, and it was probably a big point of the negotiations for Mourinho to even come.

I'd say Pogba collapsing would be the most shambolic of all. The rest were just pot shots in the hope of making a statement, that really didn't hamper preparations or other targets, just our ego and disappointment.

For all the straight forward talk from Van Gaal, can't recall him talking **** about Woodward that much, or conveying disappointment with transfers. He seemed happy with his lot, and to be honest who wouldn't be after his first summer window(that most turned out **** is hindsight)

That's what i'm fully relying on - Woodward wanting to offer Jose the perfect environment to achieve success.

Also, Woodward must know now he has been seen as bit of idiot when it came to sealing the big transfers and getting them over the line since he came in.

BUT, Pogba is playing a game at the moment during his one-man tour of the USA, and he's loving the attention. I also can't see United allowing ADIDAS to take the absolute p1ss out of them in their adverts.

But again, once burned.......

bullvine

Not been in here in a while, looking for some information, can anyone remember a United Game when Scholes gave the ball away by passing it across the box and whoever we were playing scored?

Cheers,

Mitch Connor

bullvine wrote: »

Not been in here in a while, looking for some information, can anyone remember a United Game when Scholes gave the ball away by passing it across the box and whoever we were playing scored?

Cheers,

Remember him being at fault for a city goal on his comeback, that it?

master-t

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Remember him being at fault for a city goal on his comeback, that it?

From a throw in?

Pro. F

Adamcp898 wrote: »

This is going nowhere but.....

You made the point that Fellaini looked good, in certain aspects, under LvG and blamed his shortcomings on poor management. I made the point that the inverse argument can be made a few posts ago and thus how little you can take from that but you continue to ignore it and keep coming back with various versions of the above.

And you're just continuing to attempt to skew and move the goalposts by breaking up a single point into several quotes and addressing them separately. And before you ask, position is of no odds to this.

I did address it, directly. From the post you quoted, in direct response to that point:
"So we can't point out positives from any players' performances last season as a reason to believe they can be good this season?"

To claim that I am ignoring your point is laughable.

Adamcp898 wrote: »

You centred in on a single sentence in my initial post and everything you have said since has been based on the inferences you made from it. Hence why I said like the whole thing as felt a little copy and pasted.

So in all these posts back and forth you haven't been arguing the case that Fellaini doesn't have the skills to play good possession football in CM? You haven't been arguing that Fellaini's strengths are better suited to being a target man? No?

How strange. Maybe you are just really bad at expressing yourself and we actually agree with each other on Fellaini. So do you agree that Fellaini has the skills to play good possession football in 4231 CM and that his strengths don't just suit him to being a target man?

Adamcp898 wrote: »

I would've thought that went without saying to be perfectly honest It's not quite as rare as you're making out either I feel. Find it a bit odd that you think Michael Carrick has never been able to receive and distribute a ball in pressure too.

This doesn't surprise me. Most people who can't appreciate good CM skills tend to overrate Carrick.

Adamcp898 wrote: »

When you accuse someone of conflating things you do realise you're saying that they're mistakenly thinking them to be one and the same?

This would then infer that you believe them to be different. Like I said, just wanted to know where it was going.

I meant that you were conflating the CM in a 4231 being synonymous with CM in general and nonother types of CM counting. I worded it confusingly. I explained what I meant. We don't need to discuss it. We could just discuss Fellaini.

Adamcp898 wrote: »

And here have reached the fallacious stage of your reasoning. Deciding you can dictate questions in a discussion in an effort to appear like you hold some authority on the subject.

But here is one for you out of curiosity. How many of these masterful midfield performances came in the past season and how many came in the second half of LvG's first season? No need for exact numbers rough % is fine.

I like the way you are willing to argue the topic for so long, but won't stand over any of your opinions on Fellani and won't clarify your opinions on him when you seem to be contradicting them.

I'll answer your question, no problem:
I'd say roughly 50/50, give or take 10% either way.

Now, since I've answered your question, maybe you would answer one of mine (This isn't a power play by the way, I'd just rather discuss Fellaini, his ability and the games he's played, than deal with the convoluted bullshít this discussion has turned into):

What do you think Fellaini's strengths and weaknesses are?

Pro. F

Pro. F wrote: »

Bailly is class imo. Good enough to start for a title chasing team. But, I think the rumours are that Jose is going to buy an older CB to be first choice and the rest are going to compete for the other starting spot. It's a bit of a pity I think, because I'd love to see Smalling and Bailly build a partnership, but it makes sense for Jose to want some more experience in there. Also, neither Smalling nor Bailly are particularly good passers, so maybe that's a concern.

I'd be of the opinion Smalling is a good passer and also good in possession

Pro. F

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'd be of the opinion Smalling is a good passer and also good in possession

I should just point out that I do think Smalling has a good chance to develop his passing in time. Lots of CBs and CMs get better at it as they get older.

Lord TSC

As per Duncan Castle

Jose Wants €12m for Rojo
hull looking to loan Jones
Blind is also for sale
CBJ and McNair to be loaned out
CB targets are Garay,Bouncci,Fonte

magnumbud

Lord TSC wrote: »

As per Duncan Castle

Jose Wants €12m for Rojo
hull looking to loan Jones
Blind is also for sale
CBJ and McNair to be loaned out
CB targets are Garay,Bouncci,Fonte

would keep jones and blind for his utility player role and when possible as starting DM in my opinion.

didnt fonte just sign a new contract yesterday?

bangkok

Pro. F wrote: »

I did address it, directly. From the post you quoted, in direct response to that point:
"So we can't point out positives from any players' performances last season as a reason to believe they can be good this season?"

To claim that I am ignoring your point is laughable.



So in all these posts back and forth you haven't been arguing the case that Fellaini doesn't have the skills to play good possession football in CM? You haven't been arguing that Fellaini's strengths are better suited to being a target man? No?

How strange. Maybe you are just really bad at expressing yourself and we actually agree with each other on Fellaini. So do you agree that Fellaini has the skills to play good possession football in 4231 CM and that his strengths don't just suit him to being a target man?



This doesn't surprise me. Most people who can't appreciate good CM skills tend to overrate Carrick.



I meant that you were conflating the CM in a 4231 being synonymous with CM in general and nonother types of CM counting. I worded it confusingly. I explained what I meant. We don't need to discuss it. We could just discuss Fellaini.



I like the way you are willing to argue the topic for so long, but won't stand over any of your opinions on Fellani and won't clarify your opinions on him when you seem to be contradicting them.

I'll answer your question, no problem:
I'd say roughly 50/50, give or take 10% either way.

Now, since I've answered your question, maybe you would answer one of mine (This isn't a power play by the way, I'd just rather discuss Fellaini, his ability and the games he's played, than deal with the convoluted bullshít this discussion has turned into):

What do you think Fellaini's strengths and weaknesses are?

Can I answer this.... Pleeeeeeease?

Liam McPoyle

Pogba to be in the box seats for the CS on Sunday.

jayo26

Saul T Nutzz wrote: »

Pogba to be in the box seats for the CS on Sunday.

Linky????

RobertKK

Damn, just looking at the United Premier League fixture list for next season and I will be abroad for both Chelsea games.
Two massive games every season, and especially this coming season with Jose as manager.

Trigger

jayo26 wrote: »

Saul T Nutzz wrote: »

Pogba to be in the box seats for the CS on Sunday.

Linky????

Think it was more his wish

Trigger

Off topic but does anyone know how to turn off the legacy mode on the mobile website. It just start appearing for me all of a sudden and I hate it with a passion
NvM figured it out doing the same thing that wasn't working for me the other day

On topic.. another person went into that store and took this pic.. seems them Dybala #10 was true

https://twitter.com/AlessioButera/status/760839459604729856

bangkok

astradave wrote: »

Off topic but does anyone know how to turn off the legacy mode on the mobile website. It just start appearing for me all of a sudden and I hate it with a passion
NvM figured it out doing the same thing that wasn't working for me the other day

On topic.. another person went into that store and took this pic.. seems them Dybala #10 was true

https://twitter.com/AlessioButera/status/760839459604729856

It was reported on Monday that juventus had given the no10 to dybala

jayo26

astradave wrote: »

Off topic but does anyone know how to turn off the legacy mode on the mobile website. It just start appearing for me all of a sudden and I hate it with a passion
NvM figured it out doing the same thing that wasn't working for me the other day

On topic.. another person went into that store and took this pic.. seems them Dybala #10 was true

https://twitter.com/AlessioButera/status/760839459604729856

I can see this deal been wrapped up sometime this month then so lads


Or 48hrs into next month.

Jayop

What's the significance of that? I assumed it was a Pogba reference but he's 6 for Juve.

py2006

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A2koYvmuNM

Why doesnt woody just fork out for Prime and we could have these deals down in 24hrs the cheapstake..

Trigger

Jayop wrote: »

What's the significance of that? I assumed it was a Pogba reference but he's 6 for Juve.

Pogba was given the no 10 when Del Piero left.. he is still listed on their Web store as #10.. supposedly the store is a bit ****e at numbers and names..

magnumbud

Jayop wrote: »

What's the significance of that? I assumed it was a Pogba reference but he's 6 for Juve.

he was no 6 but currently is no 10 well before dybala took it

Trigger

py2006 wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A2koYvmuNM

Pffft old news..

Whatsisname

They're some pair of spoons, aren't they?

Trigger

magnumbud wrote: »

he was no 6 but currently is no 10 well before dybala took it

Dybala is still officially #21 it hasn't been confirmed that he is #10 yet

Jayop

astradave wrote: »

Pogba was given the no 10 when Del Piero left.. he is still listed on their Web store as #10.. supposedly the store is a bit ****e at numbers and names..

magnumbud wrote: »

he was no 6 but currently is no 10 well before dybala took it

Ah OK. I did a google image search and seen Pog wearing 6 so I was wondering.

astradave

astradave wrote: »

Pffft old news..

Zerks news :pac:

jayo26

bangkok wrote: »

It was reported on Monday that juventus had given the no10 to dybala

If we're playing that game it was reported that Pogba is coming back to United two year ago.

stesaurus

City have just signed Gabriel Jesus, didn't want him anyway :P

Link

bangkok

Gabriel jesus just signed for city 27m, serious prospect.

bangkok

bangkok wrote: »

Gabriel jesus just signed for city 27m, serious prospect.

You've seen much of him playing for peru I take it

magnumbud

Deleted User wrote: »

You've seen much of him playing for peru I take it

peru?

stesaurus

Deleted User wrote: »

You've seen much of him playing for peru I take it

In joke? He's Brazilian

Trigger

It will certainly depend on how he settles anyways.. signing players directly from the South American leagues to the PL has been hit and miss tbh.. most of the better players seem to sign for a team in the spain/Portugal before moving on.. by all accounts if he lives up to his potential he could be one of the best players in the world.. time will tell. For 27m I think it could be a shrewd accusition for City..

City are starting to invest heavily to bring down the age of their team

Jayop

I wouldn't bother worrying about a SA forward moving directly to the league before he plays regardless of how good he looks. He could be great but the likelyhood is he won't.

MagicIRL

Yeah, but will he score a bicycle kick goal within 3mins on his debut? No.

But Zlatan did.

bangkok

astradave wrote: »

It will certainly depend on how he settles anyways.. signing players directly from the South American leagues to the PL has been hit and miss tbh.. most of the better players seem to sign for a team in the spain/Portugal before moving on.. by all accounts if he lives up to his potential he could be one of the best players in the world.. time will tell. For 27m I think it could be a shrewd accusition for City..

City are starting to invest heavily to bring down the age of their team

Don't think he will ever win a ballon dor or anything and he won't join up with city until after Olympics, but I wouldn't be surprised to see him loaned out to another club for a few months. City already well stocked with players in same position