Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016 - Mod Warning Post #6863

beno619

Arguably Rooney's form has been all over the shop since Fergie's final season.

Rooney has had poorer games than today, he was okay but I just don't see him lasting in this side.

We have better options.

GSPfan

This Liverpool v Arsenal game is good fun.

Flint Fredstone

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

What do you recommend Rooney do with the ball then in terms of "creative" play? Maybe the players around him need to improve their movement?

It doesn't seem to matter if they're 10 yards away on their own sometimes. He still manages to misplace the pass.

Flint Fredstone

Zlatan was sloppy enough at times today. Rooney looked like a pub player for most of the game. He's done IMO.

jayo26

GSPfan wrote: »

This Liverpool v Arsenal game is good fun.

Excellent game it's the game of the season so far just a pity the match thread is low level trash.

Whatsisname

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

What do you recommend Rooney do with the ball then in terms of "creative" play? Maybe the players around him need to improve their movement?

Absolutely they do. The attacking movement the last 2 seasons has been non existent. But theres already evidence of more freedom in Jose's reign.

But, what I'd like to see from Rooney playing no.10 is more of a drive at the defence and actually playing in the number 10 position. Cut all this crap of dropping back into the midfield, he doesn't need to do it, especially with Pogba signed now. Bit more forward thinking, Rooney ponders on the ball wondering where it should go next, which is why he gets dispossessed alot, second he gets it, he should know where he wants to play it. Switching the play is fine, when its unexpected and at pace. I don't see the need for it when its slow and just lets the opposition get back into position.

jayo26

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Zlatan was sloppy enough at times today. Rooney looked like a pub player for most of the game. He's done IMO.

Zlatan made some mistakes but he more then made up for it with the little flick ons that he pulled off and the strike and some nice bits of skill.

Rooney made some mistakes too and I'll still give him the benifit of a run of games before I'll judge him under new manager but he also made up for his mistakes with the header.

deaddonkey15

Whatsisname wrote: »

Absolutely they do. The attacking movement the last 2 seasons has been non existent. But theres already evidence of more freedom in Jose's reign.

But, what I'd like to see from Rooney playing no.10 is more of a drive at the defence and actually playing in the number 10 position. Cut all this crap of dropping back into the midfield, he doesn't need to do it, especially with Pogba signed now. Bit more forward thinking, Rooney ponders on the ball wondering where it should go next, which is why he gets dispossessed alot, second he gets it, he should know where he wants to play it. Switching the play is fine, when its unexpected and at pace. I don't see the need for it when its slow and just lets the opposition get back into position.

All depends on the movement of those around him and them getting into the right positions. I don't recall a situation today where there was an obvious defense splitting pass on for Rooney to make. If you don't want him to come deep to get a ball then how can he "drive at a defense"? Especially against teams that keep most of their players in their own half.

Mikeyt086

Thought Ander Herrera absolutely bossed it today. Himself and Fellaini were excellent as the sitting midfield two.

Eric Bailly is a ****ing headcase and I absolutely love him already. Good defender first and foremost but loves kicking people into the air too, a good combo. Daily Blind's calm and collected Dutchness is a good foil for him.

I don't think Ibra looked sloppy, thought again he wasn't offered much by the way of service but for the second game in a row he produced the goods. His presence also makes a lot of players panic and lose the ball which is something I've noticed, but he's clinical and a great focal point to have in the attack. He's going to be a lot of fun.

Wayne Rooney was ****e, his touch was embarrassing for the majority of the game but this is nothing new. He goes and plays for England and he comes back looking like an amateur player time and time again. He will take weeks to get into stride, but it appears as though he will be given every chance to do that.

Happy for Juan, good to see Memphis given a bit of love from Jose too as if anyone can make him a player, it's Mourinho.

But really what pleased me most was the play from our full-backs. Valencia and Shaw up and down the pitch all day long, and you can only do that when both are on the same wavelength to keep the oppo guessing which showed how much we missed Luke Shaw last year. Thrilled to have him back.

Great start, get a run of wins going and we could be in business here.

Liam McPoyle

jayo26 wrote: »

Excellent game it's the game of the season so far just a pity the match thread is low level trash.

I had $20 on a United / LFC double at 4/1.

Chuffed!

Only time I wanted them to win!

:pac:

Whatsisname

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

All depends on the movement of those around him and them getting into the right positions. I don't recall a situation today where there was an obvious defense splitting pass on for Rooney to make. If you don't want him to come deep to get a ball then how can he "drive at a defense"? Especially against teams that keep most of their players in their own half.

Had a chance for a very good counter attack and got dispossessed immediately. He doesn't need to come particularly deep to drive at a defence. I'm talking, I don't want him picking it up at the centre circle off one of the centre backs. And if he did, I'd like him to burst forward with it, rather than straight out to Valencia as already said.

We're not gonna agree so no point in going in circles for the night. Said all I need to say about Rooney.

Comic Book Guy

2 seasons ago Jose led the Premier League from week 1 to 38, just saying!!

Pro. F

Whatsisname wrote: »

Because he just signed for us man. Thats why he's not being criticized nor is he supposed to be our main creative outlet. He's there to finish. If everyone was up in arms here about Ibra's performance so far, we'd all be acting like spoilt little ****s. I'm not saying Ibra should get away with it if he begins to perform underpar. No player should.

I'm saying, IMO, Rooney has been poor for a while now, if Ibra, or any other player for example, is playing poor consistently, they'll be criticized for it in due time. To alot of us, Rooney has been poor for 2 years or so. To others, like yourself, maybe not. But hey, we'll agree to disagree.

Don't get me wrong, as I said, I've always been a Rooney fan, and I'd love nothing more than him to prove me entirely wrong here but ultimately, I don't think he will.

I didn't say or imply that people should be up in arms about Ibra in this, his first, game. If you're not going to reply to what I said then there's no point us discussing this.

Whatsisname

Pro. F wrote: »

I didn't say or imply that people should be up in arms about Ibra in this, his first, game. If you're not going to reply to what I said then there's no point us discussing this.

Nor did I say or imply Ibrahimovic should get away with criticisms Rooney doesn't. So yes Pro F, maybe there is no point in discussing it if you're not gonna reply to what I initially said either.

Pro. F

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

It doesn't seem to matter if they're 10 yards away on their own sometimes. He still manages to misplace the pass.

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Zlatan was sloppy enough at times today. Rooney looked like a pub player for most of the game. He's done IMO.

Rooney completed 46 passes with a 90% accuracy. "Looked like a pub player" my hole.

bangkok

Rooney had a 90% pass completion today, done a lot of work for the team, scored a goal and had other chances as well. Anyone who thinks he played poorly today need to look at the game again

deaddonkey15

Whatsisname wrote: »

Had a chance for a very good counter attack and got dispossessed immediately.

He got dispossessed pulling the ball back as there was pretty much no one ahead of him except Bournemouth defenders.

Whatsisname wrote: »

Said all I need to say about Rooney.

Until the next game when you and the rest come out with the same over the top criticism.

Pro. F

Whatsisname wrote: »

Nor did I say or imply Ibrahimovic should get away with criticisms Rooney doesn't. So yes Pro F, maybe there is no point in discussing it if you're not gonna reply to what I initially said either.

I didn't say you did. You can quote where I did if you think I'm wrong on that.

I replied to what you said. You made up something and replied to it as if I had said it.

RasTa

Pro. F wrote: »

Rooney completed 46 passes with a 90% accuracy. "Looked like a pub player" my hole.

Not good enough. Big F had 99% accuracy with 69 passes.

Flint Fredstone

Pro. F wrote: »

Rooney completed 46 passes with a 90% accuracy. "Looked like a pub player" my hole.

Ah, my eyes must be lying again...

deaddonkey15

bangkok wrote: »

Rooney had a 90% pass completion today, done a lot of work for the team, scored a goal and had other chances as well. Anyone who thinks he played poorly today need to look at the game again

He also had 70 touches and only 2 tackles which proves that the claims made here that he miscontrolled the ball more often than not and his second touch is usually a tackle are just childish exaggerations and as I said earlier, simply untrue.

Pro. F

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Rooney again being the focal point of nearly all of our attacks is ultimately going to be scrutinised the most. Ibra again can do **** all in a match and when it matters do something class.
Credit to Rooney for his goal today but for so long he's been lackluster in every department including his finishing. It's not just about today's game

I know it's not just about today's game. But you still have to look at each game objectively. Lots of people clearly aren't doing that.

Ibra could indeed be that type of player who does nothing and still wins a game with some impossible skill. That theory could be put forward. But nobody was expressing that idea today. The misplaced passes and lack of shots - which are supposedly important - from Ibra were not being acknowledged before I mentioned them today.

Pro. F

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Ah, my eyes must be lying again...

You probably just weren't thinking about it objectively.

Whatsisname

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

He got dispossessed pulling the ball back as there was pretty much no one ahead of him except Bournemouth defenders.

Until the next game when you and the rest come out with the same over the top criticism.

Ah yes cause I'm always giving him a hard time after every match. Pull me up on that one. And I'm the one exaggerating.

jayo26

Pro. F wrote: »

Rooney completed 46 passes with a 90% accuracy. "Looked like a pub player" my hole.

I hate this rooney debate but unfortunately there is no getting away from it here.

I love rooney I think he has been a great player for United and hope he will be again but I can also see his faults today.

You say rooney had 90 percent accuracy with his passes that's grand but how many times was he caught on the ball and dispossessed.

Or on a number of occasions the attack was going forward and Rooney was caught running away from the goal while receiving the ball and ended up passing it back to the defence or out wide.

But he did well to get the goal and he got about alot and always runs I don't think he is finished as a player but jose has to find a way to get him working in an attack that already has zlatan playing as a bit of a target man or focal point up front and what we really need is someone that can run past zlatan at pace.

jayo26

bangkok wrote: »

Rooney had a 90% pass completion today, done a lot of work for the team, scored a goal and had other chances as well. Anyone who thinks he played poorly today need to look at the game again

Fellaini had 99% passing just saying

Flint Fredstone

Pro. F wrote: »

You probably just weren't thinking about it objectively.

Could say the same about you tbf. You don't budge on anything. You'll still be here defending him to death come May after a dire season.

adox

Off topic but, Shreeves interviewing Wenger there just reminding me what an utterly horrible gutter journalist he is. Must see Wenger as a soft target.

Wenger should have told him where to go.

Whatsisname

Pro. F wrote: »

But the Ibra mistakes don't even get a mention. It's not like people are pointing them out and saying hopefully they'll improve, they just aren't acknowledged. And these are things that supposedly are completely unacceptable for an attacking player when it's Rooney doing them.

Needless to say, I don't agree with your summary of Rooney's game over red tent years.

Pro. F wrote: »

I didn't say you did. You can quote where I did if you think I'm wrong on that.

I replied to what you said. You made up something and replied to it as if I had said it.

Here. I never said any of that. Never even mentioned Ibrahimovic. You made that up and replied to me as if I said it. You're taking a phrase I used way too literal.

Pro. F

Whatsisname wrote: »

Here. I never said any of that. Never even mentioned Ibrahimovic. You made that up and replied to me as if I said it. You're taking a phrase I used way too literal.

You most certainly did mention Ibra's supposed mistakes and talked about why he isn't being criticed for them. For example, you said:

Whatsisname wrote: »

A new player, especially of Ibra's reputation, is not gonna be slaughtered for any mistakes yet.

bangkok

jayo26 wrote: »

Fellaini had 99% passing just saying

He played well today

TheDoc

Rooney will be out of that team by October. Terrible again. He slows everything down.....everything.

Martial a bit stroppy today.

Other then that good performance and pleased. Fellaini and Herrera where good I thought.

ElChe32

bangkok wrote: »

He played well today

Nalz

bangkok wrote: »

He played well today

Some decent interceptions too. Hopefully he can keep it up

jayo26

bangkok wrote: »

He played well today

Fair play I didn't think you had it in ya

jayo26

Nalz wrote: »

Some decent interceptions too. Hopefully he can keep it up

His all round play was on a different level to anything I seen from him in 3 years.

His movement and passing was simple but quality I hope its from new coaching or tactics because a Fellaini playing like he has past two games and Paul pogba in midfield is seriously strong.

brinty

So guys missed the match

MS Brinty had me otherwise occupied

3-1 happy days, seems like most people played well,Juan started and scored but I'm sure Jose is selling him tonight...

the Rooney-bate rumbles on in its continuous loop of page on page stuff...

ibra scores but still he's not good enough for some cos he did silly stuff that no one says anything about but woh betide Rooney made such errors???

I love the football being back

#vivaJose

Nalz

Rooney wasn't great today but he wasn't terrible.

He gets overally criticised and then gets overally defended by others.

Was a bit in the middle today but I worry about him ever being a "big" player for us. I hope I'm wrong and he hits a purple patch for 8-10 games this season.

bucketybuck

Pro. F wrote: »

You most certainly did mention Ibra's supposed mistakes and talked about why he isn't being criticed for them. For example, you said:


Claiming you "Never even mentioned Ibrahimovic." ...:eek:

Thats just a bull**** and dishonest misrepresentation of what was said. Typical.

To everybody else, I think it is perfectly valid to note that while Rooney might indeed have had a 90% pass success rate today its clear that we still need a more creative player in that position.

Cookie_Dough

bangkok wrote: »

He played well today

Somebody alert a mod. I think bangkok has been hacked

Fair play man

TheDoc

His pass completion rate irrelevant. Just need to use your eyes.

Some turning over possession when we are on the attack, and his lack of incision ..jesus. So slow.

Pro. F

bucketybuck wrote: »

Thats just a bull**** and dishonest misrepresentation of what was said. Typical.

To everybody else, I think it is perfectly valid to note that while Rooney might indeed have had a 90% pass success rate today its clear that we still need a more creative player in that position.

What did I misrepresent about what Whatsisname said? He claims he never even mentioned Ibra ffs.

deaddonkey15

TheDoc wrote: »

His pass completion rate irrelevant. Just need to use your eyes.

Some turning over possession when we are on the attack, and his lack of incision ..jesus. So slow.

Would the pass completion be irrelevant if it was only 50 or 60%? Was the goal irrelevant too? Probably.

JakeArmitage

I'm excited by the physicality a midfield of Fellaini and Pogba can bring us, if he keeps the form he played today he cant be dropped and deserves to partner Pogba in central midfield. Question , Does Pogba have much pace?

brinty

JakeArmitage wrote:

I'm excited by the physicality a midfield of Fellaini and Pogba can bring us, if he keeps the form he played today he cant be dropped and deserves to partner Pogba in central midfield. Question , Does Pogba have much pace?

Deceptively quick from what I remember
Glides over the ground

bucketybuck

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Would the pass completion be irrelevant if it was only 50 or 60%? Was the goal irrelevant too? Probably.

Its all about the bigger picture, about the creativity that we will need in the future to win champions leagues and we did not see any of it from Rooney today regardless of his pass completion rate. We saw solid play and solid use of the ball and thats fine for Bournemouth, fair play to him for that, but we still need better.

Watching the game my opinion is that we won't be back to the very top until we have improved upon Mata, Rooney and Ibra. They will win us games like today but we need the Rashfords, Martials and Pogbas to supplant them if we want to reach the very top.

jayo26

brinty wrote: »

Deceptively quick from what I remember
Glides over the ground

78 pace in fifa sure he be grand

Adamocovic

https://twitter.com/SkyFootball/status/764837266476765184

Pro. F

jayo26 wrote: »

I hate this rooney debate but unfortunately there is no getting away from it here.

I love rooney I think he has been a great player for United and hope he will be again but I can also see his faults today.

You say rooney had 90 percent accuracy with his passes that's grand but how many times was he caught on the ball and dispossessed.

Or on a number of occasions the attack was going forward and Rooney was caught running away from the goal while receiving the ball and ended up passing it back to the defence or out wide.

But he did well to get the goal and he got about alot and always runs I don't think he is finished as a player but jose has to find a way to get him working in an attack that already has zlatan playing as a bit of a target man or focal point up front and what we really need is someone that can run past zlatan at pace.

According to whoscored he had 4 unsuccessful touches - joint second most of all 10s and CFs this weekend, behind Kane (6); Llorente and Berahino were both 4 as well. And was disposed twice - the same as 7 other players; there were 8 players with 3+ disposessions. I'd say given how much more he was involved with possession than most in his position (3rd most total passes, 25% more passes than 4th place), that those numbers are fine, but it's open to interpretation.

Billy86

I'm no big fan of Rooney, but feck the negatives and complaining for today. Only Bournemouth but no Pogba yet, and we still won convincingly. We looked good and had more 'threat' to us than I have seen in a long, long time, and one of my biggest worries is slipping away - for all his talent, Zlatan is also proving an absolutely excellent 'team player' on and off the pitch. Along with Suarez he is probably the 3rd best attacking player of the last several years so I was delighted for us to sign him but had a slight worry about how his ego would slip in. The answer to that has been...