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I've just had an auctioneer ask me for €10k in cash to close a deal

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2

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    #32
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Oral Surgeon wrote: »
    Is the asking price plus the €10k good value for you?? Will it seal the deal and stop bidding wars that may cost you more than €10k? If so, pay it and be happy. If not, move on, reporting him gets you what??

    Reporting him gets you the knowledge that a corrupt agent is being dealt with.


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    #33
    laoisman11
    Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Emersyn Helpful Metro wrote: »
    If its good value at the price +10k paying him is definitely an option to be considered if it saves you money in the long run. People can say this and that about it but at the end of the day you need to look after your own pocket first. The world is cut throat and the next person that comes won't think twice about it. That being said I'd want some serious guarantees that the house was mine for sure.

    Wow. Just wow.

    Even if I had the possibility of getting a house at "good value" if I slid a brown envelope into someone's hands, I couldn't or wouldn't do it. But maybe that's just me.

    How can some people not see a little bit further than their own personal interests in these situations??

    OP, make sure of your facts and act accordingly.


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    #34
    Oral Surgeon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,240 ✭✭✭Oral Surgeon


    Braylee Creamy Dean wrote: »
    Reporting him gets you the knowledge that a corrupt agent is being dealt with.

    Great, that's worth the effort so!


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    #35
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,714 ✭ [Deleted User]


    intheclouds wrote: »

    You cant just hand someone 10k in an envelope and not tell the Revenue Commissioners!

    People pay their booking deposits in cash, people buy cars in cash all the time. I never told revenue about handing over a few k in cash in an envelope when buying a car.

    I'm, not advising the op to do it I wouldn't advise anyone to do it. People need to make their own decisions on these things. There are three options. Do nothing, report the auctioneer or go through with it and people need to make their own minds up on how to proceed.


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    #36
    Avatar MIA
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,750 ✭✭✭Avatar MIA


    It's likely the amount the OP is paying before the €10k bribe is the acceptable amount to the seller. Therefore, if he can tell the seller (possibly a bank) then he could get the deal for the lesser amount.


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    #37
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Op, the first thing to consider is, will this benefit you? If the property is undervalued, you really like it and it is likely to cost more if it is kept on the market, then it may be in your interest to pay the cash and get the property you want at a price lower than expected.

    On the other hand, you could consider the moral dilemma in this, it is unsavoury to say the least to be asked for cash (even though a lot of buyers do offer it), and you could report the auctioneer but you no doubt will lose the property or at the very least have to pay more then the €10 extra for it.

    It really comes down to your conscience and whether you want to seal that deal asap at a price which benefits you.


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    #38
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,904 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    kceire wrote: »
    I bought last year and I had to pay the deposit in cash. It was only €5k though.
    It made sure I was serious about the purchase. All was above board and that was to a registered auctioneer also.

    That's the deposit. This isn't a deposit, its a bung.
    Emersyn Helpful Metro wrote: »
    If its good value at the price +10k paying him is definitely an option to be considered if it saves you money in the long run. People can say this and that about it but at the end of the day you need to look after your own pocket first. The world is cut throat and the next person that comes won't think twice about it. That being said I'd want some serious guarantees that the house was mine for sure.

    Its outright fraud, not being "cut throat". They aren't looking for a deposit here - they are looking to defraud the bank selling. The bank will never hear of or see that 10k.
    m'lady wrote: »
    Very true, which is what I would assume too but I think it's important the OP establish the facts first.
    Why would the Auctioneer put his job and reputation on the line to arrange 10k to the soon to be former owner? Especially when he's obviously selling on behalf of the bank.

    Because for years they were effectively unregulated as a profession - a member run body that didn't uphold complaints - and think they're untouchable. Also most people don't even know you can complain.


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    #39
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,193 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Avatar MIA wrote: »
    It's likely the amount the OP is paying before the €10k bribe is the acceptable amount to the seller. Therefore, if he can tell the seller (possibly a bank) then he could get the deal for the lesser amount.

    Or he ends up not getting a bargain of a house.

    House sales can be complicated and if 10k will seal the deal and OP gets a bargain then pay it.

    No point in being rigetous and homeless or overpaying for the next house.


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    #40
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    Emersyn Helpful Metro wrote: »
    People pay their booking deposits in cash, people buy cars in cash all the time. I never told revenue about handing over a few k in cash in an envelope when buying a car.

    But there will be a record of a booking deposit. Its a legitimate transaction regardless of how it is paid.

    What record will there be of a bribe?


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    #41
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,193 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    L1011 wrote: »
    Its outright fraud, not being "cut throat". They aren't looking for a deposit here - they are looking to defraud the bank selling. The bank will never hear of or see that 10k

    Tone it down a little, it's the way the world works. Banks will get the price their willing to accept, seller gets his 10k and OP gets a bargain, everybody's happy.


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    #42
    Avatar MIA
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,750 ✭✭✭Avatar MIA


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    No point in being rigetous and homeless or overpaying for the next house.

    If the OP is in the market to purchase a house he's unlikely to be at risk of being homeless. Hyperbole much?


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    #43
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,714 ✭ [Deleted User]


    L1011 wrote: »

    Its outright fraud, not being "cut throat". They aren't looking for a deposit here - they are looking to defraud the bank selling. The bank will never hear of or see that 10k.

    I'm under no illusions about what the 10k is, what I meant is that if a person was willing to hand over the money they would want the auctioneer to guarantee them that they was getting the house.
    intheclouds wrote: »

    What record will there be of a bribe?

    None obviously.


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    #44
    laoisman11
    Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    davo10 wrote: »
    Op, the first thing to consider is, will this benefit you? If the property is undervalued, you really like it and it is likely to cost more if it is kept on the market, then it may be in your interest to pay the cash and get the property you want at a price lower than expected.

    On the other hand, you could consider the moral dilemma in this, it is unsavoury to say the least to be asked for cash (even though a lot of buyers do offer it), and you could report the auctioneer but you no doubt will lose the property or at the very least have to pay more then the €10 extra for it.

    It really comes down to your conscience and whether you want to seal that deal asap at a price which benefits you.

    Mé féinism........

    I just don't understand how someone can say "On the other hand, you could consider the moral dilemma in this".

    There is no other hand here apart from the greedy one. The greedy hand of an auctioneer thinking he can get 10k to "guarantee" a deal (whatever that means) and the greedy hand of a person thinking that they can illegaly outdo other potential buyers.


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    #45
    ectoraige
    Registered Users Posts: 2,100 ✭✭✭ectoraige


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    It's illegal to record the call without informing him.

    A note on this, it's not illegal to record a call you are making. It is illegal to record a conversation between two parties where neither party know about it. Once one person knows about it beforehand, there's nothing illegal. There may be question marks concerning admissibility in a court case however.


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    #46
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    Tone it down a little, it's the way the world works. Banks will get the price their willing to accept, seller gets his 10k and OP gets a bargain, everybody's happy.

    Itd cost you less to walk into a shop and steal the stuff off the shelves instead of paying for them too.


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    #47
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,193 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Avatar MIA wrote: »
    If the OP is in the market to purchase a house he's unlikely to be at risk of being homeless. Hyperbole much?

    No but they'll overpay, if 10k saves 50k then it's a no brainier.


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    #48
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    No but they'll overpay, if 10k saves 50k then it's a no brainier.

    Is that you Bertie?


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    #49
    wally1990
    Registered Users Posts: 1,222 ✭✭✭wally1990


    Personally, I'd report it. Regardless of good deal or not. Its illegal and we can't have this going on


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    #50
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    laoisman11 wrote: »
    Mé féinism........

    I just don't understand how someone can say "On the other hand, you could consider the moral dilemma in this".

    There is no other hand here apart from the greedy one. The greedy hand of an auctioneer thinking he can get 10k to "guarantee" a deal (whatever that means) and the greedy hand of a person thinking that they can illegaly outdo other potential buyers.

    Welcome to the real world, don't think for a second that when you were buying your home, if the EA said that he could get you your house for €50k less if you paid him €5k, you wouldn't at least consider it.

    I'm not saying it is right, but it is up to the op to at least consider the benefits to him/her of getting the house for less than it may be worth.


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    #51
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    davo10 wrote: »
    Welcome to the real world, don't think for a second that when you were buying your home, if the EA said that he could get you your house for €50k less if you paid him €5k, you wouldn't at least consider it.

    I'm not saying it is right, but it is up to the op to at least consider the benefits to him/her of getting the house for less than it may be worth.

    But the EA didnt say anything like that.

    The OP stated that the Auctioneer said it would mean his offer would be accepted and the deal completed.

    Nothing about it being cheaper to do it.


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    #52
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    intheclouds wrote: »
    But the EA didnt say anything like that.

    The OP stated that the Auctioneer said it would mean his offer would be accepted and the deal completed.

    Nothing about it being cheaper to do it.

    Look above your head, any moment now a lightbulb will go on.

    What possible advantage would the EA see for the op to pay €10k unless they were going to get it cheaper by paying him? If he isn't paid, the property stays on the market until a similar/higher bid is accepted. Property prices are rising, it's in today's indo.


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    #53
    livedadream
    Registered Users Posts: 2,457 ✭✭✭livedadream


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    It's illegal to record the call without informing him.

    If your getting a great deal and want the house pay the 10k

    Once you've the keys you can worry about getting some of the 10k back, little threat of a call to the revenue will fix that.
    Get the house first before doing anything.

    no its not,


    If a person or any other entity records a conversation or telephone call and they are not a party to that conversation it is illegal.
    eg: if im talking to my boyfriend and you record that, thats illegal.

    The only exception to this is when the third party is authorised by the government and obtains a legal and valid warrant- the cops.

    If a person is a party to the conversation or phone call then it is legal to record it with or without prior consent of the other parties. For telephone calls specifically, it became legal to do so in 1993.


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    #54
    testicles
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,198 ✭✭✭testicles


    This post has been deleted.


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    #55
    Avatar MIA
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,750 ✭✭✭Avatar MIA


    testicles wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Really?


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    #56
    livedadream
    Registered Users Posts: 2,457 ✭✭✭livedadream


    people watch way to much American crime/legal shows and think its real...


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    #57
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Registered Users Posts: 7,223 ✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    Mod: The next person to advocate paying a bribe gets a card.


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    #58
    Bandana boy
    Registered Users Posts: 4,330 ✭✭✭Bandana boy


    Do not pay this , and report the auctioneer in question to everybody and anybody who will listen including the papers.

    The posters saying that this bribe should be paid should be ashamed of themselves.
    This is a black and white issue , All crimes have a benefit to the participants , that is no excuse to commit a crime.


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    #59
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    davo10 wrote: »
    Look above your head, any moment now a lightbulb will go on.

    What possible advantage would the EA see for the op to pay €10k unless they were going to get it cheaper by paying him? If he isn't paid, the property stays on the market until a similar/higher bid is accepted. Property prices are rising, it's in today's indo.

    It might just be to get the deal done quick. Or he might be offering the same deal to a few people and whoever comes up with the 10k first gets it.

    <snip>


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    #60
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 24,714 ✭ [Deleted User]


    livedadream wrote: »
    no its not,


    If a person or any other entity records a conversation or telephone call and they are not a party to that conversation it is illegal.
    eg: if im talking to my boyfriend and you record that, thats illegal.

    The only exception to this is when the third party is authorised by the government and obtains a legal and valid warrant- the cops.

    If a person is a party to the conversation or phone call then it is legal to record it with or without prior consent of the other parties. For telephone calls specifically, it became legal to do so in 1993.

    Why are banks, insurance companies, utility companies etc compelled to inform you that your call is being recorded so?


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    #61
    testicles
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,198 ✭✭✭testicles


    This post has been deleted.


This discussion has been closed.
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