Deep Space Nine Runthrough

To think just how huge a star Whoopie was in the 80's, they actually didn't believe that she wanted a part in the show

odyssey06

Speaking of casting, the producers were setting up Ro Laren to be Ds9 bajoran liaison officer and were very annoyed when she didnt want to signup for the series. Would have been interesting to see her, would Bajorans have seen her as a bit too close to Federation?

Evade

bluewolf wrote: »

i'm willing to make an allowance for ezri only being afraid of everything since she got joined

Waking up one day with the memory of dying horribly in a shuttle crash is bound to have an effect on you.

Daith

odyssey06 wrote: »

Speaking of casting, the producers were setting up Ro Laren to be Ds9 bajoran liaison officer and were very annoyed when she didnt want to signup for the series. Would have been interesting to see her, would Bajorans have seen her as a bit too close to Federation?

I think Kira (or a brand new character) worked better. Would have been interesting to see Ro back during the Maquis storylines though.

TheValeyard

Daith wrote: »

I think Kira (or a brand new character) worked better. Would have been interesting to see Ro back during the Maquis storylines though.

I liked Kira, suited to have a member of the Bajoran military I'm a key position. Added an extra layer of complexity to DS9.


But they should have used Ro in some sort of three or four episode arc. That was a missed opportunity.

odyssey06

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

I liked Kira, suited to have a member of the Bajoran military I'm a key position. Added an extra layer of complexity to DS9.
But they should have used Ro in some sort of three or four episode arc. That was a missed opportunity.

They brought her back for TNG Preemptive Strike to close out her story, but yeah, would have been great to see her in The Maquis arc on DS9.

_Kaiser_

odyssey06 wrote: »

Speaking of casting, the producers were setting up Ro Laren to be Ds9 bajoran liaison officer and were very annoyed when she didnt want to signup for the series. Would have been interesting to see her, would Bajorans have seen her as a bit too close to Federation?

Yea.. having 2 Starfleet officers in charge of DS9 (a Bajoran station) would have provided a different type of conflict yes, but wouldn't have fit with the idea of the 2 sides working together to rebuild after the Occupation.

I always preferred Kira to Ro anyway - at least, once the writers got her past her "angry shouty" initial phase.

Inviere

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Yea.. having 2 Starfleet officers in charge of DS9 (a Bajoran station) would have provided a different type of conflict yes, but wouldn't have fit with the idea of the 2 sides working together to rebuild after the Occupation.

Unless by then, Ro had become part of the Bajoran Militia, and was no longer a Maquis. She left Starfleet for the Maquis during Preemptive Strike, so she was never going to be a Starfleet Officer after that.

I always preferred Kira to Ro anyway - at least, once the writers got her past her "angry shouty" initial phase.

Same. She's a fantastic character, and so very well acted once she's fleshed out and more relaxed.

Evade

Inviere wrote: »

Unless by then, Ro had become part of the Bajoran Militia, and was no longer a Maquis. She left Starfleet for the Maquis during Preemptive Strike, so she was never going to be a Starfleet Officer after that.

Preemptive strike takes place a long time after the Federation took over administration of DS9. If Ro had have been the first officer on DS9 and joined the Bajoran Militia she'd probably still be considered an outsider among the Militia since a large portion of the senior officers seem to have been resistance fighters during the occupation.

Inviere

Evade wrote: »

Preemptive strike takes place a long time after the Federation took over administration of DS9. If Ro had have been the first officer on DS9 and joined the Bajoran Militia she'd probably still be considered an outsider among the Militia since a large portion of the senior officers seem to have been resistance fighters during the occupation.

Spot on, I got the timelines wrong.

Rawr

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I always preferred Kira to Ro anyway - at least, once the writers got her past her "angry shouty" initial phase.

Ditto. I'm also always a little amused by this when watching "Emissary".
The writing in that episode was very "Pilot-y".

Kira: Grrr!! I am the ANGRY CHARACTER...you'd better watch out for me in future episodes....oh boy!"

Also:

Odo: The situation is tense. We had better take control the Promenade. Oh...and by the way Commander....I don't know where I'm from and my whole species is a mystery....better stay turned for details of that (winks at camera)

_Kaiser_

To be fair to Ms Forbes though, she was brilliant as Admiral Cain (just the wrong franchise)

I could have imagined that character substituting for Admiral pain-in-the-ass (Nechayev), or even Jellico (although Ronny Cox - legend that he is - OWNED that role!)

Riker was lucky not to be discharged for being such a petulant knob when serving under Jellico

IvySlayer

Deleted User wrote: »

Riker was lucky not to be discharged for being such a petulant knob when serving under Jellico

I love how the writers suddenly decided that he was the best pilot on the ship despite never been shown to fly a shuttle before. He's better than DATA!

I wonder how a situation where Jellico takes over as CO on DS9 for an episode or 2 would go?

Jellico vs Kira :eek:

Evade

IvySlayer wrote: »

I love how the writers suddenly decided that he was the best pilot on the ship despite never been shown to fly a shuttle before. He's better than DATA!

I can think of two times Riker flew a shuttle before Chain of Command off the top of my head, the Host and the Outcast. I'm pretty sure Picard is the best pilot on the ship since he takes over for the trickiest maneuvers like in Booby Trap and In Theory. But he obviously wasn't there during Chain of Command. As for being better than Data, it's possible Data is too by the book like was shown in the Most Toys and some expert flying requires bending or breaking rules. Plus Data isn't always right, see Cause and Effect.

Inviere

Deleted User wrote: »

Riker was lucky not to be discharged for being such a petulant knob when serving under Jellico

Riker had all all of the complaints about Jellico coming to him, and as XO, it fell to him to butt heads with Jellico. As bad ass as Jellico was, I’d definitely agree with Riker in that he wasn’t a particularly good Captain, didn’t inspire people to go above and beyond for him, had everyone wound up with his abrasive and adversarial style of command, and for me, wasn’t in the same league as Picard in terms of character traits. He was a small minded, emotional, singular, and bullish man. Good for storming out of meetings, and little else.

River lost his cool admittedly, but Jellico was just as culpable.

Inviere

Inviere wrote: »

River had all all of the complaints about Jellico coming to him, and as XO, it fell to him to butt heads with Jellico. As bad ass as Jellico was, I’d definitely agree with Riker in that he wasn’t a particularly good Captain, didn’t inspire people to go above and beyond for him, had everyone wound up with his abrasive and adversarial style of command, and for me, wasn’t in the same league as Picard in terms of character traits. He was a small minded, emotional, singular, and bullish man. Good for storming out of meetings, and little else.

River lost his cool admittedly, but Jellico was just as culpable.

Riker's job is to carry out the captain's will.
Bring complaints to note but accept captain decision.

Jellico had the Cardassians number. And officers don't get to whine about who they serve under.

Inviere

Deleted User wrote: »

Riker's job is to carry out the captain's will.
Bring complaints to note but accept captain decision.

Jellico had the Cardassians number. And officers don't get to whine about who they serve under.

Thankfully then Star Trek isn’t a show about people who mindlessly follow orders, be pretty dull otherwise.

Inviere

Inviere wrote: »

Thankfully then Star Trek isn’t a show about people who mindlessly follow orders, be pretty dull otherwise.

Thankfully they did follow Data's orders Redemption. There are plenty of examples of them not following orders, correctly IMHO, Chain of Command was a bunch of brats getting prissy that he stepped on their toes

Inviere

Deleted User wrote: »

Thankfully they did follow Data's orders Redemption. There are plenty of examples of them not following orders, correctly IMHO, Chain of Command was a bunch of brats getting prissy that he stepped on their toes

Riker was chosen as XO by Picard because he disobeyed an order by his previous Captain because he felt he was right. He knows how to do it right too. The situation with Jellico was tough for the entire crew, they didn’t mind the work, the time it took to make the changes was the issue. Yes they got pissy, but I feel it was justified. Yes the Captain has final say, doesn’t make it easier to accept though, and that’s what we explored in the episode.

Inviere

Inviere wrote: »

Riker was chosen as XO by Picard because he disobeyed an order by his previous Captain because he felt he was right. He knows how to do it right too. The situation with Jellico was tough for the entire crew, they didn’t mind the work, the time it took to make the changes was the issue. Yes they got pissy, but I feel it was justified. Yes the Captain has final say, doesn’t make it easier to accept though, and that’s what we explored in the episode.

They explored that so much better in All Good Things, at Farpoint timeline

Inviere

Deleted User wrote: »

They explored that so much better in All Good Things, at Farpoint timeline

Would have loved to see how things would have worked out if Jellico were in that position It took Picard making a rousing, inspirational speech imploring the crew to trust him, that he trusts them, knows they’re the finest crew in Starfleet etc, to get them to trust him. Wouldn’t imagine Jaleco getting that far, he’d have been received more like the imposter Picard who wanted to take the ship lethally close to a pulsar, ie, removed of command.

_Kaiser_

Inviere wrote: »

Riker had all all of the complaints about Jellico coming to him, and as XO, it fell to him to butt heads with Jellico. As bad ass as Jellico was, I’d definitely agree with Riker in that he wasn’t a particularly good Captain, didn’t inspire people to go above and beyond for him, had everyone wound up with his abrasive and adversarial style of command, and for me, wasn’t in the same league as Picard in terms of character traits. He was a small minded, emotional, singular, and bullish man. Good for storming out of meetings, and little else.

River lost his cool admittedly, but Jellico was just as culpable.

I do remember siding with Riker when I first watched the show but that was partly down to loyalty to the character and Picard, and the abrasive way Jellico came aboard.

But as Jellico said himself (more or less), he wasn't there to make friends and give people time.. he was there to deal with a Cardassian threat and prevent a potential war, and that's what he did - and very effectively - to be fair.

He was a wartime captain on a ship with a crew that had only really faced peacetime issues (the odd skirmish with the Romulans or Borg notwithstanding). While Picard would undoubtedly have been up to the task, in his absence Nechayev probably made the right call.

_Kaiser_

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I do remember siding with Riker when I first watched the show but that was partly down to loyalty to the character and Picard, and the abrasive way Jellico came aboard.

But as Jellico said himself (more or less), he wasn't there to make friends and give people time.. he was there to deal with a Cardassian threat and prevent a potential war, and that's what he did - and very effectively - to be fair.

He was a wartime captain on a ship with a crew that had only really faced peacetime issues (the odd skirmish with the Romulans or Borg notwithstanding). While Picard would undoubtedly have been up to the task, in his absence Nechayev probably made the right call.

He tied the Cardassians in knots

coffee_cake

If i ever run a space station there will be security cameras.

Guys someone killed this lieutenant
Okay whodunit
I duno lol

Evade

bluewolf wrote: »

If i ever run a space station there will be security cameras.

Guys someone killed this lieutenant
Okay whodunit
I duno lol

It must be because it's a Cardassian station, or Dukat didn't want any recorded evidence. Because over on Voyager they monitor the crew's brainwaves 24/7.

coffee_cake

Evade wrote: »

It must be because it's a Cardassian station, or Dukat didn't want any recorded evidence. Because over on Voyager they monitor the crew's brainwaves 24/7.

I remember something about a security cam review on enterprise but didn't know about voyager

And now ezri has gone off the deep end altogether

Evade

bluewolf wrote: »

I remember something about a security cam review on enterprise but didn't know about voyager

Yeah, in Cathexis the Doctor is able to pull brain scans from Torres and Paris from a few hours earlier while they were supposed to be going about their normal duties. No indication or comment was given as to why they need their brains monitored. I'm starting to think Voyager was like a Vault-Tec vault from Fallout and Janeway as the overseer is supposed to mess with the crew at every opportunity.

IvySlayer

Surely with all the technology every room/hallway apart from private quarters would have automatic voice recorders and video recording. With the vast resources and personnel of Stafleet this security could be on every ship/station/starbase within a week.

How many times do we see people frantically pushing buttons and looking at consoles wondering what happening in Engineering behind a locked door or who killed who?

With the changeling threat say on DS9/the Defiant, computers could track everyones movements and if people appeared in 2 different locations at the same time surely the computer would instantly declare intruder alert?

The episode where a Pah'Wraith takes over Keikos body, or when Crusher was in an alternate universe, they asked the computer to record their lifesigns and report them occasionally. If someone was killed/injured on the Ent-D the computer should have automatically picked up that lifesigns in distress but the plot always ignores it and we have a murder mystery :P

Evade

I'd imagine the reason they don't, Voyager aside, monitor you 24/7 is privacy. Even if your quarters were private they'd still know who had private conversations, or other activities, with who and for how long. And constant lifesigns monitoring sounds horrifying. Imagine the computer flags that you have an illness or allergy because a few times per day you have inexplicable changes to your lifesigns that coincidentally occur every time that new lieutenant is at your station or the potential embarrassment if that information was somehow publicly displayed.