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Deep Space Nine Runthrough
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Join Date:Posts: 34532
Well, I finished. And would you believe it folks, while watching 'What You Leave Behind', the room just became SUPER dusty. Crazy stuff
Can't really add anything that I haven't already done in this thread: I've no doubt in my mind this was the best Trek series ever made, and that's including TOS. Smart, complex, funny, human, humane, exciting, dark, optimistic-yet-pragmatic; the best compliment I always feel I can give any show is that I'll genuinely miss the characters. No flat meat puppets in Starfleet uniforms, but a cast of rounded, interesting humans and aliens alike. I'm struggling to pick a favourite among them tbh.
Only quibble was the dropped ball during the little flashbacks for the departing crew; the absence of Jadzia during Worf's reminiscence was pretty unfortunate and a bit disrespectful.0 -
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I've said it before on other threads, DS9 was always my favourite. Look at how you grew to love the characters.
The reluctant messiah who was, by far, the most human lead on any of the Treks. Who did what was needed, not always what was easy or "right". Can you imagine any other captain doing what Cisco did in "In the pale moonlight" (Or whatever that episode was called)
His son. Just a kid. Not a technical prodigy. Just a likable kid who grew up before our eyes.
The Irish Engineer who was more than just a re-skin of a Scotty re-skin. He actually has a history/life outside of Engineering.
The initially, intentionally, quite annoying know-it-all Doctor who really grew on ya.
The alien who was torn between his people and his friends as war came.
Look how much you knew about the secondary, guest stars:
The Ferengi kid who wanted to prove he, and the Ferengi, were more than a one-trick pony.
The initial "Bad-guy lackey" who because a freedom fighter.
Morn!
Christ, even the holodek singer (I actually enjoyed Vic
)
Compare to Enterprise which was launched with such fanfare (No pun intended). I mean a lot of money was spent on Enterprise (Initially at least) and CBS put a lot of focus on it. What do you get?
Quantum Leap guy.
Hot alien chick
Southern guy.
Brit (And I do mean "Brit" as in real stereotype. All he was missing was a catchphrase asking for a cuppa each episode)
Hot asian chick
Unbelievably bland black guy.
Stupid alien design doc.
Falling back on Episode-of-the-week really hurt them. Xindi arc was an improvement but then..... Spaaaaaaaaceeee Nazis.........
Just thank CBS/God we actually had DS9. It is missed but at least US mainstream Nwtwork TV had a moment of braveness to create such a complex show for a mainstream audience.0 -
^^
I'd have to add...
- Dukat: The best Trek villain by a country mile and for me up there with other TV/film villains like Hans Gruber. Not just a one-dimensional stereotype but a complex developed character who you hate, sympathise with, and laugh with/at at various times. The majority of that is down to Mark Alaimo and some great stories and writing for him
- Garak: Another all-round fantastic character and again down to the actor and stories. Like Dukat, could go from witty and charming to menacing (and back again) in a heartbeat:
But really pretty much all of the recurring cast were fully developed over the series and the show still holds up really well today as a result 0 -
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Join Date:Posts: 34532
Yeah, as I said, a doe-eyed obsession between friends. Jadzia had him well under control, and again, enjoyed his attention for what it was. She was well able for him.
Haha, I dunno. I appreciate that Jadzia was capable of dealing with his advances, but it always felt like in those early days it was mostly Jadzia being Kurzon, rather than the more interesting mix she later became. Julian was a creep though, 'doe eyed' only stretches so far; I love where the character eventually went, but that described behaviour previously was stalking at best, sexual assault at worst. You certainly never saw anything remotely like it with any other "Julian falls in love with..." plots later on.
It wasn't a particularly singular case of a screenwriting trope either: for obvious reasons it's not visible anymore, but there was a pretty common cliché for romantic pairings to write the man as the affable "nice guy", simply too in love to take 'no' for an answer, and pretty much stalking & harassing her til - hooray! - she gives up and sees what a lovely guy he really is. I never thought of it was deliberately malicious, but only accidentally letting the eagerness to pair off the fictional characters, at the expense of normal, acceptable behaviour.
Now, that's not me getting on my high horse or anything, just that those season 1 decisions made him a total creeper, and given how definitively it disappeared from the show, I suspect the writers knew this too 0 -
Now, that's not me getting on my high horse or anything, just that those season 1 decisions made him a total creeper, and given how definitively it disappeared from the show, I suspect the writers knew this too
As I said, Kirk gets a free pass for similar (leering at total strangers etc), but he's Jim Kirk...that's ok. It's fashionable to jump on Bashir though. Yes, I grant he was quite persistent with Jadzia, and in the real world, it's obviously unacceptable behaviour. It wasn't written to be creepy though, it's just modern trends have put a spotlight on it.0 -
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0mba5Nf520
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