Deep Space Nine Runthrough

TheIrishGrover

Evade wrote: »

And the real kicker was Maxwell was right.

It's funny thinking back that even pre-DS9 O'Brien was a better developed character that anyone in the new stuff.

EDIT: Although maybe it's not surprising, I looked it up he was in 52 episodes.

Yeah, they were definitely bigging him up before DS9 to aid his transition. He was certainly the biggest non-headline character/actor on the series. Even over Guinan. His character was certainly one of the most human Trek had (See "Data's Day" also) - Had his back story and his issues. He wasn't a paragon of virtue like Picard or Manly Manington like Riker. I'm sure outside of Ireland he's a minor character but without him we'd never have Roddy Doyle's Star Trek

odyssey06

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

Yeah, they were definitely bigging him up before DS9 to aid his transition. He was certainly the biggest non-headline character/actor on the series. Even over Guinan. His character was certainly one of the most human Trek had (See "Data's Day" also) - Had his back story and his issues. He wasn't a paragon of virtue like Picard or Manly Manington like Riker. I'm sure outside of Ireland he's a minor character but without him we'd never have Roddy Doyle's Star Trek

Probably Barclay would be the closest similar role I can think of on TNG - recurring, some episodes as central character.

TheValeyard

odyssey06 wrote: »

Probably Barclay would be the closest similar role I can think of on TNG - recurring, some episodes as central character.

Ahh yes,

Evade

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

I'm sure outside of Ireland he's a minor character but without him we'd never have Roddy Doyle's Star Trek

And that would be a good thing.

JayRoc

Evade wrote: »

And that would be a good thing.

Bite your tongue!

odyssey06

odyssey06 wrote: »

Probably Barclay would be the closest similar role I can think of on TNG - recurring, some episodes as central character.

And to continue my own post: Ro Laren of course... who was meant to follow O'Brien to DS9 as first officer.
Although I don't think we saw enough of her as much of off duty.

TheValeyard

It's a pity voyager didnt really have enough memorable secondary ship characters or just killed them off after they appeared a few times. A ship alone for seven years, limited crew, we should have seen lots of returning crew. A few O Briens and Ro Larens

odyssey06

TheValeyard wrote: »

It's a pity voyager didnt really have enough memorable secondary ship characters or just killed them off after they appeared a few times. A ship alone for seven years, limited crew, we should have seen lots of returning crew. A few O Briens and Ro Larens

Only read if you've seen Voyager

I liked Seska but that concept burned out quickly. Imagine if it had been just a regular Cardassian, with skills Voyager needed, who wanted to get home and not rock the boat. Or a random Romulan they rescued.

Evade

They started off with a few Seska, Carey, Sudor, and Jonas. But they killed off most of them or in Carey's case seemingly forgot he wasn't dead, brought him back for an episode in flashbacks, and then killed them in the next episode. Amanda Wildman all but disappeared once Naomi could talk.

Then there's Lieutenant Ayala. A name you probably don't know, you might recognise his face, but he's been in 124 episodes. Imagine if they'd gave him a bit of story here and there.

Stark

Not sure if we need spoiler tags, the statute of limitations must surely have run out by this point but anyway

There was also that creepy Betazoid guy Suder. They seemed to do well in the first two seasons with the recurring characters, then the concept burned out. I suppose you also had Captain Braxton from the future though he was underdeveloped. The Romulan thing reminds me of my favourite Season 1 episode "Eye of the needle" where they have to gain the trust of a Romulan from the Alpha Quadrant in order to get home or at least send a message home only for it all to end in disappointment.

TheIrishGrover

TheValeyard wrote: »

It's a pity voyager didnt really have enough memorable secondary ship characters or just killed them off after they appeared a few times. A ship alone for seven years, limited crew, we should have seen lots of returning crew. A few O Briens and Ro Larens

Ah, Voyager? Don't get me started

You knew/cared more about Rom and Leeta's relationship than you did about Chakotay and Seven's.

Nog had a better story arc than Tom Paris

And Morn was more interesting than Harry Kim!

Stark

TheIrishGrover wrote:

You knew/cared more about Rom and Leeta's relationship than you did about Chakotay and Seven's.

That was some weird chemistry or lack thereof. That said, Rom and Leeta also felt weird. Janeway and Chakotay on the other hand, that was one where you could cut the tension with a knife until they decided to resolve it with that episode where they got trapped on a planet together.

flazio

What was the name of the helm operator on the Enterprise after Wes Crusher? The black lady?

Evade

Rager or Gates, there were two different ones.

The Mighty Quinn

I finished DS9 last night, for the first time. I loved it, probably my favourite ST. However, season 7 was a good bit weaker than those leading up to it I think.

It brings to a conclusion my run of full watches of TNG & Voyager before them.

I had watched maybe 5 episodes of Enterprise, but while I didn't hate it, I just kinda forgot about it, maybe I need to go and watch it now that I'm thin on options... or maybe I could watch TOS. I watched season 1 of discovery and... no, I just can't get into it as Star Trek, doesn't work for me. I watched 2 episodes of Picard but life got in the way, is it worth watching? Didn't grab me straight away, but neither did DS9...

Maybe I should download other series, Stargate or Battlestar Galactica.....?

Justin Credible Darts

The Mighty Quinn wrote: »

I finished DS9 last night, for the first time. I loved it, probably my favourite ST. However, season 7 was a good bit weaker than those leading up to it I think.

It brings to a conclusion my run of full watches of TNG & Voyager before them.

I had watched maybe 5 episodes of Enterprise, but while I didn't hate it, I just kinda forgot about it, maybe I need to go and watch it now that I'm thin on options... or maybe I could watch TOS. I watched season 1 of discovery and... no, I just can't get into it as Star Trek, doesn't work for me. I watched 2 episodes of Picard but life got in the way, is it worth watching? Didn't grab me straight away, but neither did DS9...

Maybe I should download other series, Stargate or Battlestar Galactica.....?

DS9 is the best show of the lot in my opinion, as for enterprise it was slated when it came out., and when i finally got around to watching it after setting the bar low, i was pleasantly surprised, as it was not bad, and in comparison to discovery and picard, it is actually quite good, especially season 4

Stark

Unfortunately there's no "slow burn" payoff with Picard. Starts out quite well, but descends into nonsense as the season progresses. It is only 10 episodes though and some of them are quite enjoyable so probably worth watching for the sake of it.

The Mighty Quinn wrote:

Maybe I should download other series, Stargate or Battlestar Galactica.....?

Farscape or "The Expanse" would be my two recommendations. Both on Amazon Prime. First two seasons of "new BSG" and the miniseries are very enjoyable. I never really got into Stargate personally, found it very bland.

Justin Credible Darts wrote:

DS9 is the best show of the lot in my opinion, as for enterprise it was slated when it came out., and when i finally got around to watching it after setting the bar low, i was pleasantly surprised, as it was not bad, and in comparison to discovery and picard, it is actually quite good, especially season 4

Season 4 of Enterprise is good. It's what the show should have started out as. Thought Seasons 1 and 2 were very poor. Haven't watched Season 3, people tell me it's good but the whole Temporal Cold War thing holds no interest for me.

JayRoc

The Mighty Quinn wrote: »

I
Maybe I should download other series, Stargate or Battlestar Galactica.....?

BSG was one of the best non-trek sci-fi shows ever, in my opinion.

pixelburp

The Mighty Quinn wrote: »

I finished DS9 last night, for the first time. I loved it, probably my favourite ST. However, season 7 was a good bit weaker than those leading up to it I think.

It brings to a conclusion my run of full watches of TNG & Voyager before them.

I had watched maybe 5 episodes of Enterprise, but while I didn't hate it, I just kinda forgot about it, maybe I need to go and watch it now that I'm thin on options... or maybe I could watch TOS. I watched season 1 of discovery and... no, I just can't get into it as Star Trek, doesn't work for me. I watched 2 episodes of Picard but life got in the way, is it worth watching? Didn't grab me straight away, but neither did DS9...

Maybe I should download other series, Stargate or Battlestar Galactica.....?

If you want to watch something with the same kind of moral complexity of DS9, then yes the reboot series of "Battlestar Galactica" is a good sideways. "The Expanse" is an even more recent example, and still going with a 5th season due out sometime later this year.

Stargate is definitely more of the "fun adventures in space" kind of show, with almost none of the budget or aesthetic intent of Trek. Lots of running around Canadian forests and none of the kind of consistent moral grey areas of DS9 (or the two recommended shows)

TheIrishGrover

Yeah, I loved BSG. It's definitely worth a look for your post DS9 fix.

Stargates? Yeah, they are a bit of fun but not really in the same ballpark.

Farscape? Interesting one. I love Farscape but it certainly is an acquired taste. People may be put off by the use of puppetry and the bright colours and the manic nature of the first season or so but it really goes to interesting places story-wise. Plus, without Farscape you'd have no:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCNDdlCo4rA

JayRoc

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

Yeah, I loved BSG. It's definitely worth a look for your post DS9 fix.

Stargates? Yeah, they are a bit of fun but not really in the same ballpark.

Farscape? Interesting one. I love Farscape but it certainly is an acquired taste. People may be put off by the use of puppetry and the bright colours and the manic nature of the first season or so but it really goes to interesting places story-wise. Plus, without Farscape you'd have no:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCNDdlCo4rA

I've never actually watched Farscape. Must give it a go

mewso

Stark wrote: »

Season 4 of Enterprise is good. It's what the show should have started out as. Thought Seasons 1 and 2 were very poor. Haven't watched Season 3, people tell me it's good but the whole Temporal Cold War thing holds no interest for me.

Like many here I rate Enterprise higher than common consensus but I'm probably alone in thinking Season 3 was the best and 4 the worst. I just thought Season 4 was constant fan service brought to a ridiculous level and the final episode was a complete joke but what do I know. Most people say 4 is the best.

mewso

mewso wrote: »

Like many here I rate Enterprise higher than common consensus but I'm probably alone in thinking Season 3 was the best and 4 the worst. I just thought Season 4 was constant fan service brought to a ridiculous level and the final episode was a complete joke but what do I know. Most people say 4 is the best.

3 is great, I've just rewatched S1 and no where as bad as I remember.



S4 may have been full of fan service but if their goal was Earth/Romulan war and founding of the Federation, it had to be.
While I obviously like S3 it did nothing to progress that arc, much, and there was a lot of catch up to do

Johnny Storm

JayRoc wrote: »

BSG was one of the best non-trek sci-fi shows ever, in my opinion.

The first few seasons were truly excellent and very well worth seeing IMHO. They more or less started the whole trend for dark and gritty remakes.
But, unfortunately, it really went to **** in the last few seasons.

Once your hear a certain well-known song its time to stop watching.......

pixelburp

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

Yeah, I loved BSG. It's definitely worth a look for your post DS9 fix.

Stargates? Yeah, they are a bit of fun but not really in the same ballpark.

Farscape? Interesting one. I love Farscape but it certainly is an acquired taste. People may be put off by the use of puppetry and the bright colours and the manic nature of the first season or so but it really goes to interesting places story-wise. Plus, without Farscape you'd have no:

Yeah, there has never been anything like Farscape, and not since then either. It's definitely not for everyone because it rams the dial marked "alien weirdness" all the way to 11 and more often than not had a very playful, bordering on "zany" tone (there was often more than one "comedy" episode per season). But then that's also why the show still lingers and people like myself remember it so fondly.

Having the Jim Henson workshop available was a massive boon because it allowed the show to have properly exotic-looking aliens - including two of its main cast. No underwhelming forehead wrinkles, no distracting CGI; the puppetry was so good on Rygel and Pilot that after a few episodes of adjustment you just stop thinking of them as puppets. Helped that their characters were excellently realised anyway.

Usually, with recommendations there's the standard caveat of "you gotta get past the first season" and while that's true with Farscape it's more instructive because the first half of season 1 definitely played it safe. There were some episodes that were more like Trek-lite than anything else, and isn't until "Scorpy" turns up that things really take off into entertaining madness.

IIRC it's on Amazon Prime so give it a go. Same for anyone else. All other SciFi will seem restrained and quaintly terrestrial in comparison.

odyssey06

As a DS9 fan I also love Babylon 5...
It does come with the "you have to get through the first season" syndrome - some iffy episodes in there such as TKO and Eyes.
But even in the first season there were some knockout episodes.

Stark

Yeah B5 seasons 2 - 4 are up there with the best sci-fi. Replacing the lead (Jeffrey Sinclair) from Season 1 helped a lot imo. He was even more wooden than Captain Archer

Smegging hell

BSG is on BBC2 at the moment. James Callis is remarkably similar to Alexander Siddig, and it's not just the accent.

JayRoc

Smegging hell wrote: »

BSG is on BBC2 at the moment. James Callis is remarkably similar to Alexander Siddig, and it's not just the accent.

I always thought that, it was spooky!

TheValeyard

JayRoc wrote: »

I always thought that, it was spooky!

At first I thought they were the same actor when I watched the mini series!

BSG was a great space opera.