Turtle in the Tolka

i71jskz5xu42pb

Spotted this lad in the Tolka this morning (Drumcondra). Anyone know what breed? I assume is is a pet that was abandoned (escape is unlikely, right )

How long will it survive in Irish waters? Based on some of the other threads there's a few knocking around. Do they breed?

syklops

Its a Terrapin. One of the slider breeds, probably a Yellow Belly.

How long will it survive in Irish waters?

Impossible to know. A healthy animal might survive the winter here, but if its previous owner was so careless to abandon it in the Tolka, I can't imagine it was given proper care.

Based on some of the other threads there's a few knocking around. Do they breed?[/QUOTE]

I doubt they would breed in the wild in Ireland as it never gets warm enough here. I'd say its more likely people in the area dumping them when they get too large.

I assume is is a pet that was abandoned (escape is unlikely, right )

Escape is possible. They are a lot more agile than you might think, and they can move when they want to. Maybe someone put it out on the lawn on a sunny day and it ran away. Still, though, abandonment is more likely.

magicbastarder

i know of a garden centre (not going to say where) who have a decent pond; they have at least three, and i think four, turtles/terrapins in the pond, only one of which were they asked about before it was put in; the others were obviously brought in surreptitiously and abandoned there.

Kamili

Colin Stafford Johnson had a short mention in one of his Living the Wildlife pieces about them being abandoned on the Dodder years ago too. They can't breed but apparently are surviving ok.

Half-cocked

I've seen them in ponds in St Annes Pk and the Phoenix Pk too. The Phoenix Pk ones have survived quite a few years. They've been reported in the canals as well.

Keplar240B

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oijEsqT2QKQ

No. I'm, I'm simply saying that life, uh... finds a way.

syklops

Terrapins generally live to be 16-30 years old. Tortoises much longer. Charles Darwin brought a tortoise named Harriet back from the Galapagos Islands in 1830. Sadly Harriet died in 2006 when she was 186.

I read a book on terrapins years ago, around the time I got one and it said "Every large pond in the Uk has a resident terrapin that has been abandoned.".

Unfortunately its a common problem, terrapins being abandoned. Similar to puppies and kittens being abandoned I suppose.

Where did you see the terrapin? If I saw it and I thought it was in danger I'd rescue it.

i71jskz5xu42pb

syklops wrote: »

Where did you see the terrapin? If I saw it and I thought it was in danger I'd rescue it.

Griffith Park, Drumcondra, in the river, under the most downstream bridge. I passed through there yesterday and no sign of it.

Looked happy enough when I was there. Well as happy as a Terrapin can look.

Interslice

Nayeli Warm Fool wrote: »

Spotted this lad in the Tolka this morning (Drumcondra). Anyone know what breed? I assume is is a pet that was abandoned (escape is unlikely, right )

How long will it survive in Irish waters? Based on some of the other threads there's a few knocking around. Do they breed?

Thats a yellow belly slider turtle. Not known to breed here sucessfully due to the climate... They are regularly released it seems judging by the number of sightings every year. A major problem as an invasive in Spain, originally introduced from america. They are bought as small cute pets but they get big and smelly and the animal loving owners, rather than killing them and throwing them in the bin, release them into the wild to feed on indigenous animals..

peter1892

I spotted this one at the Ordnance Survey pond in Phoenix Park today:



I saw a tv programme about wildlife in London a few years back and there are loads of them living in ponds, rivers & canals over there that are a result of a craze for them around the time of the 'Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles'. Quite a few were abandoned but thrived in the wild (no natural predators).

recedite

Great photo^^

I saw a similar one basking on a log at the edge of the pond in Stephens Green about 2 years ago. Couldn't get a decent photo though, you would need a good zoom lens I think.

magicbastarder

there are some sizable pike in the pond in stephens green too.

Half-cocked

magicbastarder wrote: »

there are some sizable pike in the pond in stephens green too.

There are indeed, saw 2 of them spawning in the shallows a few years back. Apparently there are pipes connecting the Stephens Green pond to the canal and fish can travel between them (can anyone confirm this? It's about 800 metres distance)

ScumLord

I wonder how they're mixing with the life in the rivers here. They're pretty aggressive feeders. They're quite tough and can hibernate through the winter.

magicbastarder

Half-cocked wrote: »

There are indeed, saw 2 of them spawning in the shallows a few years back. Apparently there are pipes connecting the Stephens Green pond to the canal and fish can travel between them (can anyone confirm this? It's about 800 metres distance)

a friend was told by a ranger that the water in the pond is stocked from the canals - the stocking method was not mentioned, or at least my friend didn't say if it was.

Half-cocked

ScumLord wrote: »

I wonder how they're mixing with the life in the rivers here. They're pretty aggressive feeders. They're quite tough and can hibernate through the winter.

A BWI member I know reckons they are responsible for eating a lot of the Little Grebe chicks in the Phoenix Park ponds.

magicbastarder

that was why my friend struck up a conversation with the ranger in stephen's green; was asking if the chicks were being taken by the pike. the ranger blamed (you guessed it) seagulls.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

magicbastarder wrote: »

that was why my friend struck up a conversation with the ranger in stephen's green; was asking if the chicks were being taken by the pike. the ranger blamed (you guessed it) seagulls.

In fairness Herring Gulls do take many chicks and have readily been observed doing so.

recedite

Half-cocked wrote: »

There are indeed, saw 2 of them spawning in the shallows a few years back. Apparently there are pipes connecting the Stephens Green pond to the canal and fish can travel between them (can anyone confirm this? It's about 800 metres distance)

Interesting. It makes sense though, considering the pond is up on a height relative to Grafton Street, yet it never dries out.

syklops

magicbastarder wrote: »

that was why my friend struck up a conversation with the ranger in stephen's green; was asking if the chicks were being taken by the pike. the ranger blamed (you guessed it) seagulls.

A friend of mine put a video up on facebook of a seagull devouring a nest of small birds on the balcony of his office. Not a pleasant video to watch, no idea why he chose facebook to do upload it to, but if anyone was ever in doubt that gulls take chicks they should see that video.

syklops

ScumLord wrote: »

I wonder how they're mixing with the life in the rivers here. They're pretty aggressive feeders. They're quite tough and can hibernate through the winter.

To be fair to them both their level of activity and their metabolism is tied to the ambient temperature. I'd imagine it only gets warm enough in Ireland a couple of weeks a year for them to get active enough to affect any other life.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

syklops wrote: »

To be fair to them both their level of activity and their metabolism is tied to the ambient temperature. I'd imagine it only gets warm enough in Ireland a couple of weeks a year for them to get active enough to affect any other life.

In fairness, they are an alien species and do have an impact on native wildlife. They survive here and therefore feed sufficiently. They take small fish, crustaceans, insects, water snails etc; all in competition with native species.

syklops

Jackson Obedient Fang wrote: »

In fairness, they are an alien species and do have an impact on native wildlife. They survive here and therefore feed sufficiently. They take small fish, crustaceans, insects, water snails etc; all in competition with native species.

I appreciate that but I'd imagine a couple of hungry gulls would have the same or greater impact than all the terrapins put together. Even an active adult terrapin doesnt eat a whole lot.

the boss of me

This fella lives in the Botanic gardens not too far from the one in the ops picture.

Gazzmonkey

magicbastarder wrote: »

was asking if the chicks were being taken by the pike. the ranger blamed (you guessed it) seagulls.

Seagulls are bad bastards..

I saw one snatch a rabbit a few years ago, would never have believed it if I hadn't seen it myself.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

syklops wrote: »

I appreciate that but I'd imagine a couple of hungry gulls would have the same or greater impact than all the terrapins put together. Even an active adult terrapin doesnt eat a whole lot.

Denuded areas of sub aquatic life has a greater impact than taking eggs or chicks. Gull predation in part of the ecosystem here. Terrapins eating water snails, crayfish, caddisfly larvae etc upsets the balance.

Interslice

the boss of me wrote: »

This fella lives in the Botanic gardens not too far from the one in the ops picture.

Looks like a yellow belly slider. Here's a bit of a key.

http://ec.europa.eu/environment/life/project/Projects/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.showFile&rep=file&fil=TRACHEMYS_Triptico_galapagos_exoticos_ingles_EN.pdf

syklops

Jackson Obedient Fang wrote: »

Denuded areas of sub aquatic life has a greater impact than taking eggs or chicks. Gull predation in part of the ecosystem here. Terrapins eating water snails, crayfish, caddisfly larvae etc upsets the balance.

Again, Im not denying they have an impact, I'm saying that impact is relatively small. Terrapins dont eat when they are cold. Thats most of the time in Ireland. Even when they are eating, its really not a lot.

I'd disagree that gull predation is part of the eco-system when you take into account the huge numbers of gulls in existence currently.

Yes of course a non-native species has an environmental impact on the eco-system. No-one is arguing otherwise. The direct effect in my opinion is relatively small. I'd be far more concerned about indirect effects, such as the introduction of foreign parasites.

Interslice

syklops wrote: »

Again, Im not denying they have an impact, I'm saying that impact is relatively small. Terrapins dont eat when they are cold. Thats most of the time in Ireland. Even when they are eating, its really not a lot.

I'd disagree that gull predation is part of the eco-system when you take into account the huge numbers of gulls in existence currently.

Yes of course a non-native species has an environmental impact on the eco-system. No-one is arguing otherwise. The direct effect in my opinion is relatively small. I'd be far more concerned about indirect effects, such as the introduction of foreign parasites.

The only major problem I see is if you continue releasing enough of them will two of them eventually breed successfully. Unlikely but I still think they should all be shot or caught or whatever when reported, for both this reason and that they impact the local ecosystem. However significant that impact iss just speculation. What if they get a taste for pearl mussels or salmon eggs or something else that is already endangered. They might not eat a large biomass but in a sensitive environment it could be devastating.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

syklops wrote: »

Again, Im not denying they have an impact, I'm saying that impact is relatively small. Terrapins dont eat when they are cold. Thats most of the time in Ireland. Even when they are eating, its really not a lot.

I'd disagree that gull predation is part of the eco-system when you take into account the huge numbers of gulls in existence currently.

Yes of course a non-native species has an environmental impact on the eco-system. No-one is arguing otherwise. The direct effect in my opinion is relatively small. I'd be far more concerned about indirect effects, such as the introduction of foreign parasites.

I'm afraid surveys of rivers affected contradict your opinion.

Interslice wrote: »

The only major problem I see is if you continue releasing enough of them will two of them eventually breed successfully. Unlikely but I still think they should all be shot or caught or whatever when reported, for both this reason and that they impact the local ecosystem. However significant that impact iss just speculation. What if they get a taste for pearl mussels or salmon eggs or something else that is already endangered. They might not eat a large biomass but in a sensitive environment it could be devastating.

Breeding is highly unlikely that's to our climate... thank goodness. Just hope we don't have a prolonged heatwave some year followed by an exceptionally mild winter though.

syklops

Jackson Obedient Fang wrote: »

I'm afraid surveys of rivers affected contradict your opinion.

Do you have a source for these surveys?