Nice - Bastille day **mod warning post 1**

Billy86

Some info coming out about the perpetrator today.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/who-mohamed-lahouaiej-bouhlel-what-8425647

The alleged killer was described as drug-taking wife beater who never went to Mosque by one of his relatives.

His wife’s cousin claims he was an “unlikely jihadist” who drank and ate pork,

Walid Hamou told the Mail he was “not a Muslim, he was a s***” and was a “nasty piece of work”.

He said: “Bouhlel was not religious - he did not go to the mosque, he did not pray, he did not observe Ramadan.

“He drank alcohol, ate pork and took drugs. This is all forbidden under Islam.

“He was not a Muslim, he was a s***.

“He beat his wife, my cousin, he was a nasty piece of work.”

AlekSmart

end of the road wrote: »

No they aren't. they are Islamophobic because they are bigoted towards anyone and everything that isn't the same as them.

Well considering some of them are all ready home, that would be hard.

Not always quite as clear cut as you might think though.....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/15/please-stop-staying-the-nice-attacks-arent-about-islam/

In the wake of the Nice attacks people are already saying: "But the terrorist wasn't pious. See! It has nothing to do with Islam."

Please stop.

Your good intentions towards us Muslims are only making the problem worse. This is as dangerous as saying it is everything to do with Islam.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/15/how-religion-can-drive-someone-slaughter-his-fellow-citizens--an/

Nice terror attack: Truck driver who killed 84 named as 'loner' French-Tunisian criminal who 'became depressed' when wife left him as police question estranged spouse

A disturbed nut-case,who just happens to be an Islamic nut Case,no more-no less ?

Jimmy Garlic

_oveless_ wrote: »

thankfully the Prime Minister of France is more forward thinking and tolerant:

https://heatst.com/uk/nice-attack-french-prime-minister-says-learn-to-live-with-terrorism-after-84-die/

Yes, he wants to tolerate even more gruesome murder sprees perpetrated by dark age barbarians. Is that what passes for "forward thinking" these days

wakka12

I don't know why that would be made up. Also I would imagine most of the 'torture' was committed post mortem, would want to get the body count up with quick fatal gunshots before spending time gouging out eyeballs.

skywanderer

Nice to see the Liberals try do everything to avoid linking this to Islam just like the Orlando Massacre also. Next thing they will be telling us that the sky is pink or something.

failinis

dav3 wrote: »

It's being reported by whom? Are you believing all the sh*te you read on the internet again?

If you honestly believe we're at war I'll pay for your flight to the frontline tomorrow.

I did see articles on this earlier,

https://heatst.com/uk/exclusive-france-suppressed-news-of-gruesome-torture-at-bataclan-massacre/

http://nypost.com/2016/07/15/horrifying-details-of-the-bataclan-theatre-massacre-revealed/

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jul/15/french-terror-cover-up-bataclan-attack-included-gr/

EDIT - seems to be false rumours picked up by papers via Snopes.

dav3

You can PM with proof that you'll have someone to meet you in Damascus to take you to the front line and I'll book your one-way ticket straight away.
The flight goes through Istanbul so you'll probably have to wait a few days. At least it gives you some time to say goodbye to your family.
The offer is open to all the other internet hard men out there too.

Samaris

http://www.snopes.com/france-covered-up-bataclan-victims/

Not finished reading it yet, but it looks like this wasn't true.

failinis

Samaris wrote: »

http://www.snopes.com/france-covered-up-bataclan-victims/

Not finished reading it yet, but it looks like this wasn't true.

Fair enough.

getzls

dav3 wrote: »

If you honestly believe we're at war I'll pay for your flight to the frontline tomorrow.

Islam has been at war with non muslims since its inception.

getzls

Any Mosque's lit up in the French colours yet?

Strumms

You'd want to be pretty gullible to be taken in by that. Considering there were no eyewitness reports of anything like that happening and the number of people who were in the venue.

Junkyard Tom

Does it really matter what level of commitment to Islam the fucker had?

Stigura

_oveless_ wrote: »

europe needs to realize that this is the new normal, we need to accept that large groups of people will be killed on a more regular basis from now on and just get on with it as a part of life. the real fight is against islamaphobia and people who question immigration and security policies. we need to be even more tolerant from now on because even though these people are not representing islam if we further upset muslims they will kill us and it will be our own fault.

Now; I actually 'Liked' that post. I came in here at eighty odd posts ~ can't be bothered to wade through the trench warfare that AH becomes, every time this sort of schit kicks off. Saw that. 'Liked' it. Because I thought; " Yeah! LOL! Enough Iron there to break a weigh bridge! My sort of humour! "That's right. Right? Or is the OP FUBAR?!?

jackofalltrades

Billy86 wrote: »

Sorry what? You're trying to say I 'ignored' your post by replying to it?

Try to be even just a little less disingenuous in future. Just a little.

No I'm not saying you ignored my post, I'm saying you're ignoring reality.
Toronto has had and will possible have an issue with Islamic extremism.
Stop trying to act like it hasn't had issues.

jackofalltrades

Shenshen wrote: »

There IS nothing wrong with religion...

What??? First you claim that Islam in new to terrorism and now this.
There are loads of things wrong with religion.
They exploit vulnerable people, they prey on our basest fears.
They promise things that they can't honestly deliver.
They promise an afterlife, which allows their followers to sacrifice their lives in the knowledge that they will have another.
No there is everything wrong with religion, and it deserves to be challenged.
Not even far-right racist ideologies can offer what some religions can.

... we need to figure out how to address how a religion can become vulnerable to such abuse.

Religion is vulnerable to abuse.
You're aware of some of the things Abrahamic religions promote right?

BlaasForRafa

skywanderer wrote: »

Nice to see the Liberals try do everything to avoid linking this to Islam just like the Orlando Massacre also. Next thing they will be telling us that the sky is pink or something.

red sky at night, islamists delight

Billy86

jackofalltrades wrote: »

No I'm not saying you ignored my post, I'm saying you're ignoring reality.
Toronto has had and will possible have an issue with Islamic extremism.
Stop trying to act like it hasn't had issues.

The reality here is that I already replied to the post you linked to, and you never got back to me on it. Ignoring my response does not mean my response didn't happen, so do me a favour and stop ignoring the reality that you failed to respond in the first place.

Have you ever actually been to Toronto? You should come here and let all the locals know that there is a problem, to be afraid, to get paranoid and to alienate Muslims or whatever it is that you want. See how far it gets you.

I'm assuming you also think the UK has a white supremacist terrorist problem, by the way?

long range shooter

Too Tired wrote: »

Our fault for not being tolerant enough.

Not our fault,politicians fault,they invited them here.

long range shooter

SPDUB wrote: »

Of course if they were atheists they wouldn't be committing attacks in the name of ISIS but the Tamil Tigers in Sri Lanka showed you can have suicide attacks that are not in the name of religion

Atleast the Tamil tigers are doing something about it,not like here in Europe where politicians sends their prayers and feels sorry for the victims,and a month later its all forgotten and life goes on like nothing happened.

The_Kew_Tour

What I have to laugh at this morning is that people have links to rag papers, but when me and others link far more credible sources and videos, then it's BS

just gave me chuckle.

long range shooter

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

What I have to laugh at this morning is that people have links to rag papers, but when me and others link far more credible sources and videos, then it's BS

just gave me chuckle.[/QUOTE

Sometimes newspapers are not politically correct enough

The_Kew_Tour

long range shooter wrote: »

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

What I have to laugh at this morning is that people have links to rag papers, but when me and others link far more credible sources and videos, then it's BS

just gave me chuckle.[/QUOTE

Sometimes newspapers are not politically correct enough

The tabloids are.

First for Breaking news!!!

long range shooter

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

long range shooter wrote: »

The tabloids are.

First for Breaking news!!!

That depends on what side you are in politically.:D

DEFTLEFTHAND

Shield already posted a vid from Dave Rubin but here is another. This is a good one to watch for those who might not fully understand the difference between Judaism, Christianity and Islam.

I should note beforehand that Rubin is a left wing media journalist, he previously worked with the Young Turks. Watch if you can spare the time, you might just learn something

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czBiWm3ljv0

Billy86

long range shooter wrote: »

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

What I have to laugh at this morning is that people have links to rag papers, but when me and others link far more credible sources and videos, then it's BS

just gave me chuckle.[/QUOTE

Sometimes newspapers are not politically correct enough

twinytwo

end of the road wrote: »

"World is too PC"

translates as "the world isn't racist and bigoted enough for my liking"

Well if wanting to look after and put my own people first makes me racist and bigoted then i guess i am......

A Dub in Glasgo

Strumms wrote: »

You'd want to be pretty gullible to be taken in by that. Considering there were no eyewitness reports of anything like that happening and the number of people who were in the venue.

I would guess that a lot of the folk taken in my this wanted to believe it therefore kept repeating it as fact

Fleawuss

dav3 wrote: »

You can PM with proof that you'll have someone to meet you in Damascus to take you to the front line and I'll book your one-way ticket straight away.
The flight goes through Istanbul so you'll probably have to wait a few days. At least it gives you some time to say goodbye to your family.
The offer is open to all the other internet hard men out there too.

Damascus? Save yourself a lot of money: London, Brussels, Paris. Maybe even Nice. If you're going to make internet boasts about what you would do at least you might consider if by making such an offer you are just bull****ting as bad as others.

dav3

Fleawuss wrote: »

Damascus? Save yourself a lot of money: London, Brussels, Paris. Maybe even Nice. If you're going to make internet boasts about what you would do at least you might consider if by making such an offer you are just bull****ting as bad as others.

No, I'm actually serious. I can't pay for all the racists, bigots and xenophobes that pollute threads like this after an attack, but I'll get as many over there as I can.

Let me guess, you believe there's a war going on in those countries right now. I don't know how you manage to get out of bed every morning, you must be gripped with fear with all these wars raging around you.

CMOTDibbler

So apparently IS are claiming responsibility.

Reported in Le Monde as coming from IS controlled news agency.

Shenshen

jackofalltrades wrote: »

What??? First you claim that Islam in new to terrorism and now this.
There are loads of things wrong with religion.
They exploit vulnerable people, they prey on our basest fears.
They promise things that they can't honestly deliver.
They promise an afterlife, which allows their followers to sacrifice their lives in the knowledge that they will have another.
No there is everything wrong with religion, and it deserves to be challenged.
Not even far-right racist ideologies can offer what some religions can.


Religion is vulnerable to abuse.
You're aware of some of the things Abrahamic religions promote right?

I am - a lot more than some in this thread, I'm starting to think.
But all religions share the issues you raised. Every last single one. Yet Christianity doesn't embrace terrorism and (for the most part) violence any more, while others do. And interestingly, during the time Christianty was at its most violent, other religions didn't have issues with terror and bloodshed from within their ranks.
Add to that that while a lot of terrorism in the past and today cloaked itself in religion, a lot of terrorism didn't and doesn't. The excuse for terrorism can be anything - from black civil rights to nationalism, from women's rights to any given religion. And at any given time any one of these issues will draw more supporters with a willingness to kill. Right now, that's Islam. In 20 years? Who knows what it'll be.

So the question now is do we want to try and find a solution to end terrorism - in which case just staring transfixedly at a particular religion is probably not going to give us any new ideas or help us along in any way, or do we just want to hate people following a religion we don't?

KindOfIrish

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

So apparently IS are claiming responsibility.

Reported in Le Monde as coming from IS controlled news agency.

IS would be idiots not to. Actually they didn't claim responsibility, they said that it's been done by one of their followers.

CMOTDibbler

KindOfIrish wrote: »

IS would be idiots not to. Actually they didn't claim responsibility, they said that it's been done by one of their followers.

They don't have a history of claiming responsibility when they aren't. "One of our soldiers who responded to calls to target citizens of the coalition that fights IS" is a reasonably strong statement of responsibility.

Fleawuss

dav3 wrote: »

No, I'm actually serious. I can't pay for all the racists, bigots and xenophobes that pollute threads like this after an attack, but I'll get as many over there as I can.

Let me guess, you believe there's a war going on in those countries right now. I don't know how you manage to get out of bed every morning, you must be gripped with fear with all these wars raging around you.

No you won't. It's just bs. Please consider your position if you are publicly offering to finance people to go and fight abroad. In great charity to you, it's bs and you should let it drop.

There is a war going on between the values of the western world and Islamic extremism. It's an intellectual war between those who believe in the primacy of human reason and those who believe in the primacy of "revelation" by "God" to a man called Mohammed. It has become a shooting war on the streets of Western Europe.

I am not gripped by fear, merely prudence. I haven't travelled to any state with an Islamic government since the mid 1980's. I haven't travelled to France since the early 2000's. In NYC and London I avoid all public transport. There are going to be more attacks and it is reasonable to avoid likely areas and manage risk when you have to go.

weisses

Fleawuss wrote: »

There is a war going on between the values of the western world and Islamic extremism.

Don't forget that the Mainstream Muslims suffer more from Islamic extremism then people in the western world, a point conveniently looked over in threads like this.

Fleawuss

weisses wrote: »

Don't forget that the Mainstream Muslims suffer more from Islamic extremism then people in the western world, a point conveniently looked over in threads like this.

It is equally overlooked that conflict within Islam is sectarian: it is based on conflicting interpretations of the same "revelation" and the succession to the "prophet".

The wars within Islam aren't overlooked in threads like this: they are thankfully irrelevant as those wars are fought elsewhere.

weisses

Fleawuss wrote: »

It is equally overlooked that conflict within Islam is sectarian: it is based on conflicting interpretations of the same "revelation" and the succession to the "prophet".

The wars within Islam aren't overlooked in threads like this: they are thankfully irrelevant as those wars are fought elsewhere.

Equally overlooked ?? Don't think so ... To many "all Muslims are bad" comments here

So IS is not a thread to Europe ?

There is a war going on between the values of the western world and Islamic extremism.

What war is going on here then?

CMOTDibbler

Fleawuss wrote: »

It is equally overlooked that conflict within Islam is sectarian: it is based on conflicting interpretations of the same "revelation" and the succession to the "prophet".

The wars within Islam aren't overlooked in threads like this: they are thankfully irrelevant as those wars are fought elsewhere.

Isn't it one of those 'irrelevant' wars that formed the basis for IS?

The_Kew_Tour

dav3 wrote: »

Fleawuss wrote: »

Damascus? Save yourself a lot of money: London, Brussels, Paris. Maybe even Nice. If you're going to make internet boasts about what you would do at least you might consider if by making such an offer you are just bull****ting as bad as others.

No, I'm actually serious. I can't pay for all the racists, bigots and xenophobes that pollute threads like this after an attack, but I'll get as many over there as I can.

Let me guess, you believe there's a war going on in those countries right now. I don't know how you manage to get out of bed every morning, you must be gripped with fear with all these wars raging around you.

Was there once for a short stint, im curious as to what you saw when there?

The_Kew_Tour

dav3 wrote: »

Fleawuss wrote: »

Damascus? Save yourself a lot of money: London, Brussels, Paris. Maybe even Nice. If you're going to make internet boasts about what you would do at least you might consider if by making such an offer you are just bull****ting as bad as others.

No, I'm actually serious. I can't pay for all the racists, bigots and xenophobes that pollute threads like this after an attack, but I'll get as many over there as I can.

Let me guess, you believe there's a war going on in those countries right now. I don't know how you manage to get out of bed every morning, you must be gripped with fear with all these wars raging around you.

Was there once for a short stint, im curious as to what you saw when there?

Fleawuss

weisses wrote: »

Equally overlooked ?? Don't think so ... To many "all Muslims are bad" comments here

So IS is not a thread to Europe ?



What war is going on here then?

The wars between Islamic sects are being fought in areas under their control. Europe isn't.

Fleawuss

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Isn't it one of those 'irrelevant' wars that formed the basis for IS?

The wars between Islamic sects have been fought since after the death of Mohammed.

What is happening in Europe isn't rooted in Mislems killing Moslems over who would succeed Mohammed and what is the correct interpretation of the Hadith.

CMOTDibbler

Fleawuss wrote: »

The wars between Islamic sects have been fought since after the death of Mohammed.

What is happening in Europe isn't rooted in Mislems killing Moslems over who would succeed Mohammed and what is the correct interpretation of the Hadith.

You're quite correct, but I didn't say it was.

Fleawuss

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

You're quite correct, but I didn't say it was.

I didn't say that you said it was.

weisses

Fleawuss wrote: »

The wars between Islamic sects are being fought in areas under their control. Europe isn't.

What is the goal of Al Queada and IS in regards to Europe?

Fleawuss

weisses wrote: »

What is the goal of Al Queada and IS in regards to Europe?

I'm sure you know already. You could fly there and ask them. There's a poster promising flights to Damascus for one group of posters. He might fit you in.

lawlolawl

5 people arrested in connection to the incident and IS claiming responsibility.

Guess that's the "lone nutter" theory out the window.

The_Kew_Tour

lawlolawl wrote: »

5 people arrested in connection to the incident and IS claiming responsibility.

Guess that's the "lone nutter" theory out the window.

Do they eat Pork though? Cause that's the most important question

selastich2

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Do they eat Pork though? Cause that's the most important question

How's their relationships? Any tiffs with the wives recently over the washing up?