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Wada commissioned McLaren report into Antdoping in Russis

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  • 18-07-2016 2:29pm
    #1
    RobFowl
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,667 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    Russian sport is toast.....

    https://www.wada-ama.org/en/media/news/2016-07/wada-publishes-independent-mclaren-investigations-report

    Key Findings
    1. The Moscow Laboratory operated, for the protection of doped Russian
    athletes, within a State-dictated failsafe system, described in the report as
    the Disappearing Positive Methodology.
    2. The Sochi Laboratory operated a unique sample swapping methodology
    to enable doped Russian athletes to compete at the Games.
    3. The Ministry of Sport directed, controlled and oversaw the manipulation
    of athlete’s analytical results or sample swapping, with the active
    participation and assistance of the FSB, CSP, and both Moscow and Sochi
    Laboratories


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    #2
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,311 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    I'm shocked, stunned and not a little amazed?


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    #3
    RobFowl
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,667 Mod ✭✭✭✭RobFowl


    endacl wrote: »
    I'm shocked, stunned and not a little amazed?

    I'm shocked the report is so damning, was expecting a slap on the wrist/could do better one....


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    #4
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 30,573 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    It's Russia... same as the USSR, same as East Germany, same as Caucescu Romania ... if there is any way they will give their athletes an edge, without regard to the damage that will do the athlete or the sport in question, they will grab it with both hands, whether that is doping, corruption, bribery, intimidation whatever.

    The only surprising thing about it is that an official body is finally taking off its blinkers to call a spade a spade.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #5
    terrydel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,881 ✭✭✭terrydel


    The response from Pat Hickey is just fecking unreal, it really would make you despair!
    http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/other-sports/pat-hickey-slams-report-calling-for-outright-russian-olympic-ban-1.2725073

    Totally ignores the actual findings and focuses in on the fact that the info got out a day before it was due. Christ almighty!


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    #6
    fishfoodie
    Registered Users Posts: 564 ✭✭✭fishfoodie


    odyssey06 wrote: »
    It's Russia... same as the USSR, same as East Germany, same as Caucescu Romania ... if there is any way they will give their athletes an edge, without regard to the damage that will do the athlete or the sport in question, they will grab it with both hands, whether that is doping, corruption, bribery, intimidation whatever.

    The only surprising thing about it is that an official body is finally taking off its blinkers to call a spade a spade.

    You left out, Jamaica, Kenya, Ethopia, Turkey, China, India, & the good olde U.S. Of A, & many, many, others !


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    #7
    NiallBoo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭NiallBoo


    terrydel wrote: »
    The response from Pat Hickey is just fecking unreal, it really would make you despair!
    http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/other-sports/pat-hickey-slams-report-calling-for-outright-russian-olympic-ban-1.2725073

    Totally ignores the actual findings and focuses in on the fact that the info got out a day before it was due. Christ almighty!
    A few minor good points but he's really missing the big picture and would have been much better off keeping quiet.

    They're just trying to hurry things along so that they can get qualification spots reassigned before Rio - hardy surprising this close to the date.

    Pat might change his tune if any Irish athletes get qualified on the back of this.


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    #8
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,477 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    A minimum 643 "Disappearing Positive Test Results" between 2012 and 2015. 139 Athletics, 117 Weightlifting, 37 Non Olympic sports, 35 Paralympic Sport....

    Cycling is lagging behind with "only" 26!!


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    #9
    Darkglasses
    Registered Users Posts: 14,526 ✭✭✭✭Darkglasses


    Beasty wrote: »
    A minimum 643 "Disappearing Positive Test Results" between 2012 and 2015. 139 Athletics, 117 Weightlifting, 37 Non Olympic sports, 35 Paralympic Sport....

    Cycling is lagging behind with "only" 26!!

    Damn, we need to up our game.


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    #10
    manwithaplan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,200 ✭✭✭manwithaplan


    fishfoodie wrote: »
    You left out, Jamaica, Kenya, Ethopia, Turkey, China, India, & the good olde U.S. Of A, & many, many, others !

    There are a couple of state sponsored doping programmes in there but mostly it was the work of privateers - individual training groups etc. The authorities certainly didn't cover themselves in glory in tackling it but it's a bit different to full on state sponsored or state sanctioned doping.

    An interesting point is the extent to which outright bans of athletes from particular nations will be used as a weapon in the future. It is certainly an appropriate response when the state is behind doping - will we also see it used more widely to ensure that states' anti-doping programmes become more effective? To some extent this is what the IAAF have already done in athletics.
    The difficulty is that clean athletes from countries with ineffective anti-doping programmes potentially suffer and may take action. I don't know enough about the institutional and legal framework for imposing country's responsibilities for anti-doping to know if those actions would be likely to succeed. The idea of allowing athletes voluntarily submit themselves to testing by accredited structures outside of their national arrangements is an attractive short term fix but seems like a mess as a longer term approach.


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    #11
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    fishfoodie wrote: »
    odyssey06 wrote: »
    It's Russia... same as the USSR, same as East Germany, same as Caucescu Romania ... if there is any way they will give their athletes an edge, without regard to the damage that will do the athlete or the sport in question, they will grab it with both hands, whether that is doping, corruption, bribery, intimidation whatever.

    The only surprising thing about it is that an official body is finally taking off its blinkers to call a spade a spade.

    You left out, Jamaica, Kenya, Ethopia, Turkey, China, India, & the good olde U.S. Of A, & many, many, others !


    Agree. "They're all doping." I mean, if Maria Sharapova fancies a bit of heart medicine to up her game, who isn't doping. Finnish Cross Country skiers were banned for doping with a very dangerous blood expander, i said the FINNISH CROSS COUNTRY SKIERS.


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    #12
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,477 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    It would appear to me that clean athletes from states like Russia are probably better off with action like this as their chances of ever making it within a regime like that look pretty low.


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    #13
    NiallBoo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭NiallBoo


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Finnish Cross Country skiers were banned for doping with a very dangerous blood expander, i said the FINNISH CROSS COUNTRY SKIERS.

    Maybe I'm wrong, but isn't this something that's done to mask (and/or reduce the health risks of) EPO use?


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    #14
    Esroh
    Registered Users Posts: 1,508 ✭✭✭Esroh


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Agree. "They're all doping." I mean, if Maria Sharapova fancies a bit of heart medicine to up her game, who isn't doping. Finnish Cross Country skiers were banned for doping with a very dangerous blood expander, i said the FINNISH CROSS COUNTRY SKIERS.

    The Finnish were blood doping prior to Munich and Montreal in the 70s.


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    #15
    happytramp
    Registered Users Posts: 2,622 ✭✭✭happytramp


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Finnish Cross Country skiers were banned for doping with a very dangerous blood expander, i said the FINNISH CROSS COUNTRY SKIERS.

    It's absolutely huge in Finland. Like the 'GAA' here. Nearly everyone in Finland skies and it's still used as a mode of transport there. They were at the forefront of EPO use as well and started using it well before the pro peloton.


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    #16
    RobFowl
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,667 Mod ✭✭✭✭RobFowl


    Esroh wrote: »
    The Finnish were blood doping prior to Munich and Montreal in the 70s.

    It was actually legal up til after the 1984 Olympics when the USA team used it extensively to great effect esp in the cycling events


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    #17
    NiallBoo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭NiallBoo


    RobFowl wrote: »
    It was actually legal up til after the 1984 Olympics when the USA team used it extensively to great effect esp in the cycling events

    Is it not that it was illegal to use performance enhancing substances at the time but that many PEDs weren't specifically listed and was no way of testing for them. Meaning that there was no way of getting caught (unless you admitted to it) and no real incentive not to do it.

    I.e. they were technically illegal, but not really in practice...and most didn't bother worrying about the difference.


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    #18
    RobFowl
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,667 Mod ✭✭✭✭RobFowl


    NiallBoo wrote: »
    Is it not that it was illegal to use performance enhancing substances at the time but that many PEDs weren't specifically listed and was no way of testing for them. Meaning that there was no way of getting caught (unless you admitted to it) and no real incentive not to do it.

    I.e. they were technically illegal, but not really in practice...and most didn't bother worrying about the difference.

    No, I was specifically saying blood doping via transfusion was only banned after 1984.


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    #19
    Andalucia
    Registered Users Posts: 553 ✭✭✭Andalucia


    the response from Pat Hickey prior to publication of report signifies how deep the problem is and how far the omerta extends to as regards what these administrations will do to cover up the issue

    I mean a State sponsored doping programme in Russia still isn't enough to ensure they are table toppers - they should have just thrown money at it like other countries


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    #20
    fishfoodie
    Registered Users Posts: 564 ✭✭✭fishfoodie


    Andalucia wrote: »
    the response from Pat Hickey prior to publication of report signifies how deep the problem is and how far the omerta extends to as regards what these administrations will do to cover up the issue

    I mean a State sponsored doping programme in Russia still isn't enough to ensure they are table toppers - they should have just thrown money at it like other countries

    Sadly, there is an alternative reason why the State Sponsored Dopers from Russia might have failed to win their events :mad::mad::mad:


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