Forever tenants

Graham

fits wrote: »

As someone who has worked hard and saved hard all my live and finding it difficult to get a mortgage, I really find it infuriating that people can simply put it down to poor decision making. I really do.

The article wasn't about you.

It was about a young single mother who appears to have done fairly well to keep a roof over her head (struggling like most single mothers) and a man in his 50s who one can only assume prioritised renting in Rathgar rather than buying somewhere more affordable.

There's nothing in the article to suggest the cause of your infuriation applies to either party.

intheclouds

fits wrote: »

As someone who has worked hard and saved hard all my live and finding it difficult to get a mortgage, I really find it infuriating that people can simply put it down to poor decision making. I really do.

Well Im sorry if it shakes your world view but I really dont believe that life is monopoly. There are certainly some external elements to consider but you make your own luck to a large degree.

There are people who are given a big deposit by their parents, people who receive large inheritances, people who lose investments, people who end up needing expensive medical things, etc.....

But the average person can make a better future for themselves by making good decisions for that future as they go.

You cant just throw your hands up and say "poor me" 10 years later (like the Rathgar guy) - you have to think about the choices you make and how they will affect you later.

Speedwell

I'm 50 this year. Two years and a bit ago, I moved here to be with my Irish husband. As a single man who was perfectly happy caring for his disabled mother with plenty of other family nearby, he had never needed or wanted to buy a house of his own. I came from America, where it never made sense to me to do anything but rent (there's a lot to be said for the freedom to relocate with your job, not having to pay for routine and non-routine home maintenance, living in a cool city high-rise in a trendy neighborhood, etc.). We rent here in south Sligo for what I consider to be a modest rental rate that matches my modest income from work. From working for the deep-pocketed oil industry before being caught in a round of "staff reductions", I have almost enough savings in a retirement account to buy the "average" home in Sligo outright... but it's my retirement! I'm certainly not about to buy property here until I am a citizen.

If I'm to be told now that the bank will turn me down for a mortgage because of my age, regardless of my other assets and income, I'm probably going to tell them what part of my anatomy they can kiss.

beauf

For me, the article is mainly about the affordability of renting. Which has the knock on effect of the ability to save for future provision.

The paper has made it about buying a place, via the headline. As they knew people would fixate on that. Job done.

intheclouds

Speedwell wrote: »

If I'm to be told now that the bank will turn me down for a mortgage because of my age, regardless of my other assets and income, I'm probably going to tell them what part of my anatomy they can kiss.

They wont turn you down because of your age. But obviously the time frame you have left to pay off a mortgage will be taken into the calculations (as will your other assets and income).

You can get a 15 year mortgage at 50. That might be enough depending on how much you want to borrow/ability to repay.

Speedwell

intheclouds wrote: »

They wont turn you down because of your age. But obviously the time frame you have left to pay off a mortgage will be taken into the calculations (as will your other assets and income).

You can get a 15 year mortgage at 50. That might be enough depending on how much you want to borrow/ability to repay.

Oh, well, that's good news. I'll find some other good reason to snark off at the bank then

intheclouds

Speedwell wrote: »

Oh, well, that's good news. I'll find some other good reason to snark off at the bank then

Although I have noticed that although they (the government) want you to work til youre 68, the banks are still stuck on 65 as the cut off age for mortgage repayments.

Idbatterim

Back to square one. Why aren't these idiots permitting cheaper builds, where people actually want to live? Very few of us can have it all, that's obvious. You have to make sacrifices. Why can't I choose to live in a new much cheaper to construct apartment, by ditching dual aspect entirely, further reducing lift ratios, increasing permitted height. People would then have far more options. Stay renting,move to one of these new cheaper apartments and increase saving rate. Simply move out of house shares as they are done with sharing, which would begin to start freeing up these homes...

To make major inroads into the crisis, drastic action needs to be taken and as usual here, they are tinkering around the edges!!!

Nekarsulm

There are options, but people will have to make some comprimises/sacrifices.
For example, here in my locality (cavan) monthly rent is around 475 to 550.
There are houses for sale under 100k, (but rising at the moment)
For the lady in the article, there are 3 nursing homes within walking distance of this property.

http://touch.daft.ie/cavan/houses-for-sale/cavan/29-harmony-heights-cavan-cavan-1074467/

Speedwell

Nekarsulm wrote: »

There are options, but people will have to make some comprimises/sacrifices.
For example, here in my locality (cavan) monthly rent is around 475 to 550.
There are houses for sale under 100k, (but rising at the moment)
For the lady in the article, there are 3 nursing homes within walking distance of this property.

http://touch.daft.ie/cavan/houses-for-sale/cavan/29-harmony-heights-cavan-cavan-1074467/

What's the job market like, compared to the rest of the country?

Angel2016

fits wrote: »

You can pull apart these situations all you want but the fact remains is that there is a huge crisis and 'personal responsibility' is only a small part of it. I know many well educated working couples who "didn't get pregnant" that cannot get mortgages in Ireland. Part of the reason is the precarious nature of work these days. Rents are out of control and there is very little on the market to buy.

Straight to the point and well said, I am 40 and rent currently paying 1250.00 my husband is 42 we are saving for a house deposit at the moment we are both educated people no kids and paying a high rent for a kip of a house with teh new rules as I am a second time buyer ( bought a one bed in 2009 via affordable housing which has just gone sale agreed ) husband is a first time buyer but as he is married to me we need a huge deposit for a house.

It's going to take at least another 17 months to get what we want and in the meantime we feel we have no security renting.
It's just tough for alot of people but I think you have to get on with it and save what ever you can.

jimmycrackcorm

Idbatterim wrote:

Back to square one. Why aren't these idiots permitting cheaper builds, where people actually want to live? Very few of us can have it all, that's obvious. You have to make sacrifices. Why can't I choose to live in a new much cheaper to construct apartment, by ditching dual aspect entirely, further reducing lift ratios, increasing permitted height. People would then have far more options. Stay renting,move to one of these new cheaper apartments and increase saving rate. Simply move out of house shares as they are done with sharing, which would begin to start freeing up these homes...

Because where people want to live is incompatible with what you want to achieve. Everyone wants cheap housing but as close to the city centre as possible.

Idbatterim wrote:

To make major inroads into the crisis, drastic action needs to be taken and as usual here, they are tinkering around the edges!!!

People will still complain regardless. They want mixed social housing even if it means having to buy expensive houses from developers in private developments.

The government could focus on building cheaper house building in rural areas for people who clearly won't ever be or would take years to get themselves in a position to be able to stand on their own feet.

intheclouds

Angel2016 wrote: »

Straight to the point and well said, I am 40 and rent currently paying 1250.00 my husband is 42 we are saving for a house deposit at the moment we are both educated people no kids and paying a high rent for a kip of a house with teh new rules as I am a second time buyer ( bought a one bed in 2009 via affordable housing which has just gone sale agreed ) husband is a first time buyer but as he is married to me we need a huge deposit for a house.

It's going to take at least another 17 months to get what we want and in the meantime we feel we have no security renting.
It's just tough for alot of people but I think you have to get on with it and save what ever you can.

Actually youre not doing too bad (from your other thread) in that you are going to walk away debt free from the affordable house whereas many others who bought that year (non affordable) are swallowing massive negative equity.

For that rent there are lovely places in D24 - so why are you living in a kip of a house?

Whats a huge deposit?

Angel2016

intheclouds wrote: »

Actually youre not doing too bad (from your other thread) in that you are going to walk away debt free from the affordable house whereas many others who bought that year (non affordable) are swallowing massive negative equity.

For that rent there are lovely places in D24 - so why are you living in a kip of a house?

Whats a huge deposit?

Snooping on my other threads are you ?

I am walking away debt free yes and council get their cut of the proceeds, all taxes are being paid, maintenance fees are paid up everything.
I have paid over 40K mortgage payments on the property which alot of was interest so about 14K actually gone off the mortgage, yes I got an affordable property but what was to stop the other people out there who paid silly money for properties applying ? they could have easily done that I take no responsibility for people who paid far too much money for a house / apt in the boom time they was bad decision making on their part.

I was on around 28K back in 2008 and I had been on the affordable list for 2/3 years previous to that I believe it was so qualified for the AH scheme.

To answer your other questions:

For 1250.00 there are houses out there but not in the parts of Tallaght that I would want to live or rent, I am from Tallaght and know what parts I like and dont like which I would think is the same as alot of other people.
There isn't alot out there for rent I did look just out of curiosity and the competition for these properties for rent is very high.
The house is a total kip I won't go into what is wrong with it because the list it too long, LL wont fix it anyway but we are staying there as we like the road, our neighbors and also if we are going to buy in about 17 months I dont see the point in shifting and moving again just for that period of time so ye we will just have to suck it up that the house is in bits.
Even a guy doing repairs on water said it was a dump.

The deposit we need for a standard house of 250K would be 20% = 50K and then 5k for fees etc..
We could qualify for an exemption and need 30K which would be more ideal for us but who really knows if that could happen we've been to see a broker so know what we need to do he has given good advice to us over the past year.

Nekarsulm

Speedwell wrote: »

What's the job market like, compared to the rest of the country?

Same as the rest of the country, outside Dublin . The reason I mentioned the nursing homes is because the lady is a carer, and there seems to be ongoing expansion in each facility. Also there is a good hourly bus service to Dublin so visiting family would not necessarily entail buying a car etc.
If she is getting rent allowance, it will be at a dramatically lower level to Dublin,as it is roughly matched to local rental prices.

Speedwell

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Same as the rest of the country, outside Dublin . The reason I mentioned the nursing homes is because the lady is a carer, and there seems to be ongoing expansion in each facility. Also there is a good hourly bus service to Dublin so visiting family would not necessarily entail buying a car etc.
If she is getting rent allowance, it will be at a dramatically lower level to Dublin,as it is roughly matched to local rental prices.

Good to know. It looks like your rental and home prices are roughly the same as they are here, and it wouldn't be a huge stretch to see us moving there if my husband found the right job (I work from home so it makes little difference to anything but our Internet connection).

intheclouds

Angel2016 wrote: »

Snooping on my other threads are you ?

Yes indeedy!

Angel2016 wrote: »

I am walking away debt free .....yes I got an affordable property but what was to stop the other people out there who paid silly money for properties applying....

I was on around 28K back in 2008 and I had been on the affordable list for 2/3 years previous to that I believe it was so qualified for the AH scheme.

Probably because they earned a bit over what the cut off was at the time? Or didnt meet the criteria in other ways? Either way, Ill bet they would prefer to be in your current situation rather than owe money? Someone is always in a better situation. You made a choice that has put you into a relatively good situation now - debt free. But also as a consequence you are not a first time buyer.

Angel2016 wrote: »

For 1250.00 there are houses out there but not in the parts of Tallaght that I would want to live or rent, I am from Tallaght and know what parts I like and dont like which I would think is the same as alot of other people.
There isn't alot out there for rent I did look just out of curiosity and the competition for these properties for rent is very high.

I live in D24 (firhouse) and most of the 2 bed apartment rentals in the area are in that price range and theyre not kips at all, nor is the area. I was just curious as to why you would stay in a place like that (not now so much when you have an end in sight but over the past few years before rentals were so thin on the ground).

Angel2016 wrote: »

The deposit we need for a standard house of 250K would be 20% = 50K and then 5k for fees etc..
We could qualify for an exemption and need 30K which would be more ideal for us but who really knows if that could happen we've been to see a broker so know what we need to do he has given good advice to us over the past year.

Yeah 50k is a big deposit alright. I suppose the upside is that you will end up borrowing less and so pay back less mortgage interest over time.

They say rent is dead money, but mortgage interest is just as dead.

Angel2016

Agree with you on all points there, we prefer a house to live in so are renting in Kingswood houses in good condition there should rent for 1400 but this one needs so much work but I am sure if we are still there May 2018 rent will go up as it went up once in 2015 & again in 2016 for me rent is dead money I would never have rented only we couldn't live in the apt any longer due to noise from a restaurant / pub across from us I moved in there Feb 2009 and no word of a lie never got a decent nights sleep other then xmas day and good Friday so we chose to move out and rent reluctantly the plan was for a year and then everything changed and 4 years later we are still there.
We also have 2 cats and most LL dont allow them or any animals our LL doesn't mind once the house is kept clean she doesn't fix a single thing in the place but we are happy to be left alone until we can move out of there and she is happy she gets her money.

Some of my friends paid 600K for houses in various areas I thought at the time they were nuts but there you go one other friend has 3 places and all are in negative equity so I do have sympathy for them for sure.
We are debt free too don't owe anything as in loan or for cars so renting I suppose has allowed us to clear everything other then a credit card.

I seen how eager people are for renting places myself when I was looking for a tenant for my apt I had calls and emails coming in all day it was good in one respect but worrying in another.
We will get there in the end I might be 50 buying a house but sure look what can ye do lol..

intheclouds

Angel2016 wrote: »

We will get there in the end I might be 50 buying a house but sure look what can ye do lol..

Im looking myself at the moment and have accepted that wherever I get now isnt "final destination" but just an upgrade on apartment living for the next 10-15 years.......

Turns out anywhere I like I cant afford and anywhere I can afford......I dont like!!

Angel2016

intheclouds wrote: »

Im looking myself at the moment and have accepted that wherever I get now isnt "final destination" but just an upgrade on apartment living for the next 10-15 years.......

Turns out anywhere I like I cant afford and anywhere I can afford......I dont like!!

I just seen a house in Belgard for 250K which was very surprising I can't afford Firhouse where you live as in a house our max is 265K I am from Millbrook so would live there, Kingswood for sure, Old Bawn, all of those type of places but again prices are going up, I never thought at 40 I would be renting I presumed I would be a house owner I saved hard for the apartment to get the deposit and furnish the place and was delighted only to have the experience ruined by the pub / restaurant across from us if we had stayed there I most definitely would have bought a house by now but sure look no point moaning I just need to get on with things and work towards the deposit and security of my own home.

intheclouds

Angel2016 wrote: »

I just seen a house in Belgard for 250K which was very surprising I can't afford Firhouse where you live as in a house our max is 265K I am from Millbrook so would live there, Kingswood for sure, Old Bawn, all of those type of places but again prices are going up, I never thought at 40 I would be renting I presumed I would be a house owner I saved hard for the apartment to get the deposit and furnish the place and was delighted only to have the experience ruined by the pub / restaurant across from us if we had stayed there I most definitely would have bought a house by now but sure look no point moaning I just need to get on with things and work towards the deposit and security of my own home.

Best of luck with the hunt!

Angel2016

intheclouds wrote: »

Best of luck with the hunt!

Same to you !

Butters1979

Milly33 wrote: »

Yeah all bits to be worked out, but Ireland me thinks does need to address this..

Many things can be done, like lets say when you retire etc the government could offer a subsidy for renting for people who would like to avail of the option.. Or have group retirement homes offered cheaper to retirees... So many options but all Ireland see's is but sure how do we make money off them that way..

This actually really annoys me. When people say 'the government should pay' do they actually understand where the government gets it's revenue.

What you mean is other people should pay because this person, who has been employed all their lives, has not planned or prepared for retirement.

I don't mind state support for people who didn't have the opportunity, but for those who did, they should get nothing. The man is in his 50's. Rent is high now, but it hasn't been all his life. In fact only 4 years ago rent was really low. Why has this person not invested in his future, and why should other people now be expected to subsidise that?

Idbatterim

Because where people want to live is incompatible with what you want to achieve. Everyone wants cheap housing but as close to the city centre as possible.

not everyone wants to be in the city centre or close to it and be in an apartment. They should allow high density building around areas with good rail links. Sandyford for example, broombridge industrial estate could be rezoned etc. Its obvious the city centre alone cant take everyone... But when you look at 6 floor buildings in Ireland Canary Dwarf, is it any surprise.

Let me say this again, I don't need these IDIOTS that we have in "planning" here, telling me to hang myself with an extra 50-100k apartment for some OTT specced in certain aspects and on the noise front the other extreme. So I can pay an extra whatever it is 50k per unit and then another 50k in interest over the course of the mortgage. They don't need to worry, the people making these decisions will never have to live in an apartment and from their "standards" in relation to them, you can tell that they never have...

Or do they think that they allow 10-12 floors buildings, we will be back to Ballymun Mark 2, with people on 35-40k inhabiting them in Dublin?