Spar retail

Johnoshamrock

Does anybody know if you need to pay money upfront to spar or bwg to take out your first store . Thanks

DubTony

Johnoshamrock wrote: »

Does anybody know if you need to pay money upfront to spar or bwg to take out your first store . Thanks

If you're asking do they have a franchise fee, and assuming you already own or lease a shop, the answer is No.

Bandara

op

Can I ask if you have managed a symbol group store before ?

Johnoshamrock

Bandara wrote: »

op

Can I ask if you have managed a symbol group store before ?

Yes I manage a spar store at the moment but would like to take my own store in the near future . The owner of my store is not available to ask so need as much info as possible

Bandara

Johnoshamrock wrote: »

Yes I manage a spar store at the moment but would like to take my own store in the near future . The owner of my store is not available to ask so need as much info as possible

No problem

I'll post here later on everything you will need to have in order to get your own store

Johnoshamrock

Bandara wrote: »

No problem

I'll post here later on everything you will need to have in order to get your own store

Thank you very much really thanks

Johnoshamrock

Bandara wrote: »

No problem

I'll post here later on everything you will need to have in order to get your own store

Thank you very much really thanks

Bandara

Ok, so BWG foods is Spar Mace & Londis
(Musgraves being the other option: i.e. Centra)

What you'll need to setup your own store, theres three routes really, your own store from scratch, taking over an existing store and making it into a Spar etc., or getting a franchised company owned store from BWG (through a shoulder company called Newhill)

Option one I'm going to ignore as its about 400k, is huge risk, and I guess thats not an option for you.

Option two, you see a current store that for lease, get it, and change to a symbol store. Ok, you find yourself a site, agree the rent / fees with the landlord, now BEFORE you sign anything to take the site, you contact BWG and ask to speak to the regional manager for Spar (if thats the symbol you want), if your Leinster based the guy you want to talk to is Peter Dwan of BWG, if its Mace its John Tully, not sure who the Londis guy is.

You then ask them to meet with you, you go through your plans/ideas with them, ask them to accompany you to the site and have a look at it with you. Ask them if they would be interested in doing a deal with you to make the site a Spar/Mace etc. They may not want to be associated with the site if they feel its not a good enough location, or your not up to the job etc. In that case they might suggest you look at the lower down symbol options they have like Day-Today, XL Stop and Shop and so on. These are far cheaper options, but obviously inferior.

If they are happy to talk to you, you need to ask them to put a proposal together for you, tell them you want them too do proposed drawings for the interior and costings. Saves you a lot of time and money. Be very clear with them that you are speaking to Centra also, keeps them on their toes.

When they come back with plans ask them how much they will be prepared to contribute to you to do the upgrade to a Spar. The amount depends on how much the store will do weekly etc. For rough guideline if your talking about a store doing 25k a week ex vat ex agency you could get approx 60k in return for a five year commitment. This also depends on how confident they are that you can keep the business going.

Regarding financing, this is where I think your screwed tbh. Off the top of my head your going to need:

50k bank guarantee for BWG
10k Bank Guarantee for the National Lottery
Approx 4k for the Newspaper companies, some in guarantee some in cash.
Wages for 2 weeks minimum, (about 3k a week).
2,000 cash and coin float.

And money to buy the spar sign, graphics, etc etc

Now, add in there that if your taking over an existing site you will need to buy the stock left from the previous person, and this will need to be a cheque on the day you take over. A shop doing again say 25k ex ex is going to be holding about 55k in stock, with about 20-25 of that being cigs, so no haggling there I'm afraid.

What you need to do there is strike an deal with BWG to finance that stock purchase from the previous person with you over a period of 13 weeks, you can stock the remainder of the store through them and get that rolled into your opening stock loan also. So you'll most likely have an opening stock loan of 70k or so for a smaller to medium shop. So your repaying them 5.5k a week for 13 weeks. However you need to realise that after week two your going to need more stock, fresh foods, cigs, minerals etc. And the max credit terms they will give you for that will be 3 weeks I'd imagine. So from week five your going to be paying your 5.5k and your standard weekly purchases bill, which again on a 25k store I'd estimate at 18k a week.

Basically from month four the sh!t will be hitting the fan bank wise bigtime and thats when you'll know very very quickly if you can survive.

Re: bank loan, bank aren't going to be very excited to loan to you. You've never run a business, have no real money, I don't know you age but I'm hoping your over 30, and you will need to be coming across very well and demonstrating you are an intelligent and astute business man. Even with all that I'll go out on a limb here and say that even Ulster Bank won't give you more than 40%. And thats still a bit of a reach, they might just say no thanks. So long story short unless you have 40k your wasting your time. Your going to need 70-80k in funding total. Even that is going to be so tight. I'd be of the opinion that unless you have 20k cashflow for the January nightmare that is retail you'll start bouncing payments by week 2 of Jan.

Your final, and imo only option, is to beg spar for a company owned store and hope for the best.

Contact the Newhill group, get to meet with one of their guys, ask whats out there and see whats they come back with. The sad fact is you will only be offered the crap that no one else wants or would touch with a barge pole. Obviously thats not good, however listen, you got to start somewhere, you take the best shop you can manage to get, and the figures will show you earning probably 20k a year. You go in, bust your balls at it, and find out if your good enough. Remember the previous guy wasn't a good operator, generally speaking (with some exceptions, high rents, new competition etc) a shop goes bust because the operator doesn't do the job, theres a million excuses but thats the fact usually when you drill down into it. It will be a hard sell, but try to have Newhill employ you to run the store for 6 months with the option of you taking it over at agreed franchise fee % after that time. Gives you a free run at it. ps. standard Newhill franchise fee is 7% of turnover, for struggling shops its 4% and I have seen stores paying no franchise fees - is the basket case stores.

So you get yourself a store doing 20k a week ex ex, you throw yourself into it, and if you get it up to 26k with decent deli participation (which is bloody hard work) then you make 50-60k, and you can lift 10k off the top also.

Now your on your way.

Hope that helps a bit, sorry its a bit random, was just typing as I was thinking, any specific questions fire away I'll answer them if I can.

Hanley

If I'm reading that correctly, for all that stress, hassle and risk, you might pull 60-70k/year salary?

VincePP

Hanley wrote: »

If I'm reading that correctly, for all that stress, hassle and risk, you might pull 60-70k/year salary?

If I read it correctly the example is of a poor performing store and getting turnover up 20-30%, but it will still be at the lower end of stores.

The bigger stores probably take 50-80k a week and the profit would be greater.

If you are good at retail it would not be difficult to increase a bad performing store by 20-30% assuming that the performance is down to management of the store.

Bandara

VincePP wrote: »

If I read it correctly the example is of a poor performing store and getting turnover up 20-30%, but it will still be at the lower end of stores.

The bigger stores probably take 50-80k a week and the profit would be greater.

If you are good at retail it would not be difficult to increase a bad performing store by 20-30% assuming that the performance is down to management of the store.

The problem is he won't get within an asses roar of a store doing more than 35k a week.

The well established clique will keep that between themselves

Bandara

Hanley wrote: »

If I'm reading that correctly, for all that stress, hassle and risk, you might pull 60-70k/year salary?

Yes, and 70k would be the upper end, and not its not a salary, he gets nothing if the store doesn't turn a profit, it's essential his little company with no guarantees

If he starts earning too much in their eyes they will try to increase the franchise fee accordingly

But you need to temper that against the fact that as a manager of a store he's not likely to be on much more than 32-36k so it's a huge increase

Hanley

Bandara wrote: »

Yes, and 70k would be the upper end, and not its not a salary, he gets nothing if the store doesn't turn a profit, it's essential his little company with no guarantees

If he starts earning too much in their eyes they will try to increase the franchise fee accordingly

But you need to temper that against the fact that as a manager of a store he's not likely to be on much more than 32-36k so it's a huge increase

Jesus that's a big risk considering almost half of the difference will get eaten in tax

great post tho, I definitely feel more informed about the retail game now!

Bandara

Anyone else thing its absolutely pig ignorant rude for the OP to not acknowledge the assistance he has received here?

I know it shouldn't bother me but its everything thats wrong with forums when someone visits a forum after they have been given invaluable help, reads that advice and is too ignorant to thank someone.

really pisses me off tbh.

westgolf

Bandara wrote: »

Anyone else thing its absolutely pig ignorant rude for the OP to not acknowledge the assistance he has received here?

I know it shouldn't bother me but its everything thats wrong with forums when someone visits a forum after they have been given invaluable help, reads that advice and is too ignorant to thank someone.]

+ 1 Bandara.
agree totally, particularly as your response was quite detailed.

mrawkward

Nothing unusual in that. Looking at his other recent post on financing it was obvious that he was in the dreamer/lower end percentile.

DubTony

I'm inclined to check post count on some of these threads before I commit to a few minutes. One hit wonders and noobs are generally avoided.

jcon1913

mrawkward wrote: »

Nothing unusual in that. Looking at his other recent post on financing it was obvious that he was in the dreamer/lower end percentile.

TBF the guy thanked in advance of the detailed post.

route9

Bandara wrote: »

Anyone else thing its absolutely pig ignorant rude for the OP to not acknowledge the assistance he has received here?

I know it shouldn't bother me but its everything thats wrong with forums when someone visits a forum after they have been given invaluable help, reads that advice and is too ignorant to thank someone.

really pisses me off tbh.

He did say thanks in advance and the info was really great for everyone, not just the OP (plus the thousands of others people who will read it). So it was well worthwhile I'm sure.

JustTheOne

With option 2 what fee do you have to pay to actually use the spar name?

pedroeibar1

I fully agree with Bandara’s comment. Although it is a holiday weekend and the OP could be away, it is ‘bad form’ to start a thread and then disappear.

There are numerous issues here, a ‘general’ one where loutish OPs can’t be ar$ed to thank quality posts (such as Bandara’s); another is the level of knowledge (or lack thereof) of many posters that is apparent in the OP / other posts. Mods do not like reference to other thread posts which is a pity. They should be taken into account. From one of those we also know the OP has €15 k and no idea about borrowing/ approaching a bank. €15k is a drop in the ocean for what the OP wants to do.

How credible is a person working as a manager who does not understand how his business works? Could s/he not have asked a Spar rep. what was needed? What calibre is the person who, as a manager, would ask the boss how to start a new business? ( “……and BTW the reason I’m asking is that I’m soon leaving because I’m opening my new shop”) Or post here because “the boss was not available” to answer a question?

Boards are lucky to have posters like Bandara, whose input obviously is appreciated given the number of ‘thanks’ his post has received.:)

pedroeibar1

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

Boards are lucky to have posters like Bandara, whose input obviously is appreciated given the number of thanks his post has received.:)

Bitten manys a time like this. More so in PM's. So now I just say 200 euro an hour in the first reply and you can hear a pin drop in the following days

Great post from Bandara. Based on those numbers I'd prefer to punch myself a few times a day in the face then embark on a project like that...

DubTony

Deleted User wrote: »

Bitten manys a time like this. More so in PM's. So now I just say 200 euro an hour in the first reply and you can hear a pin drop in the following days

€ 200 an hour? Anyone ever take you up on it?

Great post from Bandara. Based on those numbers I'd prefer to punch myself a few times a day in the face then embark on a project like that...

I still have the bruises from my last encounter.

Johnoshamrock

First off I would like to thank k everyone for their input and help . I have been away with family so have not been online . I'm taking into consideration everybody's input . As I said I have money saved and been working hard to make it happen . I am right at the beginning of this. I'm finding it difficult at the moment thanks get started so I needed as much info as possible.

DubTony

DubTony wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

Bitten manys a time like this. More so in PM's. So now I just say 200 euro an hour in the first reply and you can hear a pin drop in the following days

200 an hour? Anyone ever take you up on it?

Great post from Bandara. Based on those numbers I'd prefer to punch myself a few times a day in the face then embark on a project like that...

I still have the bruises from my last encounter.

Only that big cheque you wrote me Tony Still living off it!

The ol quotes dont seem to be working to well

Johnoshamrock

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

I fully agree with Bandara’s comment. Although it is a holiday weekend and the OP could be away, it is ‘bad form’ to start a thread and then disappear.

There are numerous issues here, a ‘general’ one where loutish OPs can’t be ar$ed to thank quality posts (such as Bandara’s); another is the level of knowledge (or lack thereof) of many posters that is apparent in the OP / other posts. Mods do not like reference to other thread posts which is a pity. They should be taken into account. From one of those we also know the OP has €15 k and no idea about borrowing/ approaching a bank. €15k is a drop in the ocean for what the OP wants to do.

How credible is a person working as a manager who does not understand how his business works? Could s/he not have asked a Spar rep. what was needed? What calibre is the person who, as a manager, would ask the boss how to start a new business? ( “……and BTW the reason I’m asking is that I’m soon leaving because I’m opening my new shop”) Or post here because “the boss was not available” to answer a question?

Boards are lucky to have posters like Bandara, whose input obviously is appreciated given the number of ‘thanks’ his post has received.:)

For your information not replying for a couple of days is not disappearing . It's called being busy. Who are you to determine how good i am at my job . I appreciate what Barbara has said and I said thanks for what she has said . I can ask a spar rep at any time but I wanted the opinion of somebody else outside my circle . So I came on this for help, but what is the point in coming into forums when there's people like you just siting at a keyboard typing about people lives that you haven't a clue about . I never said 15k was going to give me the best chance of starting my shop I said it is what I have so far . I work 2 jobs so I can get were I wanna be , which is 7 days a week . And before you ask why should I have to work 2 jobs its because as I am sure you already know running a spar store is ok money but noting fantastic so doing 2 jobs will eventually give me the opportunity to do what I want . So before you sit there and think you know me get your head out of your arse or out of your laptop for 5 mins and realise that not all of us can sit there all day waiting on people posts to come up so I can criticise peoples ambition . I'm sorry for anyone who thinks I am being to tough here but all I asked for was a bit of help not crap of some people. Thanks again Barbara for your in put and sorry for the late reply as I previously said I was working one of my 2 jobs and only coming on when I get a chance . Thanks

elastico

Johnoshamrock wrote: »

For your information not replying for a couple of days is not disappearing . It's called being busy. Who are you to determine how good i am at my job . I appreciate what Barbara has said and I said thanks for what she has said . I can ask a spar rep at any time but I wanted the opinion of somebody else outside my circle . So I came on this for help, but what is the point in coming into forums when there's people like you just siting at a keyboard typing about people lives that you haven't a clue about . I never said 15k was going to give me the best chance of starting my shop I said it is what I have so far . I work 2 jobs so I can get were I wanna be , which is 7 days a week . And before you ask why should I have to work 2 jobs its because as I am sure you already know running a spar store is ok money but noting fantastic so doing 2 jobs will eventually give me the opportunity to do what I want . So before you sit there and think you know me get your head out of your arse or out of your laptop for 5 mins and realise that not all of us can sit there all day waiting on people posts to come up so I can criticise peoples ambition . I'm sorry for anyone who thinks I am being to tough here but all I asked for was a bit of help not crap of some people. Thanks again Barbara for your in put and sorry for the late reply as I previously said I was working one of my 2 jobs and only coming on when I get a chance . Thanks

Bear in mind this is the business forum not the happy clappy forum and its better get some harsh advice than everybody patting people on the back telling them how easy and great it will all be.

Unfortunately there is a history around here of one post wonders giving vague details of plans and when given some info. along with requests for more detailed information they disappear. Don't expect people to be nice around here, its not the forum for it.

Good luck with your plan, Bandara gave great advice there which you should find useful.

pedroeibar1

Johnoshamrock wrote: »

For your information not replying for a couple of days is not disappearing . It's called being busy. Who are you to determine how good i am at my job . I appreciate what Barbara has said and I said thanks for what she has said . I can ask a spar rep at any time but I wanted the opinion of somebody else outside my circle . So I came on this for help, but what is the point in coming into forums when there's people like you just siting at a keyboard typing about people lives that you haven't a clue about . I never said 15k was going to give me the best chance of starting my shop I said it is what I have so far . I work 2 jobs so I can get were I wanna be , which is 7 days a week . And before you ask why should I have to work 2 jobs its because as I am sure you already know running a spar store is ok money but noting fantastic so doing 2 jobs will eventually give me the opportunity to do what I want . So before you sit there and think you know me get your head out of your arse or out of your laptop for 5 mins and realise that not all of us can sit there all day waiting on people posts to come up so I can criticise peoples ambition . I'm sorry for anyone who thinks I am being to tough here but all I asked for was a bit of help not crap of some people. Thanks again Barbara for your in put and sorry for the late reply as I previously said I was working one of my 2 jobs and only coming on when I get a chance . Thanks

That type of abuse is like water off a duck’s back. Your sense of entitlement is interesting. Also, you contradict yourself by saying you were away with your family
and later say you were working one of your 2 jobs ...

You have your answer - if you bothered to re-read Bandara’s (not 'Barbara') post you might see the light – option one he says you need €400k, Option 2 the amount is €150k as a bank will want back-to-back cash for any guarantees. Ambition and hard work are great, but if 15k is all you have it will be a very long time before you attain the necessary deposits so dreaming here is a waste of time.

Bandara

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

That type of abuse is like water off a duck’s back. Your sense of entitlement is interesting. Also, you contradict yourself by saying you were away with your family
and later say you were working one of your 2 jobs ...

You have your answer - if you bothered to re-read Bandara’s (not 'Barbara') post you might see the light – option one he says you need €400k, Option 2 the amount is €150k as a bank will want back-to-back cash for any guarantees. Ambition and hard work are great, but if 15k is all you have it will be a very long time before you attain the necessary deposits so dreaming here is a waste of time.

I quite like Barbara actually






*puts on Beyonce CD

duploelabs

Bandara wrote: »

I quite like Barbara actually






*puts on Beyonce CD

Reminds me of Barbara in League of Gentlemen
https://youtu.be/8rRA8GYzU8E